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Photographer
925 image
Posts: 272
Martinez, California, US


i can't cook without kitchen aid 
stupid do stupid say

it does not hurt to educate
Jun 30 12 03:34 pm  Link  Quote 
Artist/Painter
MainePaintah
Posts: 1,524
Saco, Maine, US


You should have said:

"Actually"  Dude, you are an idiot!

"Next in line please..."
Jun 30 12 03:36 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Raven Photography
Posts: 2,547
Melbourne, Victoria, Australia


Dannyb66 wrote:
I have been talking to a model about a outdoor shoot planned next week, and I said I only normally use natural lighting in my shots, and use of reflectors, and this was the reply I got...
"ok but you cannot get good photos with natural ligt its basic photo  actually"
So guess Im not working with him then.

Be thankful. You won't be working with a complete idiot!

Jun 30 12 03:38 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Danny Barson
Posts: 57
Mansfield, England, United Kingdom


Innovative Imagery wrote:

I think he may be responding that on a few of your shots, you have exceeded the dynamic range of the sensor and it doesn't match his view as to what it should look like.

Thank you for you critique, any practical comments are always useful, and appreciated, but the model was trying to tell me that extra light is always needed and not a critique of my work, to quote is original responce to a casting I had up "Hi there
I am interested for your casting.
i love your work !! they are stunning
I would like to collaborate with you for your this project. "
He only had problems when I said I don't normaly use extra lighting apart from reflectors to get the results he liked on my port.

Jun 30 12 03:41 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Innovative Imagery
Posts: 2,800
Los Angeles, California, US


Actually, I was trying NOT to provide a critique, just trying to point out what he was seizing on.  You could have very well made a conscious decision on the dynamic range and used the results for artistic effect, which is totally up to you.  So no critique offered at all from this end.

He was clearly "wrong" , mistaken or skewed in his perspective as has been so soundly pointed out by all who have responded.
Jun 30 12 03:44 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jhono Bashian
Posts: 2,427
Cleveland, Ohio, US


c_h_r_i_s wrote:

Why ?

don't you want to have your clients and talent educated on what you do??
don't you think an educated client is a stronger one, a more valuable one??
knowledge is power and if you can help educate you have the power.

Jun 30 12 03:48 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
AlloyOne Photography
Posts: 138
Atlanta, Georgia, US


I love it when they send the red flag up early.  That way I get nice running start as far away from them as I can!  No lost for you there!
Jun 30 12 03:53 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
The Something Guy
Posts: 14,776
Cheltenham, England, United Kingdom


Jhono Bashian wrote:

don't you want to have your clients and talent educated on what you do??
don't you think an educated client is a stronger one, a more valuable one??
knowledge is power and if you can help educate you have the power.

Your about the fourth person mentioning education so can you please enlighten us all about how you would educate them with this power in knowledge ?

Jun 30 12 03:57 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
outwiththeold
Posts: 185
Chapel Hill, North Carolina, US


I would point them to Jaime Ibarra's port and be like wow I guess you really cant get good photos with natural light:)
Jun 30 12 03:58 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
outwiththeold
Posts: 185
Chapel Hill, North Carolina, US


But ANYWAYS I have always found that usually when something is said to me it has some sort of relevance! When im told I need to lose weight there is a chance that I might be a bit bloated or the large pizza I ate the night before is trying to escape through my love handles!
So if I was a photographer and someone mentioned something about my lighting then EVEN if there is plenty of photographers out there that work with natural light all the time and give great results! That doesnt mean your results are great:)

I mean if you dont think you are lacking in anything put your port up for crit and see what happens:) But yeah anyways good luck hun
Jun 30 12 04:05 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
The Grace Gabbana
Posts: 348
Santa Rosa, California, US


Personal Photograph wrote:
No cure for stupid.

Yup.

G

Jun 30 12 04:06 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Orca Bay Images
Posts: 31,679
Lodi, California, US


"ok but you cannot get good photos with natural ligt its basic photo  actually"

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems to me that Basic Photography would have the photographer learn how to take a decent picture in natural light before ever introducing artificial lighting.

Jun 30 12 04:54 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Matt Knowles
Posts: 3,550
Ferndale, California, US


Kyleigh Erin wrote:
That is by far the stupidest thing I've ever heard, the best light is natural light.

Define best. Because if you're trying to stop the motion of a bullet passing through a balloon, natural light's not going to cut it.

Kyleigh Erin wrote:
Indor lighting is used to try to imitate natural light!

That is not the stupidest thing I've ever heard, but...

I have been shooting in the studio for over 10 years, and I've only done two shoots where I used indoor lighting to imitate natural light.

Jun 30 12 07:37 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Sabine Luise
Posts: 890
Boston, Massachusetts, US


95% if my pictures in my port are by natural light.

