As a model, do you take or request breaks during a shoot?
As a photographer, do you suggest breaks to your model during a shoot? Do you find it appropriate or inappropriate when a model asks for a break?
To either group, how long of a break do you think is OK, and after how many hours of working?
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I don't ask for breaks personally... I usually keep pushing myself no matter how many hours I am booked. I'm starting to find it can get me hurt if I'm not careful (for example, 5-6 hour shoots with no break at all save for a swig of water during light change). I am wondering if what I am doing is the norm and I should suck it up ... or if it's not the norm.
I don't think it's unrealistic to ask for a break. Both sides can be draining mentally and physically.
If you just need to take 5 I don't see anything wrong with asking
if it's just not working and you need to regroup or recompose yourself I don't' see anything wrong with asking.
If you need a cigarette every 15 minutes, don't ask.
I think a typical break could be 10 minutes or so depending on hourly costs being incurred. If the photographer is paying for the space by the hour I would tend to keep breaks short and sweet.
At the same time, both parties are getting a sort of break during wardrobe changes. For me that's enough to keep my brain in check
Matt Knowles
Posts: 3,519
Ferndale, California, US
Usually I have natural breaks every hour or so if I'm working in the studio since I'm changing lighting or sets.
If there isn't a natural break, I usually take one after two hours or so, but I try to find a time that doesn't interrupt the flow. It's not like a whistle goes off and I call break.
If a break is required to ensure this, then we take a break. However, it's all pretty relative. If we're shooting trade for 7 hours, and it's somewhat more than "sit here, look pretty", then request all the break time you want.
If I'm paying for 2 hours of your time, I will not appreciate two 20 minute smoke/potty/rest breaks in the middle of it, and would argue to add time to the end.
GoldRoseMedia
Posts: 2,708
NORTH BRUNSWICK, New Jersey, US
I always tell the llamas to feel free to release a difficult pose and take a break at any time they start feeling strained. Plus they normally get a 5-10 minute break between sets while I rearrange the studio. The last thing I want is for a llama to get injured on my set.
Good Egg Productions wrote: I care if the model is comfortable.
If a break is required to ensure this, then we take a break. However, it's all pretty relative. If we're shooting trade for 7 hours, and it's somewhat more than "sit here, look pretty", then request all the break time you want.
If I'm paying for 2 hours of your time, I will not appreciate two 20 minute smoke/potty/rest breaks in the middle of it, and would argue to add time to the end.
Hypothetically speaking, if you're paying a model for 4-5 hours of her time, would one ten minute break be reasonable to you?
GoldRoseMedia
Posts: 2,708
NORTH BRUNSWICK, New Jersey, US
Aaron Lewis Photography wrote: If you need a cigarette every 15 minutes, don't ask.
That would be a problem, but it has never happened to me. Come to think of it, I have worked with dozens of different models and I have never seen a single one of them smoke. I don't know if it's because none of them do smoke, or because none of them ever asked for a cigarette break. I typically shoot 3-4 hours so you would think a smoker would want at least one cigarette during that time.
Don't starve yourself. Ask for a break. If your gonna be working for hours then a break every other hour (10m-15m) or maybe decent lunch break for everyone will help the mind frame. Time is money your gonna hear that all the time.
I smoke so I'm usually the one initiating the breaks lol. I've never had a hard-fast rule but I'd say 10 minutes every 2 hours sounds about right. If a shoot is only a couple hours I'll usually suggest a break at some natural point.
Now, I haven't paid models so I've never been in a situation where I felt like breaks were excessive or I had to calculate a dollar value to them. When I'm the one being paid I'm not usually the one suggesting a break...the model or client usually breaks it up.
DAN CRUIKSHANK
Posts: 1,645
Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Breaks don't really apply to the work I am currently doing... But if I was shooting on set for a full day with a model I would have no problem giving them a 10 min break every few hours. Of course it completely depends on the style of shoot... If the model has to be extremely active, or pulling off some pretty rediculous poses, more breaks may be acceptable. If there is a lot of down time between sets, such as makeup or hair, where the model is just sitting in a chair, fewer breaks would be acceptable.
