When Lorraine Bracco was a teenage model in Spain, Salvador Dali wanted her to pose nude for him. He was very persistent. He sent her an etching of a huge penis. Many years later she said, "I just thought he was a dirty old man. And he was a dirty old man. But he was a dirty old man with talent."
natural beauties of qld wrote: Have you ever encountered a creepy photographer who also had an impressive portfolio?
My theory is that word would get around about creeps and they would not get the chance to build a good portfolio.
If that were the case, instead of fretting about escorts and references, models could just check out portfolios.
However, theories are no good unless they are tested ...
Terry Richardson photographs for every major fashion magazine in the world and works with a plethora of top models and celebrities, including the president of the US.
Being a pervert/horny/having loose morals does not exclude having talent/resources.
I've heard first hand reports of photographers with great portfolios who regularly solicit new models for sex or demand sexual favours in return for shooting. Enough models apparently go along with it to make it worth their while continuing to ask.
In the UK last year Lee Cropper (aka. 'The Mofo') was jailed for sexually assaulting models, some of whom he found via MM. Prior to that MM admins had removed various profiles he created after negative reports from models, but he managed to keep finding new girls via other sites including Facebook. His work was very good and he shot new faces for many top London agencies as well as doing celebrity portraits.
Unfortunately, the opportunity to be around and exert some power over young and often naive models will always attract a few scumbags to photography, some of whom will actually have some talent. This simply reinforces the advice to all models to check references before shooting with a new photographer, regardless of the quality of his portfolio.
Mini_ wrote: Terry Richardson photographs for every major fashion magazine in the world and works with a plethora of top models and celebrities, including the president of the US.
Being a pervert/horny/having loose morals does not exclude having talent/resources.
The question is actually about personal experience.
Mini_ wrote: Terry Richardson photographs for every major fashion magazine in the world and works with a plethora of top models and celebrities, including the president of the US.
Being a pervert/horny/having loose morals does not exclude having talent/resources.
natural beauties of qld wrote: The question is actually about personal experience.
Actually, that last sentence comes from personal experience. The first example disproves your theory right away.
Abby Hawkins
Posts: 1,943
Boston, Massachusetts, US
Of course. The rumors about Terry Richardson's behavior during shoots sometimes are mind-boggling, but people still line up through the door to work with him. Creepers are in every facet, every profession, every level of skill. The trick, sadly, is to win people over first with your talent, so they feel that they have to "excuse" your behavior.
I feel like people on MM are quick to judge "creepiness" by their port. Snapshots? Doesn't matter if he's a good guy -- must be a creep if he's looking for models with that level of "skill" (even if he's just a good guy with no experience). Crazy-good port? He must be legit.
Fotographia Fantastique wrote: When Lorraine Bracco was a teenage model in Spain, Salvador Dali wanted her to pose nude for him. He was very persistent. He sent her an etching of a huge penis. Many years later she said, "I just thought he was a dirty old man. And he was a dirty old man. But he was a dirty old man with talent."
Great story.
So does being a great artist give one a free pass to scumbaggery?
Terry Richardson photographs for every major fashion magazine in the world and works with a plethora of top models and celebrities, including the president of the US.
Being a pervert/horny/having loose morals does not exclude having talent/resources.
Abby Hawkins wrote: Of course. The rumors about Terry Richardson's behavior during shoots sometimes are mind-boggling, but people still line up through the door to work with him. Creepers are in every facet, every profession, every level of skill. The trick, sadly, is to win people over first with your talent, so they feel that they have to "excuse" your behavior.
I feel like people on MM are quick to judge "creepiness" by their port. Snapshots? Doesn't matter if he's a good guy -- must be a creep if he's looking for models with that level of "skill" (even if he's just a good guy with no experience). Crazy-good port? He must be legit.
Have you personally encountered any creeps with impressive portfolios?
many, some are always creeps, some are only creeps with marginal models who wont actually be a real benefit to their work or associate with potential clients, some are even famous
Abby Hawkins
Posts: 1,943
Boston, Massachusetts, US
natural beauties of qld wrote: Have you personally encountered any creeps with impressive portfolios?