Don't get me wrong editing is nice especially for fun or whatever it is intended for. I have some in my port too!

925 image wrote:
i can't cook without kitchen aid 
stupid do stupid say

it does not hurt to educate

And this, some people just don't know. maybe they just needed to be educated. Maybe they worked with someone who didn't use light and they didn't like the way their photos ended up.

Jun 30 12 10:26 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Shutterbug5269
Posts: 16,084
West Winfield, New York, US


-B-R-U-N-E-S-C-I- wrote:
NEXT!




Just my $0.02

Ciao
Stefano
www.stefanobrunesci.com

Ditto!

Jun 30 12 10:34 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
RistPhoto
Posts: 390
Scottsdale, Arizona, US


I've had a few models see me simply carrying my camera bag and they have asked where my reflectors are. Then when I don't pull out a flash, they ask where the flash is. I then patiently explain that I don't use either. One was completely dumfounded, a couple were impressed, all of them were surprised. Sometimes models get used to the way a certain photographer works and then think it's the only way to work.
Jun 30 12 10:38 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
TheNormGallerys
Posts: 1,222
Fullerton, California, US


As Bill would say, "Here's your sign"!
Jun 30 12 10:48 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Lanna_
Posts: 817
Seattle, Washington, US


Yeah, damn that natural light.  It's totally useless wink

http://photos.modelmayhem.com/photos/110825/02/4e56168a53962_m.jpg
Jun 30 12 10:50 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Illianna
Posts: 155
Niagara Falls, New York, US


Kyleigh Erin wrote:
That is by far the stupidest thing I've ever heard, the best light is natural light. Indor lighting is used to try to imitate natural light! This model is either really stupid or just started modeling like yesterday lol

+1

Jun 30 12 10:51 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Darren Brade
Posts: 2,718
London, England, United Kingdom


Dannyb66 wrote:

Thank you for you critique, any practical comments are always useful, and appreciated, but the model was trying to tell me that extra light is always needed and not a critique of my work, to quote is original responce to a casting I had up "Hi there
I am interested for your casting.
i love your work !! they are stunning
I would like to collaborate with you for your this project. "
He only had problems when I said I don't normaly use extra lighting apart from reflectors to get the results he liked on my port.

Now this I can't fathom, he looks and likes your port and then when he knows your method tries to dismiss it!

Normally I'd try to educate by showing them how I achieved certain looks in my port or showing work from other photographers, but this guy does sound like a 'studio slave'.

Would be interesting to know who it is since I know of a few models in the East Midlands.

Jul 01 12 05:03 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Darren Brade
Posts: 2,718
London, England, United Kingdom


Kyleigh Erin wrote:
That is by far the stupidest thing I've ever heard, the best light is natural light. Indor lighting is used to try to imitate natural light! This model is either really stupid or just started modeling like yesterday lol

I disagree, light is light, and the best light is whatever is "right" for the situation. I shoot both indoors and outdoors, the majority of my outdoor shots in my port use a mixture of natural AND flash light.

Jul 01 12 05:10 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Kent Art Photography
Posts: 2,545
Ashford, England, United Kingdom


Models only have to look good.  They don't have to have brains.

They can say what they like, as long as they're right for the job.
Jul 01 12 05:21 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Danny Barson
Posts: 57
Mansfield, England, United Kingdom


Darren Brade wrote:
Would be interesting to know who it is since I know of a few models in the East Midlands.

He is not from the East Midlands, he is from Birmingham, but not gonna name and shame, I dont thnk thats the way forward.

Jul 01 12 05:29 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
K E E L I N G
Posts: 39,717
Peoria, Illinois, US


My gawd, do you people really think that way?  Are you really that intolerant?

The guy most likely hasn't worked with a decent natural light shooter and simply doesn't know what's possible.  Treating him like an idiot is the act of an idiot.

Of course now that I look a little deeper, maybe the model actually deserves a lot of respect.
Jul 01 12 05:30 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Photographe
Posts: 2,350
Bristol, England, United Kingdom


I remember a model who turned up to a shoot and then  tried to cancel because there were no Elinchrom there, I was using 500k Fresnel theatre spots. I had another model walk out once because there was no "stage". I was using the location, not a backdrop. "If there is no stage, I can not perform!".

Natural light in the UK might be tricky, according to weather forecasts it's "crazy weather" until December...
Jul 01 12 05:35 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Danny Barson
Posts: 57
Mansfield, England, United Kingdom


K E E L I N G wrote:
Treating him like an idiot is the act of an idiot.

.

I havnt treated him like an idiot, I have explained to him over several messages and pointed out the whys and reasons, but he dosnt believe you can get a good shot without artificial light. And wont accept what I am telling him.

