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first12
Photographer
AG_Boston
Posts: 345
Boston, Massachusetts, US


Did this bride to be have any constructive criticism? Or was it all just complaining?
Nov 11 12 12:23 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Elizabethmakeup
Posts: 338
Hereford, England, United Kingdom


MADE NYC wrote:
So, you asked for advice and basically took none of it ...even though some came from senior artists with a wealth of experience in these type of situations.

Once again, I'm reminded why I post so infrequently at MM. Forum members claim they want information from experienced senior artists ...then they either ignore it or argue it.

Waste of time.

Advice does not have to be taken but can be used to put things into perspective. The OP has decided that she wants to go down the route of a free second trial and see if she can rectify the situation. It is her decision and doesn't affect anyone else on here in any way.

I personally would have walked away as she sounds like a right headache but hopefully experience will help the OP to make an informed decision in the future when (and I am sure that it is indeed a 'when') she meets another bride like the current one.

Nov 11 12 12:29 pm  Link  Quote 
guide forum
Makeup Artist
KJB
Posts: 1,184
New York, New York, US


Elizabethmakeup wrote:
It is her decision and doesn't affect anyone else on here in any way.

You're absolutely right.

So when put into perspective, the OP simply wanted a use the forum as an audience for their rant and had no intention of using the advise we (erroneously) assumed they "requested".

Just a thought ...wouldn't it be much more productive if people were candid and admitted that they are looking for empathy, not advise.
And in the end, I take full responsibility for choosing to exert myself and answer what I misconstrued as a question.
Lesson learned.

Nov 11 12 12:53 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Elizabethmakeup
Posts: 338
Hereford, England, United Kingdom


I do agree with what you are saying but I have also been in a position (not on MM or regarding makeup) where I have asked for advice but chosen to go with my gut instincts; sometimes I have been burned, sometimes not.

What I am saying is that advice can be given and I have personally found that no further thought should be given whether that person chooses to follow it or not. You have given what they 'asked' for and there is nothing more that you can do than that. It really isn't worth your time.
Nov 11 12 02:00 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Simire MUA
Posts: 91
London, England, United Kingdom


MADE NYC wrote:
Once again, I'm reminded why I post so infrequently at MM.

Please do not tar us all with the same brush and 'punish' us alike......quite a number of your junior colleagues like myself hang on to hair and makeup advice given by you and other extremely talented and experienced MAKE UP ARTISTS on this forum (ignoring the other unnecessary' noise' frequently created on the HMS forum).

The OP is free to do what she wants with any advice given.

There are bound to be some who do not take your valuable advice which is acceptable i guess but they are in the minority and it should NOT decrease the frequency of your posts or indeed the posts of other senior artists.....we depend on these posts to stay on the right track.

Nov 11 12 02:50 pm  Link  Quote 
Body Painter
Lisa Berczel
Posts: 3,983
Corona, California, US


My philosophy - I always answer a post as though it were a question in my class - everyone *reading* has the benefit of the reply - not just the one individual with a question.

As to the OP, I won't be put into a position where a Client is bullying me.

There ARE bad fits - and sounds as though you've got one.

Going into a Trial, Wedding - or ANY job - with apprehension is a big giant No Good Will Come Of This. You MUST shed the reprehension and be able to walk in with a Good Attitude.

A vital part of ANY successful business is knowing when the best, right and most ethical course of action is to turn down the business.

I wish you every luck - and hope you experience the very infrequent exception to the rule and have a fantastic experience.
Nov 11 12 04:44 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
LC Makeup and Styling
Posts: 90
Perth, Western Australia, Australia


I dont think it's wrong at all for the OP to have a rant. Maybe she ranted on here because she knows there are people on here who have had the same experience and can relate and perhaps share there story.  At the end of the day it's her decision, doesnt mean she doesnt appreciate the feedback and advice.
Nov 11 12 06:21 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Erica Wandemberg
Posts: 9
Baltimore, Maryland, US


MADE NYC wrote:

So, you asked for advice and basically took none of it ...even though some came from senior artists with a wealth of experience in these type of situations.

Once again, I'm reminded why I post so infrequently at MM. Forum members claim they want information from experienced senior artists ...then they either ignore it or argue it.

Waste of time.