I've never been propositioned or touched inappropriately, but I did have one photographer with a stellar port who really struck me as off. Just the way he talked/looked at me gave me the willies. And it was confirmed later in the shoot, when the dress I was wearing was of a very thin fabric (meaning even seamless undergarments would show up). I had no issues removing said undergarments, but he then spent the next 10 minutes talking on and on and on about how good it feels to not wear any panties, the "soft fabric on bare skin", "dress draped across your bare breasts", etc, etc, etc. Looking back, I should've spoken up, but I was young and I didn't, and I figured, "Hey, that's just what some 'artists' are like."
So that actually sums it up pretty well: some rationalize the bad behavior as, "Well, they're an artist, so they're allowed to be creepy/obnoxious/mean/greedy."
Abby Hawkins
Posts: 1,943
Boston, Massachusetts, US
KonstantKarma wrote: Yep, it's okay to be a scumbag as long as you're handsome!
There's an SNL skit parodying HR "Sexual Misconduct" videos, defining what is a "compliment" and what is "harassment". Anything that Horatio San said was harassment, and anything Tom Brady said was a compliment.
KonstantKarma
Posts: 2,057
Asheville, North Carolina, US
Abby Hawkins wrote:
There's an SNL skit parodying HR "Sexual Misconduct" videos that shows what is a "compliment" and what is "harassment". Anything that Horatio San said was harassment, and anything Tom Brady said was a compliment.
It's just the way things are, for both sexes. Just like unattractive women getting ignored or overlooked in most situations for the prettier one, the same words/actions by a handsome man is a compliment while for the ugly man it's harassment.
I've never been propositioned or touched inappropriately, but I did have one photographer with a stellar port who really struck me as off. Just the way he talked/looked at me gave me the willies. And it was confirmed later in the shoot, when the dress I was wearing was of a very thin fabric (meaning even seamless undergarments would show up). I had no issues removing said undergarments, but he then spent the next 10 minutes talking on and on and on about how good it feels to not wear any panties, the "soft fabric on bare skin", "dress draped across your bare breasts", etc, etc, etc. Looking back, I should've spoken up, but I was young and I didn't, and I figured, "Hey, that's just what some 'artists' are like."
So that actually sums it up pretty well: some rationalize the bad behavior as, "Well, they're an artist, so they're allowed to be creepy/obnoxious/mean/greedy."
A gentleman who was my friend and a photographer (who has since passed), was one of the best in my area. I send a few llamas that I had shot with to him to help them jump start their portfolio. He was really good. Every single one of those llamas would come back to me and tell me how much of a pervert and the things he would ask them to do during the shoot. However, llamas still lined up by the dozens to shoot with him. He was that good.
KonstantKarma
Posts: 2,057
Asheville, North Carolina, US
One of the art nude books I read mentioned the concept of "professional flirting". It's your job as the photographer to compliment your model, make her feel sexy and self-confident.
KonstantKarma wrote: One of the art nude books I read mentioned the concept of "professional flirting". It's your job as the photographer to compliment your llama, make her feel sexy and self-confident.
and here I always tried to make them feel short, fat and unappreciated that way they put more effort into impressing me
Abby Hawkins wrote: Of course. The rumors about Terry Richardson's behavior during shoots sometimes are mind-boggling, but people still line up through the door to work with him. Creepers are in every facet, every profession, every level of skill. The trick, sadly, is to win people over first with your talent, so they feel that they have to "excuse" your behavior.
I've met a couple of models who actually have worked w/ him & they say he's a pretty nice guy. Which in fairness doesn't mean that he is a bad guy, its just not what they experienced.
Sometimes I wonder if that's just a public personna that he takes on & cultivates because of the free press it brings. Sorta like how Robert Capa cultivated his Robert Capa personna from Andre Freidmann. Or "Ozzie biting the head off a bat". Or Alice Cooper killing a chicken on stage.
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