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Photographer
Benjo_Arwas
Posts: 73
Los Angeles, California, US


any suggestion for studying at Brooks institue photography school at California?...

really need your opinion guys and if you know some press relese or graduated students from there...

cheers.


Benjo.
Aug 03 10 03:45 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Rebel Photo
Posts: 11,446
Florence, South Carolina, US


This is just an opinion, but I suspect that it could help with creativity and contacts. As far as actually being some great advantage, I doubt it. You could most likely learn everything they teach, from the internet in a week or two.
Aug 03 10 03:52 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Benjo_Arwas
Posts: 73
Los Angeles, California, US


Rebel Photo wrote:
This is just an opinion, but I suspect that it could help with creativity and contacts. As far as actually being some great advantage, I doubt it. You could most likely learn everything they teach, from the internet in a week or two.

yeah...like i did until now...
but is the whole studying / programms/ majors worth the money?
the portfolio going to grow by 250% with amazing shoots im sure...
right now my portfolio based on girls next door shoots...not with proffesional models at all... :\

Aug 03 10 04:23 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
AVD AlphaDuctions
Posts: 10,524
Gatineau, Quebec, Canada


Benjo_Arwas wrote:

yeah...like i did until now...
but is the whole studying / programms/ majors worth the money?
the portfolio going to grow by 250% with amazing shoots im sure...
right now my portfolio based on girls next door shoots...not with proffesional models at all... :\

consider the cost of going there from where you are (tuition, travel, additional expenses for being away from home etc).
Figure out how much additional gear you need, professional models you could hire, etc etc either locally or in Milan, Paris, London etc.
Figure out how many DIFFERENT photographers you could meet and interact with.

Then decide if it's worth it or not.  I know the decision tree looks biased against but  you won't really know for YOURSELF unless you do the mental exercise.  It may still be worth it to you.  Just don't do it for the piece of paper.


I wrote this reply without even going to look at your portfolio. Now I"ll go have a look smile

Aug 03 10 04:29 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
AVD AlphaDuctions
Posts: 10,524
Gatineau, Quebec, Canada


Benjo_Arwas wrote:

yeah...like i did until now...
but is the whole studying / programms/ majors worth the money?
the portfolio going to grow by 250% with amazing shoots im sure...
right now my portfolio based on girls next door shoots...not with proffesional models at all... :\

ok I had a look at your port. I"m going to steal your girl-next-door model from Toronto!

We spend our lives chasing light.  And everyone has room for improvement in their use of lighting (I'm no different).  This is not a critique section so I'm not asking you to tell us but what exactly do you think you need to learn?

Aug 03 10 04:35 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Nicely Disturbed
Posts: 1,765
New York, New York, US


Benjo_Arwas wrote:
any suggestion for studying at Brooks institue photography school at California?...

really need your opinion guys and if you know some press relese or graduated students from there...

cheers.


Benjo.

A diploma helps get you in the door in some cases.
The interaction between you and the instructors cannot be learned over the internet.
And everything they teach cannot be learned in two weeks on the internet.

If you aspire to be the absolute best, don't you think MAYBE you'd want to interact and learn from the best? Learn from people who are actually there to mold you into the best. Not some internet forum.

Just a thought,


Russ

Aug 03 10 04:36 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Benjo_Arwas
Posts: 73
Los Angeles, California, US


AVD AlphaDuctions wrote:

Benjo_Arwas wrote:
yeah...like i did until now...
but is the whole studying / programms/ majors worth the money?
the portfolio going to grow by 250% with amazing shoots im sure...
right now my portfolio based on girls next door shoots...not with proffesional models at all... :\

ok I had a look at your port. I"m going to steal your girl-next-door model from Toronto!

We spend our lives chasing light.  And everyone has room for improvement in their use of lighting (I'm no different).  This is not a critique section so I'm not asking you to tell us but what exactly do you think you need to learn?

in this case Jenny wasnt girl next door smile she was totally great model and great person as well.

what i need to learn? EVERYTHING i think...we all the time got the place and points to get more improvments.
but its really confuse me...dont you think so?


Nicely Disturbed  wrote:

A diploma helps get you in the door in some cases.
The interaction between you and the instructors cannot be learned over the internet.
And everything they teach cannot be learned in two weeks on the internet.

