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This is why we don't reply to messages
When you are polite and reply back with a decline or with a message saying only doing paid assignments at the moment and someone decides to be a sarcastic jerk. It seems most times I always get a sarcastic jerk when I tell someone I'm not doing TFP. Photographer 01/18/16 09:58 AM After a brief hiatus from this site, I have returned with renewed motivation to create beautiful images. You can check out my work here: www._______.com and let me know whether you are interested in doing a photo shoot. Until then, have a great day! Me 02/02/16 08:26 PM Thanks for reaching out, at the moment I'm only accepting paid assignments. Thanks Photographer 02/02/16 08:31 PM I guess you're not interested in doing a paid photo shoot assignment...oh well...best of luck to you Really that's how you reply he was never intending on hiring me for a shoot if he was he would have mentioned it in his original message and if he had forgotten he would have just replied with it is a paid assignment, gave me the details and ask me if I was interested. But no he thought to himself hmmm how can I be a sarcastic jerk to this stranger instead. And this is why I will no longer reply to most messages because some people don't know how to say thanks and move on. My final response was you never mentioned it was a paid assignment so I assumed it was a collaboration but you are correct after your sarcastic reply I'm definitely not interested in working with you paid or not. Thanks Feb 05 16 05:33 am Link I guess it served as a good litmus test though. Imagine having to deal with that person during a shoot or afterwards trying to simply request images. I think you dodged a potentially lame experience. Feb 05 16 06:00 am Link Maybe he was surprised that you were only seeking paid assignments. And models are a dime dozen in the Orlando area so it will not be too tough to find someone else for the shoot. That will teach him! Feb 05 16 06:17 am Link Bullet dodged. I still try to reply to everything on matter of principle so that I can't be accused of being unprofessional, but I know exactly what you mean. I've had photographers fly into a rage at me because I didn't reply quickly enough for their liking (within 4 hours after they sent the message) and berate me for being a "fake model" and threaten to report me. I once responded to a TFP request from a photographer whose port was full of nothing but snapshots of nudes taken with on-camera flash, saying "thank you but I'm not interested in doing this type of shoot right now" and received a nasty response "we hadn't even discussed what kind of shoot, it's your loss". Umm if your port has ONLY nudes and you don't say at all what type of shoot you want to do with me...I think it isn't a crazy notion that I think you're looking to do more work like that in your port. Regardless of any miscommunications if you can't reply civilly consider that opportunity blown. Feb 05 16 06:20 am Link 
Model Posts: 6638 MacMurdo - permanent station of the US, Sector claimed by New Zealand, Antarctica A lot of people don't reach out with a paid offer in the first email. They reach out first to see if you are interested/available to shoot. If I had received that email, I would have replied, "Hi there - Thanks for the email! Could you give me a few more details about what genre you are looking to shoot? Also, if you'll let me know how long you'd like to shoot for and where we'd be shooting I can send you my rates. Talk to you soon! MoRina" Feb 05 16 06:31 am Link MoRina wrote: While I agree this would have been a better response, I do think OP's assessment is correct that the fact he replied so passive-aggressively indicates he had no intention of offering a paid shoot to begin with--otherwise there would have been no reason to get rude, he would have simply responded "it is a paid shoot, are you interested?" instead of trying to "make her regret not working with him". Feb 05 16 06:37 am Link It goes both ways too and sometimes someone is just having a bad day. I replied out of sorts to someone's refusal to shoot with me once, (albeit they insulted/critiqued me in their refusal and that just hit me wrong.) Lesson learned on my end because nothing good came of it, at all. Like you, for a while I refused to reply with rejections to others but, realized I wanted to. What I changed though...if they reply badly, I do not engage with them equally badly but, reiterate my initial refusal and wish them the best. What a bad reaction to my initial refusal will do is guarantee we will never shoot. Someone replied so awesomely to a refusal by me that it made me change my mind completely and I wanted to shoot with them and did!! Jen Feb 05 16 06:38 am Link CamelliaFlower wrote: Even though most of my shoots are nude hoots I have some clothed photos in my portfolio. There is even one of a porn model who has a fully clothed photo in my port. Feb 05 16 06:39 am Link MoRina wrote: This is true. Feb 05 16 06:41 am Link