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first123
Photographer
J Welborn
Posts: 2,552
Clarksville, Tennessee, US


K I C K H A M wrote:
Ford +, New York:

http://models.fordmodels.com/models/11/talents/13477
5'11.5 Size 10 (and clearly not big at all)

http://models.fordmodels.com/models/11/talents/27528
5'10 size 10

http://models.fordmodels.com/models/11/talents/13018
5'10 size 8-10

So, for some girls who fit into those sizes, plus is an option.

I would say big but as with every thing it's subjective . All are very nice looking but are more of the new accepted size because America is getting heavier smile

Jan 04 13 05:37 am  Link  Quote 
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Model
Damianne
Posts: 15,973
Austin, Texas, US


J  Welborn wrote:

I would say big but as with every thing it's subjective . All are very nice looking but are more of the new accepted size because America is getting heavier smile

Honey those women have always been the accepted size.

Jan 04 13 05:39 am  Link  Quote 
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Model
Anna Adrielle
Posts: 18,762
Antwerp, Antwerp, Belgium


J  Welborn wrote:

I would say big but as with every thing it's subjective . All are very nice looking but are more of the new accepted size because America is getting heavier smile

Curious, cause I'm not sure I understood you right: you would call this big?

http://runwayrevolution.com/wp-content/flagallery/cosmopolitan-uk-dec-2010-gorgeous-curves/cosmo-11.jpg

Jan 04 13 05:46 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
J Welborn
Posts: 2,552
Clarksville, Tennessee, US


Damianne wrote:

Honey those women have always been the accepted size.

I would say your the right size but they are just over the edge as I view them .

Jan 04 13 05:46 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
J Welborn
Posts: 2,552
Clarksville, Tennessee, US


Anna Adrielle wrote:

Curious, cause I'm not sure I understood you right: you would call this big?

http://runwayrevolution.com/wp-content/flagallery/cosmopolitan-uk-dec-2010-gorgeous-curves/cosmo-11.jpg

Nope that "image" looks great smile

Jan 04 13 05:49 am  Link  Quote 
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Model
Damianne
Posts: 15,973
Austin, Texas, US


J  Welborn wrote:

I would say your the right size but they are just over the edge as I view them .

*you're
I'm super skinny. I don't have to bend much for someone to see my ribs, and my boyfriend can touch his fingers around my waist.
That makes me about right for mainstream modelling (I'm slightly too short and slightly too fat for agency work) but if we're talking about socially accepted size, outside of the world of modelling, I'm fucking small.

Those women are actually what I would call "trim" for outside of the world of modelling. Maybe "healthy skinny".
They're definitely not over any edges, and that has nothing to do with America getting fat, and it's not new.

Jan 04 13 05:54 am  Link  Quote 
Model
MB Jen B
Posts: 2,857
Clarksville, Tennessee, US


Anna Adrielle wrote:

I'm pretty sure I don't have an inner beauty, I just have an 82 year old sarcastic woman with verbal diarrhea.

You two!!

smile Yes, lovely way to put it. My inner beauty is as curvilicious as all get out!

On the flip side, I'd also like a helping of healthy sarcasm with a timely bit of snarky too! Just a little but, I can't work that one.
Jen

Jan 04 13 07:21 am  Link  Quote 
Model
Saedcantas
Posts: 445
Saint Saviour, Saint Saviour, United Kingdom


I'm an in the middler (probably plus in some places) and I just do my own thing and don't worry about everyone else and their respective sizes. smile

P.S: Lack of measurements is unpopular and counter-productive no matter what size you are smile
Jan 04 13 10:41 am  Link  Quote 
Model
AllisonLael
Posts: 704
Los Angeles, California, US


Anna Adrielle wrote:
not only wrong, but insulting to both sides.

Sorry, I totally didn't mean to be insulting. Just giving my experience (full time model in NYC since I was 8. I've met A LOT of girls who were 'inbetween' and did just that, lost the weight, or gained the weight. And yes, I knew a girl who was a 6 and booked a plus job)

Sorry again, I do not mean to offend! smile

Jan 04 13 11:45 am  Link  Quote 
Model
May Sinclair
Posts: 1,147
Los Angeles, California, US


Whenever you break our "real size," or any similar terms, people work themselves into a tizzy (even if it's clear you didn't mean to be offensive).

