Forums > Photography Talk > Longest wait for a client to pay?...

Photographer

PR Zone

Posts: 897

London, England, United Kingdom

I'm moving to a new PC - and using the move as an excuse to get 'tidy'.
Part of that 'tidy' is to check and make sure that all invoices have been paid.

I have one from a major label that is now just over a YEAR unpaid (not naming names - yet)...

...and another from a local business that is 15 months unpaid

What's your record for chisellers* ?


* http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Chiseler

Feb 01 15 02:15 am Link

Makeup Artist

ArtistryImage

Posts: 3091

Washington, District of Columbia, US

PR Zone wrote:
Longest wait for a client to pay?

Andrzej with your background in business account management I'm certain you realize the lack of merit using the derogatory term of "chisellers" on an overdue account.

First do your have an audit trail of all that has transpired with said client?
Especially a signed contract stating the scope of services and the nature or recompense?

I'm uncertain how accounts are handled across the pond but here in the states my financial adviser has assured me that any account over 90 days (120 days in some markets) is considered delinquent...

There are SOP's for moving forward here... with the ultimate being civil litigation to recover payments due, albeit this typically isn't a wise option since the cost associated with the aforementioned oft exceeds what might hang in the balance...

Ok, for your information I once had to wait seven months on a photo assisting job for a major land development client... the commercial shooter that hired me stipulated that I get paid only after he gets paid... and he gets paid only after the advertising agency that hire him gets paid... seems that an economic downturn in the sale of residential properties played heavily into the mix here and this very large entity was struggling to remain solvent... the good news is after a prolonged wait I received recompense as initially negotiated... that said every 30 days I requested a status update from the photographer who hired me (at the advice of my financial adviser) 

Possibly retaining the services of a financial adviser might be thought Andrze, I have paid mine partly in services rendered... again just a thought...

All the best on your journey...

Feb 01 15 03:59 am Link

Photographer

martin b

Posts: 2770

Manila, National Capital Region, Philippines

i have my wedding clients either give me checks advanced or credit card.  That doesn't stop me from calling the day before i make the deposit.  It helps stop bouncing checks.  I still have to recover one bad check from October.

Feb 01 15 05:09 am Link

Photographer

Dan Howell

Posts: 3555

Kerhonkson, New York, US

ArtistryImage wrote:
I'm uncertain how accounts are handled across the pond but here in the states my financial adviser has assured me that any account over 90 days (120 days in some markets) is considered delinquent...

Many editorial submissions and many editorial assignments are payable upon publication. 90 days would be a minimum time span for submission to publication in my experience. I expect it to be longer. I have experienced it to be MUCH longer. Not sure it would be advisable for me to send delinquency notices at a fixed interval.

Feb 01 15 05:29 am Link

Photographer

AJ_In_Atlanta

Posts: 13053

Atlanta, Georgia, US

I think 90 days is about as long as I have had.  I would suggest an automated system for invoicing, one that reminds both you and the client of overdue situations.

Feb 01 15 06:19 am Link

Photographer

Stephoto Photography

Posts: 20158

Amherst, Massachusetts, US

The longest I've waited is 4 months.  Because, I thought they were going to schedule a larger project (so I could roll the event coverage in with the invoice for that one) but they never did, so I sent an invoice. They took 2 weeks after that to pay. Most commonly, I get a lot of 60 and 90 day folks.

How are you communicating with them ? Have you spoken to them to find out an update? Surely you must be doing more than just sending an overdue invoice notice? Because that's sort of assholish by itself.

Feb 01 15 06:27 am Link

Photographer

Voy

Posts: 1594

Phoenix, Arizona, US

For me the longest is 60 days. I have a regular client that takes that long to pay.

After 90 days I start taking legal action. If it has been a year, you can forget about getting paid.

Feb 01 15 10:20 am Link

Photographer

ontherocks

Posts: 23575

Salem, Oregon, US

we've had a couple where we finally just wrote it off as bad debt. but for the most part our clients have paid. and most of them have paid promptly.

Feb 01 15 10:26 am Link

Clothing Designer

GRMACK

Posts: 5436

Bakersfield, California, US

Probably 14 months with a purchase order through a college for me.  They blew the department's budget and it had to roll over to the next fiscal year and await board approval.  Purchase orders can drag out and be a very long wait.

Sadly, one camera store here that was very popular went under due to slow and minimal pays out of a large outfit that bought tons of supplies.  They'd charge $500 on open account and pay $50 and repeat over and over.  Big name, but sure sucked in paying off their accounts.  After 2-3 years, and huge unpaid debit, the store folded.

Feb 01 15 10:29 am Link

Photographer

Orca Bay Images

Posts: 33877

Arcata, California, US

I've never had a business drag its feet on paying an invoice, but some sport parents tried to slide under the radar, so to speak.

The worst was a single mother who had a high-paying job herself, plus generous child-support from the ex. This mother kept putting off paying on what was already a ridiculous bargain I'd never give again. When pressed, she actually used "my daughter attends a private school and the tuition is tough." (Yeah, I know. It's your daughter I shot playing soccer for that elite school.) Then the mom, struggling to get her kid through private school, took a European vacation. She had the nerve to tell me how much she needed to lay on a beach in Greece. At that, I told her I'd be passing her account along to a collection agency. After four months of runaround, I got the check the very next day.

