Forums > Off-Topic Discussion > The NBA Thread

Photographer

Looknsee Photography

Posts: 26342

Portland, Oregon, US

The NBA Finals start on Thursday, with the same two teams that competed in the last two finals.

I invite you to comment and/or predict on the NBA finals.  Also, feel free to comment on the NBA in general.

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It's difficult to choose who I think will win the finals -- I'll say the Warriors in six, but any result would not surprise me.

I think it's pretty obvious that there isn't a lot of parity in the NBA right now.  There are two top tier teams, the handful of middle tier team are not even close (the top two teams went 24-1 in the playoffs), and the bottom tier teams are just embarrassing.

May 28 17 07:51 pm Link

Photographer

Nor-Cal Photography

Posts: 3718

Walnut Creek, California, US

Even with LeBron being the closest thing to superman the NBA has ever seen, Warriors easily in 5 games.  Average margin of victory in their 4 wins will be 13 points.

smile

May 28 17 09:17 pm Link

Photographer

Motordrive Photography

Posts: 7086

Lodi, California, US

I've pretty much made up my mind, I'm just trying to figure out the over/under for LeBron flops and
times Steph Curry gets mugged in the paint. Oh, and Dramond crotch fu kicks.

May 28 17 09:40 pm Link

Photographer

Looknsee Photography

Posts: 26342

Portland, Oregon, US

I think I agree that LeBron is the best player in the league right now.  His ability to take over a game is amazing.  I don't feel comfortable when there's a debate about whether he or Michael Jordan is the best of all time.  One thing that MJ did that LeBron didn't was that MJ made his teammates better.  As far as taking over a game, I think no one did it better than Wilt Chamberlain -- heck, they had to change the rules of the game because he was so gifted physically.  But today, LeBron is the gold standard.

May 29 17 09:25 am Link

Photographer

Looknsee Photography

Posts: 26342

Portland, Oregon, US

Another thought:  Dean Smith, a HOF college coach at UNC, used to advise his players that they could consider joining the NBA draft early if they are projected to be a lottery pick (i.e. early in the first round).  I think that's solid advice.  However, there are tons of freshman declaring for the draft with only 10 minutes of playing time per game & a handful of points.  Of course, it's none of my business, and college isn't for everyone, but there's a lot of childish behavior in the NBA, and populating the courts with immature & spoiled youngsters is not a solution.

May 29 17 01:22 pm Link

Model

Model Sarah

Posts: 40987

Columbus, Ohio, US

Looknsee Photography wrote:
I think I agree that LeBron is the best player in the league right now.  His ability to take over a game is amazing.  I don't feel comfortable when there's a debate about whether he or Michael Jordan is the best of all time.  One thing that MJ did that LeBron didn't was that MJ made his teammates better.  As far as taking over a game, I think no one did it better than Wilt Chamberlain -- heck, they had to change the rules of the game because he was so gifted physically.  But today, LeBron is the gold standard.

There is no debate. LeBron is no Micheal Jordan.

Cavs will win again and Cleveland will talk about it for another fucking year.

May 30 17 11:33 am Link

Photographer

Brian Diaz

Posts: 65617

Danbury, Connecticut, US

There's been a lot of chatter about salaries this year, especially since this is the third straight Cavs/Warriors Finals AND together they have lost a total of 1 playoff game.  There's a serious imbalance going on here.

This isn't the players' fault or the teams' fault.  They're both doing whatever they can within the rules (or what they can get away with outside the rules) to win championships.  That's the goal.  But it's making the sport less fun to watch. 

This is the league's fault.

There's a $94 million salary cap, and if you go over that, you pay a "luxury tax" to the league.  Well, the Cavs have gone way over that figure in salaries, and are reportedly paying over $50 million in luxury tax.  So instead of $94 million going toward building a good team, they're paying about $182 million.  That seems to go against the point of a salary cap.

To make maters worse, the NBA has individual maximum salaries for players, limiting what teams have to pay to get the top players.  There's no way for teams to compete for the top players except by accumulating other top players.  I can't blame Durant for wanting to play with Curry, or for that matter for Jame and Love for wanting to play with Irving.  All those guys, particularly Lebron, should be making more.  If teams could actually have competed for him based on salary, he'd likely be making $50, $60, maybe $70 million a year.  And if he were, the Cavs wouldn't be able to afford to pay Irving and Love what they're worth.

I'm tired of teams packed with superstars in predictable playoff scenarios.  I want to see superstars and super coaches elevating the games of their teammates, creating surprising and exciting seasons.

That said, Warriors in 6.

