-JAY- wrote:
At the end of the day it's $40 for a freaking 7 foot umbrella, so I'm going to get it, but I'd like to see others' opinions. I'd use it as a reflective parabolic umbrella, a shoot through, and as a 7 foot 1 stop diffusion panel to cut down daylight, so it's a lot of shit for $40.

re. outdoor use, I would look at the differences between this one and the ones that are made for outdoor use. One gust of wind could make the Adorama one a single-use item. The Photek Sunbuster looks to be much more rugged. Mine is essentially a beach umbrella (sand spike and all) with translucent skin. I have the 72".

Dan Howell Tearsheets wrote:

re. outdoor use, I would look at the differences between this one and the ones that are made for outdoor use. One gust of wind could make the Adorama one a single-use item. The Photek Sunbuster looks to be much more rugged. Mine is essentially a beach umbrella (sand spike and all) with translucent skin. I have the 72".

My 86" silver one works well outside, and has for years. Just curious about the light performance of this one.

-JAY- wrote:
For the past 2 years or so I have been using Adorama's 86" Silver Parabolic Umbrella and I absolutely love it.

They recently dropped their 86" translucent white parabolic umbrella to $40 and I am really wanting to pick it up, but I wanted to get some input prior to pulling the trigger.

I have used shoot through umbrellas in a reflective configuration before, and it works, just with about 2 stops less power than using a traditional reflective umbrella, and with the light also going through the umbrella there's plenty of bounce, so it's a completely different beast altogether... but it's parabolic in nature, so the output from the shape should be increased - similar to how my silver para adds about a stop, should I expect an extra stop from the translucent? Does the parabolic shape hinder shoot-through capabilities? It'd also be nice to put 4 speedlites in a 4-square bracket, and have a massive, soft, portable system.

At the end of the day it's $40 for a freaking 7 foot umbrella, so I'm going to get it, but I'd like to see others' opinions. I'd use it as a reflective parabolic umbrella, a shoot through, and as a 7 foot 1 stop diffusion panel to cut down daylight, so it's a lot of shit for $40.

I might just go order one. $40?! That's cheap. Even I have no need/use of it. But just putting in the studio as a fixture is worth the $40.

Chuckarelei wrote:
I might just go order one. $40?! That's cheap. Even I have no need/use of it. But just putting in the studio as a fixture is worth the $40.

If I had a brick and mortar studio, I'd have one set up at all times in the corner for the fancy factor.

It may be juvenile, but I giggle a little bit when models say "Oh wow, it's so big" when I open up my 86" silver on location, lol.

-JAY- wrote:
Gonna pick one up today - seems like so many people use it as a shoot through, but then what's the purpose of it being parabolic? But I have seen one or two people state they used it as a white reflective umbrella, but didn't comment on how the power changed

I think they meant a diffuser? Not sure it would reflect more than a regular white reflector (someone correct me if I'm wrong).

-JAY- wrote:
Gonna pick one up today - seems like so many people use it as a shoot through, but then what's the purpose of it being parabolic? But I have seen one or two people state they used it as a white reflective umbrella, but didn't comment on how the power changed

Hi_Spade Photography wrote:
I think they meant a diffuser? Not sure it would reflect more than a regular white reflector (someone correct me if I'm wrong).

Yeah, this whole thread has been a little confusing to me. A shoot through umbrella (of any kind, parabolic or no) will defuse light, not focus it. And it will reduce the transmitted light substantially (shooting through any fabric is going to cut the transmitted light). Now if it has some reflective qualities, and you are using it like a standard umbrella (not a shoot through), it will still produce less light on the subject simply because some of it is being transmitted through the umbrella and not being reflected.

Paul Buff companies do have a large shoot through umbrella as part of their PLM system (it's called a Japanese Lantern). I have used two 86" white PLM's with the back spill kill panel to light a room, and with it's very defused light it provided a very uniform lighting solution. They also offer a reflective case to go around the white PLM which then turns it into a parabolic reflector, but it is not as efficient as the standard large PLM parabolic umbrella.

John
Sponsored Photographer for Paul C. Buff Companies. (Alien Bees, White Lightning, Zeus, and Einstein)
--
John Fisher
900 West Avenue, Suite 633
Miami Beach, Florida 330139
(305) 534-9322
http://www.johnfisher.com

Hi_Spade Photography wrote:
I think they meant a diffuser? Not sure it would reflect more than a regular white reflector (someone correct me if I'm wrong).

Since its parabolic in shape, it **should** put out more light when used in a reflective configuration (and not shot through) when compared to a traditional translucent umbrella... but havent found any real world data.

