I'm not sure how to write this as I truly don't want to offend anyone or imply something that isn't true. Y'all know me and know I'm not a racist. With that out of the way. Being disabled I watch a lot of TV. I've been watching this show called Bait Car. Cops rig a car with hidden cameras and microphones. The car can be shut down and the doors locked by the police.
I would guess that at lease 80% of the people who steal the cars are African-American while the other 20% are Hispanic. When they are busted they always make up the most stupid of stories.
My question and concern. Why is it always black people stealing? Does the show cut out or not set up in "white"parts of town? And often the thief will express extreme pleasure regarding their heist! What does this say about young black men? Is the show balanced and fair or is it unfair to black people? If so how?
The bait car programs are designed to catch thieves in specific areas that are experiencing high numbers of car thefts. If an area is really low on the car theft stats, it would likely mean hours and hours of wasted manpower sitting on a bait car.
My guy likes to go fishing. He has one spot he goes that he consistently brings home large Snapper. When he says he's going there, I am reasonably certain he will be successful. If he told me he was going to go fishing in the back yard... Well, you get the point?
A lot depends on geography. I'm sure that if the Moscow police started a Bait Car program, most of the would-be car thieves would be Russians. So, if one sets up a Bait Car program in a mainly minority area, and finds that most of the thieves are mainly minorities...uh, what conclusions should we draw?
Galas wrote: The bait car programs are designed to catch thieves in specific areas that are experiencing high numbers of car thefts. If an area is really low on the car theft stats, it would likely mean hours and hours of wasted manpower sitting on a bait car.
My guy likes to go fishing. He has one spot he goes that he consistently brings home large Snapper. When he says he's going there, I am reasonably certain he will be successful. If he told me he was going to go fishing in the back yard... Well, you get the point?
Well said and true. I like Bait Car and watch it whenever I can. To me the most fun is (a) Watching the trapped people trying to get out of the car and (b) The stories they tell about why they took the car. Number one on the list? "A guy asked me to move the car for him."
When I lived in Brooklyn every couple months a white cop would pretend to be drunk have a couple dollars hanging out his pocket and lay on the subway steps pretending to be drunk. Did they have this program in Long Island?
People are treated very differently according to skin color. I know this by experience.
Case in point, same retail chain, different neighborhoods. Kids get caught stealing, predominantly white neighborhood, the manager calls the parents. Poor neighborhood the manager calls the cops. I know this first hand, directly from the managers.
Well said and true. I like Bait Car and watch it whenever I can. To me the most fun is (a) Watching the trapped people trying to get out of the car and (b) The stories they tell about why they took the car. Number one on the list? "A guy asked me to move the car for him."
Yea, I love the stories. One guy, after they struggled to get him out of the car insisted he had never been in that car and was only walking by when they jumped him. Ha!
When I was asst. mgr. of a store in a mall in a predominately white area, most of the shoplifters were teen-aged white girls. Now, from this we can conclude about teen-aged white girls...er...uh...
A prominent minister who spoke at Whitney Houston's funeral was carjacked the other day. They arrested the carjackers in 2 days. The Infiniti's color was unique. There was only one of that color in the state. They ditched the vehicle.
They carjacked Rev. Marvin Winans. This occurred at 1:30 PM during the day at a gas station.
Jerry Nemeth wrote: A prominent minister who spoke at Whitney Houston's funeral was carjacked the other day. They arrested the carjackers in 2 days. The Infiniti's color was unique. There was only one of that color in the state. They ditched the vehicle.
They carjacked Rev. Marvin Winans. This occurred at 1:30 PM during the day at a gas station.
Art of CIP
Posts: 21,234
Long Beach, California, US
Why is it in Soapbox when whites are discussed - there is a chorus of people screaming and crying "race card!" and "race baiter!". Yet when whites single out blacks - not a word of protest from the usual suspects?
Hmmmm...
*Rhetorical question folks - I already know the answer...
Oh, and as far as your op. The answer is a complex one, opportunity, ability, high success rates, geographic location, economic demographics, etc. The OP question is also an easy one to answer. All one need do is look at the common factors involved...