May 30 17 03:00 pm Link

Photographer

Lovely Day Media

Posts: 5885

Vineland, New Jersey, US

Brian Diaz wrote:
There's been a lot of chatter about salaries this year, especially since this is the third straight Cavs/Warriors Finals AND together they have lost a total of 1 playoff game.  There's a serious imbalance going on here.

This isn't the players' fault or the teams' fault.  They're both doing whatever they can within the rules (or what they can get away with outside the rules) to win championships.  That's the goal.  But it's making the sport less fun to watch. 

This is the league's fault.

There's a $94 million salary cap, and if you go over that, you pay a "luxury tax" to the league.  Well, the Cavs have gone way over that figure in salaries, and are reportedly paying over $50 million in luxury tax.  So instead of $94 million going toward building a good team, they're paying about $182 million.  That seems to go against the point of a salary cap.

To make maters worse, the NBA has individual maximum salaries for players, limiting what teams have to pay to get the top players.  There's no way for teams to compete for the top players except by accumulating other top players.  I can't blame Durant for wanting to play with Curry, or for that matter for Jame and Love for wanting to play with Irving.  All those guys, particularly Lebron, should be making more.  If teams could actually have competed for him based on salary, he'd likely be making $50, $60, maybe $70 million a year.  And if he were, the Cavs wouldn't be able to afford to pay Irving and Love what they're worth.

I'm tired of teams packed with superstars in predictable playoff scenarios.  I want to see superstars and super coaches elevating the games of their teammates, creating surprising and exciting seasons.

That said, Warriors in 6.

Interesting ... I mostly agree, except I think it'll be Warriors in 5.

May 30 17 07:45 pm Link

Photographer

Looknsee Photography

Posts: 26342

Portland, Oregon, US

If the league will allow / encourage the existence of two top tier teams with 30 middle & lower tier teams, then I want all the games of the top tier teams to be televised, and don't bother me with the local teams preempting local programming.  And quit blacking out local games that are not sold out, too / either.

May 30 17 08:25 pm Link

Photographer

Chuckarelei

Posts: 11271

Seattle, Washington, US

Brian Diaz wrote:
There's been a lot of chatter about salaries this year, especially since this is the third straight Cavs/Warriors Finals AND together they have lost a total of 1 playoff game.  There's a serious imbalance going on here.
This isn't the players' fault or the teams' fault.  They're both doing whatever they can within the rules (or what they can get away with outside the rules) to win championships.  That's the goal.  But it's making the sport less fun to watch. 
This is the league's fault.
There's a $94 million salary cap, and if you go over that, you pay a "luxury tax" to the league.  Well, the Cavs have gone way over that figure in salaries, and are reportedly paying over $50 million in luxury tax.  So instead of $94 million going toward building a good team, they're paying about $182 million.  That seems to go against the point of a salary cap.
To make maters worse, the NBA has individual maximum salaries for players, limiting what teams have to pay to get the top players.  There's no way for teams to compete for the top players except by accumulating other top players.  I can't blame Durant for wanting to play with Curry, or for that matter for Jame and Love for wanting to play with Irving.  All those guys, particularly Lebron, should be making more.  If teams could actually have competed for him based on salary, he'd likely be making $50, $60, maybe $70 million a year.  And if he were, the Cavs wouldn't be able to afford to pay Irving and Love what they're worth.
I'm tired of teams packed with superstars in predictable playoff scenarios.  I want to see superstars and super coaches elevating the games of their teammates, creating surprising and exciting seasons.
That said, Warriors in 6.

Even without the luxury tax, there are still many other free agents rules that allow wealthy teams to stack up talents or prevent small market teams to compete. The WNBA has a hard salary cap, however it has more or less the free-agency structure. such as restricted free agents which the original team has first right of refusal. And the WNBA is exactly like the NBA, there are two teams the stacked with superstars while the rest of the leagues are average to mediocre.

Even Kevin Durant is longer is Oklahoma, I'm still rooting for the Cavs. Cleveland needs it more than Oakland.

Besides, Draymond Green is such a dirty player.

May 30 17 10:07 pm Link

Photographer

Brian Diaz

Posts: 65617

Danbury, Connecticut, US

So, can the Cavs come back at home?  Or are we looking at the second time a team will sweep LeBron in the Finals?

Jun 06 17 11:03 am Link

Photographer

Looknsee Photography

Posts: 26342

Portland, Oregon, US

Brian Diaz wrote:
So, can the Cavs come back at home?  Or are we looking at the second time a team will sweep LeBron in the Finals?

Well, the Cavs were down 0-2 last year, and they came back to win the series.  Winning in Cleveland would be a significant test for the Warriors.  We'll see.

Jun 06 17 12:47 pm Link

Photographer

Instinct Images

Posts: 23162

San Diego, California, US

That had to be a very demoralizing loss for the Cavs. I don't see them coming back from 3-0. Maybe the Warriors will be the first team to sweep the playoffs. That would be an incredibly impressive feat.