I loved your advice to her. Actually it was great and also got me thinking of adding much needed info in my contract so everything is clear as well.

Nov 11 12 09:33 pm  Link  Quote 
guide forum
Makeup Artist
Mary
Posts: 7,155
Coronado, California, US


MADE NYC wrote:

You're absolutely right.

So when put into perspective, the OP simply wanted a use the forum as an audience for their rant and had no intention of using the advise we (erroneously) assumed they "requested".

Just a thought ...wouldn't it be much more productive if people were candid and admitted that they are looking for empathy, not advise.
And in the end, I take full responsibility for choosing to exert myself and answer what I misconstrued as a question.
Lesson learned.

it's not really a waste....   For one person that chooses not to listen there are many silent people that do pay attention.  You have no idea who you're helping when you give advise on a board like this.  When she comes back and tells everyone what a disaster the whole event was it will sink in for the wise ones that just sit on the sidelines and learn

Nov 11 12 09:51 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Aleksandra Ambrozy
Posts: 142
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, US


Nov 12 12 02:22 am  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Aleksandra Ambrozy
Posts: 142
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, US


Nov 12 12 02:27 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Image Magik
Posts: 1,067
New Orleans, Louisiana, US


Easy. If the pain doesn't justify the payoff. Or if your well off,
You don't have time for bs.
Nov 12 12 02:36 am  Link  Quote 
guide forum
Makeup Artist
KJB
Posts: 1,184
New York, New York, US


Aleksandra Ambrozy  wrote:
you really have no idea what you are talking about. If this was simply just as simple as doing A or B. But it is not. That's why I wanted an advice. I have though about it a lot and I did what made me most comfortable in that moment. I do not understand why you have to be so bitter. If you don't want to give an advice then don't. I do not appreciate your tone. I have taken many advices into consideration, not just yours.
I have admited that what i did didn't work, I have learned from my mistake.
Aleksandra Ambrozy  wrote:
it is funny how some of you talk about me like I am not part of this conversation. point taken and i won't be posting on the forum anymore. I do not need to be bullied like that.

Thank you OP for clarifying my confusion concerning this thread.
The power of Karma is quite potent and the rules of cosmic attraction are just as strong. You're responses provide insight as to why this troublesome client appeared in your life. Drama attracts drama.

And thank you Mary. I can always count on you to put things into proper perspective. wink

Nov 12 12 05:54 am  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Aleksandra Ambrozy
Posts: 142
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, US


Nov 12 12 11:18 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Carlos Occidental
Posts: 10,546
Glendora, California, US


(deleted)

For some of the above posters, the word is "advice."  Not "advise."
Nov 12 12 12:26 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Scott Sullivan Photo
Posts: 1,175
Royal Oak, Michigan, US


Aleksandra Ambrozy  wrote:
I am having a very difficult and rude client and I need help deciding what to do.
I have a bride who is getting married next month ( december bit slow for me). She booked me months ago and just came for a trial last weekend before her engagement session. She was very happy during the trial and didn't want any changes/adjustments but she emailed me last night that she was very unhappy with the way she looked on the photos.
I did exactly what she wanted etc....
She is quite rude now and says she wants another trial that she won't pay for blah blah blah. I usually accomodate brides and give them discounts for second trials but she is just so rude.
What do I do? I don't want to dump her because I need the money, if i dump her I will need to give her the retainer back also.
I tried to be very nice, accomodating and understanding but she is just such a bitch. I actually want her to dump me now because then she will still have to pay my fee.
When do you know its just not worth it?
Thanks
Aleks
p.s. I have been doing bridal for a long time and have a great record otherwise...

1 quick question???  did you ask to see the photos, and ask what she objects to???

how good is the photo quality? is it some GWC who does not know crap, and use the wrong White Balance, and not the makeup is the wrong color??

before you dump her, get a bit more information. if it's bad photography, and you can show her the colors you use, vs the picture, then she owe's you an apology. then if you want you can walk away with your chin held high, because you will know what happen, and how to avoid in the future.

{background check on photographer before accepting client smile }

GL

S

Nov 12 12 12:41 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Strength Studios
Posts: 342
West Hazleton, Pennsylvania, US


Aleksandra Ambrozy  wrote:
it is funny how some of you talk about me like I am not part of this conversation. point taken and i won't be posting on the forum anymore. I do not need to be bullied like that.

