kickfight wrote: Hey, L-A, a question: does the BDSM angle disappear entirely by the end of the final book? In other words, was the BDSM angle just a plot device to represent Christian's "brokenness", which Ana gradually "repairs"... a gauntlet of sorts that both characters must run in order to get to Happy-Ever-After?
I don't think, and I could be wrong, that there is any BDSM in the third book at all. If there is, it's mild and completely consensual. (I read all three back to back, so they kind of run together a tad), and by the end of the book, yeah. There's none.
She essentially "repairs" him to the point of him actually REFUSING BDSM-style sexual activities until she has to convince him it's okay to be a little rough once in a while. This just seemed unrealistic, and way too fast, especially if Mr. Grey is as messed up as they claim him to be. But, in fairy-tale land, women have the magical touch!
Presley ONeil wrote: This thread is kind of obnoxious. If you're basing what your ideal relationship should be, off of a book- you have bigger problems...
Like those parents who worry about what society is doin to their children but never actually Talk To their children.
If yuu dnt like the book don't read it. Seems stupid af to me..
Well put.
Besides, the "if you don't like the book, don't read it" comment made no sense whatsoever.
How would one know they don't like a book unless they read it?
Read the back?(: I suppose it didn't make much sense, but I don't understand what ranting about things does to change them. (not saying I don't) you're the one who chooses how the book will affect you after you read it. If you don't already know that our society is s*** ....well yuu must have had some blinders on for the past 7 years of the kardashians..
Presley ONeil wrote: Read the back? I suppose it didn't make much sense, but I don't understand what ranting about things does to change them. (not saying I don't) you're the one who chooses how the book will affect you after you read it. If you don't already know that our society is s*** ....well yuu must have had some blinders on for the past 7 years of the kardashians..
Yeah, reading the back of the book is not the same as actually reading the book.
I only know of the Kardashians by virtue of them being ridiculed by The Soup. In that context, society is not shit at all (you *can* type out the word "shit" here, BTW... we're all adults here). It's a healthy sign for society when ridiculous people are actually regarded as such.
The thread's focus is about being disappointed by a book that is very very popular. I don't know that implies that society is shit.
Laurie-Anne Foster wrote: I don't think, and I could be wrong, that there is any BDSM in the third book at all. If there is, it's mild and completely consensual. (I read all three back to back, so they kind of run together a tad), and by the end of the book, yeah. There's none.
She essentially "repairs" him to the point of him actually REFUSING BDSM-style sexual activities until she has to convince him it's okay to be a little rough once in a while. This just seemed unrealistic, and way too fast, especially if Mr. Grey is as messed up as they claim him to be. But, in fairy-tale land, women have the magical touch!
Aha. So as the BDSM decreases (or as Ana gradually defines the scope of it), it is implied that we're getting closer to "fixed". Thanks for providing some insight on that.
kickfight wrote: The thread's focus is about being disappointed by a book that is very very popular. I don't know that implies that society is shit.
Agreed.
In fact, I think people being disappointed by it is a good sign...it means they realize it's ridiculous and they're not letting themselves get carried away by some twisted fantasy that they will "create" the perfect man out of someone.
Presley ONeil wrote: This thread is kind of obnoxious. If you're basing what your ideal relationship should be, off of a book- you have bigger problems...
Like those parents who worry about what society is doin to their children but never actually Talk To their children.
If yuu dnt like the book don't read it. Seems stupid af to me..
Kelly Kooper
Posts: 814
Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
Laurie-Anne Foster wrote:
I don't think, and I could be wrong, that there is any BDSM in the third book at all. If there is, it's mild and completely consensual. (I read all three back to back, so they kind of run together a tad), and by the end of the book, yeah. There's none.
She essentially "repairs" him to the point of him actually REFUSING BDSM-style sexual activities until she has to convince him it's okay to be a little rough once in a while. This just seemed unrealistic, and way too fast, especially if Mr. Grey is as messed up as they claim him to be. But, in fairy-tale land, women have the magical touch!
Ahhh....I have no plans to read the other two but that explanation actually tells me a fair bit about the appeal for women.
It's a pity we don't have an S&M regular visiting this thread, it'd be interesting to hear their take on the book and if it matches what I've heard.
Were they abused a child or is this a ridiculous S&M stereotype? How many conform to vanilla sex? Is this common?
