login info join!
This thread was locked on 2010-02-23 06:03:33. Reason: OP request
Forums > Photography Talk > 15 year old implied topless.. What would you do??? Search   Reply
12345last
Photographer
ADB-Fotografie
Posts: 303
Rotterdam, Zuid-Holland, Netherlands


NEVER MIND... I HAVE MADE UP MY MIND, THIS CAN BE CLOSED.
Feb 22 10 08:35 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Making Shots
Posts: 5
Goldsboro, North Carolina, US


Don't do it. Let them find another person to do it...
Feb 22 10 08:37 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Davison Photography
Posts: 5
Harlow, England, United Kingdom


Well, I would ask the mother first if she is okay with this. And think to yourself, whether you're comfortable with this.
Feb 22 10 08:38 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Shizam1
Posts: 2,997
Cumming, Georgia, US


I would read all the previous threads on under-aged models smile

Personally, myself, I wouldn't even consider it unless this is highly paid.  Plenty of 18+ models who will do implied topless.
Feb 22 10 08:38 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
PYPI FASHION
Posts: 36,332
San Francisco, California, US


It's up to you. I assume that does not violate any laws in Holland. If you do shoot something like this, you cannot use it on MM.
Feb 22 10 08:38 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Set222
Posts: 8,900
Sydney, New South Wales, Australia


It's just a plain no
we have all done shots like this and 95%of the time you see the models nipples which is just not cool for a 15 yr old
and even if you don't everyone who sees the image will think you did
Feb 22 10 08:38 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Quinna B Photography
Posts: 440
Moorcroft, Wyoming, US


I wouldnt do it!!!! to many possibilities for a lawsuit....
Feb 22 10 08:38 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
ADB-Fotografie
Posts: 303
Rotterdam, Zuid-Holland, Netherlands


Shizam1 wrote:
I would read all the previous threads on under-aged models smile

Personally, myself, I wouldn't even consider it unless this is highly paid.  Plenty of 18+ models who will do implied topless.

It's not even that I want the shot.. She wants it... I can get plenty models myself, but she's paying me for it... Not top-dollar though, just  35,00 big_smile

Feb 22 10 08:39 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Bored Squid Photography
Posts: 32
Jacksonville, Florida, US


there's no way, that i personally would be comfortable doing something like that.  even with the mom present, that would just creep me out.
Feb 22 10 08:40 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
ADB-Fotografie
Posts: 303
Rotterdam, Zuid-Holland, Netherlands


Ok, thanks.. I'm not doing it smile
Feb 22 10 08:41 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
PYPI FASHION
Posts: 36,332
San Francisco, California, US


It's a personal choice. What we think does not matter. I'll wager this thread does not make it to the end of page 2 before someone screams it is illegal. Maybe it is illegal in Holland. I have no idea. It's certainly not illegal in the U.S.
Feb 22 10 08:41 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Shizam1
Posts: 2,997
Cumming, Georgia, US


Chieffie wrote:

It's not even that I want the shot.. She wants it... I can get plenty models myself, but she's paying me for it... Not top-dollar though, just  35,00 big_smile

Ok, you're not in the US, so I don't know the rules and what society thinks about under-18 girls posing without a shirt on for you.

Do some research and get answers from people living in an area with the same laws.

Feb 22 10 08:41 am  Link  Quote 
Model
M A B
Posts: 6,504
Richmond, Virginia, US


PYPI FASHION wrote:
It's a personal choice. What we think does not matter. I'll wager this thread does not make it to the end of page 2 before someone screams it is illegal. Maybe it is illegal in Holland. I have no idea. It's certainly not illegal in the U.S.

This. Look into your local laws and make a judgment call from there.

Feb 22 10 08:42 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Mickle Design Werks
Posts: 5,949
Washington, District of Columbia, US


Chieffie wrote:
So here's the deal:

My colleague's daughter, 15 years old, s paying me to shoot her. My colleague, her mother, is also present. Now she has mailed me she wants to do an implied topless, much like this one:
http://photos.modelmayhem.com/photos/100130/17/4b64e08d5935d.jpg

I am assuming the mom agrees. What would YOU do? She's paying for it, but normally I wouldn't shoot a 15 year old this way...

If you can handle the potential legal issue that you could possibly subject yourself to, go right ahead.

Given the ambiguity with the 2256 and 2257 regs You couldn't pay me enough to do an implied nude of a minor in this country. The Fed don't care if the Mom or Dad is there, they only care that you did it. Why give them a "Go To Jail" card?

Edit: just read that the OP is in Holland. Perhaps they are a little more tolerant about this than the US.

I'd proceed with caution. Check on the child porn laws and regs to see what constitutes this. Perhaps you could get a lawyer to see if this kind of picture is safe for you to take.

Feb 22 10 08:43 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Shaun Dent
Posts: 169
Roanoke, Virginia, US


Chieffie wrote:
So here's the deal:

My colleague's daughter, 15 years old, s paying me to shoot her. My colleague, her mother, is also present. Now she has mailed me she wants to do an implied topless, much like this one:
http://photos.modelmayhem.com/photos/100130/17/4b64e08d5935d.jpg

I am assuming the mom agrees. What would YOU do? She's paying for it, but normally I wouldn't shoot a 15 year old this way...