We are all real, whether size 0 or 24.

But, to answer your question, I am a "real" size. I shoot nudes. Size doesn't matter as much, though trim, proportional models seem to be preferred.

In the modeling world, I'm much too fat for fashion. In the "real" world, I am very thin.
Jan 04 13 12:48 pm  Link  Quote 
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Model
Anna Adrielle
Posts: 18,762
Antwerp, Antwerp, Belgium


AllisonLael wrote:
Sorry, I totally didn't mean to be insulting. Just giving my experience (full time model in NYC since I was 8. I've met A LOT of girls who were 'inbetween' and did just that, lost the weight, or gained the weight. And yes, I knew a girl who was a 6 and booked a plus job)

Sorry again, I do not mean to offend! smile
Jan 04 13 01:10 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
T A Y L O R
Posts: 2,976
Austin, Texas, US


Serena Toxicat wrote:
RS is the NOS of modeling.

lol I love this, it's so true!

Jan 04 13 01:32 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
T A Y L O R
Posts: 2,976
Austin, Texas, US


Damianne wrote:
I'm eternally amused by the hesitance to accept shallow judgements in a field where what you look like is all you're selling.

+100000

Jan 04 13 01:32 pm  Link  Quote 
Wardrobe Stylist
The Trousseau
Posts: 469
Alameda, California, US


You asked what women between the size 4 to 10 range can model.  Well, in many cases, that is what I am looking for.  I sell vintage dresses, and though I have to find the model to fit the dress, not the other way around.  Though most of my dresses still need a model who is a size 2, some of my best shots were done with non-agency standard size women. 

But, then, I am in a small market.  For my slim profit margin, it is wiser for me to find women who want to work for pretty pictures than for cash.
Jan 04 13 01:45 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
K I C K H A M
Posts: 14,495
Los Angeles, California, US


Anna Adrielle wrote:

you made it sound as if all fashion models starve themselves to be thin, and if plussize models eat like pigs or are "bulky" (which means what? big? muscular?)

A lot of fashion models are naturally thin, and work hard to stay that way
a lot of plussize models are naturally bigger, and work hard to maintain their size.
A lot of models in general, both plus and straight, watch what they eat and work our, because it's in important to be in shape no matter your size, if you want to work as a model.

So that's the part I disagreed with and found insulting, just wanted to clear that up smile

and yes, 6's book plus work sometimes... a bit ridiculous, but it happens.

I'm going to step in here and say how I read it- I didn't read it as her saying that plus size models eat a lot or straight size starve themselves-- I think that she was just saying she knows girls who fall in the middle (who aren't normally straight or plus size), and they do something to "fit in."

I could be wrong, but I think that's what she was talking about, because the original question was what girls do if they AREN'T naturally in either category.

Jan 04 13 06:35 pm  Link  Quote 
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Model
Anna Adrielle
Posts: 18,762
Antwerp, Antwerp, Belgium


K I C K H A M wrote:

I'm going to step in here and say how I read it- I didn't read it as her saying that plus size models eat a lot or straight size starve themselves-- I think that she was just saying she knows girls who fall in the middle (who aren't normally straight or plus size), and they do something to "fit in."

I could be wrong, but I think that's what she was talking about, because the original question was what girls do if they AREN'T naturally in either category.

if I misunderstood, then my apologies, perhaps I judged too quickly smile

Jan 05 13 01:47 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Art Provocative
Posts: 222
Sydney, New South Wales, Australia


I'm not sure where this thread is at, but anyway...

I shoot "plus-size" models for agencies and the market is huge (no pun intended). There's a lot of commercial work for fuller-figured girls - just look at Robyn Lawley who's the new face of Ralph Lauren.

Two of the girls I photographed recently...

http://photos.modelmayhem.com/photos/121010/02/5075454ccb8ba.jpg

http://photos.modelmayhem.com/photos/121211/21/50c81cd2010a9.jpg
Jan 05 13 01:54 am  Link  Quote 
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Model
Anna Adrielle
Posts: 18,762
Antwerp, Antwerp, Belgium


KARL CLIFFORD wrote:
I'm not sure where this thread is at, but anyway...

I shoot "plus-size" models for agencies and the market is huge (no pun intended). There's a lot of commercial work for fuller-figured girls - just look at Robyn Lawley who's the new face of Ralph Lauren.