If you aspire to be the absolute best, don't you think MAYBE you'd want to interact and learn from the best? Learn from people who are actually there to mold you into the best. Not some internet forum.

Just a thought,


Russ

hi russ, im totally agree with you...thats why i want to go there...
until today ive learned in the internet..but to learn from good (best) teachers and instructors as i think..can open my mind and view more and put me a new limits.

Aug 03 10 04:44 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
AVD AlphaDuctions
Posts: 10,524
Gatineau, Quebec, Canada


Benjo_Arwas wrote:

AVD AlphaDuctions wrote:

Benjo_Arwas wrote:
yeah...like i did until now...
but is the whole studying / programms/ majors worth the money?
the portfolio going to grow by 250% with amazing shoots im sure...
right now my portfolio based on girls next door shoots...not with proffesional models at all... :\

ok I had a look at your port. I"m going to steal your girl-next-door model from Toronto!

We spend our lives chasing light.  And everyone has room for improvement in their use of lighting (I'm no different).  This is not a critique section so I'm not asking you to tell us but what exactly do you think you need to learn?

in this case Jenny wasnt girl next door smile she was totally great model and great person as well.

what i need to learn? EVERYTHING i think...we all the time got the place and points to get more improvments.
but its really confuse me...dont you think so?



hi russ, im totally agree with you...thats why i want to go there...
until today ive learned in the internet..but to learn from good (best) teachers and instructors as i think..can open my mind and view more and put me a new limits.

I'm a fan of education. I have 3 degrees and parts of several others.  Looking at your portfolio and what you do, I can't help wondering if there aren't better places to go get those (best) teachers?  Such as Paris, London, or even New York?  Both for the networking/contacts and for the learning.

Aug 03 10 05:01 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Benjo_Arwas
Posts: 73
Los Angeles, California, US


AVD AlphaDuctions wrote:

I'm a fan of education. I have 3 degrees and parts of several others.  Looking at your portfolio and what you do, I can't help wondering if there aren't better places to go get those (best) teachers?  Such as Paris, London, or even New York?  Both for the networking/contacts and for the learning.

smile so, like my portfolio? i didnt got it...
anyway, yes, i'm agree with you about europe studies but still...i got the oppertunity for Brooks institue...
i dont have any degree and never attract to learn something...but photography is in my mind and i want to develop my carrer and direct my self as a pro-photographer...

Aug 03 10 05:13 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
TheScarletLetterSeries
Posts: 3,438
Carmel, California, US


Benjo_Arwas wrote:
....
i got the oppertunity for Brooks institue... ....

Brooks has an excellent reputation.  It can be considered "expensive" but then again most all quality educational endeavors are expensive.  Education is always a good thing.  Brooks would require quite a committment---it would be worthwhile to travel to CA and check it out.

Aug 03 10 05:45 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Farenell Photography
Posts: 17,860
Albany, New York, US


Benjo_Arwas wrote:
any suggestion for studying at Brooks institue photography school at California?...

really need your opinion guys and if you know some press relese or graduated students from there...

It really depends.

What are you looking to get out of your education? Are you looking to use it as a means for a wage (like to gain credentials for employment somewhere else...like in academia)? Or are you looking to use it for the experience of the education itself as well as to get the knowledge therein?

Aug 03 10 05:57 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Benjo_Arwas
Posts: 73
Los Angeles, California, US


Farenell Photography wrote:

It really depends.

What are you looking to get out of your education? Are you looking to use it as a means for a wage (like to gain credentials for employment somewhere else...like in academia)? Or are you looking to use it for the experience of the education itself as well as to get the knowledge therein?

direct my carrer as a pro-photographer.

Aug 03 10 06:13 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Farenell Photography
Posts: 17,860
Albany, New York, US


Benjo_Arwas wrote:
direct my carrer as a pro-photographer.

You need to tighten your focus as to HOW you want to direct your career as a pro photographer.

Are you looking to be a newspaper photographer? You want to get into fashion? You want to mostly do the art gallery angle? You want to work locally doing portraitures to be your bread & butter but leaving you time to explore your own projects? You want to work for commerical clients? You want to be a working professor (many of them work as full-time photographers when they're not teaching)?

Kinda get what where I'm going?

