Forums > Off-Topic Discussion > Will society ever change..? R.I.P. Amanda Todd...

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Phane

Posts: 2048

Rockville, Maryland, US

Nicolette wrote:

I meant that about the people posting those YouTube comments.

Reditied with  a bad attempt my quote wink

Oct 12 12 11:37 am Link

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Jordan Bunniie

Posts: 1693

Los Angeles, California, US

-Nicole- wrote:
EVERYONE around Amanda failed her. And it's a god damn shame.

Agreed, sadly.

Oct 12 12 11:38 am Link

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David Desoer

Posts: 148

Cayuga, Ontario, Canada

Oct 12 12 11:39 am Link

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Gianantonio

Posts: 8028

Minneapolis, Minnesota, US

JessieLeigh wrote:

Did you read the articles? To me, it seems like the victim here (and likely her parents) were informed by the police that the photos were online.

Personally, if the police came to me and informed me that something like this happened, I'd expect them to do something about it. I was woken up one night by the police knocking on my door because my car had been broken into.. That didn't make it MY responsibility to go track down the person that did it...


I think you are asking questions about the parents that should actually be asked about the police...

The whole story seems fishy. Why would police come to the house at 4AM with news of the photo(s)?  There are no detectives on duty then. Why would a squad car with beat cops wake people up at 4AM with that kind of news?  Doesn't make sense. Why would someone with child porn on their Facebook page not be visited by the police? Doesn't make sense.

Oct 12 12 11:43 am Link

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DarcieK

Posts: 10874

Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada

Gianantonio wrote:

Right--that's why I was wondering where the parents were in all this.

And if she or a parent reported their daughter's 13-yr old boobs were on a guy's Facebook account, wouldn't that person be banned from Facebook?  And possibly prosecuted for distribution of child porn?

Once a photo is on the net, it's there forever.

And no one knows for sure how old the person who posted the pic was. If he was under 18, then there is nothing law enforcement would really do.

Oct 12 12 11:45 am Link

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Nicolette

Posts: 12698

Midland, Texas, US

Phane wrote:

Reditied with  a bad attempt my quote wink

I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic in that post or not...

Oct 12 12 11:49 am Link

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DarcieK

Posts: 10874

Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada

Gianantonio wrote:
The whole story seems fishy. Why would police come to the house at 4AM with news of the photo(s)?  There are no detectives on duty then. Why would a squad car with beat cops wake people up at 4AM with that kind of news?  Doesn't make sense. Why would someone with child porn on their Facebook page not be visited by the police? Doesn't make sense.

Because in Canada, unless the city has its own police unit, the RCMP cover everything.

Oct 12 12 11:51 am Link

guide forum

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CHAD ALAN

Posts: 3799

Los Angeles, California, US

-Nicole- wrote:
EVERYONE around Amanda failed her. And it's a god damn shame.

Agreed. Very sad video to watch.

Oct 12 12 11:51 am Link

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Phane

Posts: 2048

Rockville, Maryland, US

Nicolette wrote:
I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic in that post or not...

No am not I messed up. what I meant to say in the beggining was I agree some of the comments on Youtube were very harsh and those people should somehow learn to be better human beings.  And then I  realised you had made some wonderful suggestions about how to solve a form of the problem.

But you quoted before I could finish and I failed at my attempt to edit my post.

Oct 12 12 11:59 am Link

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Nicolette

Posts: 12698

Midland, Texas, US

Phane wrote:

No am not I messed up. what I meant to say in the beggining was I agree some of the comments on Youtube were very harsh and those people should somehow learn to be better human beings.  And then I  realised you had made some wonderful suggestions about how to solve a form of the problem.

But you quoted before I could finish and I failed at my attempt to edit my post.

Alright. I understand now smile

Oct 12 12 12:05 pm Link

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Phane

Posts: 2048

Rockville, Maryland, US

Nicolette wrote:

Alright. I understand now smile

wink keep on with your good advice.

