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Photographer
Terrell Gates
Posts: 1,027
Santa Fe, New Mexico, US


You tell me.... I just do what I do...
Jan 07 13 01:36 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
J O H N A L L A N
Posts: 9,727
Santa Ana, California, US


Only when bewbie's are showing, otherwise no.
Jan 07 13 01:40 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
fullmetalphotographer
Posts: 2,670
Fresno, California, US


David Bollt wrote:
I say... craftsmanship, imagination, creative intention and above all... GOOD TASTE.

Are you creating images that seem like real art? How much of what you see at Model Mayhem seems like art to you? What do you think makes an image a work of art, as opposed to just a photograph or a picture of a model?

"We stand in awe before that which can not be seen... And we respect, with every fiber, that which can not be explained."- Rukia, (And so fell the sword of fate...) opening words of Bleach

To me a photograph is art. I am never believed in being boxed in by things like good taste, or someone else's definition of art.

Jan 07 13 01:44 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Drew Smith Photography
Posts: 5,209
Nottingham, England, United Kingdom


One of my favourite quotes:

"No, it (love) is a word. What matters is the connection the word implies."

From a conversation about 'love'.

So it is with 'art'; it's just a word that has a connection. The connection is different for all of us.

Some of us feel the need to have others tell us it is 'art' and others don't care what anybody else thinks.
Jan 07 13 01:45 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
MesmerEyes Photography
Posts: 2,788
Tyler, Texas, US


Art can not be put in a box. If only one person in the world considers something art then to them it is art.

Drew Smith Photography wrote:
One of my favourite quotes:

"No, it (love) is a word. What matters is the connection the word implies."

From a conversation about 'love'.

So it is with 'art'; it's just a word that has a connection. The connection is different for all of us.

Some of us feel the need to have others tell us it is 'art' and others don't care what anybody else thinks.

Bravo!

Jan 07 13 02:07 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
KMP
Posts: 4,650
Houston, Texas, US


David Bollt wrote:

I don't think it will ever be truly defined, but I want to hear what people experience as great art. Screw the collective definition. What moves any single person.

The viewer brings beauty into the world... not the image. What has the experience of art show up for you... in your world?

There are so many senses that art will affect.  some are totally emotional and others are more temporal. 

There is one portrait, I'm pretty sure was by Robert Mapplethorpe. Maybe someone here can find a link. I'm pretty sure I saw a portrait of his.   I think it was Jackson Pollack's wife.  Whoever the woman, it was a profile portrait. She had a hooked nose, no discernible chin and very pronounced lips.  She had what some might say was an unfortunate profile.

But she had such confidence in her expression that that she looked incredible in stature and very comfortable with herself.  I've always admired Mapplethorpe's work but that portrait seemed to me, to be the ultimate portrait.  To me it truly captured the inner beauty.

Jan 07 13 02:21 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
KMP
Posts: 4,650
Houston, Texas, US


oops DP
Jan 07 13 02:22 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Don-Jones
Posts: 301
Memphis, Tennessee, US


I actually did a paper on what makes good art.  I stated it was down to 3 things: Technique, Replication, and Truth.  Good art will have two of these... amazing art has all three.

Technique
When you look at work and know it wasn't easy.  It can be a combination of time, consideration, or using a variety of tools.

Replication
There is no such thing as original... there is always reference, but that's not what I'm talking about.  The view must be able to recognize what the artist is conveying. 

Truth
It's when you see the work and realize a truth or you know it to be true.  Now you can have things that would normally be impossible, but we're looking at emotion or message.

One of the best clear-cut examples I can use is Normal Rockwell.  He had technique, we recognized what he created, and there was always an emotional truth.  But this is what drives me when I start thinking about what I want to do.  It doesn't mean I achieve it in any way, but it does keep my honest as an artist.
Jan 07 13 02:40 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Kevin Stenhouse
Posts: 2,658
Calgary, Alberta, Canada


MesmerEyes Photography wrote:
Art can not be put in a box. If only one person in the world considers something art then to them it is art.
Bravo!

I think a healthy majority of us realise that it's subjective. What do YOU think art is? That was part of the original post and i thnik it is worth answering, even for personal insight.