See if she wants to do an "implied" Implied topless. See the example pic? what if you angled it to where the model wore a tube top and her hand wrapped around to her back to cover the band going around her arms covering her breasts? This way you get the effect she wants and she is not nude at anytime.

If her breasts are covered via her arms then what's the problem? In the example pick she is covered more than she would have been if she wore a bikini top?

Feb 22 10 08:45 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
ADB-Fotografie
Posts: 303
Rotterdam, Zuid-Holland, Netherlands


"2256 and 2257 regs"

I have NO idea what these are, and I'm pretty sure we don't have them in Holland. Also, it's NOT illegal to do implied nude with 15 Y/O here, this is just me asking you guys what you would do...
Feb 22 10 08:45 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
ADB-Fotografie
Posts: 303
Rotterdam, Zuid-Holland, Netherlands


Studio2512 wrote:

See if she wants to do an "implied" Implied topless. See the example pic? what if you angled it to where the model wore a tube top and her hand wrapped around to her back to cover the band going around her arms covering her breasts? This way you get the effect she wants and she is not nude at anytime.

If her breasts are covered via her arms then what's the problem? In the example pick she is covered more than she would have been if she wore a bikini top?

Hmmm... Interesting... I'll see about this one smile

Feb 22 10 08:46 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
JA Sanchez
Posts: 6,830
Miami, Florida, US


I would do it but I would also have her wear 'stickies' so that she is not technically topless (rather large stickies, I might add). It would also have to be a paid shoot, a nice paying one at that. The risk is just not worth it otherwise.


Yes, I realize it's not illegal to shoot  even full frontal nudity with a minor, but all it takes is one accusation and I am out thousands in legal fees and having my hard drive taken into custody for examination, and all sorts of other problems that I can't afford.
Feb 22 10 08:47 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Brooklyn Bridge Images
Posts: 9,196
Brooklyn, New York, US


Given that most of the posters on this forum are US based and know nothing about the laws and culture of your country you are not going to get much useful advice here.
Ask this question in a forum based in Holland or Europe.
Feb 22 10 08:47 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Mickle Design Werks
Posts: 5,949
Washington, District of Columbia, US


Chieffie wrote:
"2256 and 2257 regs"

I have NO idea what these are, and I'm pretty sure we don't have them in Holland. Also, it's NOT illegal to do implied nude with 15 Y/O here, this is just me asking you guys what you would do...

sorry they are US Code of Federal Regulations related to Child Pornography.  They don't apply to you in Holland.

They are not illegal in the US either but the those regulations are so subjective that taking the image may not be worth the risk of some activist Prosecutor deciding to make your life a living hell and try to put you in jail for child porn while you drown in debt from your legal bills.

Is the risk worth the reward?

Feb 22 10 08:47 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Shizam1
Posts: 2,997
Cumming, Georgia, US


Chieffie wrote:
"2256 and 2257 regs"

I have NO idea what these are, and I'm pretty sure we don't have them in Holland. Also, it's NOT illegal to do implied nude with 15 Y/O here, this is just me asking you guys what you would do...

If it is NOT illegal to do an implied nude, and no social judgements will be applied to you for taking the picture, then I say go for it.  Just make sure the parents are on board with it,  make it a beautiful picture and everyone will be happy.

Feb 22 10 08:48 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Shon D.- Femme
Posts: 24,369
Virginia Beach, Virginia, US


Chieffie wrote:
So here's the deal:

My colleague's daughter, 15 years old, s paying me to shoot her. My colleague, her mother, is also present. Now she has mailed me she wants to do an implied topless, much like this one:
http://photos.modelmayhem.com/photos/100130/17/4b64e08d5935d.jpg

I am assuming the mom agrees. What would YOU do? She's paying for it, but normally I wouldn't shoot a 15 year old this way...

I'd shoot it. I'd shoot a shot like my avatar even, and the law would be on my side here where I live. I am not familiar with the law where you are, though.

Feb 22 10 08:49 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
ADB-Fotografie
Posts: 303
Rotterdam, Zuid-Holland, Netherlands


Shizam1 wrote:

If it is NOT illegal to do an implied nude, and no social judgements will be applied to you for taking the picture, then I say go for it.  Just make sure the parents are on board with it,  make it a beautiful picture and everyone will be happy.

Actually, reading all these answers it occurred to me that I'm not comfortable doing it, even if it is legal... I've just mailed her saying so...

Feb 22 10 08:49 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Good Egg Productions
Posts: 15,211
Orlando, Florida, US


What would I do?

I wouldn't.
Feb 22 10 08:49 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
ACPhotography
Posts: 8,616
Plainview, New York, US


I don't understand what is illegal about it?