Edit: Any of us can tell you that Program A is better than Program B based on our own desires & experiences. But if we don't know what your main interest is (besides wanting to be a pro photographer), that advice or critique would be useless because our professional focus may not remotely coincide w/ your professional focus.

Aug 03 10 06:21 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Benjo_Arwas
Posts: 73
Los Angeles, California, US


Farenell Photography wrote:

You need to tighten your focus as to HOW you want to direct your career as a pro photographer.

Are you looking to be a newspaper photographer? You want to get into fashion? You want to mostly do the art gallery angle? You want to work locally doing portraitures to be your bread & butter but leaving you time to explore your own projects? You want to work for commerical clients? You want to be a working professor (many of them work as full-time photographers when they're not teaching)?

Kinda get what where I'm going?

sure man and appriciate your care,

i think i slide myself into fashion/commercial photographer genre...

Aug 03 10 06:23 am  Link  Quote 
guide forum
Photographer
Giacomo Cirrincioni
Posts: 20,930
New York, New York, US


Rebel Photo wrote:
This is just an opinion, but I suspect that it could help with creativity and contacts. As far as actually being some great advantage, I doubt it. You could most likely learn everything they teach, from the internet in a week or two.

Brooks is probably the best school there is in terms of commercial photography.  There is no way you'll learn everything they teach you in a week or two, even with the internet and books.  If you really apply yourself, maybe in a year or two, but even then you'll probably miss out on much of the detail. 

It is much more of a tech school than an art school.

Aug 03 10 07:04 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Nicely Disturbed
Posts: 1,765
New York, New York, US


Benjo_Arwas wrote:
any suggestion for studying at Brooks institue photography school at California?...

really need your opinion guys and if you know some press relese or graduated students from there...

cheers.


Benjo.

It's just my opinion but, you've got skill.
Go to school and hone that skill into a profitable profession.
Once established, it will be much easier to do the photographic things that do not make us alot of money in your off time.

Russ

Aug 03 10 07:30 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Gil Lang
Posts: 4,655
Isla Vista, California, US


I would say...to be an assistant for a photographer that do the kind of work you want to do will be a lot more valuable and cheaper(you can even even earn money out of it)than coming here and drop your money on Brooks.
Aug 03 10 08:30 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
studio818
Posts: 113
Los Angeles, California, US


brooks is an expensive factory -- and on the other side of all those thousands of dollars, you'll still be at square one in building your business -- and the rule of the market is that it's great to know how to do the job, yes, but it's even better to know how to GET the job.
Aug 03 10 08:35 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Benjo_Arwas
Posts: 73
Los Angeles, California, US


ok got alot of opinions over here...
thank everyone...

but still confused...anyone know a person who finished over there? and really got success?!

cheers,

Benjo.
Aug 03 10 10:23 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Ken Marcus Studios
Posts: 8,427
Los Angeles, California, US


I went to Brooks and value what I learned there

Arny Freytag (Playboy photog) went to Brooks and was a top student

Several of my photographer friends that do advertising and commercial also went there.

If you have what it takes to make it in photography, Brooks will give you a good foundation to succeed.

If you don't have any talent, nobody can teach you how to make it in this business
Aug 03 10 10:28 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Leonard Gee Photography
Posts: 16,080
Sacramento, California, US


Yes, several members have attended and some have graduated. Brooks is considered one of the better ones along with Rochester Institute. However, it has some detractors and some consider it not as good since it was bought out. Their approach is different from Art Center College of Design in Pasadena and California Institute for the Arts north of LA. It all depends on the student and the fit.
Aug 03 10 10:30 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Cherrystone
Posts: 36,025
Columbus, Ohio, US


You can be the best shooter in the world, but a miserable failure at business.

Hedge your bets and investments.
Aug 03 10 10:35 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Black Sunshine
Posts: 811
Austin, Texas, US


I just graduated a 10 month program at the Hallmark Institute of Photography, and right after I left, I started interning at Hearst, who shoots for Oprah, Cosmo, Harpers, Seventeen, etc. Within a month or two, I will be assisting here. Overall I would recommend Hallmark over any other school I've seen. The tuition is just under $60k, but the cost of living is much lower than somewhere like Brooks, and you work with profoto gear all the time, and have access to an excellent friendly staff. If you want to go the school route for photography, I'd definitely recommend Hallmark.
Aug 03 10 10:37 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Benjo_Arwas
Posts: 73
Los Angeles, California, US


ok guys,

thank you very much!

i got a bit from your opinions and suggestions, now i need to sit with myself and decide if its worth for me now.
Aug 03 10 10:13 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Lightcraft Studio
Posts: 11,963
Delray Beach, Florida, US


Benjo_Arwas wrote:
ok got alot of opinions over here...
thank everyone...

but still confused...anyone know a person who finished over there? and really got success?!

cheers,

Benjo.