I have a bad back so I generally want more breaks than my model. If on location, frequent water breaks. If it's an all day sunrise/sunset shoot, then long midday rest periods.
GoldRoseMedia wrote: That would be a problem, but it has never happened to me. Come to think of it, I have worked with dozens of different models and I have never seen a single one of them smoke. I don't know if it's because none of them do smoke, or because none of them ever asked for a cigarette break. I typically shoot 3-4 hours so you would think a smoker would want at least one cigarette during that time.
Most photographers don't allow smoking in the studio. I know plenty of models that smoke. They just know not to ask to do it in the studio.
i need breaks, too. the photographer should be making sure that all the talent is well cared for. i use the break to check my email or grab a snack or use the facilities or review the work in progress.
working someone for 6 hours straight without a break seems mean and counterproductive.
GoldRoseMedia
Posts: 2,708
NORTH BRUNSWICK, New Jersey, US
Chain Reaction wrote:
Most photographers don't allow smoking in the studio. It can mess up the equipment and stink up the place and wardrobe. I know plenty of models that smoke. They just know not to ask to do it in the studio.
As well they should. My point, though, was that none of the models I've worked with have ever even asked for a smoke break. My shooting space is very small; if any of them had ever smoked in the bathroom or gone outside to do it, I would have known.
Aaron Lewis Photography wrote: I don't think it's unrealistic to ask for a break. Both sides can be draining mentally and physically.
If you just need to take 5 I don't see anything wrong with asking
if it's just not working and you need to regroup or recompose yourself I don't' see anything wrong with asking.
If you need a cigarette every 15 minutes, don't ask.
I think a typical break could be 10 minutes or so depending on hourly costs being incurred. If the photographer is paying for the space by the hour I would tend to keep breaks short and sweet.
At the same time, both parties are getting a sort of break during wardrobe changes. For me that's enough to keep my brain in check
This. Some people, like myself need reasonable breaks, I am a disabled model who can't pose for 4 hours straight. A five minute break every hour and a half or two isn't too much to ask for imo. When models are sitting/posing for figure drawings in schools they usually get a 15 minute break every two hours. I think breaks are important for not overworking both parties. Breaks also give (me, personally,) time to brainstorm other ideas or shots you could get in while shooting. Some people hate breaks though and feel it ruins the creative process, it varies as a case by case basis.
Thanks so far, everyone. I wanted to get an idea of what is generally appropriate or inappropriate
There is no one answer here, that's clear! It's all very situational as we all do different styles and things. I just wanted to make sure personally that I don't need to feel bad if, after several hours of shooting (especially of a strenuous nature), I need a brief break
Okie dokie, I'll let you guys talk <3 Thanks again.
It depends on how long the shoot is. If its 2 hours, no point for a break for me. 4 hours, I ask for one break. Just to get a drink and/or smoke real fast, then it's right back to work
Hypothetically speaking, if you're paying a model for 4-5 hours of her time, would one ten minute break be reasonable to you?
I wouldn't imagine I would notice it.
In 4-5 hours, I'm changing sets at least twice. I'm young and spry, but I'm not THAT young and spry. It takes me several minutes to break down in one place and set up in another. Plenty of time for a bathroom break (which you should do when the need arises anyway) or a smoke or a phone check.
Like I said, it's really all relative. If I just took 20 minutes to reset, and THEN the model wants a break, that's not as well received as if we've been working an hour on some strenuous yoga nudes and a break is requested.
But to answer your question. A single 10 minute break over 4 hours is more than reasonable. I would probably insist more than that, and ensure you're drinking a bit of water.
Yes always take breaks, 10 min should be appropriate. Not only does (for me at least) allow myself and the model to recollect our thoughts and continue putting out our best work but its just good business practice. In California with a paid shoot and crew, I believe its mandatory anyways after a certain period of time.