Oct 12 12 12:08 pm Link

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Gianantonio

Posts: 8028

Minneapolis, Minnesota, US

DarcieK wrote:

Because in Canada, unless the city has its own police unit, the RCMP cover everything.

At 4AM?  I don't think so...

Oct 12 12 12:30 pm Link

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DarcieK

Posts: 10874

Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada

Gianantonio wrote:
At 4AM?  I don't think so...

Yes. It does happen here. My dad used to be an auxilliary for the RCMP. If they are investigating something, they could show up at any time.

If you're going to continue to be skeptical of this poor girl's story, then I suggest you leave this thread. It's disgusting your lack of compassion.

Oct 12 12 12:42 pm Link

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Gianantonio

Posts: 8028

Minneapolis, Minnesota, US

DarcieK wrote:

Yes. It does happen here. My dad used to be an auxilliary for the RCMP. If they are investigating something, they could show up at any time.

If you're going to continue to be skeptical of this poor girl's story, then I suggest you leave this thread. It's disgusting your lack of compassion.

Wow--so being skeptical = no compassion.  Okay...

Oct 12 12 01:07 pm Link

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JessieLeigh

Posts: 2048

Las Vegas, Nevada, US

Gianantonio wrote:

Wow--so being skeptical = no compassion.  Okay...

Maybe you should go back and read what you have posted in this thread? I don't see anything in any of yourposts that indicateds anything but skepticism. Feel free to quote where you showed any compassion for the girl, cuz I am not seeing it...

Oct 12 12 01:21 pm Link

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Patrick Walberg

Posts: 42737

Salinas, California, US

Gianantonio wrote:

Wow--so being skeptical = no compassion.  Okay...

I've been posting compassionate responses to this video and story on Facebook, so please excuse my coming in late on this thread.  BUT why are you skeptical?  If this story does not effect you, then why not move on?  Maybe you are a cynical person?  I am the opposite.  I wish I could have been there to help these people before they commit suicide.  I lost a dear friend from high school to suicide, so I went into training to answer the hotline for suicide prevention.  This is a serious problem with the Internet being used by bullies and haters who are actually hurting themselves. This is an issue that needs a positive, and compassionate response, ... not cynicism!

Oct 12 12 01:24 pm Link

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DarcieK

Posts: 10874

Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada

Gianantonio wrote:
Wow--so being skeptical = no compassion.  Okay...

You've shown nothing but skepticism this whole thread.

Maybe her timing about when the police came was wrong, so what.

You say her parent's weren't there. I can guarantee they tried to help as best they could. How? By having her change schools to start over. You cannot transfer schools in Canada without parental permission to do so. However, the guy followed her and tormented her. Others followed suit.

The parents can only do so much. I actually blame the parents of the bullies more than Amanda's parents. You can't coddle your children all the time. And you certainly cannot completely prevent a teen from finding a way to get on FB and other social media outlets. It wasn't just on FB that she had problems, either. She got used and abused by people she thought she could trust. She got beat to a pulp and attempted suicide twice. Even with a parental "watch" over a suicidal teen, things like this can happen.

We need to find a way to stop this from happening again. It goes beyond the parents and bullies, etc. It needs to be brought up to school boards, even the governments of the provinces to implement some sore of legislation to punish the bullies and/or their parents.

Oct 12 12 01:35 pm Link

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Tricia Oaks

Posts: 106

Thousand Oaks, California, US

terrible.

Oct 12 12 01:44 pm Link

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David Desoer

Posts: 148

Cayuga, Ontario, Canada

Oct 12 12 01:51 pm Link

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Jordan Bunniie

Posts: 1693

Los Angeles, California, US

Nicolette wrote:

Some people just aren't wired for that.
How about we just don't be assholes? I think that should be a life lesson.


When I was in school, I got in fights with known bullies on a regular basis. I'd stick up for peers who wouldn't do it for themselves. I told them if they want to be left alone, break that fuckers nose and he won't mess with you again.