Jun 07 17 11:36 pm Link

Photographer

Looknsee Photography

Posts: 26342

Portland, Oregon, US

I think the Cavs have a win in them -- last night was close, but they missed some key shots at the end.  Still, Warriors sweeping the entire playoffs -- that's a record that can never be broken.

Jun 08 17 08:11 am Link

Photographer

Brian Diaz

Posts: 65617

Danbury, Connecticut, US

Looknsee Photography wrote:
Still, Warriors sweeping the entire playoffs -- that's a record that can never be broken.

Haha, yeah, I guess it can't--unless the league somehow adds games to the playoffs.  But I really don't see that happening.

I wonder if LeBron is one game away from becoming the first player to be swept twice in the Finals (2007 and 2017).

Edit:  Nope, he won't because the Lakers were swept in both 83 and 89, with Kareem, Magic, Worthy, and Michael Cooper on both teams.

Jun 08 17 09:40 am Link

Photographer

Nor-Cal Photography

Posts: 3718

Walnut Creek, California, US

Nor-Cal Photography wrote:
Even with LeBron being the closest thing to superman the NBA has ever seen, Warriors easily in 5 games.  Average margin of victory in their 4 wins will be 13 points.

Prediction made BEFORE the start of the first game.  Right on, huh!?

smile

Jun 08 17 09:02 pm Link

Photographer

Instinct Images

Posts: 23162

San Diego, California, US

Boy the Cavs sure came out fired up. It's going to be tough for the Warriors to pull this game out but I wouldn't put it past them.

And the Cavs shatter the all-time record for most points in the first half of a NBA Finals game. Pretty incredible effort.

Jun 09 17 07:01 pm Link

Photographer

Motordrive Photography

Posts: 7086

Lodi, California, US

well, the inevitable (in my opinion) has happened. GSW are world champions again. congrats to them

The series had the poorest officiating that I have seen.

KD was MVP, very much deserved  borat

what a marathon, the playoffs are a third of the seasons length = cash grab  hmm

Jun 12 17 09:10 pm Link

Photographer

Instinct Images

Posts: 23162

San Diego, California, US

The Warriors went 31-2 in their last 33 games. Pretty incredible. The rest of the league has some catching up to do.

Jun 13 17 12:39 am Link

Photographer

Looknsee Photography

Posts: 26342

Portland, Oregon, US

Thinking back to the beginning of this past season, everyone expected that Golden State & Cleveland would meet in the finals.

Going back to the start of the playoffs, everyone expected these two teams would meet in the finals, despite the Cavs coming in second in the Eastern Conference.

With the addition of Kevin Durant, everyone expected the Warriors to win.

Big surprise -- everyone was right.

However -- is that good for the NBA?  The NBA is a two team league with ~30 middle & lower tier "minor" league teams.  Where's the value of parity?  Basically, today, the rich just get richer, and by that I mean that the teams willing to spend 'way over the salary cap can do so, as long as they pay the luxury tax. 

Sure, watching a seven game series between the Warriors & Cavs can be fun, but no one really wants to watch a seven game series between the 76ers & the Knicks.  My point -- the elite competition is elite, but the average competition is not as good as college basketball.

Jun 13 17 09:12 am Link

Photographer

Chuckarelei

Posts: 11271

Seattle, Washington, US

Looknsee Photography wrote:
Sure, watching a seven game series between the Warriors & Cavs can be fun, but no one really wants to watch a seven game series between the 76ers & the Knicks.  My point -- the elite competition is elite, but the average competition is not as good as college basketball.

College basketball has it's own elite group too.

Jun 13 17 10:25 am Link

Photographer

Looknsee Photography

Posts: 26342

Portland, Oregon, US

Looknsee Photography wrote:
Sure, watching a seven game series between the Warriors & Cavs can be fun, but no one really wants to watch a seven game series between the 76ers & the Knicks.  My point -- the elite competition is elite, but the average competition is not as good as college basketball.

Chuckarelei wrote:
College basketball has it's own elite group too.

Semi-true.  There are more than two teams in the "elite group" of college teams.  Indeed, there are over a dozen elite teams, any one of which is likely to win the championship.  Further, all teams are expected to turn over their player personnel every (one to) four years.  There is no comparison.

Further, they call the NCAA tournament in March "Madness" for a reason.  The 68 best teams, all of which are on a "lose or go home" basis.  Meanwhile, the Warriors & the Cabs got to the playoff with something like a combined 24-1 record.  Not really competitive.

Heck -- I wonder:  could the NCAA champions beat the "average" NBA team in a short series?

Jun 13 17 01:21 pm Link