Light Writer
Posts: 18,233
Hayward, California, US
If the show is set in the US, then one may falsely assume that only people in the US steal cars. The neighborhood chosen influences the population of car thieves shown. If the car were set up in a different neighborhood the demographic of the thieves would reflect that demographic. Also there is no indication of how the show is edited. The incidents with the most "appeal" to the audience are chosen, not a representative sample of the participants.
Areas in America that are predominately minority are predominately economically poor. This leads to predominately lower education, higher unemployment and a higher incidence of crime. That attracts the media, the media puts on a show, and the show shows those people living in those areas. This perpetrates the perception that all minorities live like this and encourages racial bias toward minorities. In fact, it also tends to make minorities believe their self-worth is less so than other non-minorities.
It doesn't help, and I encourage you to stop watching the program. The sponsors of the program are probably as conscientious as those that are trying to profit from the blood of President Ronald Reagan.
ZingArts wrote: Areas in America that are predominately minority are predominately economically poor. This leads to predominately lower education, higher unemployment and a higher incidence of crime. That attracts the media, the media puts on a show, and the show shows those people living in those areas. This perpetrates the perception that all minorities live like this and encourages racial bias toward minorities. In fact, it also tends to make minorities believe their self-worth is less so than other non-minorities.
It doesn't help, and I encourage you to stop watching the program. The sponsors of the program are probably as conscientious as those that are trying to profit from the blood of President Ronald Reagan.
I assume that if they had a show called "Bait Car Beverly Hills" where the bait car was a Lamborghini, there would be a bunch of little white kids stealing cars. Human nature is human nature ... my question is, why do we as a society allow the police to intrap and criminalize people using tactics that we would all fall victim too if the bait were enough too intice us?
What surprises me is that there is no organized effort that I'm aware of to try and get a balanced representation of gender and race.
Let's take another show where people bring shame on themselves. "Hardcore Pawn". On this show the wack jobs are from all backgrounds. You would think Bait Car could do that, unless they edit to make it look like its mostly minorities.
STL-After-Dark wrote: I assume that if they had a show called "Bait Car Beverly Hills" where the bait car was a Lamborghini, there would be a bunch of little white kids stealing cars. Human nature is human nature ... my question is, why do we as a society allow the police to intrap and criminalize people using tactics that we would all fall victim too if the bait were enough too intice us?
It's not just a show. It is a legal (read: not entrapment)and widely used law enforcement tool. TV did not create the bait car teams. Whether the show was on our not, these teams would be setting bait cars up in areas where they will most likely attract the attention of criminals. Use something flashy like the Lambo, and you would likely not get any action at all, because nobody remembers the guy in the Tercel, not the same for the Lambo.
It is really bottom of the barrel entertainment, but it is cheap for production, and the cooperating law enforcement agencies get some more money in their coffers. I REALLY DOUBT they are trying to push any race-based agenda, or lower the self esteem of minorities, ZING. Notice no one mentions the diversity of the teams setting these cars up and making the arrests, because cultural diversity in a profession that has historically been majority white doesn't piss people off and get them jawing at each other about race.
ZingArts wrote: Areas in America that are predominately minority are predominately economically poor. This leads to predominately lower education, higher unemployment and a higher incidence of crime. That attracts the media, the media puts on a show, and the show shows those people living in those areas. This perpetrates the perception that all minorities live like this and encourages racial bias toward minorities. In fact, it also tends to make minorities believe their self-worth is less so than other non-minorities.
It doesn't help, and I encourage you to stop watching the program. The sponsors of the program are probably as conscientious as those that are trying to profit from the blood of President Ronald Reagan.
We rarely agree but this is well written. Put in 'Bait care racist' on google and see the hits. While, I don't think its racist it does reinforce racial stereotypes and it does what you mentioned. It helps to encourage minorities to believe we are all criminal. It is bottom of the barrel entertainment.
We rarely agree but this is well written. Put in 'Bait care racist' on google and see the hits. While, I don't think its racist it does reinforce racial stereotypes and it does what you mentioned. It helps to encourage minorities to believe we are all criminal. It is bottom of the barrel entertainment.