As an adult, I understand that doesn't always work. Not everyone is capable of that. So how about instead of passively blaming the victim, we teach our kids to not be little fucking assholes who need to get their asses kicked occasionally? How about we teach them to be decent people?

Wow. What a concept.

+1

Oct 12 12 02:07 pm Link

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Gianantonio

Posts: 8028

Minneapolis, Minnesota, US

JessieLeigh wrote:

Maybe you should go back and read what you have posted in this thread? I don't see anything in any of yourposts that indicateds anything but skepticism. Feel free to quote where you showed any compassion for the girl, cuz I am not seeing it...

Just because I haven't written about the compassion I feel doesn't mean I don't feel it...  Seriously...  Several people here are acting kind of like bullies...

Oct 12 12 02:09 pm Link

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JessieLeigh

Posts: 2048

Las Vegas, Nevada, US

Gianantonio wrote:
Just because I haven't written about the compassion I feel doesn't mean I don't feel it...  Seriously...  Several people here are acting kind of like bullies...

If you feel it, show it. You can't get pissy at people online for thinking you are not compassionate when you have made zero attempt to show that you are... All we have to go by is what you are posting. And you aren't posting anything but cold, heartless skepticism.

Oct 12 12 02:10 pm Link

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Gianantonio

Posts: 8028

Minneapolis, Minnesota, US

Gianantonio wrote:
Just because I haven't written about the compassion I feel doesn't mean I don't feel it...  Seriously...  Several people here are acting kind of like bullies...

JessieLeigh wrote:
If you feel it, show it. You can't get pissy at people online for thinking you are not compassionate when you have made zero attempt to show that you are... All we have to go by is what you are posting. And you aren't posting anything but cold, heartless skepticism.

Um, I'm not the one getting pissy...  big_smile

And if you would go by only what I have posted, that would be fantastic.  But that's not what's happening, is it...  You are taking what I have posted and convincing yourself of things completely unrelated to what I have posted.  You've skipped over the possibility that I have feeling of compassion that I've decided not to share and landed square on the illogical conclusion that I must have no compassion for the girl.

Oct 12 12 02:44 pm Link

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Gianantonio

Posts: 8028

Minneapolis, Minnesota, US

David Desoer wrote:

Yep.  Well .. no ... but as a fellow skeptic you have to know that this is how this sort of thing plays through.  If your skeptical of something like this, give it a day or two.  Otherwise you get trounced and nobody comes back later to apologize if you were right.  Sometimes it is useful to imagine the internet as being the mob with pitchforks and torches.  Then act accordingly (or don't .. I usually don't).

In this case, however, I don't see why one would be so skeptical.  I've been interviewed by police numerous times and it has often been at irregular hours.  And we're not talking pressing investigations but ongoing stuff.  If they were pointed at the pictures in question, the first thing they would have needed to determine was the girl's involvement in the matter.  If it had been reported at 3:00am they would have done a bit of preliminary investigation and then bee-lined it to her door to ask her some questions before either her or the suspect had any time to prepare statements, discard evidence etc.  They would have wanted to see her face when presented with the news.  They would have wanted to be the first to do so.  So why not 4am?   

Cheers,
Dave

Online mobs with pitch-forks don't bother me...  big_smile  It is interesting, though, how people decrying the actions of bullies try to bully people not expressly sharing their emotional zeal. 

Okay--that makes some sense (about the police showing up at 4AM).  But the lack of parental involvement (and I realize it wasn't zero, it just seems incredibly minimal...) and other details strike me as odd.  Not impossible; just fishy.  And maybe, as someone above suggested, the details don't matter.  For me, it seems better to get the details right or just leave them out.  Nothing is worse than a story making a big point that is later shown to be a hoax.  THAT leaves people disbelieving of future, true, stories.

Oct 12 12 02:54 pm Link

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salvatori.