Again, I am not a makeup artist, but I worked as a wedding planner for about a decade in NYC. If you feel that what happened here in this forum is bullying, then I respectfully suggest that you might be a bit oversensitive. There was criticism certainly, but no bullying.

Weddings are a tough business, you need to have a thick skin. I have literally dealt with about 500 brides, and they come in all shapes, sizes and attitudes. And if you aren't willing to take the time to calm down a bride, then maybe you should rethink the weddings. As a vendor to a wedding client, the most important skill is to figure out what is really happening with the client. Often it is not about you at all, and sometimes it is. You will never figure it out until you actually speak with your client.

And in all honesty, asking for a sooner appointment isn't disrespectful, it's impatient. They are two different things, and I have yet to meet a patient bride to be.

For those in the wedding business, it is just another day at work, to those getting married it is a monstrous investment and a huge amount of stress. A little understanding never lost anyone a client.  When I was a planner, some of my most "pain in the ass" brides, ended up sending me their sisters, cousins and friends.

Nov 12 12 03:39 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Sungoddess Studios
Posts: 5,169
Atlantic Highlands, New Jersey, US


Aleksandra Ambrozy  wrote:
I am having a very difficult and rude client and I need help deciding what to do.
I have a bride who is getting married next month ( december bit slow for me). She booked me months ago and just came for a trial last weekend before her engagement session. She was very happy during the trial and didn't want any changes/adjustments but she emailed me last night that she was very unhappy with the way she looked on the photos.
I did exactly what she wanted etc....
She is quite rude now and says she wants another trial that she won't pay for blah blah blah. I usually accomodate brides and give them discounts for second trials but she is just so rude.
What do I do? I don't want to dump her because I need the money, if i dump her I will need to give her the retainer back also.
I tried to be very nice, accomodating and understanding but she is just such a bitch. I actually want her to dump me now because then she will still have to pay my fee.
When do you know its just not worth it?
Thanks
Aleks
p.s. I have been doing bridal for a long time and have a great record otherwise...

www.dgrin.com/showthread.php?t=149267

I believe it was derived from a MM form in '07

My wifes MUA contract has a bridezilla clause in it which states that if the bride has unreal conceptions about her wedding contractors that she forfeits all deposits and payments in full and has to replace contractors herself and provide payment to the contractors as well as replacement contractors.


SUFFER BITCH!!!!

Nov 13 12 08:31 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
I M N Photography
Posts: 2,329
New York, New York, US


Aleksandra Ambrozy  wrote:
I am having a very difficult and rude client and I need help deciding what to do.
I have a bride who is getting married next month ( december bit slow for me). She booked me months ago and just came for a trial last weekend before her engagement session. She was very happy during the trial and didn't want any changes/adjustments but she emailed me last night that she was very unhappy with the way she looked on the photos.
I did exactly what she wanted etc....
She is quite rude now and says she wants another trial that she won't pay for blah blah blah. I usually accomodate brides and give them discounts for second trials but she is just so rude.
What do I do? I don't want to dump her because I need the money, if i dump her I will need to give her the retainer back also.
I tried to be very nice, accomodating and understanding but she is just such a bitch. I actually want her to dump me now because then she will still have to pay my fee.
When do you know its just not worth it?
Thanks
Aleks
p.s. I have been doing bridal for a long time and have a great record otherwise...

Suck it up. There are worse ones on the horizon.

Nov 13 12 07:25 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
MAGIC FX
Posts: 347
New York, New York, US


Sounds like her wedding jitters are making her into a rude person or maybe a clash of personalities.  I would schedule a second trial to meet face to face as soon as possible and have a kind conversation about wanting her to have the best day possibe and for "her peace of mind" you think she should find a make up artist that she is completely and totally pleased with because it's her day and she needs to feel super beautiful and confident, then give her back the retainer and wish her the best of luck.
Nov 14 12 06:55 am  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Aleksandra Ambrozy
Posts: 142
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, US


Nov 14 12 08:35 am  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Elizabethmakeup
Posts: 338
Hereford, England, United Kingdom


Aleksandra Ambrozy  wrote:
Do not tell me to rethink my carrier, you don't know me. Thats what pisses me off on this forum. People making stupid suggestions like this. Don't be such a smart ass..

