Forums > General Industry > Advice needed!

Model

Miss Lana Lamour

Posts: 1

Toronto, Ontario, Canada

Jan 09 17 09:06 pm Link

Photographer

Flair Photography

Posts: 292

Rochester, New York, US

Accept the loss and move on.

He technically doesn't owe you anything since there wasn't any currency exchanged, just time, and the only thing a model release would do is allow him to directly profit from selling the images. It doesn't matter if you signed something or not, the photos are his intellectual property, if he wants to use them on his business card he doesn't need your approval to use them. However since he's not a big fan of yourself, according to you, he probably won't be using them for much. hmm

Accept the loss and move on.

Jan 10 17 12:10 am Link

Photographer

Patrick Walberg

Posts: 45198

San Juan Bautista, California, US

Flair Photography wrote:
Accept the loss and move on.

He technically doesn't owe you anything since there wasn't any currency exchanged, just time, and the only thing a model release would do is allow him to directly profit from selling the images. It doesn't matter if you signed something or not, the photos are his intellectual property, if he wants to use them on his business card he doesn't need your approval to use them. However since he's not a big fan of yourself, according to you, he probably won't be using them for much. hmm

Accept the loss and move on.

I think the laws are slightly more in favor of the model in Canada, but I could be wrong.  Here is something;  http://zvulony.ca/2014/articles/interne … hotograph/

If no formal relationship (e.g., a release form signed by the subject) exists that permits the photographer to licence the use of the photograph for all uses or otherwise waives the subject’s, sitter’s or model’s rights, then the advertiser must seek permission from the subject of the photograph because the subject has retained both privacy and publicity rights in the use of their likeness.

So it's a good thing that she did not sign anything.  The photographer sounds crazy though.

Jan 10 17 12:49 am Link

Photographer

64318

Posts: 1638

San Anselmo, California, US

One of the most important words in the English language is the word  " NEXT".....  Many demented people are very good at covering up their disturbed personas. Treat this as a bad experience & move on.  You will be happy you did.

Jan 10 17 01:45 am Link

Photographer

Risen Phoenix Photo

Posts: 3779

Minneapolis, Minnesota, US

First everyone will just tell you to move on but I would not give up so easily. Clearly this guy tried to "punish you" for your behaviour by giving some 5x7 prints and some inadequate digital copies.

I think that you may have learned a valuable lesson from this, but let me help you with additional demands for you to make of photographers.


1. Any print that you intend to use for a physical portfolio should be at min 8.5 X11 and more likely 9x12.  If not then for the images where you choose to have prints made yourself have the photographer give you high res images at least 5 to 10 MB.  These also should not have a watermark on them so they can be used in a portfolio.

For any digital copies for MM, or Instagram or your other social media they should be 1000 pixels on the long edge of the image, at 360 dpi, this will make black and white make. Images 400 to 650 kb and color images 650 to 900 kb. 

Insist on a release from the photographer and add these stipulations into the release. Also ask for a minimum of 5 fully edited images from the shoot, which need to be given to you from 1 month after the end from the shoot, add this to the release as well.

I give model's anywhere from 20 to 40 images from a shoot, with no watermarks, and have them fully edited and back to them within 3 days of the shoot.

The way you describe it the quality of the images he gave you were app 25 kb or less, that is why I say he is punishing you.

Now, if his behaviour was inappropriate during the shoot, then it is important to use the CAM ( contact a moderator) on MM and let them know what the inappropriate behavior was.

Next time when you are considering a photographers to work with ask for references or see if he gave credit to the models he worked with so you can do reference checks. If you or he is part of a Facebook modeling group ask other models in the group if they have worked with him and what their experience was. 


It is guys like him that give photographers a bad name.

Better luck to you with togs in the future.

Jan 10 17 03:35 am Link

Photographer

WisconsinArt

Posts: 612

Nashotah, Wisconsin, US

It's a pain to do TF and even more annoying when the model asks for special requests. So you crossed the line with this photographer.

However, the line varies with each photographer. In this case the photog has a low tolerance to the point of being absurd.

What gets me about photogs is how protective they can be for images. You got small images because it limits what you can do with them as you have noticed. You're somehow going to make a million dollars from those pictures and photogs are fearful they will never see a dime. Oh, come on! Just give the model a decent picture because that was the arrangement!

There are lots of threads where photographers insist you get a model release, even for TF. Guys like this, there should be a form that models give to photographers...  how many images you will get, size, resolution, etc. At least state that verbally or in an email so it's understood what a model expects from their TF shoot.

Anyway, the Photog flaked on you. Kick the dog then move on.

Jan 10 17 03:47 am Link

Photographer

Looknsee Photography

Posts: 26342

Portland, Oregon, US

Flair Photography wrote:
Accept the loss and move on.

There's a famous saying, which I don't quite remember.  Paraphrasing:  Those who don't study history are doomed to repeat it.  Learn from this situation and take steps in the future to avoid a repeat of similar problems.

For future situations, one thing I'd suggest:  document your expectations!  These include the size, compression, & format of the images you are to receive, whether the images are going to be watermarked, when the images will be delivered, etc.  Other posters have already chimed in with suggestions:

Risen Phoenix Photo wrote:
1. Any print that you intend to use for a physical portfolio should be at min 8.5 X11 and more likely 9x12.  If not then for the images where you choose to have prints made yourself have the photographer give you high res images at least 5 to 10 MB.  These also should not have a watermark on them so they can be used in a portfolio.

For any digital copies for MM, or Instagram or your other social media they should be 1000 pixels on the long edge of the image, at 360 dpi, this will make black and white make. Images 400 to 650 kb and color images 650 to 900 kb. 

Insist on a release from the photographer and add these stipulations into the release. Also ask for a minimum of 5 fully edited images from the shoot, which need to be given to you from 1 month after the end from the shoot, add this to the release as well.  ...

Next time when you are considering a photographers to work with ask for references or see if he gave credit to the models he worked with so you can do reference checks. If you or he is part of a Facebook modeling group ask other models in the group if they have worked with him and what their experience was.

To which I'll add that there is value to having an active local photographic community.  If people know you, it's easier to get recommendations and references.  Building a community -- that's a topic for a different thread.

Jan 10 17 08:47 am Link

Photographer

Loki Studio

Posts: 3523

Royal Oak, Michigan, US

Unfortunately, this is simply a conflict with unprofessional people. In the future you should be very specific with every modeling shoot concerning exactly you will receive to reduce conflicts.

In this situation now, its very unlikely that any further action or effort will get you what you want.  Moving on is he best answer.  If you feel strongly that you where wronged, you can put a "Not Recomended" statement on your profile with his MM#, but this usually makes models look just as dramatic as photographers.

If you discover the photos are used for advertising without you having signed a model release, you have privacy rights and could sue for compensation,  The reality is these lawsuits are expensive and don't often collect $$$.

Jan 10 17 08:54 am Link