Posts: 3835

Bellefonte, Pennsylvania, US

Kelly Anne-Marie wrote:
When will it change?
When people "of power" do something about things like this!, Kick the bullies ass off MM, Make it were members and/or nonmembers of MM can't download/steal/alter images of other members....lets start there, instead of just starting a forum about what happens when one finally snaps, just a thought. hmm

P.S.   R.I.P. Amanda. sad

Are you serious?

Unless I missed something somewhere, the tragedy of this young woman taking her own life has NOTHING to do with this site. Considering your thread the other day about you being tired of everyone on here picking on you and you giving a left-handed apology, it is pretty ridiculous that you are trying to turn this tragedy into YOUR cause.

Gotta be fucking kidding me....

Oct 12 12 03:07 pm Link

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Patrick Walberg

Posts: 42737

Salinas, California, US

Gianantonio wrote:
Um, I'm not the one getting pissy...  big_smile

And if you would go by only what I have posted, that would be fantastic.  But that's not what's happening, is it...  You are taking what I have posted and convincing yourself of things completely unrelated to what I have posted.  You've skipped over the possibility that I have feeling of compassion that I've decided not to share and landed square on the illogical conclusion that I must have no compassion for the girl.

When it comes to logic, I'm with you on that.  However, I asked you a question and you ignore it.  Why are you skeptical?   Sorry if you are indeed compassionate and concerned, but you are coming across as cynical.  I do not fully believe things I read on the Internet with all my heart, as I know too well that can be a mistake, however!  I see no reason to be critical or skeptical of something that you do not know the complete story on IF you do not have a personal attachment to the story. 

I can't honestly tell you if there is fabrication of facts, or truth in this story of Amanda Todd, but it is sad when a 15 year old girl commits suicide none the less!   Do you think that she is still alive and this is all a hoax?  If you think the story if fake or a hoax, then just say so.  I'll understand, even if others may not.  I would rather show compassion at this time because I believe that is the appropriate response ... for now.

Oct 12 12 03:29 pm Link

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Patrick Walberg

Posts: 42737

Salinas, California, US

Gianantonio wrote:
Okay--that makes some sense (about the police showing up at 4AM).  But the lack of parental involvement (and I realize it wasn't zero, it just seems incredibly minimal...) and other details strike me as odd.  Not impossible; just fishy.  And maybe, as someone above suggested, the details don't matter.  For me, it seems better to get the details right or just leave them out.  Nothing is worse than a story making a big point that is later shown to be a hoax.  THAT leaves people disbelieving of future, true, stories.

The article mentioned that her parents were separated.  She lived with her dad for a time, and then moved in with her mom.  That said, it is believable to me.  There are many broken up families and dysfunctional people as a result.  Details get mixed up or lost in almost every "news" story you read.  I've been interviewed several times, and it amazes me how screwed up the writer or the editor get with trying to quote me directly!   I'm also a writer, and it's frustrating when my editor wont let my story go in as written.  So take it with a grain of salt.

Oct 12 12 03:36 pm Link

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Gianantonio

Posts: 8028

Minneapolis, Minnesota, US

Patrick Walberg wrote:

When it comes to logic, I'm with you on that.  However, I asked you a question and you ignore it.  Why are you skeptical?   Sorry if you are indeed compassionate and concerned, but you are coming across as cynical.  I do not fully believe things I read on the Internet with all my heart, as I know too well that can be a mistake, however!  I see no reason to be critical or skeptical of something that you do not know the complete story on IF you do not have a personal attachment to the story. 

I can't honestly tell you if there is fabrication of facts, or truth in this story of Amanda Todd, but it is sad when a 15 year old girl commits suicide none the less!   Do you think that she is still alive and this is all a hoax?  If you think the story if fake or a hoax, then just say so.  I'll understand, even if others may not.  I would rather show compassion at this time because I believe that is the appropriate response ... for now.

I guess one could say I'm a skeptical person (but not a cynic in the strict sense of the word).  But you seem to assume people are either compassionate OR skeptical.  Do you not see how one can be both? 