If she has a bikini top on, you place her hand covering the strap and use the camera angle to hide the rest, it's an implied...
Feb 22 10 08:50 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
silverystars
Posts: 2,524
Allentown, Pennsylvania, US


i don't know the laws because i'm not a lawyer, but Miley Cirus recently appeared in Vanity Fair in an implied shot.  nobody went to jail.  Sally Mann's book immediate family is still on the shelves as are the works of Jock Sturges.  Mann's and Sturges' works all involved full nudes, but were not without controversy.

so, i guess it is a personal choice.  not sure which way i would go on this one.
Feb 22 10 08:50 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
JohnStJohn Photography
Posts: 466
Lake Oswego, Oregon, US


I would run and never look back....
Feb 22 10 08:50 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
ADB-Fotografie
Posts: 303
Rotterdam, Zuid-Holland, Netherlands


ACPhotography wrote:
I don't understand what is illegal about it?

If she has a bikini top on, you place her hand covering the strap and use the camera angle to hide the rest, it's an implied...

It's not illegal, this is about personal judgement, just checking what everybody else feels smile

Feb 22 10 08:51 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Shon D.- Femme
Posts: 24,369
Virginia Beach, Virginia, US


Chieffie wrote:

Actually, reading all these answers it occurred to me that I'm not comfortable doing it, even if it is legal... I've just mailed her saying so...

/thread

Feb 22 10 08:51 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
DG at studio47
Posts: 2,362
East Ridge, Tennessee, US


If the mom is your 'colleague', ask her [the mom] about the child's request, or forward the email to the mom, see what mom says,...... then decide how you feel about it?
Feb 22 10 08:53 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Mickle Design Werks
Posts: 5,949
Washington, District of Columbia, US


silverystars wrote:
i don't know the laws because i'm not a lawyer, but Miley Cirus recently appeared in Vanity Fair in an implied shot.  nobody went to jail.  Sally Mann's book immediate family is still on the shelves as are the works of Jock Sturges.  Mann's and Sturges' works all involved full nudes, but were not without controversy.

so, i guess it is a personal choice.  not sure which way i would go on this one.

You can see that Mylie is covering up not the same as the example the OP gave
http://languageisavirus.com/miley-cyrus/layouts/miley-cyrus/miley-cyrus-vanity-fair.jpg

Feb 22 10 08:54 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
EnlightendedPhotography
Posts: 817
Eugene, Oregon, US


The photographer is from Netherlands - the laws, customs, and social understanding of nudity is completely different than in the US.  I lived in Europe for 5 plus years - I would probably say this 15 year old goes topless on the beaches.

If the pictures was taken in the US... definately NO unless she had a tube top or bikinini top to cover her nipples.  If Netherland allows for the implied / topless or even nude - then you should shoot the picture and not lose the friendship.

Conform to the Requirements and you can't go wrong.
Feb 22 10 08:55 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
DG at studio47
Posts: 2,362
East Ridge, Tennessee, US


Feb 22 10 08:55 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
dirk olsen
Posts: 1,337
Memphis, Tennessee, US


.........
Feb 22 10 08:55 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Stephen Dawson
Posts: 29,246
Toronto, Ontario, Canada


Make sure the mother (or father) is present when the shoot is being taken.

Ask that they bring a memory card of the type for your camera, and shoot using it. Give them the card when finished. Let them process the images as they like.

Be professional and courteous.
Feb 22 10 08:57 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Howard B
Posts: 244
Bremerton, Washington, US


Why take a chance there are plenty of over 18 year old that you can use and keep your self safe.  It's stupid since your asking you know you shouldn't.
Feb 22 10 08:57 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jon Tiffin
Posts: 1,041
San Antonio, Texas, US


Tell her that once she's 18 yo you'll be glad to shoot her any way she wishes, until then she should slow down a bit and just be a kid. There will be plenty of time for her to take her clothes off later, when she can legally do it without putting somebody else at risk.
Feb 22 10 08:57 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Great Lakes Glamour
Posts: 255
Grand Rapids, Michigan, US


Chieffie wrote:
So here's the deal:

My colleague's daughter, 15 years old, s paying me to shoot her. My colleague, her mother, is also present. Now she has mailed me she wants to do an implied topless, much like this one:
http://photos.modelmayhem.com/photos/100130/17/4b64e08d5935d.jpg

I am assuming the mom agrees. What would YOU do? She's paying for it, but normally I wouldn't shoot a 15 year old this way...

Stay away!!!

Feb 22 10 08:58 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
John Salt Images
Posts: 45
Visalia, California, US


This is not a good deal at all.....young models need to realize although they want to be all the way into the Modeling Industry they need to wait like everyone else. You open up a lot of negativity if you choose to shoot minors in implied or nudes..
Feb 22 10 08:59 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Ken Marcus Studios
Posts: 8,437
Los Angeles, California, US


Get a good lawyer . . .












Are your really that nuts to even consider this for more than a half second ?
Feb 22 10 08:59 am  Link  Quote 
12345last   Search   Reply



main | browse | casting/travel | forums | shout box | help | advertising | contests | share | join the mayhem

more modelmayhem on: | | | edu

©2006-2014 ModelMayhem.com. All Rights Reserved.
MODEL MAYHEM is a registered trademark.
Toggle Worksafe Mode: Off | On
Terms | Privacy | Careers