I just support it. Helped feel a few gigs. I recommend it to the models i shoot. And we've done some promotions together which doesn't matter.
The reason I posted in the thread was to rebuff a rumor about the site charging.
Now its a testosterone bull pen with ego's filled with law degrees from wikipedia
Seems to me that you have your own forum there, your own mailing list, and the site's ownership is in the same geographic location that you are. You just support it, but you're the only one with their own forum and mailing list? And you've been here at MM for over a year and a half and only come into the forum when your site is mentioned?
Sorry, not buying it.
As for your attempts to portray this as anything even remotely favorable to you or your position, well, I don't think anyone is fooled here except you, sir.
Had you simply stated, "Gee, I didn't realize I couldn't do this," we would have been done. But since you insisted and argued, that changed things. I am, you see, also involved in this industry in terms of casting calls and posted jobs, and have a personal interest in more than one site that does so. As such, your activities are a direct concern of mine.
So my comments are neither empty nor trivial. And your insistence upon continuing your actions merely reinforces my position that this is an issue that needs to be addressed.
Emeritus wrote: Actor's Access is an especially bad choice, since they are not the casting directors, and in fact do not own the copyright on the jobs they post there. You haven't the tiniest notion of how this industry works, how copyright law works, or what you are talking about.
Leo Marshall wrote: I'm not saying this to sound shrewd.
That was intellegently wrong.
Here's the breakdown on actors access.
Because of their copyright only agencies or paying casting directors can redistribute the breakdowns they receive from actors access. And only to their talent. The talent can view it and subscribe independently to them but they can' legally redistribute them. That is because of the copright on the format. People pay to view the breakdown in a certain format.
There's a few people on craigslist peddling copies of them which is wrong.
The original casting. The job itself can be reposted.
I say you, because you're a principal of the site. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to do the research necessary to see that (though my undergraduate work was in astrophysics, so yes, I am, in fact, a rocket scientist - but that's not important).
But if you'd rather ignore that issue and stick to the fact that "the site" is breaking the law, by all means, let's get back to that issue. Please, continue to defend your... um, I mean their illegal behavior.
Because of their copyright only agencies or paying casting directors can redistribute the breakdowns they receive from actors access. And only to their talent. The talent can view it and subscribe independently to them but they can' legally redistribute them. That is because of the copright on the format. People pay to view the breakdown in a certain format.
Get a clue.
I have been a member of Actor's Access for many years, have spoken at length with their management, and have posted castings there myself. AA DOES NOT own a copyright on what I post there, nor do they claim to.
Actor's Access owns the copyright on THE FORMAT, not the castings. They assert the very same compilation copyright that Mr. Ambler referred to above, and that Model Mayhem does. You really, seriously need to learn this stuff.
I'm a photographer. I actually do this everyday and...
I post castings for projects or assignments I have and I work on SAG & AFTRA projects quite a bit.
I appreciate that they broadcast for me and that our relationship is beneficial to what I do.
But the rest of you. Really... GTFO with the rumors and assumptions. It's silly.
Emeritus wrote: Actor's Access owns the copyright on THE FORMAT, not the castings. They assert the very same compilation copyright that Mr. Ambler referred to above, and that Model Mayhem does. You really, seriously need to learn this stuff.
You seriously need to learn to read. Because you just repeated what I originally wrote.
Leo Marshall wrote: That is because of the copyright on the format. People pay to view the breakdown in a certain format.
You seriously need to learn to read. Because you just repeadted what I originally wrote.
Yes, I did. I pointed out that the CONTENT of the castings is not copyright protected by Actor's Access, and that that content enjoys no more protection than casting notices placed here or anywhere else. You are the one who claims that they are somehow special. They aren't. Copyright law applies just the same to them as it does to Model Mayhem.
As a photographer I know that whenever an important assignment needs to be filled we pass the word by any means necessary.
Word of mouth, referral, MUA, models, and if we have a budget big enough... agents.
So really... some of you are talking trash about a free site that does that which we photographers practice and promote all the time? And everyone else in this industry.
what's your day job? really How lame.
At least focus on the ones that charge for free information and take advantage of folks with no chance.
FREE INFORMATION...lol Which is exactly what it always was.
Leo Marshall wrote: And really... What ARE we talking about here?
As a photographer I know that whenever an important assignment needs to be filled we pass the word by any means necessary.
And, as a photographer who is involved in the casting process, you have every right to do that. You have no right to "pass the word" on third party castings that you have nothing to do with.
So really... some of you are talking trash about a free site
For now. Again, it is their stated intention to become a pay site.
Leo Marshall wrote: that does that which we photographers practice and promote all the time?
No. Wrong. False.
If that site wants to publish its own castings (that is what you photographers "practice and promote all the time"), more power to them. But once they start stealing other people's castings and reposting them to their own benefit (pay or not, they get a benefit from it), that is crossing the line into illegal behavior.
Emeritus wrote: For now. Again, it is their stated intention to become a pay site.
hmmm... i think you're stretching the truth again.
Post the link and quote it.