Two of the girls I photographed recently...

http://photos.modelmayhem.com/photos/121010/02/5075454ccb8ba.jpg

I just wanted to say I love that picture smile. It's all over tumblr! great job smile.

And yes, huge market, lots of work. Not only that, but I have found it is my personal experience that plussize models are much quicker to pay for a shoot than sraightsize fashion models (because photographers will do free tests with agencygirls, even great photographers with new and unexperienced girls, so often they can build their book with great photographers on a TF base), so it's a very profitable niche smile

PS the bottom pic is nice too! who's the model and what agency is she from? I feel like I've seen her before somewhere

Jan 05 13 02:07 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Shon D.- Homme
Posts: 3,185
Virginia Beach, Virginia, US


Frances Jewel wrote:
"Real size" is the most asinine term I have ever heard. thumbsdown
JessicaBaker wrote:
I didn't make it up. It's what I've been labeled by agencies, photographers, other models, etc.

We have Tyra Banks to thank for that...

Jan 05 13 07:56 am  Link  Quote 
Model
Alyssa Lovelle
Posts: 28
Salt Lake City, Utah, US


JessicaBaker wrote:
So we all know that fashion standard is < size 4 and plus is often > size 12. I, like many others, fall into the middle of these and are labeled "real size." I often struggle with getting work because of this. Do any of you other real size models have this problem? What type of modeling do most women between sizes 4-10 do?

This question is not to critique my pictures, criticize me for using a term I didn't even make up, or to provoke negativity. It's just a simple question. If you don't have anything positive to contribute, please just don't say anything.

Finding commercial work between these sizes would be very difficult on your own. So the answer to your question, most of these women getting paid work are getting it through an agency. Typically fitness or commercial work. I am curious why you choose not to share your measurements on your profile. You're a stunning woman, so it makes me question your confidence. I hope that you are very comfortable with yourself before delving into the professional side of the industry. You're gonna need some really - and I mean really - thick skin. Agents/bookers will often times talk as if you're not even there. It is very common to hear things like. "Pretty cheek bones, but those pores!" Or, "Great look, if only she was proportionate." These are mild examples. All I'm saying is if you don't like being classified (for instance you said you don't like being considered plus size) then you should really consider what such a harsh industry could do to your self worth.

That being said, the answer is also very dependent.  4-10 is a broad size range. No matter what your size,  however, it would be your job as an agency represented model (if you're hoping to get paid) to be in top physical form. In other words these women are firm, toned, and because it is kind of a niche category - exceptionally proportionate and beautiful. I have a friend who could run circles around me, and definitely has a much perkier butt, more toned stomach etc, and has a pant size of 10. I really think it would be impossible for her to get any smaller, nor do I think she should. She's bangin'. If she decided to look for an agency she would be considered plus size.

If you approach any major market, as much as you don't like it, I think you would fit into this category. However I'm not sure of your size so I can't say absolutely. If you're between a 4-8 the only paid work you will find will be with a small market agency (commercial or fitness...maybe runway if you are a 4. And thats a stretch.) The pay won't be substantial and there won't be enough work to quit your day job. But if you believe that you are truly talented and want to really make some dough (in other words work in a large market) then maybe the money would be worth losing your qualms about the plus size part of the industry, because like I said, you're stunning.  smile

I wish you luck. I truly am trying to be helpful.

Jan 05 13 01:34 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Amanda Ashley Harris
Posts: 79
Los Angeles, California, US