You need to log off before you burn all of your bridges. If you keep speaking to people like that, you're not going to get any help in the future. I personally, will not be answering any of your future posts.

This is a classic example as to what pisses *me* off about this forum.

Nov 14 12 08:45 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jonathan NYC
Posts: 1,114
New York, New York, US


Keep in mind that when she or other clients Google you, these threads can come up.
Nov 14 12 01:05 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Star
Posts: 17,925
Los Angeles, California, US


Aleksandra Ambrozy  wrote:

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
look who is talking!

An Emmy award winning makeup artist and some girl I've never heard of are talking

Now ask who is listening

Nov 14 12 01:38 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Star
Posts: 17,925
Los Angeles, California, US


Aleksandra Ambrozy  wrote:

have also dealt with hundrets of brides. I understand that people get stressed out. I am great dealing with them but when someone is straight out rude and disrespectful i refuse to deal with them. Do not tell me to rethink my carrier, you don't know me. Thats what pisses me off on this forum. People making stupid suggestions like this. Don't be such a smart ass..

Who is your carrier? I use sprint.

Man you are not coming off well in this forum.

Nov 14 12 01:40 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Robert Jewett
Posts: 2,443
al-Marsā, Tunis, Tunisia


Aleksandra Ambrozy  wrote:

have also dealt with hundrets of brides. I understand that people get stressed out. I am great dealing with them but when someone is straight out rude and disrespectful i refuse to deal with them. Do not tell me to rethink my carrier, you don't know me. Thats what pisses me off on this forum. People making stupid suggestions like this. Don't be such a smart ass..

Um, no.  That's what people were telling you to do.
You set another time when they can come in to have their make-up done.

Nov 14 12 03:05 pm  Link  Quote 
Hair Stylist
Michael Nesbitt
Posts: 1
Washington, District of Columbia, US


Protect your peace at all cost! At least then you maintain your dignity and professional standards.
Nov 14 12 04:25 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
Christl Colven
Posts: 1
BOISE, Idaho, US


I always charge a non-refundable fee for a bridal consult. The price is taken off their final bill if they hire me. I also have a contract and make them pay half up front which if they cancel within1-2 weeks before they lose a percentage of that deposit, more of course closer to the date. You are just as important as the caterer or photographer. Do not let anyone take advantage of you.
Nov 25 12 02:57 pm  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
SarahChaudhry
Posts: 298
Singapore, Singapore, Singapore


Raw-Beauty wrote:
what are the odds that she has another different MUA in mind that is undercutting your prices and just wants and excuse?  I agree with above posts.  not worth the headache dealing with this.

hahha this reminds me of what a bride did! So I have this rule that all clients need to leave a non refundable deposit when they want to book me so i block that time slot for them. so I had this bride booked me for 5th October. one week before the 5th, she sends me a sob email about how her wedding has been cancelled and she's really sad about it and she said in the email "Im shattered, i dont know what to do now".
Whilst I felt bad for her, I gave her my sympathy and told her to be strong. I didnt mention anything about the deposit because, well because no matter what, Its non refundable. and THEN... on the 6th of October, this bride apparently FORGOT that she had added me on facebook big_smile So on the 6th she posted a facebook shout out thanking everyone for coming 'last night' and that she had a beautiful wedding!
I was stumped but found it hilarious, rather than getting upset. So I left a comment on her shout out saying "Thats nice to hear!'
within an hour, she blocked me off her facebook account big_smile
LOL! I found it ridiculously hilarious. WHY would you LIE about your ow wedding being cancelled??  I mean even if you wanted another makeup artist to do it, thats totally fine because Im not really at a total loss because I still have the deposit. Some said maybe the weddng was indeed cancelled and then last minute it was back on...REALLY? If that was the case then why freak out when I commented on her facebook and block me?
smile

anyways i have two facebook accounts One is a persona account and another is for clients and family, people who i dont want to have in my personal account. Because alot of them prefer facebooking rather than emailing.
Obviously she wasnt in my personal account smile

Nov 25 12 06:22 pm  Link  Quote 
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