And don't I lay out the parts of the story I'm skeptical about?  Or are you asking why I'm skeptical in general?  (I don't have an answer as to why on that one--but for as far back as I can remember, there are stories I hear that just don't seem right.  Like the story that woman told recently where some crazy lady stole her 3 week old baby from the car...)

Indeed--it is sad when anyone commits suicide.  But just because YOU see no reason to be skeptical about something doesn't mean others shouldn't.  I mean, seriously--are we really to all think like you do? 

I don't know if it is a hoax or not.  All I've said is that there are aspects of the story with don't add up for me.

Oct 12 12 04:10 pm Link

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Lisa Andresen

Posts: 8664

Abingdon, Illinois, US

The sad thing is that it gets better. So many kids kill themselves in high school but high school sucks for everyone after that life gets so much better. I just wish they would hang on so they could see what life is like and that it doesn't stay like that forever. I hope the kids that are connected to her story can see the hurt that they have caused. And even though it won't bring her back maybe they will change the way they treat people. =[

Oct 12 12 04:19 pm Link

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Gabrielle Heather

Posts: 10064

Middle Island, New York, US

David Desoer wrote:
I would say if there is one thing to be done it would be to lobby for continued improvements to mental health services.  Progress has been made but there are still some serious shortcomings.  Some of these are inherit to the overall lack of understanding of mental health. We're still very much in the "vapours" stages of diagnosis for some areas which means that there is often no clear treatment. Stacked on top of this are issues of access, funding etc.  If a kid is addicted to heroine we don't expect the parents to be able to deal with it alone.  We don't expect the teachers to solve the problem.  We don't blame parents for being unable to treat their kid's leukemia. So why is it we expect parents to be able to cope with issues like clinical depression?  Of course some parents are tools and that doesn't help.  Same with teachers.  Many are hung up on their own issues and can't move past.  etc. etc.  blah blah blah. Cheers,
Dave

SNIP

You touched on some great things here. Our government and world does not understand these things UNLESS it effects someone directly related to them. If someone in power has a relative who suffers and is close with them, they will then become an activist for the cause. If people arent exposed to things, they have no sensitivity.

There are tons of programs out there for people who have mental illness, and suicide hotlines for those who are in pain, but will a human answer?  Will an individual get the RIGHT care they need to begin their healing process? The workers IN the field get paid shit, but good benefits. So there's that. The burn out rate is rediculous, and it's understandable because in order to survive through hearing all the cruelty of the world you have to be strong. In my opinion, if you are to work in the field of helping others, it should be from a genuine place. You should want to help others, and it should make you feel better to help others. Most people that work out there dont care enough and there fore dont give enough. People are selfish.

The government does not want to help out the programs enough to supply enough support. Even if they did, society and cultures have placed shame on being emotionally "sick" or "weak". I wish that girl would have been taught to handle the situation different. Someone should have told her it was ok to screw up, and to stand up for herself, to love her body, and live with it. Im sure there were other girls who were showing there tits and doing much worse. She could have become a motivational speaker. Channeled her energy elsewhere. No one sat her down and talked with her. (that it seems) I would have had a school assembly. hat man who shared her pictured would be in jail. Its called stalking. Parents need to be more "real" with their kids so their kids feel more open about talking to them. Shit like this should not happen on so many levels.

Oct 12 12 04:46 pm Link

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Chicchowmein

Posts: 14486

Palm Beach, Florida, US

How tragic.

How desperate and alone she must have felt.

Oct 12 12 06:11 pm Link

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Jules NYC

Posts: 16228

New York, New York, US

Gianantonio wrote:
Um, I was talking about when it was happening... 

I mean, if my kid came home beat up or if I found him in a ditch, it would be time to involve a psychologist to help find out what was going on. Her parent(s) must have known part of it as they would need to be involved in school changes. If someone was stalking one of my kids on Facebook, I would have them delete their account and not start another one. I would get the police and/or a lawyer involved.

The story just doesn't add up for me...

I am with you here.
Were the parents that uninvolved with their own child?