John Fisher wrote:

-JAY- wrote:
Gonna pick one up today - seems like so many people use it as a shoot through, but then what's the purpose of it being parabolic? But I have seen one or two people state they used it as a white reflective umbrella, but didn't comment on how the power changed

Yeah, this whole thread has been a little confusing to me. A shoot through umbrella (of any kind, parabolic or no) will defuse light, not focus it. And it will reduce the transmitted light substantially (shooting through any fabric is going to cut the transmitted light). Now if it has some reflective qualities, and you are using it like a standard umbrella (not a shoot through), it will still produce less light on the subject simply because some of it is being transmitted through the umbrella and not being reflected.

Paul Buff companies do have a large shoot through umbrella as part of their PLM system (it's called a Japanese Lantern). I have used two 86" white PLM's with the back spill kill panel to light a room, and with it's very defused light it provided a very uniform lighting solution. They also offer a reflective case to go around the white PLM which then turns it into a parabolic reflector, but it is not as efficient as the standard large PLM parabolic umbrella.

John
Sponsored Photographer for Paul C. Buff Companies. (Alien Bees, White Lightning, Zeus, and Einstein)
--
John Fisher
900 West Avenue, Suite 633
Miami Beach, Florida 330139
(305) 534-9322
http://www.johnfisher.com

Since translucent umbrellas can be shot through and reflected, i am just curious as to if the parabolic nature of the umbrella negages some of the light lost while reflecting. It could be more powerful to reflect than to shoot through if this is true - making this a super cheap, super big modifier that doesnt eat any power (lose a stop from light lost going through, gakn a stop from shape, if it does work)

But from what i have seen, nobody has really tested it like this that I can find.

Sablesword wrote:
http://www.paulcbuff.com/plm-competitor.php gives an idea of how the silver PLMs do focus, and how the white ones don't.

Thanks for that - but look... the silver PLM put out f/8 + 8/10 and the flashpoint white shoot through (reflected) did f/8 + 1/10 - just a little more than half a stop (when shoot through eats a stop or more) ... this is the kind of stuff I was looking for, thanks.

Now that I'm looking at PCB's umbrella, it's also $40 with the umbrella shaft... hrm.

AJScalzitti wrote:
I am with the rest on this, those words don't work together.  If its translucent then the shape doesn't matter, unless maybe it has a cover like a convertable one?

Other brands have a cover, so I can see that - that's why I was curious... why take the extra effort to have the shape if the shape doesn't do anything?

Green Grape Photography wrote:
best bet is to stick with a wescott 7 footer. cost you $99 though. you will be happy.

Why is that the best bet?

-JAY- wrote:

Why is that the best bet?

The Quality. The Black Cover. Maximize your light strength. Very Durable. Amazing coverage

Green Grape Photography wrote:

The Quality. The Black Cover. Maximize your light strength. Very Durable. Amazing coverage

The above link comparing translucent umbrellas show similar quality, with identical power output (f/8'1) and coverage (150°) and I didn't see a black cover on the translucent model, just the white model.

-JAY- wrote:

The above link comparing translucent umbrellas show similar quality, with identical power output (f/8'1) and coverage (150°) and I didn't see a black cover on the translucent model, just the white model.

http://www.amazon.com/Westcott-4632-Dif … t+umbrella

Green Grape Photography wrote:

http://www.amazon.com/Westcott-4632-Dif … t+umbrella

Yeah - that's the translucent one, with no black cover. I don't see anything here that makes it worth 2.5 times the cost of the alienbee or flashpoint ones.

-JAY- wrote:

Yeah - that's the translucent one, with no black cover. I don't see anything here that makes it worth 2.5 times the cost of the alienbee or flashpoint ones.

from what i read in your post, you have silver?
now the price dropped to & you want white?
Soft white all together right, with 4 speed lights?

I'm guessing you shoot maybe 10-15ft away from your subject with a lower f stop being as though you want to use 4 speed lights.

wescotts material is much better to give you the soft light you are looking for especially with 4 speed lights. 

if i am not making any sense to you, ignore me & i apologize

-JAY- wrote:
Yeah - that's the translucent one, with no black cover. I don't see anything here that makes it worth 2.5 times the cost of the alienbee or flashpoint ones.

There's a reason the Flashpoint one is $40.  I ordered one.  It's built really crappy. The umbrella diffusion material is thin, the metal shaft bends easily...way too easily and the over all build is just cheap.  No carrying case just a thin plastic clear sleeve.  No way the Flashpoint was going to last very long with use.  Luckily UPS did a number on the shipping box and it arrived slightly damaged.  I emailed Adorama and sent them pics and they gave me a store credit plus told me to keep the umbrella. So I got it for free otherwise it was absolutely going back....damaged or not. I bent it back into shape the best I could so I'll use it as is but I don't expect it to last long. 

I then went to my local camera store and compared it to the Westcott version.  The Westcott is much better quality in every aspect.  Plus the Westcott comes with a decent quality storage/carrying case. I don't know if I can say it's actually 2.5 times worth the price but it is certainly a higher quality build.

