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Photographer
Herman Surkis
Posts: 6,230
Victoria, British Columbia, Canada


Can you set an Einstein to fire part way through an exposure?
At the .5sec mark of a 1sec exposure.
Cando with PW, but what about CC?
Dec 06 12 03:17 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Good Egg Productions
Posts: 12,812
Orlando, Florida, US


Not that I'm aware.  But I never read the manual.

You can obviously set your camera to rear curtain fire though.
Dec 06 12 03:24 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
J Allen Photographic
Posts: 186
Long Beach, California, US


Dec 06 12 03:44 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Herman Surkis
Posts: 6,230
Victoria, British Columbia, Canada


Good Egg Productions wrote:
Not that I'm aware.  But I never read the manual.

You can obviously set your camera to rear curtain fire though.

Yes, but what I want is mid-curtain fire.
Say at the 1.5 sec mark of a 3 sec. exposure.

Dec 06 12 04:38 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
GER Photography
Posts: 6,240
Imperial, California, US


Hit the test button!
Dec 06 12 04:44 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
James S Kassanoff
Posts: 799
Washington, New Jersey, US


I thought this was going to be a question on quantum physics!
Dec 06 12 04:52 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Paul AI
Posts: 572
Shawnee, Oklahoma, US


George Ruge wrote:
Hit the test button!

Lol, would require impeccable timing by the user.

Dec 06 12 05:06 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
shawn is boring
Posts: 1,285
Long Beach, California, US


isn't this more a question of camera features? Far as I know that would be something that would be controlled as front curtain or rear curtain flash.
Dec 06 12 05:10 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Herman Surkis
Posts: 6,230
Victoria, British Columbia, Canada


shawn is boring wrote:
isn't this more a question of camera features? Far as I know that would be something that would be controlled as front curtain or rear curtain flash.

Actually more like middle curtain.

And about reflexes like a mongoose, yes especially since I would like the flash to go off midway of a 1 sec exposure.

And yes, test does work, hoping for something a bit more precise then my ancient nerves and reflexes.

So perhaps until PCB adds delay to the CC or Einsteins, I am out of luck.

Dec 06 12 05:45 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
BlueMoonPics
Posts: 2,313
New York, New York, US


You're probably going to have to go to Radio Shack and build an adjustable delay from your camera hot shoe to the flash triggers.  This is what I'd do if I really needed this.
Dec 06 12 05:59 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
AJScalzitti
Posts: 9,509
Atlanta, Georgia, US


That would not be something I could see any manufacture wasting time and money on to develop for their monolights.  It would be more likely to see it as a camera function as the light is not in control, and we already have front and rear sync.

I have no idea why you would want to fire one a strange delay and obvioulsy you realize not many others would feel the need to.  It's would need to be something you built
Dec 06 12 06:12 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Kaouthia
Posts: 3,080
Lancaster, England, United Kingdom


BlueMoonPics wrote:
You're probably going to have to go to Radio Shack and build an adjustable delay from your camera hot shoe to the flash triggers.  This is what I'd do if I really needed this.

That's what I was going to say.

It's easy enough to do with something like an Arduino and an extra pair of radio triggers on a different channel.

Dec 06 12 06:14 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Leonard Gee Photography
Posts: 14,205
Sacramento, California, US


Good Egg Productions wrote:
You can obviously set your camera to rear curtain fire though.

The requirement is for a specific interval. Rear curtain sync fires just when rear curtain is release - so it won't work and the event has already lapsed.

The PW Multimax was designed to hand just that issue. It allows a specific delay after the camera sync  trigger. The Elinchrome Skyport control software also can set a delay after sync signal on the RX flash units. However, I've never heard of the PB units with that feature.

Herman Surkis wrote:
And about reflexes like a mongoose, yes especially since I would like the flash to go off midway of a 1 sec exposure.

For a reflex capture, a set delay is chancy unless the reaction is consistent or the capture event is long enough to allow some leeway. Or you have enough time for trial and error.

Dec 06 12 06:16 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Herman Surkis
Posts: 6,230
Victoria, British Columbia, Canada


So I can build it.
Or wait till PCB does a firmware upgrade to the CC to do what the PW can do.
Dec 06 12 10:48 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Darin B
Posts: 998
San Diego, California, US


I honestly think the best way to go, unless you're photographing an automation/automated process that's precisely timed/repeatable, is to keep a shutter release in one hand and a strobe trigger in the other and simply count it out. Once you have a rhythm it'll work.
Dec 07 12 12:07 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Mike Collins
Posts: 1,319
Orlando, Florida, US


I'm just curious as to why you need it to go off at exactly 1.5 sec into a 3 sec. exposure.  Maybe there is some other workaround. 

