allison mindy wrote:
For what it is worth, I will not shoot with someone who requires a premeeting (including paid gigs). I feel that it is a waste of my time. I guess there are cases where I would make an exception, but I have not come across an instance where I was willing to make such an exception to date.

Don't move to NYC to model, Allison. You'll have a problem with that attitude.

Hero Foto wrote:

pre-meet to collect 20-50% non-refundable deposit ...

otherwise models flake factor explodes exponentially ...

my half pence opinion ...

your mileage WILL vary ...

Deposits work for me.  1997 - 2013 = 0 "flakes"

DAN CRUIKSHANK wrote:
For the work I do, it would be a complete waste of time.

+1  -  though according to people here, it makes me anti-client and horrible to work with lol....

S W I N S K E Y wrote:
and you'll never hire or trade with another model ever...

Actually Hero Foto is correct.  Deposits not only work, but there's more than enough reasonably intelligent models who don't mind paying such.  I (conditionally) refund the deposit in cash at the end of the shoot per my profile.  Paid work?  You can bet you're paying a % up front if you're not a corporate entity.

Keeps no-shows (across the board) a non-issue for me and that alone has been worth it.

Different strokes.

To the OP:   No, there's almost never a need for me to meet with a model before shooting, unless I'm stuffing her into a size 2 or 0 dress...  sometimes what a model calls a size "2" and what her body calls a size two are two different things

Other than that, or situations that require physical dexterity, etc., there's not a reason to face meet.  A telephone, email, text, does the trick.

money_train wrote:
I read that "why pay model" thread, sounds more than 90% of model are Not worth to pay.

Does photographer need pre meeting with model before booking?

only for less than 10 mins, take few test shots and have a quick chat.

I understand it could waste model's time, however is it a good idea to do so?

For the work I do - I need that meeting. 

First I want to see if the model looks ANYTHING like she does in her pics.  Or has she put on or taken off LOTS of weight, changed hair color, gotten bigger (or smaller) boobs, etc. 

Can the model follow directions and be at the meeting location on time, or does she get lost or is late? 

I do this for TFP and paid gigs.

S W I N S K E Y wrote:
in the real world, we have "go sees" where a llama needs to show up in person, in order to casted for a particular job.

existing images are not always indicative of a llamas look..

thats for damn sure,   sometimes they can be such divas its not worth shooting  her.

money_train wrote:
Does photographer need pre meeting with model before booking?

It's a waste of my time.  All I need is to see the model's online portfolio.  That tells me what I need to know.

Sungoddess Studios wrote:
"Go Sees" are common in modeling even for photography

Go see's are common with Agency/Clients.... not simple modeling.

DAN CRUIKSHANK wrote:
For the work I do, it would be a complete waste of time.

Highly impractical in spread-out, high-traffic areas like Houston where the model and photographer may be 20 to 40 miles apart.

All it does is introduce another point of failure where either party may flake or have to legitimately cancel and possibly doom the shoot as a result.

Al Lock Photography wrote:
Don't move to NYC to model, Allison. You'll have a problem with that attitude.

That would require leaving the fashion capital of Ohio where all the top agencies are...

sunn fotography wrote:
for work, pre meet models its like casting.
for personal (TF or free), i dun pre meet them! cos i think its waste of their time.

Really? So you are saying your own personal projects are worth less effort?

Shot By Adam wrote:

money_train wrote:
Does photographer need pre meeting with model before booking?


It's really a case-by-case basis though and there is no one answer to your question that would encompass all shoots. For example, if I'm doing a high-end TFP shoot with makeup artists and costume designers and hair stylists, then I believe it's mandatory that we all meet for a short meeting prior to the shoot so we can get a good read off of one another. It helps everyone to brainstorm how to make the shoot the best possible. It also allows us to look one another in the eye and make sure we're all on the same page for deadlines, etc. I like to review the TFP agreements and releases then as well. This saves time during the day of the shoot and keeps things on schedule.

If I'm working with a model for a client, it goes both ways though. If the client has already chosen the model, knows what they want, then a pre-shoot meeting has no real impact one way or the other as far as how I'm going to do the shoot, so I see it as being an unnecessary step. However, if a client asks me to book a model for a shoot of theirs and they are unwilling to hire from an agency, then I make it mandatory that we meet for an interview and pre-shoot meeting primarily because, as someone else mentioned, a models' photos from six months ago are not always an indication of how they look TODAY.

