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Makeup Artist
PaulaMUAH
Posts: 36
Houston, Texas, US


Hi guys,
I had to work on a model this evening that had cold sores around her mouth. What can I use on my makeup brushes that will kill viruses? Alcohol only kills bacteria, and to my knowledge the only thing that will kill viruses is virucide or bleach, but I am obviously hesitant to dip my brushes in bleach! I don't want the bristles to disintegrate or something.

Any advice would be super appreciated! Thanks! smile
Oct 17 12 08:03 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
A M Johnson
Posts: 8,024
Las Vegas, Nevada, US


I can't address your brush cleaning problem but I can tell you that untreated, many viruses can live for 30 days in a dry environment. Longer in a moist environment.
Oct 17 12 08:26 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
SD Makeup Artisty
Posts: 184
Hicksville, New York, US


PaulaMUAH wrote:
Hi guys,
I had to work on a model this evening that had cold sores around her mouth. What can I use on my makeup brushes that will kill viruses? Alcohol only kills bacteria, and to my knowledge the only thing that will kill viruses is virucide or bleach, but I am obviously hesitant to dip my brushes in bleach! I don't want the bristles to disintegrate or something.

Any advice would be super appreciated! Thanks! smile

If it's something I'd noticed, I would only have used disposables on her... But peroxide kills viruses as far as I know.  I always clean my lip brushes with peroxide after I wash them and since viruses can't survive on dry surfaces, I just clean all of my other brushes with antibacterial soap then spray them/my shadows with 70% alcohol. (The other alcohol percentage is too high and evaporates before it does anything.)

Oct 17 12 08:36 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Dagger133
Posts: 349
Kitchener, Ontario, Canada


Lysol disinfectant will kill herpes on surfaces, it might eat glue or plastic handles though.
Oct 17 12 08:39 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Thomas Van Dyke
Posts: 1,430
Washington, District of Columbia, US


PaulaMUAH wrote:
... cold sores around her mouth....

Herpes labialis, or orolabial herpes...

SUSCEPTIBILITY TO DISINFECTANTS: HSV virus is easily inactivated by lipid solvents. It can be inactivated by 0.5% Lysol in 5 min; by Listerine (1:1 mixtures) in 5 min; by 2,000 ppm (2,000 ul/liter) of bleach in 10 min; by rubbing alcohol (1:1 mixtures). HSV is also susceptible to quaternary ammonium compounds. Most herpes viruses are also susceptible to 30% ethanol and isopropanol, 0.12% orthophenyl phenol, and 0.04% glutaraldehyde.

Source: http://www.phac-aspc.gc.ca/lab-bio/res/ … es-eng.php

btw...  quaternary ammonium compounds are commonly called quats and are widely used in salons... and for good reason...  only use phenols with extreme caution, they are a caustic poison...

Oct 17 12 08:58 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
PaulaMUAH
Posts: 36
Houston, Texas, US


Thanks for the advice! I used disposables for her lips, but the photographer wanted me to cover up the redness on her skin around her lips, so I had to use a concealer brush for that sad I will definitely try the peroxide. I'll just do it all, soap and water, peroxide, 70% alc, lysol, repeat, hah.

From what I've read, herpes virus can only live on surfaces for up to 4 hours, so at least thats on my side!
Oct 17 12 09:00 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
PaulaMUAH
Posts: 36
Houston, Texas, US


I read on the link that Thomas Van Dyke posted that the virus can be inactivated by microwaving for 4 minutes.

Has anyone ever microwaved their brushes? Kinda crazy...wonder what would happen
Oct 17 12 09:04 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Makeup Hair by Dani B
Posts: 661
Seattle, Washington, US


I would throw that brush in the garbage, now.

Is the cost of one brush really worth the risk to your reputation and another client's health?

In the future, never use your brushes or tools on any open skin, just use disposables in that area. And carry some liquid bandage in your kit.
Oct 17 12 10:24 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
ThirdEyeMakeup
Posts: 292
Los Angeles, California, US


PaulaMUAH wrote:
I read on the link that Thomas Van Dyke posted that the virus can be inactivated by microwaving for 4 minutes.