My cousin went there, but it was about 30 years ago. He had a great career as a result.

Aug 03 10 10:18 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
FotoMark
Posts: 2,978
Oxnard, California, US


Benjo_Arwas wrote:
any suggestion for studying at Brooks institue photography school at California?...

really need your opinion guys and if you know some press relese or graduated students from there...

cheers.


Benjo.

I would look at other schools, Art Center in Pasadena is really good. I went to Brooks it was worth it to me, but they have been having accreditation problems meaning your degree won't mean much. Also try Cal State University of Northridge, good photo program. Also Cal Arts in Santa Clarita, there are other schools that are really good. Rochester Institute of Technology, I can't remember the others.

Aug 03 10 10:22 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Amy Seder
Posts: 145
New York, New York, US


I went to Brooks. I graduated only 2 years ago, but the program has changed quite a bit since I started (my first year was 100% film and a lot of 4x5, I think they have eliminated most of that now.) I had a great experience and learned so much while I was there. It IS expensive, but I received an excellent education, and I worked really really hard while I was there. You can not learn those skills "on the internet." The school always has a lot of good resources if you choose to use them: equipment rental, helpful professors, career services, etc.

I had a lot of friends who went to art schools for photography, and there's really no comparison. Brooks is amazing if you are committed to being a commercial photographer. You learn a ton of technical skills and lighting and how the industry works, but the creativity/drive has to come from you. It has to be said that you really get out of it what you put into it. I graduated with people who had terrible work, and I don't think have picked up a camera since, I also graduated with people that are doing amazing.
Aug 06 10 08:04 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Amy Seder
Posts: 145
New York, New York, US


Also Michael Thompson is probably our most well known graduate.
Aug 06 10 08:07 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Chuck Goodenough
Posts: 544
Los Angeles, California, US


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brooks_Institute

Brooks Institute of Photography in Santa Barbara, California has allegedly been conducting misleading recruitment practices by promising students they could earn between $50,000 to $150,000 in photography after graduation. According to a recent investigation by California's Bureau for Private Post secondary and Vocational Education the school was given a conditional operating status after it was found to have "willfully" misled students to believe that they could find high paying jobs in the field among completion of their program.


http://ddunleavy.typepad.com/the_big_pi … ion_c.html
Aug 06 10 08:46 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Vivendi Studio
Posts: 249
Los Angeles, California, US


I with art center.. I like it..
Aug 06 10 08:50 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Amy Seder
Posts: 145
New York, New York, US


Chuck Goodenough wrote:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brooks_Institute

Brooks Institute of Photography in Santa Barbara, California has allegedly been conducting misleading recruitment practices by promising students they could earn between $50,000 to $150,000 in photography after graduation. According to a recent investigation by California's Bureau for Private Post secondary and Vocational Education the school was given a conditional operating status after it was found to have "willfully" misled students to believe that they could find high paying jobs in the field among completion of their program.


http://ddunleavy.typepad.com/the_big_pi … ion_c.html

I just have to point out, 90% of that is the company that bought Brooks, CEC, and not the school itself. Also, what they tell you about job prospects has nothing to do with the actual education.

Aug 06 10 08:54 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
joeyk
Posts: 14,583
Seminole, Florida, US


Rebel Photo wrote:
This is just an opinion, but I suspect that it could help with creativity and contacts. As far as actually being some great advantage, I doubt it. You could most likely learn everything they teach, from the internet in a week or two.

Learn everything they teach from the internet in a few weeks... lol

Quite simply the best photography school available.

Aug 06 10 08:54 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Marvin Dockery
Posts: 2,243
Alcoa, Tennessee, US


Benjo_Arwas wrote:
ok got alot of opinions over here...
thank everyone...

but still confused...anyone know a person who finished over there? and really got success?!

cheers,

Benjo.