Yes, Tony, LOOK at the results from the google search. The very first one is from Topix, and the post that started the conversation is this -
"I watched the show and to no surprise, it's more racist propaganda to make minorities look bad. They park the car only in black or latino neighborhoods, race bating for the crime. Why not put it in a white neighborhood? Of course not, the Jewish media would not allow a white person to be seen in the light. I guess, based on their tactics, only blacks and Latinos are the ones that steal cars- that's what they want you to believe, but get this, there is no way no how that only blacks are the most criminals in the US; we are only 13% of the population, and whites being the majority means that obviously they commit more crimes. It's bullsh*t. Where is the Bait Meth show? You know the hillybilly whites will be shown for their true colors. Oh, nevermind, the zionist Jews will not have that- whites are perfect. Just watch the show, you'll see how your "colored folk" are treated, but that's what they want. "
Te very next response should tell you something about the original poster on TOPIX -
"You sound like the racist.the last 5 forums I have been to youve had some racist remarks.Tell it to someone who cares we sure dont.Contact Trutv see if it does you any good.vent to them you just might get your 15 minutes of fame LOL "
And then to round it out, here is someone saying pretty much what I said earlier in the thread.
"They put the cars in areas that are known for high crime rates and high thefts. The places are predetermined because they know they'll not have to wait long for the hit. Now, if they put it in some suburb on the outskirts of town with relatively no crime statistic, that will just be a waste of time. They go where the crime is, they are not forcing the the thieves to steal the car, they make that decision for themselves. "
my realtor is a retired police officer. He said they have a 100% conviction record for bait car thefts. I guess it's hard to excuse your way out of taking a car that isn't yours without permission and they have audio and video.
Personally, I don't like it. Feels too much like entrapment to me. Might as well dump a bag of drugs on the sidewalk and bust whoever dares to pick it up.
Damon Banner
Posts: 83,599
Hayward, California, US
Tim Little Photography wrote: What surprises me is that there is no organized effort that I'm aware of to try and get a balanced representation of gender and race.
Let's take another show where people bring shame on themselves. "Hardcore Pawn". On this show the wack jobs are from all backgrounds. You would think Bait Car could do that, unless they edit to make it look like its mostly minorities.
how would they accomplish that? Put a sign on the car that says, "whites only?"
Damon Banner
Posts: 83,599
Hayward, California, US
Did you see the one where they parked the car in front of a church and several people walked by. Then a priest came by and held the keys until the woman returned.
Damon Banner
Posts: 83,599
Hayward, California, US
Tony Lawrence wrote:
We rarely agree but this is well written. Put in 'Bait care racist' on google and see the hits. While, I don't think its racist it does reinforce racial stereotypes and it does what you mentioned. It helps to encourage minorities to believe we are all criminal. It is bottom of the barrel entertainment.
So, did the early episodes of cops, where they are kicking in the doors of white people and pulling them off their couch butt ass naked, make white people believe they are all criminals?
I enjoyed baitcar until Comcast canceled trutv for my plan. I never felt like a criminal.
So, did the early episodes of cops, where they are kicking in the doors of white people and pulling them off their couch butt ass naked, make white people believe they are all criminals?
I enjoyed baitcar until Comcast canceled trutv for my plan. I never felt like a criminal.
Good for you, playa. To be candid, I don't watch COPS or Bait car. Well, I have seen COPS and a few Bait cars. I didn't find either entertaining. The COPS I watched had Black offenders. I'll take your word for kicking in the doors of White people and pulling them off their couches. I feel that these kind of shows are garbage and tend to show minorities in their worst light. I avoid those kind of programs.
STL-After-Dark wrote: I assume that if they had a show called "Bait Car Beverly Hills" where the bait car was a Lamborghini, there would be a bunch of little white kids stealing cars. Human nature is human nature ... my question is, why do we as a society allow the police to intrap and criminalize people using tactics that we would all fall victim too if the bait were enough too intice us?
Years ago (when Carter was in the WH) I was at my daughtes HS to pick her up from band practice. On an adjucent field some guys were playing softball and in the parking lot a good distance from the field one had left the keys in his Ferrari 308 Spyder, top down. As a car guy I went over to look at it, no one touched the car. In the days before cell phones that car could have been out of state before he could have gotten to a phone.