You can build a simple firing device to fire off the strobe unit so you don't have to be right next to the strobe unit and hit the test button.
Dec 07 12 09:07 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
J Allen Photographic
Posts: 186
Long Beach, California, US


Herman Surkis wrote:
So I can build it.
Or wait till PCB does a firmware upgrade to the CC to do what the PW can do.

Or just use PW's to trigger the Einsteins?

Dec 07 12 12:07 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
AJScalzitti
Posts: 9,509
Atlanta, Georgia, US


J Allen Photographic wrote:

Or just use PW's to trigger the Einsteins?

+1 it's time like these when I am reminded "Sometimes you can't afford cheap"; add another reason to buy PW in the first place.

Dec 07 12 12:16 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Azimuth Arts
Posts: 1,134
Toronto, Ontario, Canada


J Allen Photographic wrote:

Or just use PW's to trigger the Einsteins?

+1 - there is no reason not to use the PW as your sync.

If you still want to use the CC to set the power levels on the Einstein you should be able to use it off the hot shoe for remote control.   Just plug the Pocket Wizard into the 1/8" sync port - I don't think having the CyberSync transceiver connected will stop the sync port from working.  But check the manual about that.

Dec 07 12 12:21 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Azimuth Arts
Posts: 1,134
Toronto, Ontario, Canada


AJScalzitti wrote:

+1 it's time like these when I am reminded "Sometimes you can't afford cheap"; add another reason to buy PW in the first place.

Except I don't think the PW can control the levels on the Einstein (or other PCB lights) like the CyberCommander does.  I've never needed mid-curtain sync, but I am constantly adjusting the output on my Alien Bees using the CC - and when you have a light 12' in the air it's a lot easier than moving a ladder into place to make the change.

Dec 07 12 12:24 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Paul AI
Posts: 572
Shawnee, Oklahoma, US


Azimuth Arts wrote:
Except I don't think the PW can control the levels on the Einstein

Power levels can be controlled remotely using the MC2 and a MiniTT1 or FlexTT5 transceiver.  The downside is they are only adjustable in 1/3 stop increments over a 6 stop range instead of 1/10 stop increments over a 9 stop range you get with the CC. 

http://www.paulcbuff.com/mc2.php

Dec 07 12 12:29 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Azimuth Arts
Posts: 1,134
Toronto, Ontario, Canada


Paul AI wrote:

Power levels can be controlled remotely using the MC2 and a MiniTT1 or FlexTT5 transceiver.  The downside is they are only adjustable in 1/3 stop increments over a 6 stop range instead of 1/10 stop increments over a 9 stop range you get with the CC. 

http://www.paulcbuff.com/mc2.php

Thanks, that would work for the OP.  I use Alien Bees which that particular part does not support - and my flimsy excuse for not knowing it exists :-)

Dec 07 12 12:32 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Top Level Studio
Posts: 3,208
Victoria, British Columbia, Canada


Herman Surkis wrote:
Can you set an Einstein to fire part way through an exposure?
At the .5sec mark of a 1sec exposure.
Cando with PW, but what about CC?

Okay, I'll do it, if CC is unavailable.

Can you turn off the Einstein's optical trigger and use a radio trigger instead?

You could also dial down the power on a shoemount flash, that is not connected to the camera, and use the test button on the "hand flash" to trigger the Einstein at the right moment.

That calls for two hands, so the camera would need to be on a tripod.  Is that practical for this shoot?

Dec 07 12 12:42 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
J Allen Photographic
Posts: 186
Long Beach, California, US


When you plug into the sync port on the light, the optical is disabled.
Dec 07 12 12:51 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Hank Shiffman
Posts: 316
Mountain View, California, US


Top Level Studio wrote:
Can you turn off the Einstein's optical trigger and use a radio trigger instead?

Yes.  The slave sync can be disabled from the back panel on the light or remotely via the Cyber Commander.

If you want to use the delay function of a PW Multimax, you can get a PW receiver that plugs into the dedicated receiver socket on the Einstein.  It supports all the Multimax channels.

Dec 07 12 12:51 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
SKITA Studios
Posts: 1,318
Boston, Massachusetts, US


Herman Surkis wrote:
Or wait till PCB does a firmware upgrade to the CC to do what the PW can do.

Doubt they will...PW's TT system needs to do that for their Hypersync hack.
CC doesn't do Hypersync because it is a hack.

You probably want some kind of arduino gadget for it...too bad the Triggertrap doesn't have additional outputs or it'd be a perfect solution (it can only fire after a delay of sensing some event).

Dec 07 12 01:00 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Looknsee Photography
Posts: 18,895
Portland, Oregon, US


Herman Surkis wrote:
Yes, but what I want is mid-curtain fire.
Say at the 1.5 sec mark of a 3 sec. exposure.

As far as I know, no camera has a mid-curtain flash.