Has anyone ever microwaved their brushes? Kinda crazy...wonder what would happen

STOP! Don't microwave your brushes! If the ferrule is metal, it will create sparks, melt, burn, etc!

Oct 17 12 11:06 pm  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
KKP Retouching
Posts: 1,489
Anaheim, California, US


Makeup by Dani B wrote:
I would throw that brush in the garbage, now.

Is the cost of one brush really worth the risk to your reputation and another client's health?

In the future, never use your brushes or tools on any open skin, just use disposables in that area. And carry some liquid bandage in your kit.

This.  Just play it safe and spend your time and money replacing it instead of trying to sanitize it.

Oct 17 12 11:36 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Julie Anne McGuinness
Posts: 88
Brantford, Ontario, Canada


I always have a contract on me that states I will not work on someone with a virus such as a cold sore, at least in that area of their face anyways.  For me, it's not worth the money I would make.  Just my own feedback, no one has to agree.
Oct 18 12 05:29 am  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Simire MUA
Posts: 91
London, England, United Kingdom


Julie Anne McGuinness wrote:
I always have a contract on me that states I will not work on someone with a virus such as a cold sore, at least in that area of their face anyways.  For me, it's not worth the money I would make.  Just my own feedback, no one has to agree.

Can we say or do this without getting blacklisted as a 'diva'. i am paranoid about my kit and this seems as very sensible contract to me. However it is a much smaller pond in the UK in comparison.

Oct 18 12 05:33 am  Link  Quote 
Model
Kristie MacLean
Posts: 12
Austin, Texas, US


One can only contract herpes from direct contact with a sore or infected skin that is actively shedding viral cells. I know people want to be hyper safe and herpes is definitely a taboo disease, but just cleaning your brush with some parian spirit, or if you're really cautious some lysol, will be fine. Honestly, if you're worried more about your reputation, then get disposables.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herpes_simplex
Oct 18 12 07:44 am  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
kat makeup artist
Posts: 179
Sydney, New South Wales, Australia


Makeup by Dani B wrote:
I would throw that brush in the garbage, now.

Is the cost of one brush really worth the risk to your reputation and another client's health?

In the future, never use your brushes or tools on any open skin, just use disposables in that area. And carry some liquid bandage in your kit.

^ this! lysol works fine but its not worth it for one brush the ruin your reputation and potentially open yourself up to litigation... Next time disposables all the way!  live and learn. I never refuse a client, just use disposables and be smart.

Oct 18 12 08:19 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
PaulaMUAH
Posts: 36
Houston, Texas, US


Thanks for the advice everyone smile It was just a small concealer brush after all, so it won't break the bank to replace!

With all the talk about disposables, can you guys suggest places online to buy good disposables? I know they are meant to be inexpensive tools, but I have used some crappy disposables in my time doing bridal work at the salon! Wondering if there are slightly better quality ones anywhere, especially for coverage of the kind I had to do last night, where I had to cover texture in addition to some redness. Would a disposable sponge be the best bet? I've always used sponges more for blending, not for packing on concealer for spot coverage.
Oct 18 12 08:35 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Kristie MacLean
Posts: 12
Austin, Texas, US


Someone who is infected with herpes could be contagious literally at any time. You will never be able to tell if someone is shedding viral cells. So if you had to use disposables on anyone that has herpes to keep from spreading it, you would therefore have to use disposables on every single client since you can't tell who has it or doesn't or who is contagious or not. It's really not necessary to throw the brush away and would be a waste of money.
Oct 18 12 09:56 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Denise
Posts: 1,898
Kelowna, British Columbia, Canada


PaulaMUAH wrote:
Thanks for the advice everyone smile It was just a small concealer brush after all, so it won't break the bank to replace!

With all the talk about disposables, can you guys suggest places online to buy good disposables? I know they are meant to be inexpensive tools, but I have used some crappy disposables in my time doing bridal work at the salon! Wondering if there are slightly better quality ones anywhere, especially for coverage of the kind I had to do last night, where I had to cover texture in addition to some redness. Would a disposable sponge be the best bet? I've always used sponges more for blending, not for packing on concealer for spot coverage.