Jan 07 13 02:49 pm  Link  Quote 
Artist/Painter
JFisher Fine Art
Posts: 1
LANDENBERG, Pennsylvania, US


In its literal definition art is simply artifice; artificial. Anything man made can be called art. Now what makes a work of art successful or "good" is really subjective and based on a great many things, including who is viewing it.

A great definition of art came from a professor of mine a while back..."Art is life intensified." That's usually the one I like to go with.
Jan 07 13 02:59 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Kevin Stenhouse
Posts: 2,658
Calgary, Alberta, Canada


Don-Jones wrote:
One of the best clear-cut examples I can use is Normal Rockwell.  He had technique, we recognized what he created, and there was always an emotional truth.

Not so much for me, I consider him more of a commercial illustrator. Alice Neel defines what a true artist is to me. There's a documentary on Netflix about her.

Jan 07 13 03:09 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jeffrey M Fletcher
Posts: 4,314
Asheville, North Carolina, US


It is good taste, and good taste alone, that possesses the power to sterilize and is always the first handicap to any creative functioning. (Pablo Picasso)
Jan 07 13 03:30 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Fotografica Gregor
Posts: 4,065
Alexandria, Virginia, US


I think that some of the images in my Angelus series might be considered "art" by some....

maybe some of my fine art nudes (those are not on MM though....)

but by and large - I am a technician -  not an artist.....
Jan 07 13 03:39 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
The F-Stop
Posts: 1,420
New York, New York, US


It's art if you had fun doing it..... there's an art to having fun.


If it seemed like work. it isn't art... it's a job!
Jan 07 13 03:41 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
MesmerEyes Photography
Posts: 2,788
Tyler, Texas, US


Kevin Stenhouse wrote:

I think a healthy majority of us realise that it's subjective. What do YOU think art is? That was part of the original post and i thnik it is worth answering, even for personal insight.

To me if it speaks to me either on an emotional or intellectual level or it tells a story then it's art.

Jan 07 13 03:53 pm  Link  Quote 
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Photographer
Giacomo Cirrincioni
Posts: 20,902
New York, New York, US


This is a weird one for me to answer honestly.

I do shoot work that is "my art" and it tends to be important to me and stays kind of personal.  Doesn't get much gallery time.

I also shoot work specifically for two art galleries that does get a fair bit of time, sales, etc.  I'm working on a new one month solo show that will be coming up for a series I did.  Two other solo shows are behind me and I was an invited artist to the NEXT show at art Chicago.  I also have one series that is part of the permanent collection of a museum. 

While I certainly like those works (the ones that have been extensively exhibited and sold) I really don't know if I consider them "art" by my personal definition.  Maybe.  I don't think they really qualify.  My next series will decidedly not, at least not from a post-modern perspective, but buying trends are shifting away from that, so who knows.  Maybe that's a good thing.

Most of my fine art work is still life.  One series was nightscapes - they were pretty pictures, I did a great job (if I can not so humbly say) and the prints (something I spend a great deal of time on) were as flawless as possible.  But were they art?  They sold.  Out of 36 in that series, 20 sold, and for not insignificant sums.  But were they art?  I don't know if they were...

I could provide you with an artist statement that would sure make it sound like they were art.

But really, were they?

I honestly don't know.  Some days I think I'm producing it, and other days I think I'm a complete charlatan waiting to be exposed.  Most days I think I'm just creating art for a time that no longer exists.

If I think about this stuff too much, I swing to my depressive state, so I try to only reflect on such issues two or three times a year. In the end, I simply move to create something which satisfies something inside me.  If it sells, great.  If not, well, it's not great, but it doesn't mean I trash it either.

I just don't know.
Jan 07 13 03:55 pm  Link  Quote 
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Photographer
Giacomo Cirrincioni
Posts: 20,902
New York, New York, US


The F-Stop wrote:
It's art if you had fun doing it..... there's an art to having fun.


If it seemed like work. it isn't art... it's a job!

Do you know many working artists?  People who make their livelihood (or a portion of it) by means of their art?  It is a job...  It can be a highly rewarding one, but it is still work.

Jan 07 13 03:56 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
nerdlinger
Posts: 30
Minneapolis, Minnesota, US


Terrell Gates wrote:
You tell me.... I just do what I do...