Ask the school for a list.  A lot of great photographers have studied there.

Aug 06 10 09:01 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jon Tiffin
Posts: 1,041
San Antonio, Texas, US


Ken Marcus Studios wrote:
I went to Brooks and value what I learned there

Arny Freytag (Playboy photog) went to Brooks and was a top student

Several of my photographer friends that do advertising and commercial also went there.

If you have what it takes to make it in photography, Brooks will give you a good foundation to succeed.

If you don't have any talent, nobody can teach you how to make it in this business

I took a weekend workshop w/returning Alumni Jason Madera as the course instructor. In his opening lecture he made a statement,  that even though the education was excellent,  it still took ten years after graduating to build the book that gave him the feeling of reaching a level of success in the business.

Aug 06 10 09:03 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Christopher Carter
Posts: 7,634
Indianapolis, Indiana, US


How many great photographers DIDN'T go there?
Aug 06 10 09:18 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Chuck Goodenough
Posts: 544
Los Angeles, California, US


I toured Brooks and Art Center in the '80's with the intent on choosing but could not afford them.
I ended up getting my education from assisting.

Part of me feels I would love to have had the background and structure of school but there is no way to know whether that experience would have augmented or otherwise changed my passion and desire and then direction.

Chuck
http://www.stockmodels.com
Aug 06 10 09:23 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Ronald N. Tan
Posts: 2,725
Los Angeles, California, US


I am curious what is it that you learnt at Brooks that you can't profess yourself auto-didactically.

I never had any training in the arts. I was disciplined in Applied Physics and Pre-pharmacy. That was my world all throughout my life until 2007.

I am being intrigued as to what I am missing by not having a degree from Brooks?

Amy Seder wrote:
I went to Brooks. I graduated only 2 years ago, but the program has changed quite a bit since I started (my first year was 100% film and a lot of 4x5, I think they have eliminated most of that now.) I had a great experience and learned so much while I was there. It IS expensive, but I received an excellent education, and I worked really really hard while I was there. You can not learn those skills "on the internet." The school always has a lot of good resources if you choose to use them: equipment rental, helpful professors, career services, etc.

I had a lot of friends who went to art schools for photography, and there's really no comparison. Brooks is amazing if you are committed to being a commercial photographer. You learn a ton of technical skills and lighting and how the industry works, but the creativity/drive has to come from you. It has to be said that you really get out of it what you put into it. I graduated with people who had terrible work, and I don't think have picked up a camera since, I also graduated with people that are doing amazing.

Aug 06 10 10:27 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Avalos Photography
Posts: 1,002
Woodland, California, US


brooks is bomb, you will learn fast. if you have the time get a degree in business and graphic arts.  Then go to brooks to be a star.  learn much faster than anywhere else.
Life is expensive.
Aug 06 10 10:30 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Nicely Disturbed
Posts: 1,765
New York, New York, US


This is a personal choice.
If one can afford it and has the time, they should get the education.
If one is amazingly good at reading books, manuals, etc, and honing their skills on their own at most everything they do, they shouldn't bother.


It's all about how much you really want your photographs to be recognixed and loved.

But to make the choice, one has to be detached from their own work and able to really truly see what they are creating thus far.
If the photos show promise and you just don't see yourself progressing further without help, well you deside.

People who have a degree and actually learned while in school show a particular skill not many others can.

VERY VERY VERY FEW who do not have a degree, can say the same about their work.

Yes there are those out there, the very very very few, that can stand toe to toe with the big boys and take better photos. But by no means are they what you will turn out to be.

Best self taught photographers I can think of?
Chase Jarvis ( I love his work)

Best educated photographers i can think of?
Houser  ( I Love his work)
Jacob Foko
Tracy trotter
Gary Bernstein
Aug 07 10 03:43 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Gil Lang
Posts: 4,655
Isla Vista, California, US


Benjo_Arwas wrote:
any suggestion for studying at Brooks institue photography school at California?...

really need your opinion guys and if you know some press relese or graduated students from there...

cheers.


Benjo.

She did graduate last year from Brooks.You could ask her.

http://www.modelmayhem.com/371205

Aug 07 10 10:28 am  Link  Quote 
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