Everything I see on that site is to the contrary. And i'm actually bored with sounding like a poster boy advocate because you are spreading rumors.
"MyModelTalk is a FREE social networking community for the entertainment industry. Centered around offering free castings auditions to models, actors, and other talent".
Right now your ego driven for whatever reason with me. Ok fine. It's fair to make a complaint but your complaing to the wrong person and in the wrong way. Don't spread rumors... Not in this industry
We reserve the right to offer paying services but for no[w] the site is free.
(typo fixed in the above quotation.)
Leo Marshall wrote: And i'm actually bored with sounding like a poster boy advocate because you are spreading rumors.
Not spreading rumors. Spreading what they say about themselves. Again, get a clue.
and this link...in which the owner posted.
Aha!
Mykkal is "the owner". And Mykkal is the one posting the bulk of the castings. That means he has forfeited the protection of the Communications Decency Act, and he and his site are liable for civil and criminal liability. Thanks!
So, just to make sure we have it correct, "Mykkal" the miscreant would be:
Michael Mckoy,
FullBlown Entertainment
10 Perimter Summit BLVD NE
#4129
Atlanta, Georgia 30319
Just in case any rights-holder wants to bring a civil action against him. Did I get that right?
Leo Marshall wrote: Right now your ego driven for whatever reason with me. Ok fine. It's fair to make a complaint but your complaing to the wrong person and in the wrong way. Don't spread rumors... Not in this industry
No ego involved, sir. As I said, this site is breaking the law and as I'm involved in the industry, that's a direct threat to my business interests. You are the wrong person, that has been established. Rest assured that the right people have, indeed, been made aware of the situation. And I'm sure that the site's ownership will be very pleased with your empassioned defense here, without which I likely would not have bothered to investigate further.
Mykkal is "the owner". And Mykkal is the one posting the bulk of the castings. That means he has forfeited the protection of the Communications Decency Act, and he and his site are liable for civil and criminal liability. Thanks!
So, just to make sure we have it correct, "Mykkal" the miscreant would be:
Michael Mckoy,
FullBlown Entertainment
10 Perimter Summit BLVD NE
#4129
Atlanta, Georgia 30319
Just in case any rights-holder wants to bring a civil action against him. Did I get that right?
Leo, make sure to remind Michael that his domain name expires in September and that he should get it renewed so that it doesn't expire and someone else gets it.
do you seriously think that models, MUAs, photographers, and others aren't forwarding castings all the time in an effort to find work?
Your angry with me for rebuffing you which I don't understand. And now you're suddenly a seasoned industry veteran declaring your duty to begin drama by "alerting authorities" about a site that probably helps direct traffic here. Why would anyone care? Why do you care?
Immersion Studios wrote: Leo, make sure to remind Michael that his domain name expires in September and that he should get it renewed so that it doesn't expire and someone else gets it.
Leo isn't all that good about domain name expiration. His own photography website domain has expired . . . .
Ah, the power of public records. Thank you, ICANN for WHOIS mandates.
Why would anyone care? You don't thunk photographers take copyright violations seriously? Really? If this site is so cavalier with others' property... Well, yeah, why would anyone care?
Immersion Studios wrote: Leo, make sure to remind Michael that his domain name expires in September and that he should get it renewed so that it doesn't expire and someone else gets it.
pretty childish. especially posting the dudes address if that is it.
Someone not affiliated with this conversation. amazing. i'm leaving the playground.
Leo Marshall wrote: do you seriously think that models, MUAs, photographers, and others aren't forwarding castings all the time in an effort to find work?
So what? "Mykkal" is posting castings. That is illegal.
Leo Marshall wrote: Your angry with me for rebuffing you which I don't understand.
Gee, everybody loves being rebuffed. I don't understand either . . . .
Leo Marshall wrote: And now you're suddenly a seasoned industry veteran
You have absolutely no idea how seasoned
Leo Marshall wrote: declaring your duty to begin drama by "alerting authorities" about a site that probably helps direct traffic here.
I don't think Chris cares about traffic being directed here. Even if he does, could you please justify the claim that it is?
Leo Marshall wrote: Why would anyone care? Why do you care?
I think he explained it. But why does someone have to justify caring about a violation of law? Isn't it sufficient unto itself?
However, since I have been in that position myself, I know very well why I care about such sites (and there are many of them). They are a pox on the community. If I were of a mind to, I could explain, but I don't have the patience for someone who clearly doesn't really want the answer. Maybe you will get lucky and someone else will.
You know, Leo, you claim that you just like the site, but imagine my surprise when I see a YouTube video made by the owner of the site who threw a big birthday party for you.
Everyone was saying your name along with the site name. What a huge coincidence, Leo! They say nothing on the Internet is private anymore. I hope the site threw you a great birthday party!
Sophistocles wrote: You know, Leo, you claim that you just like the site, but imagine my surprise when I see a YouTube video made by the owner of the site who threw a big birthday party for you.
Everyone was saying your name along with the site name. What a huge coincidence, Leo! They say nothing on the Internet is private anymore. I hope the site threw you a great birthday party!