+1

Jan 07 13 04:05 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
hbutz New York
Posts: 3,143
New York, New York, US


dcsmooth wrote:
Please define art.

Those who don't know the definition of art haven't taken art lessons.

My definition, Art is the expression of intangible ideas, concepts, emotions, or feelings through a tangible media.

You can take a photograph of a building, tree, or a person.  But, you cannot take a picture of "happy" or "sad" because those concepts are intangible.  If I photograph a "happy person" or "sad person" and show that to you instead and your brain makes the connection then the photograph is art.  Sunsets become "peaceful and quiet."  Ship at sea in a storm becomes "angry and contentious."

I once went to an art exhibition where the artist set up a 10 foot long kitty litter box.  That's what we call "bad art."  "Art is in the eye of its beholder" means that if the artist conveys an intangible idea with the viewer, then for that one and only one viewer the art is successful.  Connect with enough viewers and you are a successful artist.  The kitty litter box exhibit did not connect with many people so it's bad art.

Just as there are good photographs and bad photographs, there is good art and bad art.  And, just because people don't know the definition art does not mean the definition does not exist.

Jan 07 13 04:09 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Victoria Elle
Posts: 431
New York, New York, US


"We know what art is: it's paintings of horses."
Jan 07 13 04:20 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Thomas Dodd
Posts: 433
Atlanta, Georgia, US


The typically pretentious response is to say "It is art because I am an artist and I say it is art"
The typical self-deprecating response it to say "It is not for me to judge whether I am an artist or not... I am a photographer or a painter or a sculptor - it is only the perceptions of others that label it Art or merely craft"

Perhaps the real definition is somewhere between the two..
Jan 07 13 04:30 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Kevin Stenhouse
Posts: 2,658
Calgary, Alberta, Canada


hbutz New York wrote:

Those who don't know the definition of art haven't taken art lessons.

And, just because people don't know the definition art does not mean the definition does not exist.

What that definition is and it's usefulness is debatable. It's not like it's carved into stone wink

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/art-definition/

Jan 07 13 04:31 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
SPRINGHEEL
Posts: 38,004
Gibraltar, Michigan, US


I've never given it any thought
Jan 07 13 04:45 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Chris Macan
Posts: 12,786
HAVERTOWN, Pennsylvania, US


SPRINGHEEL  wrote:
I've never given it any thought

That's true of loads of people on MM...
But at least you are good at it!

Jan 07 13 04:49 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
intense_puppy
Posts: 862
Brighton, England, United Kingdom


Pretty much as springheel says - I haven't thought about it.

I just shoot what takes my fancy and leave it at that. Great visions of artistic accomplishment is not my style.

Also - I dislike the implication in this thread that the 90%-99.95% (take your pick) of photos that aren't high "art" on MM are somehow taking up valuable space (and yes, I'm projecting smile )
Jan 07 13 06:26 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
DA PHOTO
Posts: 1,516
Toronto, Ontario, Canada


Thomas Dodd wrote:
The typically pretentious response is to say "It is art because I am an artist and I say it is art"
The typical self-deprecating response it to say "It is not for me to judge whether I am an artist or not... I am a photographer or a painter or a sculptor - it is only the perceptions of others that label it Art or merely craft"

Perhaps the real definition is somewhere between the two..

Jan 07 13 07:10 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Art of the nude
Posts: 11,780
Olivet, Michigan, US


David Bollt wrote:
I say... craftsmanship, imagination, creative intention and above all... GOOD TASTE.

Are you creating images that seem like real art? How much of what you see at Model Mayhem seems like art to you? What do you think makes an image a work of art, as opposed to just a photograph or a picture of a model?

I'd like to think I am.  What makes it art?  That I care about the outcome, and that sometimes, my work has an impact on the viewer.

I have no idea if it's in "good taste."  That's incredibly subjective.  I had one image called porn today, and another, fairly similar image, called wonderful art.  I think they're both art, that was certainly the intention.

Jan 07 13 07:27 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Art of the nude
Posts: 11,780
Olivet, Michigan, US


Ben Hinman wrote:
Art is never self conscious. Art does not care what people think or how people feel about it. Art is truth spread through lies, brush strokes and shadows and images and sounds. Art is a feeling that thinks or a thought that feels. Art is better than you.