Had I not gotten the Flashpoint for free I was definitely going to return it and purchase the Westcott version even if it was 2.5 times more expensive.  I at least had some faith the Westcott would last much longer after seeing it in person.  When the Flashpoint gets trashed, and it will, I'll be purchasing the Westcott one.

Green Grape Photography wrote:

from what i read in your post, you have silver?
now the price dropped to & you want white?
Soft white all together right, with 4 speed lights?

I'm guessing you shoot maybe 10-15ft away from your subject with a lower f stop being as though you want to use 4 speed lights.

wescotts material is much better to give you the soft light you are looking for especially with 4 speed lights. 

if i am not making any sense to you, ignore me & i apologize

The test in the link above show the same power output when using the Flashpoint brand I linked in the OP and the Westcott - both putting out f/8 + 1/10, with the same 150° spread - I just don't see any "much better" in anything I am seeing online.

FJG Photography wrote:

There's a reason the Flashpoint one is $40.  I ordered one.  It's built really crappy. The umbrella diffusion material is thin, the metal shaft bends easily...way too easily and the over all build is just cheap.  No carrying case just a thin plastic clear sleeve.  No way the Flashpoint was going to last very long with use.  Luckily UPS did a number on the shipping box and it arrived slightly damaged.  I emailed Adorama and sent them pics and they gave me a store credit plus told me to keep the umbrella. So I got it for free otherwise it was absolutely going back....damaged or not. I bent it back into shape the best I could so I'll use it as is but I don't expect it to last long. 

I then went to my local camera store and compared it to the Westcott version.  The Westcott is much better quality in every aspect.  Plus the Westcott comes with a decent quality storage/carrying case. I don't know if I can say it's actually 2.5 times worth the price but it is certainly a higher quality build.

Had I not gotten the Flashpoint for free I was definitely going to return it and purchase the Westcott version even if it was 2.5 times more expensive.  I at least had some faith the Westcott would last much longer after seeing it in person.

I've had the silver Flashpoint for the past 2 years, and it's been fantastic for me. If the quality of the silver is good for me, I would assume the quality of the translucent would also be good for me.

-JAY- wrote:

I've had the silver Flashpoint for the past 2 years, and it's been fantastic for me. If the quality of the silver is good for me, I would assume the quality of the translucent would also be good for me.

Cool...buy it.  Not sure what answer you are looking for other than for people to agree with you to buy the Flashpoint.

FJG Photography wrote:
Cool...buy it.  Not sure what answer you are looking for other than for people to agree with you to buy the Flashpoint.

This is not a flashpoint vs westcott thread, and never has been. Nor is it a thread to convince me to buy it, I pretty much decided in the OP.

This thread is about reflective qualities of translucent umbrellas, and whether or not the parabolic shape was negated by the translucent quality of the fabric. It was derailed by a "just get a westcott" post.

-JAY- wrote:

If I had a brick and mortar studio, I'd have one set up at all times in the corner for the fancy factor.

It may be juvenile, but I giggle a little bit when models say "Oh wow, it's so big" when I open up my 86" silver on location, lol.

Moi aussi!

-JAY- wrote:
Should arrive Saturday!

Along with a quad-flash square bracket to attach four YN560II flashes. It's going to be a fun weekend.

Jay please keep us posted with some pics you take with this. I, for one am very interested in seeing them.

Hi_Spade Photography wrote:

Jay please keep us posted with some pics you take with this. I, for one am very interested in seeing them.

Probably take a couple weeks to go over enough situations to give it a thorough go-through.

Also really looking forward to playing with the 4-flash bracket.

Hi_Spade Photography wrote:

Jay please keep us posted with some pics you take with this. I, for one am very interested in seeing them.

Just got it in, and should be using it tomorrow.

It should be a fun new modifier.

-JAY- wrote:
Just got it in, and should be using it tomorrow.

It should be a fun new modifier.

In Victoria, that becomes a Parasail in a heart beat.
But, cool.

Also offsite there have been recommendations to pay the extra money and buy PCB.

Do NOT buy PCB at the current time, until they fix the manufacture issues. PCB 60" PLM's made in the last year fall apart, even with minimal use indoors. Bad wire holding the struts in place. You do not get your moneys worth, as you only get 2-5 uses before they break.

Herman Surkis wrote:

In Victoria, that becomes a Parasail in a heart beat.
But, cool.

Also offsite there have been recommendations to pay the extra money and buy PCB.

Do NOT buy PCB at the current time, until they fix the manufacture issues. PCB 60" PLM's made in the last year fall apart, even with minimal use indoors. Bad wire holding the struts in place. You do not get your moneys worth, as you only get 2-5 uses before they break.

That's not true.