Laura UnBound
Posts: 24,701
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
MKPhoto wrote:
There are always two classics, "Story of O" - made into soft-core in the 70s and "9 1/2 weeks" made into a good movie with Kim Basinger an M. Rourke
The story of O pissed me right the fuck off. The book ends abruptly with the dominant guy going "k Im bored, go away now" and drops his ever so devoted sub like a bag of bricks.
And the BDSM community wonders why they get the bad rep of being abusive and just out to hurt people. If that hadnt been a BDSM novel, everyone would call him a piece of shit who needs to not treat women like shiny new toys to get bored with. Because its a BDSM novel, hes excused as "a dominant". Its crazy to me the people who worship that book like a fucking bible, its about some dickwad who doesnt know what the fuck he wants with his life/ his partners and burns through a girl with no regard to how its going to affect her when she gets dumped.
Laura UnBound
Posts: 24,701
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
DarcieK wrote:
Pretty much. He was traumatized as a child, introduced to the BDSM lifestyle in his teens, and has never had a real relationship with anyone, until Ana comes along. Ana does leave him, but when they see each other again, they try again and although he is still a tad controlling, he slowly opens up to her.
That was another part that everyone and their brother on my fetlife feed got their panties twisted about. the (duh!) link between his abusive childhood and his shitty BDSM relationship. It perpetuates this idea that kinky people are damaged and must have had something horrible happen to them in their earlier life to lead them to do such awful things to themselves/others via kink. He supposedly goes on this ridiculous search for why he is the way he is instead of promoting a healthy acceptance for the shit that gets his dick hard.
Obviously I understand it wouldnt have made the same story if it were portrayed in a healthy positive light. But thats really the fucking shame of it. its still popular to portray kink as something dark and broken.
I think it's cheap entertainment, like most romance novels are, but it goes the extra mile to utterly destroy any healthy perception of BDSM relationships. I'm not in one, and I can't say I have much interest in that lifestyle, but the book presents the alternative lifestyle of the main male character as being something that needs to be "cured". Somehow, because he loves her, all of his former sexual proclivities are gone -- which is both unrealistic and degrades the value of the BDSM lifestyle.
I think presenting BDSM in that way does a disservice to the people who work hard to garner healthy alternative relationships.
Laura UnBound
Posts: 24,701
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Kelly Kooper wrote:
Ahhh....I have no plans to read the other two but that explanation actually tells me a fair bit about the appeal for women.
It's a pity we don't have an S&M regular visiting this thread, it'd be interesting to hear their take on the book and if it matches what I've heard.
Were they abused a child or is this a ridiculous S&M stereotype? How many conform to vanilla sex? Is this common?
It's certainly an interesting topic anyhow.
I havent read the book simply because what Ive heard of the book is directly maligned with what I subscribe to as being a healthy BDSM player.
The link between early life trauma (various forms of abuse, neglect, horrible experiences like losing loved ones, etc) and an inclination towards the BDSM scene is not as strong as the vanilla world would like everyone to think.
Sure, SOME people have troubled lives and also partake in kink. Likewise, SOME people have troubled lives and DONT have anything to do with kink. A shitty early life does not necessarily predispose you to fall into some dark kinky realm of continued "abuse" throughout your adult life. Some people do use kink as an escape from their past damage, and some people do it in a healthy way, others dont. Others will drink, others will do drugs, others will be adrenaline junkies and thrill seekers, others will seek counselling, others will volunteer for crisis outreach, There are a million different coping mechanisms people will use and almost every one of them can be used positively or negatively depending on the users mindset.
I have lots of kinky friends who have led near perfect lives. Both parents still married, no abuse, no neglect, no trauma, nice schooling, grew up in a nice neighborhood, very uneventful childhoods and young adulthoods. Theyre not poor, they have okay or great jobs, they still have lots of close friends and a supportive network around them. Theres not a thing wrong with them. And theyre happy as a clam to come home and tie someone up and beat the snot out of them (consensually) because its just what they like.
Yes I read the entire trilogy . Fifty Shades is definitely a moral compass about our 21st century. Great millions to be made for its author, great wrecks in lots of lives, good luck to psychologists, family counselors and police...!