Jul 01 12 05:36 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
The Something Guy
Posts: 14,776
Cheltenham, England, United Kingdom


Rollo David Snook wrote:
I remember a model who turned up to a shoot and then  tried to cancel because there were no Elinchrom there, I was using 500k Fresnel theatre spots. I had another model walk out once because there was no "stage". I was using the location, not a backdrop. "If there is no stage, I can not perform!".

Natural light in the UK might be tricky, according to weather forecasts it's "crazy weather" until December...

Runs on par with a casting of another site ' bikini calender on the sea of tranquility'.... a lot of models applied.

Jul 01 12 05:42 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
K E E L I N G
Posts: 39,717
Peoria, Illinois, US


Dannyb66 wrote:

I havnt treated him like an idiot, I have explained to him over several messages and pointed out the whys and reasons, but he dosnt believe you can get a good shot without artificial light. And wont accept what I am telling him.

Sometimes you have to be able to show them.

Jul 01 12 05:42 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
The Something Guy
Posts: 14,776
Cheltenham, England, United Kingdom


K E E L I N G wrote:
Sometimes you have to be able to show them.

Could you show me as I'm a bit thick...doh.
Person No 5.

Jul 01 12 05:51 am  Link  Quote 
Model
NicoleNudes
Posts: 3,725
Toronto, Ontario, Canada


I think you doged a bullet. I'd just move onto someone who actually knows that they're doing.

I love shooting in natural light smile
Jul 01 12 05:54 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
rdallasPhotography
Posts: 963
Norristown, Pennsylvania, US


I'd bet that this model couldn't tell if a shot used only natural light to begin with. That was an incredibly stupid thing to say.
Jul 01 12 06:03 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Mearle
Posts: 915
Olympia, Washington, US


Dannyb66 wrote:
I have been trying, and still am trying, but he is having none of it. He obviously feels he knows more than me about lighting a llama, and this has been one of his replies..."yes i understand what you mean natural ligt is important but you need to use other extra light to expose and highlight particular parts "
So with someone like this, I think I'm losing the will.

Perhaps you should tell him your avatar picture, a pretty important first impression, intentionally has dark eye sockets and supplemental lighting would not have helped at all. But I guess you know what you are doing. I think his mind is made up.

Jul 01 12 06:13 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Danny Barson
Posts: 57
Mansfield, England, United Kingdom


Mearle wrote:
Perhaps you should tell him your avatar picture, a pretty important first impression, intentionally has dark eye sockets and supplemental lighting would not have helped at all. But I guess you know what you are doing. I think his mind is made up.

As I have told him, and mentioned it on my profile, My avatar is not a model, it is a snap of me, used just to introduce myself, so people can see who I am.

Jul 01 12 06:28 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Darren Brade
Posts: 2,718
London, England, United Kingdom


Dannyb66 wrote:

I havnt treated him like an idiot, I have explained to him over several messages and pointed out the whys and reasons, but he dosnt believe you can get a good shot without artificial light. And wont accept what I am telling him.

Then why are you pursuing it. You can lead a horse to water.... and all that.

Jul 01 12 06:46 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Danny Barson
Posts: 57
Mansfield, England, United Kingdom


Darren Brade wrote:
Then why are you pursuing it. You can lead a horse to water.... and all that.

I am not pursuing it anymore, after I tried to inform him on the use of natural light, and he still wouldnt take what I said, I told him I think its best we dont work together and cancelled the shoot.

Jul 01 12 06:51 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jay Farrell
Posts: 12,902
Nashville, Tennessee, US


Dannyb66 wrote:
I have been talking to a model about a outdoor shoot planned next week, and I said I only normally use natural lighting in my shots, and use of reflectors, and this was the reply I got...
"ok but you cannot get good photos with natural ligt its basic photo  actually"
So guess Im not working with him then.

Um.....yea, later playa. What an ignorant moron, lol. You did the right thing by avoiding that.

Jul 01 12 06:57 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Michael Lohr
Posts: 457
Los Angeles, California, US


90 percent of my MM portfolio is natural light.....guess maybe I should find a new profession...
Jul 01 12 07:08 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
D S P
Posts: 510
Portland, Oregon, US


There will always be those that don't do what we do but are still sure they know more than we do.
Jul 01 12 07:27 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Caradoc
Posts: 19,312
Scottsdale, Arizona, US


Dannyb66 wrote:
"ok but you cannot get good photos with natural ligt its basic photo  actually"

Pure natural light - no reflectors, nothing but open shade:

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5117/7425950884_aea53d5447.jpg

Jul 01 12 07:33 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Tom deL
Posts: 3,669
Lexington, Ohio, US


DP :\
Jul 01 12 07:34 am  Link  Quote 
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