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Model
Angelique Model
Posts: 28
London, England, United Kingdom


I've been contacted via another site to do a shoot.
I asked the level of the shoot, the guy said "nude"
I said okay, then he stated that it was "basic nude"
I asked him for pictures or styles he was trying to recreate 3 times so I get an idea what on Earth "basic nude" is. (it could be interpreted in many ways)
He just replies with "I don't know..walking around, basic nudity" having no input on what the pictures are for, how long he's  been working...what style the shoot is.

It's quite sad really that I have to encounter people like this. A lot of the photographers I've worked with are incredibly inspiring and I get a real high from the shoots... people like this- it's like *face desk*
Dec 03 12 04:47 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Jordan Bunniie
Posts: 1,627
Los Angeles, California, US


I'm sorry but I can't help but laugh.


Though I do feel your pain.
They're everywhere. I get stuff like that on a regular basis. hmm
Dec 03 12 04:55 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Top Gun Digital
Posts: 1,217
Las Vegas, Nevada, US


You have to realize that the majority of photographers out there are just guys with cameras that want to photograph naked women.  They know nothing about photography and if they happen to get any good images its through the efforts of the model and a camera set on automatic that can think for them.

Don't despair, there are still plenty of real photographers out there that you can work with.

Set your standards and stick to them.  If you would be uncomfortable working with someone like that don't do it.
Dec 03 12 04:56 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Angelique Model
Posts: 28
London, England, United Kingdom


Jordan Bunniie wrote:
I'm sorry but I can't help but laugh.


Though I do feel your pain.
They're everywhere. I get stuff like that on a regular basis. hmm

Haha yeah, it's such a shame though!
I want to feel inspired by shooting.
I do too, it's just a pain constantly having to come across these types of people. xD

Dec 03 12 05:00 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Angelique Model
Posts: 28
London, England, United Kingdom


Top Gun Digital wrote:
You have to realize that the majority of photographers out there are just guys with cameras that want to photograph naked women.  They know nothing about photography and if they happen to get any good images its through the efforts of the model and a camera set on automatic that can think for them.

Don't despair, there are still plenty of real photographers out there that you can work with.

Set your standards and stick to them.  If you would be uncomfortable working with someone like that don't do it.

Yeah, I know. There really are.
I mean I have worked with some amazing people who have changed me as a person almost.
I'm just venting to be honest. xD
I wish feel for the poor girls these guys prey on who don't have a clue about who's really looking for quality images and not just after some tits and a fanny.
Pretty pathetic people spend £100's just to see women naked.
It's sad.

Dec 03 12 05:02 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Top Gun Digital
Posts: 1,217
Las Vegas, Nevada, US


Angelique Luff wrote:

I wish feel for the poor girls these guys prey on who don't have a clue about who's really looking for quality images and not just after some tits and a fanny.
Pretty pathetic people spend £100's just to see women naked.
It's sad.

It is sad.  However, there are many models that are more interested in making money than creating art.  For models like that these guys that are willing to spend a great deal of money to see women naked can be a major source of income.

Dec 03 12 05:05 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Angelique Model
Posts: 28
London, England, United Kingdom


Top Gun Digital wrote:

It is sad.  However, there are many models that are more interested in making money than creating art.  For models like that these guys that are willing to spend a great deal of money to see women naked can be a major source of income.

Very true!
You have a point.
It's just a sad world really.
I see every photo as art, but that's just me. ^^

Dec 03 12 05:10 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Paul Tirado Photography
Posts: 4,215
New York, New York, US


Angelique Luff wrote:
Haha yeah, it's such a shame though!
I want to feel inspired by shooting.
I do too, it's just a pain constantly having to come across these types of people. xD

Not sure how to feel about this. I mean if it is a trade shoot and you don't feel inspired then don't do it. If it is paid shoot, it is nice but unrealistic to expect to be both inspired and paid by...as has been noted above..the GWC crowd.

I sort of side with the many nude models who have written that they don't have an unkind word to say about the GWC crowd as they basically allow them to make a living as model.  It is all about managing expectations - a collaboration with a skilled photographer with a full team and concept...you should be inspired.  Someone's third shoot with the home and garden flood lamps....you should not expect much.

Dec 03 12 05:12 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
FLORENCE PHOTO STUDIO
Posts: 89
Florence, Oregon, US


Angelique,
from reading your bio and seeing your portfolio, you're intelligent, beautiful and very inspiring to any photographer that is lucky enough to get to work with you.
You will have many quality Photographers come your way. Take your pick!  smile
Dave
Dec 03 12 05:14 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
intense_puppy
Posts: 864
Brighton, England, United Kingdom


Angelique Luff wrote:
I asked him for pictures or styles he was trying to recreate 3 times so I get an idea what on Earth "basic nude" is. (it could be interpreted in many ways)
He just replies with "I don't know..walking around, basic nudity" having no input on what the pictures are for, how long he's  been working...what style the shoot is.