A sponge probably would have worked, you can certainly use them to stipple/pack on color, not just for blending. Qosmedix is a good place to by disposables and other supplies in bulk. I use the e.l.f. $1 concealer brushes as lip brushes, they would be ideal for this type of situation and are inexpensive enough to just toss afterward.

Oct 19 12 10:18 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
natural beauties of qld
Posts: 2,086
Brisbane, Queensland, Australia


Keep in mind that there is a dose-response situation, i.e a person is not going to get herpes just from a single viral cell, they need a large enough dose to overwhelm the immune system.

If you disinfect your brush, you should be fine. 

Several have already mentioned good disinfectants, including hydrogen peroxide (a very strong oxidising agent that destroys any micro-organism that it touches, much the same as bleach does), but don't forget good old UV, as in strong sunlight (one of the reasons it is better to hang laundry out rather than use a dryer).
Oct 20 12 09:10 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
M A S T E R S
Posts: 309
Murphys, California, US


SD Makeup Artisty wrote:
If it's something I'd noticed, I would only have used disposables on her... But peroxide kills viruses as far as I know.  I always clean my lip brushes with peroxide after I wash them and since viruses can't survive on dry surfaces, I just clean all of my other brushes with antibacterial soap then spray them/my shadows with 70% alcohol. (The other alcohol percentage is too high and evaporates before it does anything.)

PLEASE educate yourself further! Viruses CAN survive on dry surfaces, for long periods, in fact.

I'm not trying to be rude, but you should know this, to protect your clients.

Oct 20 12 09:29 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
M A S T E R S
Posts: 309
Murphys, California, US


Oct 20 12 09:38 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Lauren Reynolds Makeup
Posts: 282
London, England, United Kingdom


DP
Oct 21 12 04:44 am  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Lauren Reynolds Makeup
Posts: 282
London, England, United Kingdom


M A S T E R S wrote:

PLEASE educate yourself further! Viruses CAN survive on dry surfaces, for long periods, in fact.

I'm not trying to be rude, but you should know this, to protect your clients.

Sorry, you're wrong. All viruses are different. Some can survive for months, while some mere seconds or minutes away from their source - herpesvirus is one of these viruses. Once the body fluid is dry or removed, it's dead.

It's best practice to use disposables in case there is a secondary infection in the open skin - any open skin is vunerable to infection so disposables stored in their original plastic packaging, being handled as little as possible even if your hands are "clean", will help protect both the client sitting in front of you and future clients. However the chance of passing on specifically herpesvirus to your next client, if you've washed your brushes (rather than just cleaned with alcohol) and followed standard sanitation procedures (regarding double dipping, clean palettes etc), is about 0.

Oct 21 12 04:49 am  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Tara Pagliara MUA
Posts: 701
New York, New York, US


Makeup by Dani B wrote:
I would throw that brush in the garbage, now.

Is the cost of one brush really worth the risk to your reputation and another client's health?

In the future, never use your brushes or tools on any open skin, just use disposables in that area. And carry some liquid bandage in your kit.

Yep throw it away. I keep plastic gloves and many disposables in my kit. I am sorry but I will not put my brushes around that area or touch it with my hands. Herpes is highly contagious and I don't want it nor do I want to infect my brushes and possible spread to someone else. I also clean my house with all bleach product I am a bit of a nutbag with germs.

Oct 21 12 07:28 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Woven Thought
Posts: 328
Petersburg, Virginia, US


Kristie MacLean wrote:
Someone who is infected with herpes could be contagious literally at any time. You will never be able to tell if someone is shedding viral cells.

This is true.  Also be aware that the herpes virus is not limited to the mouth.  Acne can be infected with the herpes virus as well.  Unfortunately for me, I've had cold sores since very young and sometimes acne on my chin will be a cold sore.

Oct 21 12 07:38 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
M A S T E R S
Posts: 309
Murphys, California, US


Lauren Reynolds MUA wrote:

Sorry, you're wrong. All viruses are different. Some can survive for months, while some mere seconds or minutes away from their source - herpesvirus is one of these viruses. Once the body fluid is dry or removed, it's dead.