I was formerly with Ford, when I had agency stats. Now that I have 39" hips, I am freelancing but now I am able to do more daring, creative, and artistically liberating shoots that I never would have even known existed. I am becoming more interested in art direction, and perhaps even getting behind the camera as an assistant to figure out how it is all conducted. I loved my agency, they were very good to me, and always had my best interests at heart, including letting me go when my bone structure and body changed in my late teen years, because they didn't want me to be unhealthy. I am artistically fullfilled, still booking fashion work, still going on castings, still being shot for art galleries, still working with amazing photographers, and still getting shot for editorials and other magazine submissions. To be fair, I am 5'10, have a very strong look, and years of experience under my belt. If you want to be the best, you have to run with the bulls. When I was with Ford, I dieted, exercised, and really took care of myself to the point where photographers told me I looked like a Victoria Secret model by the time I was 15. When my hips grew in, I hated them and I wanted to get back into high fashion so badly but that simply isn't me anymore. You need to come to terms with you you are and more importantly, be at peace with it. Make a list of your strengths, and bring them to another genre you would be more suited for. For example, I bring my commercial appeal and high fashion editorial poses to my artistic and nude work. I do not like glamour but I have done some work in that genre for the experience, networking, and most importantly payment. I've had a lot of fun on glamour shoots, knowing that the images wouldn't go anywhere near my portfolio because I do not see them as aestheically pleasing or a good representation of who I am. When you are in between sizes, you do what you have to, to get by. For me, the compromises make it worth it for the artistic freedom. I have had some difficulty because 80% of the work I want, I do not fit the criteria. The 20% that I get to do, I thouroughly enjoy and it makes it all worth it! Good luck on finding you niche! :-)
Jan 05 13 06:18 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Acanthus Tattoos
Posts: 414
Union, New Jersey, US


Jan 05 13 06:50 pm  Link  Quote 
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Model
Anna Adrielle
Posts: 18,762
Antwerp, Antwerp, Belgium


Amanda Ashley Harris wrote:
I was formerly with Ford, when I had agency stats. Now that I have 39" hips, I am freelancing but now I am able to do more daring, creative, and artistically liberating shoots that I never would have even known existed. I am becoming more interested in art direction, and perhaps even getting behind the camera as an assistant to figure out how it is all conducted. I loved my agency, they were very good to me, and always had my best interests at heart, including letting me go when my bone structure and body changed in my late teen years, because they didn't want me to be unhealthy. I am artistically fullfilled, still booking fashion work, still going on castings, still being shot for art galleries, still working with amazing photographers, and still getting shot for editorials and other magazine submissions. To be fair, I am 5'10, have a very strong look, and years of experience under my belt. If you want to be the best, you have to run with the bulls. When I was with Ford, I dieted, exercised, and really took care of myself to the point where photographers told me I looked like a Victoria Secret model by the time I was 15. When my hips grew in, I hated them and I wanted to get back into high fashion so badly but that simply isn't me anymore. You need to come to terms with you you are and more importantly, be at peace with it. Make a list of your strengths, and bring them to another genre you would be more suited for. For example, I bring my commercial appeal and high fashion editorial poses to my artistic and nude work. I do not like glamour but I have done some work in that genre for the experience, networking, and most importantly payment. I've had a lot of fun on glamour shoots, knowing that the images wouldn't go anywhere near my portfolio because I do not see them as aestheically pleasing or a good representation of who I am. When you are in between sizes, you do what you have to, to get by. For me, the compromises make it worth it for the artistic freedom. I have had some difficulty because 80% of the work I want, I do not fit the criteria. The 20% that I get to do, I thouroughly enjoy and it makes it all worth it! Good luck on finding you niche! :-)

curious:
since ford has a killer plussize division that actually contains several models who used to be fashionmodels but became plus because maintaining the fashionbody would be unhealthy for them; did ford never suggest you join their plussize board?

I don't know if you would even want that, to be back with an agency I mean, but if you did it might be worth a shot, especially since you were with them before smile

Jan 06 13 10:51 am  Link  Quote 
Model
Serena Toxicat -Tattoo
Posts: 28
San Francisco, California, US


Love somebody who gets it! big_smile

T A Y L O R  wrote:

lol I love this, it's so true!

Jan 06 13 01:54 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Kelleth
Posts: 2,503
Toronto, Ontario, Canada


Frances Jewel wrote:
"Real size" is the most asinine term I have ever heard. thumbsdown

Agreed. On par with "real women".

Jan 06 13 02:34 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Serena Toxicat -Tattoo
Posts: 28
San Francisco, California, US


Why? We eat quiche.

Kelleth wrote:

Agreed. On par with "real women".

Jan 06 13 05:04 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
L Cowles Photography
Posts: 831
Corona, California, US


Good Egg Productions wrote:
I know that as a photographer, my opinion probably isn't wanted, but why are you fighting this?

I'm too tall to be a jockey and I'm too short to be a basketball player, but I like to ride horses and I like to play basketball.  I just can't do it for many many thousands of dollars a year.

+1

Jan 06 13 05:15 pm  Link  Quote 
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