Jerry Nemeth wrote: I'm not saying it isn't possible that the photographer would have wanted to shoot anything else. In fact my favorite shot in my port was done with a photographer who previously had almost ONLY nudes. Feb 05 16 06:53 am Link MoRina wrote: Feb 05 16 07:01 am Link Nature Coast Lightworks wrote: How can you say that without seeing the quality of his work anyways? Feb 05 16 07:23 am Link I understand that models get frustrated with photographers and photographers get frustrated with models, but ... I don't see the terrible problem here. I think we all need to learn to be more patient, communicate better and recognize that none of us are perfect. Feb 05 16 07:40 am Link It always amazes me to hear how so many photographers contact models and give so little information about their offer or what it is they wish to shoot. It seems many contact models having absolutely no idea what it is they even desire to get out of a shoot. That said, communication is a two-way street. In response to your reply the photographer indicated he was willing to pay, so while he may have lost a model with his poor communication, it's also possible you lost a paying gig because of your communication. The photographer didn't say what compensation he was willing to offer, so rather than respond as you did, why not say: "I'd love to do a shoot with you, my rate is X" 50% of the issues I see presented here or more, would be avoided if either party simply took the step to clarify terms. Feb 05 16 07:44 am Link The bit that I don’t understand is that if you clearly state on your profile that you are “currently only accepting paid assignments for modeling” and a photographer contacts you, isn’t it fair to assume that he was offering paid work? Feb 05 16 07:50 am Link Derek Ridgers wrote: While this is true she doesn't have Paid Assignments Only in the left column so if he just searched and didn't fully read I can see the confusion. Feb 05 16 08:05 am Link Angie Borras wrote: So you're going to act rude and unprofessional just because some jerk acted rude and unprofessional? Feb 05 16 08:11 am Link Derek Ridgers wrote: That is totally true but the last 5 messages I have received have been from people asking for TFP without initially saying anything other than are you interested in shooting? How am I supposed to know if I am interested or not if you don't say what is you want to shoot or whether I am going to be compensated. Then I send a long message asking for details etc just to find out they wanted TFP all along. Now if they are not clear in their initial message I just say Thanks for contacting me, I'm currently accepting paid assignments if they are interested they can move forward and tell me what it is they want to shoot etc and then I can quote them a rate for whatever it is they want or see if I am interested in shooting what they want at all. Feb 05 16 08:19 am Link Nature Coast Lightworks wrote: The coins flips both ways. The same way models are a dime a dozen so are photographers. Feb 05 16 08:20 am Link The moral of this post is when replying to someone you don't have to be sarcastic or rude when the person who responded to you responded in a polite manner even if the response was not what you wanted to hear you should still respond back professionally. Feb 05 16 08:23 am Link Nature Coast Lightworks wrote: Models are a dime a dozen if you are not very selective. Feb 05 16 08:25 am Link Angie Borras wrote: Am I the only one here who's seeing this as a reading comprehension problem on the photographer? Or are most here reading this as sarcasm? Feb 05 16 08:34 am Link Farenell Photography wrote: I read it as sarcasm/passive-aggression, because of the "I guess you're not interested in doing a paid shoot" after her response that she's only doing paid shoots. That kind of blatant repetitive statement, contrary to what she said, smacks of passive-aggression. Feb 05 16 08:40 am Link I agree with those who suggested politely requesting more details and either listing your rates or asking for the photographer's budget.. Since your bio says you are accepting only paid shoots (now at any rate, I don't know what it said at the time of the exchange of messages.) it may well have been, based on his initial message, that he simply needed a little more discussion to determine how much rather than if you would be paid. At any rate I don't see a suggestion that he was looking for TF in the initial message On both sides, it's a monument to poor and inadequate communication (the sort we're seeing far too much of lately) and the policy of "Never Assume!". In this case, you both probably dodged a bullet. I wonder if the brevity of messages between photographer and model is a result of communicating via text messages on a cell phone (not always the handiest device for composing a complete or courteous thought) and if so, what can be done to convince both to be more complete when initiating or replying to an inquiry. The fact is that, especially on the first shoot together (and even more likely on the