Damon Banner
Posts: 83,599
Hayward, California, US
Tony Lawrence wrote:
Good for you, playa. To be candid, I don't watch COPS or Bait car. Well, I have seen COPS and a few Bait cars. I didn't find either entertaining. The COPS I watched had Black offenders. I'll take your word for kicking in the doors of White people and pulling them off their couches. I feel that these kind of shows are garbage and tend to show minorities in their worst light. I avoid those kind of programs.
I don't idealize anyone. I know what black people are. Good bad and ugly. I know what white people are. Good bad and ugly. I know what ? people are.
If a TV show designed to catch criminals makes you start believing that you, yourself is also a criminal, you are an idiot. Do you watch House and start thinking you are a doctor? Do you watch T3 and start thinking you are a robot from the future? Of course not, so why is this any different?
Damon Banner
Posts: 83,599
Hayward, California, US
Damon Banner wrote: Did you see the one where they parked the car in front of a church and several people walked by. Then a priest came by and held the keys until the woman returned.
Christopher Hartman wrote: my realtor is a retired police officer. He said they have a 100% conviction record for bait car thefts. I guess it's hard to excuse your way out of taking a car that isn't yours without permission and they have audio and video.
Personally, I don't like it. Feels too much like entrapment to me. Might as well dump a bag of drugs on the sidewalk and bust whoever dares to pick it up.
I think the difference, and an important one, is that stealing a car requires a series of positive acts to commit the crime. Picking up a bag of drugs or cash only requires one.
Leave a car with the keys in it and see how many people steal it. Leave a bag of cash on the sidewalk and I bet the number goes up several hundred % as most people do not know how to get rid of stolen car but know how to spend cash.
I don't idealize anyone. I know what black people are. Good bad and ugly. I know what white people are. Good bad and ugly. I know what ? people are.
If a TV show designed to catch criminals makes you start believing that you, yourself is also a criminal, you are an idiot. Do you watch House and start thinking you are a doctor? Do you watch T3 and start thinking you are a robot from the future? Of course not, so why is this any different?
I hope I'm not a idiot but I think that negative shows do real damage just as music that glorifies murder, drug dealing and violence. I try to watch positive shows and listen to uplifting music. Our bodies are like our minds. Fill them with poison and garbage and expect to get sick. I don't listen to comics that call us 'n' for the same reasons. Not sure I mentioned idealizing anyone and for sure we all have our failings but I don't like shows like Bait Car or COPS or to Catch a Predator. The first two in my view tend to show minorities in a bad way and the last is just distasteful.
Mike Kelcher
Posts: 11,625
Minneapolis, Minnesota, US
Some might conjecture that the show is produced by honky-crackers that simply want to make the brothers look bad. In reality, it's probably simply another business investment in a TV show where investors hope to have more revenue than expenses. I'm fairly certain that if they "plant" a bait car and it's stolen by Asians, Caucasians, or American Indians, that episode would get aired with the rest....but I agree...that doesn't seem to happen much on that show.
Anyone who watched the show, and didn't know the true statistics, might have to be forgiven for concluding that 99% of car thefts are done by blacks and hispanics. But that conclusion would be both false and racist.
Next time the show is on, I'll note who the sponsors are, and I'll be boycotting their products.
Mike Kelcher wrote: Some might conjecture that the show is produced by honky-crackers that simply want to make the brothers look bad. In reality, it's probably simply another business investment in a TV show where investors hope to have more revenue than expenses. I'm fairly certain that if they "plant" a bait car and it's stolen by Asians, Caucasians, or American Indians, that episode would get aired with the rest....but I agree...that doesn't seem to happen much on that show.
WTF is a Honky-Cracker? Some sort of breakfast food? You know, I've been Black all my life and nobody I know refers to White people as Crackers or Honky's expect racist White folks who think that's what we call them. Rather then racist and trying to make the 'brothers' look bad I think these shows reinforce negative stereotypes and pander to the worst exceptions in all of us. Its why I stopped watching FOX and its shows like Hannity. Its why, I stopped tunning into Rush.
When I lived in Brooklyn every couple months a white cop would pretend to be drunk have a couple dollars hanging out his pocket and lay on the subway steps pretending to be drunk. Did they have this program in Long Island?
Did Long Island have a significant number of drunk people being assaulted and robbed?
By your logic, if there were a significant number of rapes in Boston, you've be staking out Dallas. Damn fine police work Uno.