Feb 01 15 10:48 am Link

Photographer

Ralph Easy

Posts: 6426

Sydney, New South Wales, Australia

Wireless credit card swipe for small clients and individual entities. Let the customer loan from the credit card, not from you.

https://image.slidesharecdn.com/charge-140418071135-phpapp02/95/how-to-get-the-best-wireless-credit-card-machine-service-7-638.jpg?cb=1397823320

For large corporate accounts, check out their payment cycles. 30 days is too long for these modern times.

.

Feb 01 15 05:38 pm Link

Photographer

John Horwitz

Posts: 2920

Raleigh, North Carolina, US

PR Zone wrote:
I have one from a major label that is now just over a YEAR unpaid...and another from a local business that is 15 months

It's all COD - otherwise:
One of you is one HELL of a lot smarter than the other!

Feb 01 15 05:43 pm Link

Photographer

The Dave

Posts: 8848

Ann Arbor, Michigan, US

31 years and counting...

Feb 01 15 11:50 pm Link

Photographer

Voy

Posts: 1594

Phoenix, Arizona, US

-The Dave- wrote:
31 years and counting...

LOL

Feb 02 15 02:44 pm Link

Photographer

Kane

Posts: 1647

London, England, United Kingdom

PR Zone wrote:
I have one from a major label that is now just over a YEAR unpaid (not naming names - yet)...

Curious if it's the same one I'm having trouble with...

Feb 02 15 02:47 pm Link

Photographer

TomFRohwer

Posts: 1601

Hamburg, Hamburg, Germany

PR Zone wrote:
What's your record for chisellers* ?

31 years - if a regional weekly's publishing house that went bancrupt counts...

3 or 4 month with some publishing houses which do monthly payments if something went wrong with the accounting. ("There's a mistake!" - "Oh, we are sorry! We will fix it next month!" - "You've forgot to fix last month's mistake!" - "Oh, oh, we are so sorry! We will fix it next month!" Human beings make mistakes from time to time and you don't ruin a longtime cooperation because of some delays.)

It's a business. You have to learn how to deal with tardy payers.

Feb 03 15 08:45 am Link

Photographer

PR Zone

Posts: 897

London, England, United Kingdom

ArtistryImage wrote:
...the lack of merit using the derogatory term of "chisellers" on an overdue account...

I'm clear up front that I work on 14 days

If they ask for 30 etc - fine - but that will also be on the invoice

When they get past 2 months, they are taking the piss

When they get close to a year, they are automatically granted 'Chiseller' status ;-)

Feb 03 15 03:05 pm Link

Photographer

PR Zone

Posts: 897

London, England, United Kingdom

I BOW BEFORE those of you who managed >30 years

My misery cannot compete :-)

Just to prove that it's not all 'Doom and gloom' with me, I do have a solution

For a small company (i.e. less than 2 million in annual revenue) to take on a large customer legally etc - it very difficult, time consuming and costly

SOLUTION TO SLOW PAYERS?
Make it LAW that invoices which remain unpaid past 60 days MUST have a 10% fee added
When the invoice reaches 90 days, it MUST have another 15% added
if it reaches 120 days, then a further 20% is added and the invoice MUST be passed to a government agency for collection

Would stop slow payment overnight

Feb 03 15 03:10 pm Link

Photographer

Mikey McMichaels

Posts: 3356

New York, New York, US

22 months.

The check was one where you tear the check off of the bottom and the top has all the billing info on it. They had the date of my invoice on it.

I scanned it, emailed it to the person who hired me and asked if they still wanted the deliverables that I'd held which expired after two years.

Outside of that, six months is probably the longest I've waited.

Feb 03 15 05:55 pm Link

Photographer

BCADULTART

Posts: 2151

Boston, Massachusetts, US

I use to play this game, but in 2015 it is COD.  I actually have a problem with
clients trying to give me money before the shoot.  I don't take money in advance.

The main thing I do is watermark all preview images and I copyright all images
via the U.S. copyright office and put that in the IPTC information of each image.

90% of the work I do is for corporations.

I'm not a bank, I am a working photographer and I get paid for the work I do
when I deliver it.

Feb 03 15 07:04 pm Link

Photographer

Mikey McMichaels

Posts: 3356

New York, New York, US

BCADULTART wrote:
I use to play this game, but in 2015 it is COD.  I actually have a problem with
clients trying to give me money before the shoot.  I don't take money in advance.

The main thing I do is watermark all preview images and I copyright all images
via the U.S. copyright office and put that in the IPTC information of each image.

90% of the work I do is for corporations.

I'm not a bank, I am a working photographer and I get paid for the work I do
when I deliver it.

And how exactly do you do that?

Unless you're doing jobs that are small enough that you can be paid by an expense account credit card, you're not getting paid by the person who hires you, you're getting paid by accounts payable who's job is specifically to delay payments.

Feb 03 15 09:14 pm Link

Photographer

Lallure Photographic

Posts: 2086

Taylors, South Carolina, US

You should NEVER allow any account to go over 120 days from invoice, without taking it to legal action.

Feb 04 15 07:02 am Link

Photographer

Al Lock Photography

Posts: 17024

Bangkok, Bangkok, Thailand

Took me just over 2 years to collect on an invoice at one point - collection by court order.

Feb 04 15 10:16 am Link