first communication), it's not unusual for either or both parties to have only the most rudimentary idea of the intended outcome. And this is not necessarily a bad thing. I can't tell you how often my initial ideas for a shoot have changed after meeting and spending a few minutes talking with the model, learning her actual boundaries (which quite often are not the same as those published in the bio) and getting an idea of the personality that she projects. The question of pay can very much depend on these sorts of facts, especially if the model's rate "Depends on Assignment" as in this case. All IMHO as always, of course. Feb 05 16 09:38 am Link OP: If you were truly not interested in working with this photographer regardless of compensation, your response was adequate and the photographer should have taken the hint and not reply in that manner. Now if you wanted to explore the possibilities of working with this person, I would have tried to open the floor for negotiations by asking for details and such. I typically try to work out collaboration agreements with others for the purpose of finding people who are seriously interested in the project and want to be part of the creative process. I can fully respect when someone comes back with rates for their services but at the same time I probably will not work with them unless it is a commercial project where everyone gets compensated monetarily. Feb 05 16 09:50 am Link I send messages with "Paid Job" in subject line and still get ingnored/unread I doubt the OP's view is the sole reason Feb 05 16 10:50 am Link Brooklyn Bridge Images wrote: The "sole reason" is "not interested". Feb 05 16 10:53 am Link Meh.. Feb 05 16 10:55 am Link A-M-P wrote: May not have to, but many people sure seem to take pleasure in doing so. Feb 05 16 11:28 am Link MoRina wrote: This is common and, for the life of me, I can't understand why. How is a model going to know if she's interested if there are exactly no details about the shoot? Or if she's even able to do it (me + heights = no.) Feb 05 16 11:35 am Link There are idiots, jerks, dumb asses like that everywhere, everyday. I wouldn't let them bother me. I would just ignore and move on. Just imagine if he happens to be reading this thread, he's probably smurking and having fun, knowing that this does bother you. Feb 05 16 11:52 am Link Derek Ridgers wrote: Isis22 wrote: If you had a consistent position throughout your profile, perhaps you would be totally blameless. However, by stating Paid Assignments in your About Me, but saying Depends on Assignments in your Details section, you are sending contradicting info to those seeking to shoot. You are inviting confusion and misunderstanding about what terms you shoot under. And it means that, of course, some unwanted messages will be sent, as your stance is currently unclear. Their only way to find out is to ask. If the questions bother you, correct your Details section to read Paid Assignments Only, so you are not sending mixed signals. Feb 05 16 12:27 pm Link
Model Posts: 6638 MacMurdo - permanent station of the US, Sector claimed by New Zealand, Antarctica Lieza Nova wrote: I'd prefer to get all or most of the details up front too; however, much of what I have read in these forums over the years disagrees with that. Many models seem to have the tl;dr issue and get annoyed if the photographer sends more than a few lines initially... or they accuse the photographer of sending a cut and paste message which doesn't make them feel special. Feb 05 16 01:37 pm Link Angie Borras wrote: I have been here long enough to have accumulated a number of unprofessional responses from the other side of the lens and I imagine that most photographers and models share that experience, but, as a matter of professional courtesy, I still reply to all messages. Feb 05 16 03:23 pm Link MoRina wrote: Really, I'm not even wanting much detail in an initial email. Type of shoot and pay is about it. Feb 05 16 03:23 pm Link MoRina wrote: Good point. Feb 05 16 03:24 pm Link Phoenix Glamour wrote: That's kind of my feeling. Feb 05 16 03:51 pm Link MoRina wrote: Lieza Nova wrote: Which is why as a photographer I can't win. If I put all the details up front, a model will complain that I've written too much. If I start with a brief introduction, another model will ignore it. You are damned if you do and damned if you don't. Feb 05 16 03:53 pm Link American Glamour wrote: The sword cuts both ways. If the photographer sends an honest, to-the-point request with a couple of details about what they have in mind...and then the model messages back something unkind (or doesn't respond) - then count your blessings, you likely dodged a bullet. Feb 05 16 04:10 pm Link Lieza Nova wrote: sometimes I just see a model that I would love to photograph so I contact them and tell them so. I figure if they like my work then they will reply back to discuss. I dont always have a concept or budget in mind in the first email. more of an introduction I suppose. sometimes thats all it is. Feb 05 16 04:14 pm Link |