IDiivil wrote: As a model, do you take or request breaks during a shoot?
As a photographer, do you suggest breaks to your model during a shoot? Do you find it appropriate or inappropriate when a model asks for a break?
To either group, how long of a break do you think is OK, and after how many hours of working?
~
I don't ask for breaks personally... I usually keep pushing myself no matter how many hours I am booked. I'm starting to find it can get me hurt if I'm not careful (for example, 5-6 hour shoots with no break at all save for a swig of water during light change). I am wondering if what I am doing is the norm and I should suck it up ... or if it's not the norm.
On a paid shoot, if the model is booked/paid for 4-5 hours, I think that one 10 minute break in that period of time is quite reasonable and would not need to be "made up". (This is something that could even be considered in a 1/2 day rate versus 4 or 5 hours at flat hourly.)
Ultimately, I expect to be working with a mature adult who can tell me her needs, and if a break is needed or beneficial, then a break is taken. I would rather someone speaks up and not hold it in, so to speak.
Just like in most other steps of this process, clear communication is essential.
Raven-Lily
Posts: 77
Eastbourne, England, United Kingdom
i think breaks are essential for both model and photographer, so we schedule it for if im changing outfits, adjusting hair/make up or the photographer is changing lighting etc.. we sometimes use break time to discuss the shoot as its happening, over a cup of tea and a sandwich.. Im personally usually hungry midway through and a wilting model isnt a good look.
Azimuth Arts
Posts: 1,134
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
My style of shooting is that there is usually some time for the team to rest while I am changing lights, and for me to rest while the model is in makeup for the second look. But if we happen to be shooting/changing looks for two straight hours I would probably want the break before the model asks for one. If the shoot is 8 hours then I usually plan for at least 20-30 minutes to take a meal break of some sort because I can't go 10 hours (if you include my pre-shoot and post-shoot routine) without eating something.
If a model knows she needs more than a 10 minute break after 2 hours, or a 30 minute break after 4-5 hours because of a health condition (or to check in with a babysitter etc.) just let me know before the shoot so it can be worked into the schedule.
I would never have a problem with a model asking for a few minutes to relax, especially during a strenuous shoot.
I feel that the same policies would apply to a paid or trade shoot. Just because it is a trade does not mean any one person should slow down the action of the others contributing their time. A model should not take 60 minutes worth of breaks during a 4 hour shoot - that would be disrespecting the photographer, MUA, stylist etc. In the case of a paid shoot then for the most part the person paying can call the shots. If I am paying the model and if I need a longer break than usual it's only me losing out (assuming the model has a fixed time arrangement). If there is a client then they can decide when to take a break, except I will be letting them know the consequences of any delays be it fewer looks, or overtime to accomplish the preset goals.
I had one model show up late for a shoot and before we got off the first frame she needed a smoke break. Less than 30 minutes later she wanted another. It's no wonder she had to stop the jumping shots after 3 jumps - there was no room for oxygen in her lungs. So I highly discourage smoke breaks during a shoot.
IDiivil wrote: As a photographer, do you suggest breaks to your model during a shoot? Do you find it appropriate or inappropriate when a model asks for a break?
It depends on the length of the shoot. If the shoot was only two hours I would not expect the model to ask for a break. For a longer shoot I would have no problem if the model asked for a short break to grab a small snack. However, regardless of the length of the shoot I always offer the model bottled water or juice or something to drink. I think a key element is that a model be honest and say she needs a break. If a model told me she needed to run out to her car to get something and then came back 20 minutes later I would be pretty pissed. If a model needs frequent breaks for medical reasons it would be better for her to disclose that information prior to the shoot.
I tend to work alone with the model. During a typical 3-hour session (I get too tired during longer sessions), I might make 3-5 lighting setup changes. The first setup is ready to do when the model arrives, but during the "scene changes", I'm focused on wrestling the lights into place -- this is a natural time for a break for the model. So, typically models cuddle up in my big comfy chair, take a bathroom break, get a drink, etc. Interestingly, only about 1 in 3 check their phone/e-mail.