STL-After-Dark wrote: I assume that if they had a show called "Bait Car Beverly Hills" where the bait car was a Lamborghini, there would be a bunch of little white kids stealing cars. Human nature is human nature ... my question is, why do we as a society allow the police to intrap and criminalize people using tactics that we would all fall victim too if the bait were enough too intice us?
I would be willing to bet everything I have that this would not be true. I wonder if this conclusion is because of the same stereotyping in the reverse direction, or because of political correctness?
To assume that it would be a bunch of "white kids" would be to assume that Beverly Hills is A) populated by white kids and B) that the kids living in Beverly Hills commit crime and C) crime committed in Beverly Hills is committed by the indigenous population.
This is not accurate - on any account. I think it plays into what others are saying that the factors that make someone steal are far beyond mere race.
I would dare say that you would be highly likely to be able to park a Lamborghini in Beverly Hills with the keys in the ignition, and it would likely not be touched. On the other hand, you probably couldn't park a Honda Civic locked in other areas of the country without significant risk.
If any of you want to see mostly white people getting busted, watch Campus PD on G4TV. Most of them are alcohol related, but I'd say, regardless of which city is being profiled, they are mostly white kids. And man...they sure are stupid pieces of shit!
I think the difference, and an important one, is that stealing a car requires a series of positive acts to commit the crime. Picking up a bag of drugs or cash only requires one.
Leave a car with the keys in it and see how many people steal it. Leave a bag of cash on the sidewalk and I bet the number goes up several hundred % as most people do not know how to get rid of stolen car but know how to spend cash.
But you're still tempting people. I don't feel sorry for the people getting busted. Not at all. I just think we could spend our resources better in doing other things. It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't thing I think as well. If you have a problem with car thieves, set a trap!! The problem is though, when you leave a car with keys in it, you might get people who are not car thieves. They are just stupid. Plus, the bait cars are shut down pretty quickly. Why not at least let it go to see if they are going to joy ride or take it to a place that will strip it down. You let them get that far and you have some more serious busts.
Years ago (when Carter was in the WH) I was at my daughtes HS to pick her up from band practice. On an adjucent field some guys were playing softball and in the parking lot a good distance from the field one had left the keys in his Ferrari 308 Spyder, top down. As a car guy I went over to look at it, no one touched the car. In the days before cell phones that car could have been out of state before he could have gotten to a phone.
Most people are honest.
Darkness Overcomes Me wrote: I would be willing to bet everything I have that this would not be true. I wonder if this conclusion is because of the same stereotyping in the reverse direction, or because of political correctness?
To assume that it would be a bunch of "white kids" would be to assume that Beverly Hills is A) populated by white kids and B) that the kids living in Beverly Hills commit crime and C) crime committed in Beverly Hills is committed by the indigenous population.
This is not accurate - on any account. I think it plays into what others are saying that the factors that make someone steal are far beyond mere race.
I would dare say that you would be highly likely to be able to park a Lamborghini in Beverly Hills with the keys in the ignition, and it would likely not be touched. On the other hand, you probably couldn't park a Honda Civic locked in other areas of the country without significant risk.
So, you've both ran with my analogy but completely missed my point.
My point, is that none of us are above temptation on some level, and that it's inherently wrong for society to allow police organizations to set people up.
I mean what next ... police threatening your wife & kids in hopes that you will commit an imprisonable offense trying to save them?
A set up, is a set up, is a set up ... it's wrong to make a vested effort too criminalize people.
Vivus Hussein Denuo wrote: A lot depends on geography. I'm sure that if the Moscow police started a Bait Car program, most of the would-be car thieves would be Russians. So, if one sets up a Bait Car program in a mainly minority area, and finds that most of the thieves are mainly minorities...uh, what conclusions should we draw?
um. that folks without cars don't like to go very far to get one?
Vivus Hussein Denuo wrote: A lot depends on geography. I'm sure that if the Moscow police started a Bait Car program, most of the would-be car thieves would be Russians. So, if one sets up a Bait Car program in a mainly minority area, and finds that most of the thieves are mainly minorities...uh, what conclusions should we draw?
qphotonyc wrote: um. that folks without cars don't like to go very far to get one?
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