I thought sending pic examples and explaining the tone of the shoot was standard practice? Do people actually really do the "let's shoot!" thing?

If it's a paid shoot, when he asks for your rates you should say "I dunno, some money. Not sure. Let's walk around for a while and I'll come up with a figure." big_smile

Seriously though - even on paid shoots don't you need to give the model an idea of what they're shooting? So it doesn't get awkward on set when they have to say no to being hung upside down and painted in marmite?

Dec 03 12 05:44 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
NicoleNudes
Posts: 3,796
Toronto, Ontario, Canada


I've gotten quite a number of messages like that.

They message me saying they want to shoot something "sexy"

I ask them what sexy is and they just respond saying the same thing.

I usually never end up shooting with these people because I like to have some sort of idea of what I'm walking into. I usually ask for reference images of what they're talking about and I never hear back from them.
Dec 03 12 05:48 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Looknsee Photography
Posts: 20,976
Portland, Oregon, US


Hey, if we was gud wit werds 'n' stuff, wed be a righter, not a truckin phottoggraphator.
Dec 03 12 06:03 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
deletedxxx
Posts: 149
Melbourne, Victoria, Australia


This is why I chucked in the modelling towel. This description would be one of the more informative "photographers" contacting me. Usually when I ask what are you wanting to shoot they completely ignore my question
or 
after asking for the 100th time I'd get "i'll leave it to you". (yay, I love mind reading) To rub it in, after several messages I would find its a TF request.
*sigh*
I also enjoyed the guys who would do the pulling teeth 20 questions game setting up a shoot, pick a date (minus time or location) then vanish into thin air the week leading to the shoot.
THEN,
about 4 months later they contact you for a shoot as if they haven't spoken to you before!

I concluded that my percieved worth as a model couldn't have been much.
Dec 03 12 06:10 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Jordan Bunniie
Posts: 1,627
Los Angeles, California, US


Looknsee Photography wrote:
Hey, if we was gud wit werds 'n' stuff, wed be a righter, not a truckin phottoggraphator.

Dec 03 12 06:13 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Angelique Model
Posts: 28
London, England, United Kingdom


landofy wrote:
This is why I chucked in the modelling towel. This description would be one of the more informative "photographers" contacting me. Usually when I ask what are you wanting to shoot they completely ignore my question
or 
after asking for the 100th time I'd get "i'll leave it to you". (yay, I love mind reading) To rub it in, after several messages I would find its a TF request.
*sigh*
I also enjoyed the guys who would do the pulling teeth 20 questions game setting up a shoot, pick a date (minus time or location) then vanish into thin air the week leading to the shoot.
THEN,
about 4 months later they contact you for a shoot as if they haven't spoken to you before!

I concluded that my percieved worth as a model couldn't have been much.

Yep this has happened to me quite a few times. xD
Or they just never contact you again. It's like...okay.

Dec 04 12 01:05 am  Link  Quote 
Model
Angelique Model
Posts: 28
London, England, United Kingdom


intense puppy wrote:

I thought sending pic examples and explaining the tone of the shoot was standard practice? Do people actually really do the "let's shoot!" thing?

If it's a paid shoot, when he asks for your rates you should say "I dunno, some money. Not sure. Let's walk around for a while and I'll come up with a figure." big_smile

Seriously though - even on paid shoots don't you need to give the model an idea of what they're shooting? So it doesn't get awkward on set when they have to say no to being hung upside down and painted in marmite?

Hahaha xD
Yeah I like to have some idea.
Even if it's just a style of a shoot.
Example 'high fashion lingerie' would go a long way letting me know what I'm doing and showing me examples of poses, lighting and imagery.

Dec 04 12 01:06 am  Link  Quote 
Model
Angelique Model
Posts: 28
London, England, United Kingdom


Paul Tirado Photography wrote:

Not sure how to feel about this. I mean if it is a trade shoot and you don't feel inspired then don't do it. If it is paid shoot, it is nice but unrealistic to expect to be both inspired and paid by...as has been noted above..the GWC crowd.

I sort of side with the many nude models who have written that they don't have an unkind word to say about the GWC crowd as they basically allow them to make a living as model.  It is all about managing expectations - a collaboration with a skilled photographer with a full team and concept...you should be inspired.  Someone's third shoot with the home and garden flood lamps....you should not expect much.