It's best practice to use disposables in case there is a secondary infection in the open skin - any open skin is vunerable to infection so disposables stored in their original plastic packaging, being handled as little as possible even if your hands are "clean", will help protect both the client sitting in front of you and future clients. However the chance of passing on specifically herpesvirus to your next client, if you've washed your brushes (rather than just cleaned with alcohol) and followed standard sanitation procedures (regarding double dipping, clean palettes etc), is about 0.

You'll notice that I did not mention the Herpes virus specifically.

If you are working around sores, which often have an opening in the skin, you should also be aware of, and concerned about blood-borne pathogens. Blood-borne pathogens can remain viable for long periods, even when dry.

Oct 21 12 08:48 am  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Lauren Reynolds Makeup
Posts: 282
London, England, United Kingdom


M A S T E R S wrote:

You'll notice that I did not mention the Herpes virus specifically.

If you are working around sores, which often have an opening in the skin, you should also be aware of, and concerned about blood-borne pathogens. Blood-borne pathogens can remain viable for long periods, even when dry.

You posted a reply in a thread about coldsores, so the assumption was that your post was relating to coldsores.

Absolutely - as I said - you should be wary of other possible pathogens in any sore or introducing pathogens to the open skin. Which is why you should always wet-wash brushes as a standard procedure after working on ANY face, which removes fluids and substances - dry or otherwise - much more effectively (and therefore disinfecting more effectively) than just brush cleaner or alcohol. For added peace of mind and safety, as I mentioned, disposables are probably the best option in the case of broken skin. Luckily I've yet to come across someone with a coldsore (still a relative newbie), but I think this is what I would do. I am always concerned about client safety and do a lot of research - there is no need to patronise me.

Oct 21 12 12:25 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
M A S T E R S
Posts: 309
Murphys, California, US


Lauren Reynolds MUA wrote:

You posted a reply in a thread about coldsores, so the assumption was that your post was relating to coldsores.

Absolutely - as I said - you should be wary of other possible pathogens in any sore or introducing pathogens to the open skin. Which is why you should always wet-wash brushes as a standard procedure after working on ANY face, which removes fluids and substances - dry or otherwise - much more effectively (and therefore disinfecting more effectively) than just brush cleaner or alcohol. For added peace of mind and safety, as I mentioned, disposables are probably the best option in the case of broken skin. Luckily I've yet to come across someone with a coldsore (still a relative newbie), but I think this is what I would do. I am always concerned about client safety and do a lot of research - there is no need to patronise me.

Don't take it personally. I was merely pointing out the inaccuracy of information being shared by another.

Oct 21 12 02:10 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Lauren Reynolds Makeup
Posts: 282
London, England, United Kingdom


M A S T E R S wrote:

Don't take it personally. I was merely pointing out the inaccuracy of information being shared by another.

That's fine, I took your post as implying that I was not concerned or aware of blood-borne pathogens. I see I was mistaken, apologies.

Oct 21 12 02:40 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Makeup by Marisa Ross
Posts: 386
Atlanta, Georgia, US


I would have only used disposables on a model with cold sores. You can never be too careful especially with a virus like herpes simplex.
Oct 23 12 03:39 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Cindy Nguyen MUA
Posts: 24
Huntington Beach, California, US


The best thing you can do if your are worried about sanitation problems is by using your disposables sponges and lip brushes to apply any makeup around areas that you are concerned about. Once the disposables are done with just throw them away and no more worries if your brushes.

Hope this helps! smile

Cindy Nguyen MUA
Oct 24 12 02:30 am  Link  Quote 
Model
Jerica Truax
Posts: 27
Seattle, Washington, US


Makeup by Dani B wrote:
I would throw that brush in the garbage, now.

Is the cost of one brush really worth the risk to your reputation and another client's health?

This ^

Oct 25 12 09:35 am  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Innovations by Jen
Posts: 4
Akron, Ohio, US


I use this diluted [per directions] in a small spray bottle, spraying brushes after each use when necessary. Never a concern about anything "surviving" on my brushes and doesn't damage them. When I get back home I wash everything with a mild shampoo and warm water.

http://www.shop.com/themall4you/5590535 … vid=243390
Oct 26 12 06:07 am  Link  Quote 
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