Wise words, its really down to the client. If you get a creative brief from the client &  really understand the look they are going for then you can do the casting yourself (don't trust portfolios - you need to see for yourself).

Unless you've worked with the client before, this can be a very risky strategy. Sometimes the client doesn't know what look they need. If there are any doubts, get the models in front of the client. They choose!

the lonely photographer wrote:
thats for damn sure,   sometimes they can be such divas i.
ts not worth shooting  her.

I think the answer lies in what type of "shoot" it is, for retail work, portraits, and portfolio building, a preproduction meeting isn't a requirement.

For commercial assignments, and commissioned fine art projects, any person unwilling to invest some time for a preproduction meeting in order to get the assignment, won't get it.

Novice talents that believe the World should revolve around them, will find instead that the is World passing them by.

Princess Dasha wrote:
Really there shouldn't be a new thread every single day about which kind of business etiquette applies where in the modeling industry. It's like any other business. Common business etiquette applies.

Pre-meetings to discuss a video shoot are common as video shoots require more planning accordingly but if it's geographically inconvenient or one of the involved parts is busy then a pre-meeting on Skype would be useful.

Are you hiring the model? Then ask yourself if you would ever ask a client (in any other business outside of the modeling business) if they would pre-meet before the actual services you are hiring them for. Depending on the level of professionalism I don't think why someone would find it attractive to work for free before someone is hiring them. I mean, isn't that why they would decline a TF* shoot and list their hourly rates, to begin with?
...
What you are referring to here does apply under the description of "casting calls" but you'd have to be a company, a publication or another major third party though.

Working for free? I think the "pre-meet" (outside of modeling) that you use as an example is called a "free estimate." It gives you both an idea of the work involved, and how much time, effort, and possibly cost it will be.

I don't shoot nudes through MM, but I can see why it would be important for some photographers to at least make sure that the model resembles his/her portfolio. It also gives the photographer the option of choosing the model that get the job done, with the least amount of post-processing,

Princess Dasha wrote:
...
What you are referring to here does apply under the description of "casting calls" but you'd have to be a company, a publication or another major third party though.

True, but you contradict your earlier statement:

Princess Dasha wrote:
... Depending on the level of professionalism I don't think why someone would find it attractive to work for free before someone is hiring them..

You make the assumption that the shots taken during the pre-meet/casting call are useful for anything other than assessing the model as a potential candidate. You should not expect to get paid each and everytime you stand in front of a camera. If that is the case then you are likely to skip on most of the selection process at casting calls.

money_train wrote:
I read that "why pay model" thread, sounds more than 90% of model are Not worth to pay.

Does photographer need pre meeting with model before booking?

only for less than 10 mins, take few test shots and have a quick chat.

I understand it could waste model's time, however is it a good idea to do so?

I love meeting with photographers beforehand. Getting to know someone's personality if you're working them, I think, is the key to having a comfortable shoot and even greater creative idea collaboration.

Of course, if there isn't time for that to happen over coffee, an adequate phone call suffices.

But still, good business comes from strong communication and interpersonal relations. I feel like most of the threads bashing models and photographers come from people who lack these skills and only briefly message each other. The flake factor when it comes to this is huge, which no MMer is stranger to.

jlorenzo Photography wrote:
During the initial phone interview I tell them that if they do not show up for a mandatory meeting, there will be no shoot.  I always insist on a meeting before I work with any model, I've never had a model not attend one and there we discuss the shoot, what is needed who, where, when and how are discussed. 
Then I followup with a shoot sheet.  It does minimises the "no-shows".

+1,000

jlorenzo Photography wrote:
During the initial phone interview I tell them that if they do not show up for a mandatory meeting, there will be no shoot.  I always insist on a meeting before I work with any model, I've never had a model not attend one and there we discuss the shoot, what is needed who, where, when and how are discussed. 
Then I followup with a shoot sheet.  It does minimises the "no-shows".

Good for you. I am always surprised at how aloof some people seem to be about the scheduling process, yet they are likely to show up and rant about flakes.

George Ruge wrote:
I have enough trouble getting one to show up for a shoot, let alone for tea and crumpets first!

Or as I say, it adds another point of failure.