However, I've seen rare devices that are positioned between the camera & the flash/strobe which can introduce a delay in the triggering pulse to the flash/strobe.  I think you'll have better luck looking through flash accessories.  (Sorry, I'm too lazy to search for you).

Dec 07 12 01:05 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Orca Bay Images
Posts: 28,330
Lodi, California, US


George Ruge wrote:
Hit the test button!
Paul AI wrote:
Lol, would require impeccable timing by the user.

On a three-second exposure?

"One Mississippi,
Two-"
Hit the test button.

Dec 07 12 01:10 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Herman Surkis
Posts: 6,230
Victoria, British Columbia, Canada


Mike Collins wrote:
I'm just curious as to why you need it to go off at exactly 1.5 sec into a 3 sec. exposure.  Maybe there is some other workaround. 

You can build a simple firing device to fire off the strobe unit so you don't have to be right next to the strobe unit and hit the test button.

Actually the 1.5 was simply as an example. Does not have to be that precise, but would be nice.

You can do this with PW and Canons and their speedlights. Saw this done with a series of speedlights firing sequentially. Produced a neat effect with a moving subject. Could you do similar with highspeed burst, probably, but would it be the same, I don't think so.

Mike what you describe is what I have done in tests, and it does work, just hoping there was a more accurate way to do it.

Dec 07 12 01:14 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Herman Surkis
Posts: 6,230
Victoria, British Columbia, Canada


J Allen Photographic wrote:

Or just use PW's to trigger the Einsteins?

Yes.

But have the CyberSync system, and buying a thousand dollars worth of PW is not in the budge, or even make sense.

But you are right PW's will do it.

Dec 07 12 01:17 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Herman Surkis
Posts: 6,230
Victoria, British Columbia, Canada


Azimuth Arts wrote:

Except I don't think the PW can control the levels on the Einstein (or other PCB lights) like the CyberCommander does.  I've never needed mid-curtain sync, but I am constantly adjusting the output on my Alien Bees using the CC - and when you have a light 12' in the air it's a lot easier than moving a ladder into place to make the change.

But moving the ladder around keeps you lean and trim.
And think of the excitement when you almost fall off it.

Dec 07 12 01:19 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Herman Surkis
Posts: 6,230
Victoria, British Columbia, Canada


SKITA Studios wrote:

Doubt they will...PW's TT system needs to do that for their Hypersync hack.
CC doesn't do Hypersync because it is a hack.

You probably want some kind of arduino gadget for it...too bad the Triggertrap doesn't have additional outputs or it'd be a perfect solution (it can only fire after a delay of sensing some event).

Trigger Trap would also be neat. Must get for some nature photography, or even action shots.
More $$$

Dec 07 12 01:23 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
J Allen Photographic
Posts: 186
Long Beach, California, US


I hear ya on the expense. If it's just for one shoot, I would rent them.

http://www.borrowlenses.com/category/pocket_wizards
Dec 07 12 01:23 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Pixsrbious Productions
Posts: 90
Boston, Massachusetts, US


Herman Surkis wrote:
Yes, but what I want is mid-curtain fire.
Say at the 1.5 sec mark of a 3 sec. exposure.

+++

Dec 07 12 01:26 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Innovative Imagery
Posts: 2,462
Los Angeles, California, US


Herman Surkis wrote:

Yes.

But have the CyberSync system, and buying a thousand dollars worth of PW is not in the budge, or even make sense.

But you are right PW's will do it.

You could rent them when you need this capability.

Dec 07 12 01:33 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Herman Surkis
Posts: 6,230
Victoria, British Columbia, Canada


Orca Bay Images wrote:

George Ruge wrote:
Hit the test button!

On a three-second exposure?

"One Mississippi,
Two-"
Hit the test button.

Yep.
Although it will really be a 1sec. exposure. Some of the examples were just that examples.

Would be nice to fire the Einsteins sequentially with a 0.5sec delay between units.
Think any form of action photography.
Ok, I could buy a 500ws stroboscopic flash. But they are not cheap. And I already own the Einsteins. Also the one flash (in this situation) would be static, and the exposure of the subject would change as they moved across the field.

There are a number of workarounds.

I will be testing some this weekend.
PW answer is the best, but unaffordable for something that will be done only on occasion. And don't count out PCB. It is only a firmware upgrade (it is for the PW), so they may do it, just not soon enough for me.

Dec 07 12 01:37 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Warren Leimbach
Posts: 2,163
Tampa, Florida, US


Have you considered "Time Machine" or "Camera Axe"?
Dec 07 12 02:55 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Paul AI
Posts: 572
Shawnee, Oklahoma, US


Orca Bay Images wrote:
"One Mississippi,
Two-"
Hit the test button.

The OP states at the 0.5 mark of a 1 second exposure.

Dec 07 12 03:33 pm  Link  Quote 
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