To be honest, I love shooting no matter what. Even if the ideas are basic. Even if I've done them before.
It's just nice knowing that the photographer is passionate about what he/she is doing.
That's just my opinion though smile

Dec 04 12 01:07 am  Link  Quote 
Model
Angelique Model
Posts: 28
London, England, United Kingdom


FLASHBACK PHOTO wrote:
Angelique,
from reading your bio and seeing your portfolio, you're intelligent, beautiful and very inspiring to any photographer that is lucky enough to get to work with you.
You will have many quality Photographers come your way. Take your pick!  smile
Dave

Why thankyou smile
Yeah I have worked with some really amazing people.
^^

Dec 04 12 01:08 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Patrick Walberg
Posts: 42,517
Salinas, California, US


Angelique Luff wrote:
I've been contacted via another site to do a shoot.
I asked the level of the shoot, the guy said "nude"
I said okay, then he stated that it was "basic nude"
I asked him for pictures or styles he was trying to recreate 3 times so I get an idea what on Earth "basic nude" is. (it could be interpreted in many ways)
He just replies with "I don't know..walking around, basic nudity" having no input on what the pictures are for, how long he's  been working...what style the shoot is.

It's quite sad really that I have to encounter people like this. A lot of the photographers I've worked with are incredibly inspiring and I get a real high from the shoots... people like this- it's like *face desk*

I really did Laugh Out Loud at this!!!  I know about "Art nudes, candid nudes, glamour nudes, implied nudes, and erotic nudes ...."  What the heck!  Some ones probably got an "Editorial nude" some where?  But I've never heard the term "basic nude" before.  So thank you for a new one!  lol

Dec 04 12 01:15 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Patrick Walberg
Posts: 42,517
Salinas, California, US


Looknsee Photography wrote:
Hey, if we was gud wit werds 'n' stuff, wed be a righter, not a truckin phottoggraphator.

lol   "Dude!!!" 


http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m8ex21biOf1rnnnavo1_500.gif

Dec 04 12 01:22 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Sourcelight Photography
Posts: 245
BOISE, Idaho, US


Of course it works both ways.  Here in the txtspk age, I usually find that sending a llama (or responding to an inquiry from a llama with) a detailed description of the shoot parameters just brands me as some sort of retro nerd, and is the quickest way to send most Internet llamas flying off into oblivion never to be heard from again.

There was an interesting discussion about this here:

http://www.modelmayhem.com/po.php?thread_id=866230
Dec 04 12 01:30 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Studio Chiaroscuro
Posts: 81
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada


My guess is he's just... really... you know - basic.
Dec 04 12 01:31 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
intense_puppy
Posts: 864
Brighton, England, United Kingdom


Patrick Walberg wrote:
But I've never heard the term "basic nude" before.  So thank you for a new one!  lol

AKA - "nudie nudes"

Dec 04 12 05:14 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Gabby57
Posts: 394
Coppell, Texas, US


Sourcelight Photography wrote:
Of course it works both ways.  Here in the txtspk age, I usually find that sending a model (or responding to an inquiry from a model with) a detailed description of the shoot parameters just brands me as some sort of retro nerd, and is the quickest way to send most Internet models flying off into oblivion never to be heard from again.

There was an interesting discussion about this here:

http://www.modelmayhem.com/po.php?threa … age=1#last

Yep, send a message asking fee schedule to a prospective model with a lot of detail about style, wardrobe, equipment, goals, example photos of the style etc., etc. (clothed or nude makes no difference), and get no reply at all.  This has been 3/4 of my experience here, not even the courtesy of a "no thank you reply".

Dec 04 12 05:17 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
salvatori.
Posts: 3,745
State College, Pennsylvania, US


Angelique Luff wrote:
It's quite sad really that I have to encounter people like this. A lot of the photographers I've worked with are incredibly inspiring and I get a real high from the shoots... people like this- it's like *face desk*

So 'a lot' of the photographers you have worked with are inspiring, and you run across a guy who isn't. And this justifies a thread about....... what.........?

Sounds like a day out of real life for, well, just about anyone....................

O_o

Dec 04 12 05:33 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
salvatori.
Posts: 3,745
State College, Pennsylvania, US


Top Gun Digital wrote:
You have to realize that the majority of photographers out there are just guys with cameras that want to photograph naked women.  They know nothing about photography and if they happen to get any good images its through the efforts of the model and a camera set on automatic that can think for them.

I want to thank you so very, very much for telling a nineteen year old model just how ridiculously perverted most of us photographers are.

Without a doubt, the dumbest fucking thing I'll hear today....

O_o

Dec 04 12 05:35 am  Link  Quote 
Model
Melodye Joy
Posts: 542
Rancho Cucamonga, California, US


Angelique Luff wrote:
I've been contacted via another site to do a shoot.
I asked the level of the shoot, the guy said "nude"
I said okay, then he stated that it was "basic nude"
I asked him for pictures or styles he was trying to recreate 3 times so I get an idea what on Earth "basic nude" is. (it could be interpreted in many ways)
He just replies with "I don't know..walking around, basic nudity" having no input on what the pictures are for, how long he's  been working...what style the shoot is.