I like models to be high energy -- giving them a break makes sense for the kind of images I like best.
RKD Photographic
Posts: 2,989
Iserlohn, North Rhine-Westphalia, Germany
I usually shoot TFP up to portrait-fashion-lingerie-topless in four-hour blocks - including make-up and hair, so usually a three-hour shooting window...
During that period, we'll have short breaks every hour or so and at least one 'coffee-break' of 15 minutes - we'll have previously identified a few costume changes for the shoot and we'll break for those as well - although it's not a true break as the model will be changing while I'm faffing around with the lights or wondering where I put my camera down...
If 'natural' breaks occur during shooting - like I decide to shift the lights around or decide a particular outfit isn't working or whatever, then we'll break there as well.
If the model is a smoker, I tell her not to be shy about it. I'm a coffee addict so I know all about cravings...
TFP shooting is all about 'fun': killing the model by forcing her to be on her feet for three hours or more isn't fun: she eventually loses interest and it shows in the images.
On paid-shoots - esp. commissioned by third-party clients, then the breaks will be fewer as we're on someone else's dime, so to speak, but I adhere to EU law on this at the very minimum: 15 minute break every 2 hours and 30-minute break after 4 hours.
On an all-day shoot - especially on location, I'll have factored time for meal-breaks as well as a possible after-shoot meal...
I take breaks all the time. Especially if I had a model going crazy for a few minutes, they just can't keep that level of energy up forever.
I don't see any issue with it, it's just sort of natural to stop and take a break. You change outfits, makeup, grab water (or a smoke in my case), use the rst room. I Don't even think about it.
My shoots tend to be no more than 2-2 1/2 hours. Typically, the wardrobe changes serve as the breaks for the llama. If a llama says she needs a few minutes to relax, I never object, a happy llama = happy photos.
Not a problem with me, so long as it doesn't interrupt the flow of the session or become excessive. In the work world 15 minutes after 2 hours seems pretty standard, with a longer break (usually called lunch) after 4 hours.
I like to take a few minutes to mentally regroup from time to time and understand that a model may be the same - not to mention physical discomfort from awkward poses, heat, cold or whatever.
Usually I will offer a soda or water after about 2 hours, unless I'm so caught up in the photos I forget.
As a smoker, I am always looking for a quick break! I need a puff at least once an hour. I would suggest you ask for a break every 2-3hrs at least enough time to catch your breath and get a drink. Should you push yourself? Fuck no...
When I'm shooting personal work, it rarely lasts more than a couple and a half hours so there's no real break needed. But of course, by the same token, I keep it light and fun so if we need to go get a bite to eat or an espresso, we do.
On commercial/editorial jobs that I assist on, there's a set break time and it's usually spelled out on the call sheet. Some photographers run a go-with-the-flow time frame. Others are pretty structured.
I know 5 minutes per hour of work (Can be all together or split up) is standard in acting, and it seems pretty reasonable for photography and modelling too.
That said, I'm usually only shooting for around 2 or 3 hours, and "breaks" tend to be as needed rather than scheduled breaks. When I shoot longer than that (6 hours or so) I'll add some sort of break in the middle with snacks/refreshments/whatever.
It depends... how long is the shoot ?, how difficult is the pose ?, does she look tired ?, am I tired ? I don't have a problem taking a few minutes at a natural breaking point. If she's changing outfits, we're changing locations, I'm changing out sets or props. I want to keep her happy. Theory is, if she's happy she is putting out her best work or in the alternative... if she's not happy it's hard to get her best work.
There are breaks pretty often as I'm changing film rolls. Longer breaks as needed, I check with who I'm working with and sometimes will need one myself.
Toto Photo
Posts: 1,112
San Francisco, California, US
As I teen, I heard labor law requires 15-minute breaks every two hours. Don't know if that's true and too lazy to Google, but that has always seemed civil to me. If a model asked for more, I'd probably grant it.
OP, ask for what you need in life to stay healthy and flexible.
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