Sophistocles wrote: You know, Leo, you claim that you just like the site, but imagine my surprise when I see a YouTube video made by the owner of the site who threw a big birthday party for you.
Everyone was saying your name along with the site name. What a huge coincidence, Leo! They say nothing on the Internet is private anymore. I hope the site threw you a great birthday party!
Sophistocles wrote: You know, Leo, you claim that you just like the site, but imagine my surprise when I see a YouTube video made by the owner of the site who threw a big birthday party for you.
Everyone was saying your name along with the site name. What a huge coincidence, Leo! They say nothing on the Internet is private anymore. I hope the site threw you a great birthday party!
Leo Marshall wrote: That site your talking about is a FREE site that seems to collect castings from everywhere and broadcasts them to interested talent.
I think you're all overreacting.
Especially if all that is happening is that models (which your looking for) are being informed of what your looking for. lol, what's the problem?
lol... this whole thread is off target. Mostly rumor even..
And I quote: "MyModelTalk is a FREE social networking community for the entertainment industry. Centered around offering free castings auditions to models, actors, and other talent in Atlanta, Miami, Los Angelos, California, Georgia, Florida, and New york!"
I will not cast models from there. I am getting emails with no pics or stats. It would end up being way too much work to check references.
How do you figure this thread is off target? Since I started it to your post people have been helpful. Anyways.... nevermind, no response needed.
Sophistocles wrote: Nevermind, yes, doing a little research shows that Mr. Marhsall is, indeed, involved with the site mentioned above. The site is in Atlanta, GA as is Mr. Marshall, and if you go to subscribe to their newsletter, one such subscription available is:
Photography by Leo Marshall - Official Newslist of Leo Marshall, a celebrity photographer located in Atlanta, Gerogia. Find out news on obtaining a photoshoot, his new travels, or events hosted by Leo.
Very honorable of you to say so before jumping to its defense, sir. Naturally you're going to accuse me of not knowing what I'm talking about. Unfortunately, I do.
Bottom line: copying castings from other sites is a violation of copyright law.
Shame on you Leo... If you think I need help with my castings you are wrong.
If you think it is okay to copy an d paste my casting on your site..you are very wrong.
I can't tell if you actually had good intentions or you were just trying to make you
site look busy and worth joining but regardless you should at the very least ask for permission.
I too will be putting together a harsher letter and a link to this thread to send back to responders.
Doug Swinskey wrote: you know whats funny, the folks that copy and paste castings from MM and craiglist..they sell those as casting leads...models actually pay to get these lead delivered in emails...
Ex Voto Studio wrote: Shame on you Leo... If you think I need help with my castings you are wrong.
If you think it is okay to copy an d paste my casting on your site..you are very wrong.
I can't tell if you actually had good intentions or you were just trying to make you
site look busy and worth joining but regardless you should at the very least ask for permission.
I too will be putting together a harsher letter and a link to this thread to send back to responders.
Wow. So not only did they copy your casting, but they didn't even do it in an automated way. Someone had to actually go to the trouble of getting your email and images. Then comment later and say to contact you! Not just copying, but it would seem that they're deliberately misrepresenting you, making it look like you posted there on your own and that they know or are associated with you!
The really humorous thing is that Leo Marshall did far more harm to his reputation and business with his antics in this forum than the good he intended by defending his business practices.
Bill Mason Images wrote: The really humorous thing is that Leo Marshall did far more harm to his reputation and business with his antics in this forum than the good he intended by defending his business practices.
Doug Swinskey wrote: you know whats funny, the folks that copy and paste castings from MM and craiglist..they sell those as casting leads...models actually pay to get these lead delivered in emails...
100% true... another website known by three letters starts with an O ends with a P did this to a casting i put up a few years ago. It was a casting for a singer/model for a major producer-very well known) and sure as shit i saw my casting blasted out to members that only like gold or above could see... I was like um... lol
"This casting notice has only been approved to be posted at ModelMayhem.com. Responses from people via unauthorized websites and publications will not be accepted."
The notice serves two really great purposes:
1.) It drastically reduces the amount of unqualified applicants and emails that came in from people AFTER the project ended.
2.) If published, it makes the casting website/publication look like total schmucks and makes it OBVIOUS to their audience that they're getting shafted, especially if they're paying to get those casting calls and notices.
Dezzi for North America wrote: 100% true... another website known by three letters starts with an O ends with a P did this to a casting i put up a few years ago. It was a casting for a singer/model for a major producer-very well known) and sure as shit i saw my casting blasted out to members that only like gold or above could see... I was like um... lol
Did you post the casting there on OMP? Because that's what they do - and those are the terms you agree to. They take anything you post and email it out to paying members. That's their business model. That's what their members pay for, and by posting a casting there, that's the value you're receiving. They're doing nothing wrong.
Now, if they culled it from *another* site and then sent it to paying-only members, that's different. Is that what you mean? Because if that's the case, then yes, they're violating copyright. But I must state that I've never seen them do this.