I believe this happened though and it is God-awful.

Oct 12 12 07:14 pm Link

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Jules NYC

Posts: 16228

New York, New York, US

The internet gives bullying an entire new dimension.

Shakes head

Oct 12 12 07:16 pm Link

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John Photography

Posts: 12958

Adelaide, South Australia, Australia

Samantha Liana wrote:

Honestly... I say this once and again and forever. UNLESS one has been through depression and/or anxiety... one will NEVER EVER EVER fully understand how painful it can be, physically, mentally, emotionally. It is such a dark place where you're alone, your mind fucks with you and tells you fucked up things... I wish we could preach if you haven't been there... Keep your negative thoughts on the disorder to yourself.

OH K..........

Samantha sorry I took so long to respond to this but here I am. I have been the target of bullying both in primary school, and later when I got into high school. Most of the time it was relatively harmless stuff name calling and stuff. There was only one occasion where I blew up at the bully in high school and that was in  woodwork class and I just snapped. I threw a router plane at the bully and he got a small cut, but never ever bullied me again.. Strangely no one else did either, but that's probably because the story went around and maybe got exaggerated here and there.

I have had bouts of depression and feeling down on myself now and then but it never took hold of me and I never let it get to that point. I've always found things to do and not get my mind into that kind of mire........But that is just me, and I understand it's different for everyone.

Oct 12 12 11:07 pm Link

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West Images

Posts: 754

Sacramento, California, US

Tis a SAD and cruel world we live in.  Why can't we all just get along.....DAMN IT!!!

RIP Baby!  sad

ALOHA

Oct 13 12 01:26 am Link

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Kelly Kooper

Posts: 1034

Melbourne, Victoria, Australia

This makes me so mad. What is wrong with people? I don't care how much I dislike someone, I would NEVER treat anybody that way. How messed up are people that they need to do this? And to continue on with it for so long. What a waste - of their lives and of hers.

Awful sad

Oct 13 12 02:00 am Link

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Rikala

Posts: 1603

Rochester, New York, US

What makes me even more sad is the girl who made a "like" page for RIP Amanda is whoring for adds and subscribers with it.

neutral

What has this world come to?

Oct 13 12 09:32 am Link

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hygvhgvkhy

Posts: 2092

Chicago, Illinois, US

DarcieK wrote:

Not all schools block Facebook.

+1 most kids know someone who makes a website to hack around the schools security system either way. We get on Facebook..

The things people are saying about this girl are making me avoid Facebook..
I'm just never going to understand:/

Oct 13 12 11:37 am Link

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hygvhgvkhy

Posts: 2092

Chicago, Illinois, US

Dp

Oct 13 12 11:37 am Link

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hygvhgvkhy

Posts: 2092

Chicago, Illinois, US

Gianantonio wrote:

Online mobs with pitch-forks don't bother me...  big_smile  It is interesting, though, how people decrying the actions of bullies try to bully people not expressly sharing their emotional zeal. 

Okay--that makes some sense (about the police showing up at 4AM).  But the lack of parental involvement (and I realize it wasn't zero, it just seems incredibly minimal...) and other details strike me as odd.  Not impossible; just fishy.  And maybe, as someone above suggested, the details don't matter.  For me, it seems better to get the details right or just leave them out.  Nothing is worse than a story making a big point that is later shown to be a hoax.  THAT leaves people disbelieving of future, true, stories.

Why? Why. Why do you have to be skeptical? Why can't the girl just get the sympathy she deserves, not even in death. I don't know what happy planet you live on but every teenage girl doesn't talk to their parents. I don't understand why people are so shocked when I say I haven't talked to my mom in a few days. It's not abnormal. &some people who have problems that big Don't discuss them with their parents UNTIL something Needs to happen. Like switching of schools. And then we just drop it. Like nothing ever happened. Even if its still going on. &maybe that's absolutely the moms fault for not paying enough attention and maybe her kid resented her for that but you can't completely blame the mother.

Oct 13 12 11:51 am Link