I have read the plot and have seen enough of facebook to know what they are about. And knowing that much makes me never want to read them they disgust me and are nothing short of porn. Were a man has total control of a young girl literally owning her and making her do horrible degrading things. That is my opinion on these books anyways I spend my time reading other things.
Anna Adrielle
Posts: 17,032
Antwerp, Antwerp, Belgium
Lisa Andresen wrote: I have read the plot and have seen enough of facebook to know what they are about. And knowing that much makes me never want to read them they disgust me and are nothing short of porn. Were a man has total control of a young girl literally owning her and making her do horrible degrading things. That is my opinion on these books anyways I spend my time reading other things.
hee doesn't "make" her do it, she wants to do that stuff with him. porn is subjective, for instance: I'm sure plenty of orthodox Jew or extremists would think your portfolio here is porn.
I'm not really into what that the book describes and I personally think it is way too poorly written to be porn, so I simply don't read it and be done with it. But let other people have their fun, that's their business.
Lisa Andresen wrote: I have read the plot and have seen enough of facebook to know what they are about. And knowing that much makes me never want to read them they disgust me and are nothing short of porn. Were a man has total control of a young girl literally owning her and making her do horrible degrading things. That is my opinion on these books anyways I spend my time reading other things.
hee doesn't "make" her do it, she wants to do that stuff with him. porn is subjective, for instance: I'm sure plenty of orthodox Jew or extremists would think your portfolio here is porn.
I'm not really into what that the book describes and I personally think it is way too poorly written to be porn, so I simply don't read it and be done with it. But let other people have their fun, that's their business.
She wants to sure so why does he make her sign a contract?
I don't know they are just way to twisted for me and nothing I want influencing me. I have made a personal choice to stay away from it.
Alivia Autumn
Posts: 531
Albuquerque, New Mexico, US
A cheesy Twilight version of a D/s relationship for vanilla people to enjoy. Anyone who has any background in BDSM and D/s would want to burn each copy like myself...
Anna Adrielle wrote: lol, so contracts mean you're doing something against your will?
sure puts contracts you sign to get a job in a different light...
posting in a (relatively old) thread about it does not give the impression that you want to stay away from it though
No contracts can be done by choice but they also make it to were you can't change your mind so it is binding until complete. And for something like a relationship that is messed up if you really love someone you don't need them to sign a contract to be with you.
cy be rea n
Posts: 2,715
Vatican City, Holy See, Vatican City
Lisa Andresen wrote: I have read the plot and have seen enough of facebook to know what they are about. And knowing that much makes me never want to read them they disgust me and are nothing short of porn. Were a man has total control of a young girl literally owning her and making her do horrible degrading things. That is my opinion on these books anyways I spend my time reading other things.
for a moment there i thought you were talking about the bible
... had to scroll back up to view the thread title again
No contracts can be done by choice but they also make it to were you can't change your mind so it is binding until complete. And for something like a relationship that is messed up if you really love someone you don't need them to sign a contract to be with you.
Um, honey, what is marriage, other than the ceremony? Don't you have to sign some papers?
Alivia Autumn
Posts: 531
Albuquerque, New Mexico, US
Lisa Andresen wrote:
No contracts can be done by choice but they also make it to were you can't change your mind so it is binding until complete. And for something like a relationship that is messed up if you really love someone you don't need them to sign a contract to be with you.
You have no clear understanding of a D/s relationship. It's all consensual.
Um, honey, what is marriage, other than the ceremony? Don't you have to sign some papers?
Really? A marriage certificate is all I signed and it is just proof that we actually got married. There is nothing written out about doing anything in particular money or anything else. It isn't really a contract it is just a document proving when and where you got married so that you can get insurance and other important things in life.
Alivia Autumn
Posts: 531
Albuquerque, New Mexico, US
Lisa Andresen wrote:
Really? A marriage certificate is all I signed and it is just proof that we actually got married. There is nothing written out about doing anything in particular money or anything else. It isn't really a contract it is just a document proving when and where you got married so that you can get insurance and other important things in life.
From someone who's been married, it is a contract, you are LEGALLY married. It was very difficult, to break the contract, ie divorce.
Whatever the point is I don't like these books they are crappy literature. They are full of things that go against my beliefs and lifestyle. And I don't want to read them the OP asked opinions I gave mine and I am out.
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