It's quite sad really that I have to encounter people like this. A lot of the photographers I've worked with are incredibly inspiring and I get a real high from the shoots... people like this- it's like *face desk*

That response is like asking someone if they'd like milk in their cereal and their reply being 'I guess'.

What professional doesn't know what LOOK he is trying to achieve?! I am always learning as a model and I will pick up photography tips and language...and some inquires similar to yours get ZERO response when I ask
"what type/style?" , "will you be lighting from the back or side?", "what about shadowing?"

Especially when  I have to do my own makeup, I need to have a general idea so that I am not washed on one side of my face or body, or so that I add just enough blush/base/lipstick to POP.

As most have stated, sounds like a GWC (guy with a camera) because when anyone approaches with a collaboration, they should dang well know their vision, have example images, even ask you to bring more than you need just because their vision MAY change slightly.

Sorry that happened, hun. sad It happens more often than not unfortunately.

Dec 04 12 09:22 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Glenn Hall - Fine Art
Posts: 431
Townsville, Queensland, Australia


salvatori. wrote:

I want to thank you so very, very much for telling a nineteen year old model just how ridiculously perverted most of us photographers are.

Without a doubt, the dumbest fucking thing I'll hear today....

O_o

LMFAO...and here I was, thinking it was just sheilas with cameras that wanted to photograph naked men....yup, the dumbest thing ["majority of photographers out there are just guys with cameras that want to photograph naked women"] I ever heard all week...LMFAO

Dec 05 12 02:07 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Drew Smith Photography
Posts: 5,209
Nottingham, England, United Kingdom


Angelique Luff wrote:
Yep this has happened to me quite a few times. xD
Or they just never contact you again. It's like...okay.

Yes, it's MM and it happens a lot.

Of course, there is a flip side to this: the photographer makes the initial approach and pm's are enthusiastically exchanged, whereupon he offers to exchange 'mood boards' or simple images that enable both model and photog to establish limits and themes; the photographer sends the model his email address via MM pm to enable this and that's the last he hears from her.  smile

Dec 05 12 02:20 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Glenn Hall - Fine Art
Posts: 431
Townsville, Queensland, Australia


Drew Smith Photography wrote:

Yes, it's MM and it happens a lot.

Of course, there is a flip side to this: the photographer makes the initial approach and pm's are enthusiastically exchanged, whereupon he offers to exchange 'mood boards' or simple images that enable both model and photog to establish limits and themes; the photographer sends the model his email address via MM pm to enable this and that's the last he hears from her.  smile

yup, there is that flip-side...the mysterious vanishing "model"

Dec 05 12 02:38 am  Link  Quote 
Model
Jojo West
Posts: 972
Silver Spring, Maryland, US


Angelique Luff wrote:
I've been contacted via another site to do a shoot.
I asked the level of the shoot, the guy said "nude"
I said okay, then he stated that it was "basic nude"
I asked him for pictures or styles he was trying to recreate 3 times so I get an idea what on Earth "basic nude" is. (it could be interpreted in many ways)
He just replies with "I don't know..walking around, basic nudity" having no input on what the pictures are for, how long he's  been working...what style the shoot is.

It's quite sad really that I have to encounter people like this. A lot of the photographers I've worked with are incredibly inspiring and I get a real high from the shoots... people like this- it's like *face desk*

I know the feeling. It didn't happen for a nude shoot but I recently did one where the photographer had no idea what he wanted out of the shots. I asked what kind of poses he preferred, what his vision was his response... "um I don't know, doesn't matter, I don't really have a vision"

I just think...if you don't have a vision, what's the point?!

Dec 07 12 02:09 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
UnsinnLight
Posts: 9
Los Angeles, California, US


Makes perfect sense to me.  I'm walking around nude right now.  smile
Dec 07 12 02:22 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
M Pandolfo Photography
Posts: 12,116
Tampa, Florida, US


I never cease to be entertained on this site.

"Umm, I don't know. Just like basic like walking around nude n stuff..."

And these are the "photographers" that so many photographers are complaining are saturating the industry and taking away our clients?

That shit is priceless.
Dec 07 12 02:24 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
B R U N E S C I
Posts: 25,319
Bath, England, United Kingdom


Patrick Walberg wrote:
I really did Laugh Out Loud at this!!!  I know about "Art nudes, candid nudes, glamour nudes, implied nudes, and erotic nudes ...."  What the heck!  Some ones probably got an "Editorial nude" some where?

How could you possibly forget "fashion nude"?  tongue

OP, come and shoot with me - I promise to keep my pants on, even if you don't.



Just my $0.02

Ciao
Stefano
www.stefanobrunesci.com

Dec 07 12 02:25 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
DAN CRUIKSHANK
Posts: 1,786
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada


Basic nude, walking around nude and stuff... Sounds like a pretty accurate description of the Me In My Place website.
Dec 07 12 02:38 pm  Link  Quote 
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