But, most important, it's in "good taste."  Right?

Jan 07 13 07:31 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Melodye Joy
Posts: 542
Rancho Cucamonga, California, US


For me, I am particular of whom I collaborate and what concept benefits my image as well as the talents of others (MUA, Hair, Wardrobe, Accessories, Photographer)...

To be ones muse is a blessing, to be ones inspiration drives my work further.

That said...what is art?

Depends on how one personally looks at it. You might see the art in the location, you may see the art in what the model emotes in an image, you may see the art in the admiration of the photographers capture/style/range, you may see art in the makeup or hair style(s).

It's been said art is in the eye of the beholder and I believe that. What I may not prefer, might be inspiring to another. What you may aspire to may not be something someone else sees as clearly.
Jan 07 13 07:35 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
EnlightendedPhotography
Posts: 816
Eugene, Oregon, US


Do you think I am creating art?
Jan 07 13 07:37 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Ken Marcus Studios
Posts: 8,415
Los Angeles, California, US


EnlightendedPhotography wrote:
Do you think I am creating art?

The question is . . . Do YOU think you are creating art?

If you think so, then you are.

If not, then you aren't

Jan 07 13 07:49 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
nyk fury
Posts: 2,900
Port Townsend, Washington, US


David Bollt wrote:
That seems fashionably dismissive. I was just rocked by your portfolio and did not see anything in there that occurred to me as less than remarkable art.

i doubt there's anything remotely fashionable about me. i wrote exactly what i feel about it. i think a couple others here did too. most though, just blathering the same old inanities, rather than digging out and expressing things they feel that might be politically incorrect, or antagonistic.

Jan 07 13 07:52 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Art of the nude
Posts: 11,780
Olivet, Michigan, US


Carlos Occidental wrote:
My images themselves may or may not be art.  But, the way I print them (hand coated cyanotypes and platinum/palladium) makes them fine art, and allows me to sell them as such.

Wait.  So, if I printed say, this (yes, it's my shot, and it's SFW, just not worth bothering to do the code to show it.)
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2150/2272 … eb05_o.jpg

with "(hand coated cyanotypes and platinum/palladium)" it would make it fine art?  And I could sell it as such?

There has to be more to it than that.

Jan 07 13 08:00 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Isis22
Posts: 2,257
Muncie, Indiana, US


Some of what I make is art. A lot of my self-portaits are not even close. They all please me in different ways. Art is what pleases someone else.
Jan 07 13 08:06 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
EnlightendedPhotography
Posts: 816
Eugene, Oregon, US


Ken Marcus Studios wrote:

The question is . . . Do YOU think you are creating art?

If you think so, then you are.

If not, then you aren't

RenĂ© Descartes I think said someting similiar.....but with a traumatic brain injury sometimes I am not sure and get confused what I read and type.   You definately are creating art.

Jan 07 13 10:11 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Unlimited Boudoir
Posts: 27
San Diego, California, US


SPRINGHEEL  wrote:
I've never given it any thought

LOL

Mys Britt

Jan 07 13 10:21 pm  Link  Quote 
Artist/Painter
aquarelle
Posts: 1,907
Chicago, Illinois, US


I'm an "Artist."  So what I make is "Art."  It has to be, right?  I mean I wouldn't be an "Artist" if I wasn't making "Art."  That's how it's supposed to be, right?



I mean, it is, right?




Isn't it?
Jan 07 13 10:30 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Art Silva
Posts: 8,876
Santa Barbara, California, US


First step, you have to have a name like mine, it says it all right there tongue
Jan 07 13 10:34 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
MaxImage
Posts: 16
Toronto, Ontario, Canada


aquarelle wrote:
I'm an "Artist."  So what I make is "Art."  It has to be, right?  I mean I wouldn't be an "Artist" if I wasn't making "Art."  That's how it's supposed to be, right?



I mean, it is, right?



Isn't it?

Yes, it is. smile

Jan 07 13 10:40 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
James Ogilvie
Posts: 6,640
Toronto, Ontario, Canada


I don't create art. I just dabble in photography.

If I ever create art, it's an accident and I refuse to accept the responsibility for it. smile
Jan 07 13 10:44 pm  Link  Quote 
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