Published on Jan 31, 2013
After so many recent mass shootings, we decided to travel to Florida to see why so many Americans are stockpiling firearms.
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Weeks before the almost unfathomable mass shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary in Newtown, Connecticut, VICE editor-in-chief Rocco Castoro visited Florida to dive headfirst into its byzantine firearms laws and discover why his home state was the first in the nation to issue over one million concealed weapons permits. Through interviews and time on the range with veterans, law enforcement officials, and gun-store owners, VICE digs deep into the gun debate and uncovers many troubling revelations along the way. Oh, we also use a Craigslist-like site to arrange for the purchase of a handgun at 10 PM in the parking lot of a big-box hardware store. And it's all 100-percent legal. Welcome to Florida.
Read the full article for more about the ongoing firearms debate in the United States here: http://bit.ly/Guns-in-the-Sun.
opinion: So it's not just members of MM who are now seeking to buy a gun for the first time. It happens after every campaign cycle in fact.
Floridians as a whole probably aren't going to buy what Obama has to sell in the way of gun programs.
Completing a private trade in a parking lot is not unusual, and perhaps routine. People don't want other people in their homes sizing things up and they want a public place. My last deal was in a parking lot with a policeman who liked doing it that way. Private buyers and sellers usually ask to see a Florida driver's license and exchange info.
The film is definitely right about the buying panic that Obama has caused. The ammo shelves at Walmart are about 80% empty. The gun store in the film probably has empty shelves at this point. Obama is their best friend. Check the prices on www.floridaguntrader.com and you'll find used guns selling for 2-3 times new cost.
Training classes for concealed carry are pretty lame. They should probably add a periodic demonstration of shooting competency.
Be reminded that law-abiding citizens purchasing firearms makes us safer. Americans are not criminals, not most of us aren't anyway. In this country, we put way too much trust and power into our elected officials and police. We have become subservient to them, allowing them to introduce and enforce legislation rather than representing us.
The photograph of the "evil looking gun" demonstrates how ignorance causes panic. No "automatic" or military firearm has been sold to a citizen in this country for nearly 80 years. The so-called "assault" weapons have no more firepower than a simple revolver. Even if a criminal got their hands on an automatic weapon, such as the M1 with a 1000 rounds per minute specification, it would empty its 30 round magazine in under 2 seconds. That would be quite a short confrontation.
Number of homicides committed by automatic weapons in this country in the past 80 years: (2) two. You're being lied to. The general public does not own military weapons, only military style weapons. Understand what defines an "assault" weapon - pistol grip, barrel shroud, folding stock i.e. "evil looking features."
I guess the folks that made that video weren't aware of Florida law that says you can't record voices surreptitiously. Now they are outlaws, and outlaws shouldn't have guns.
Guss W wrote: I guess the folks that made that video weren't aware of Florida law that says you can't record voices surreptitiously. Now they are outlaws, and outlaws shouldn't have guns.
Ahh, the part where the former marine buys a handgun off the street?
modeled wrote: ...
Ahh, the part where the former marine buys a handgun off the street?
Yes. But I can agree with Obama that expanded background checks are called for. Most private sellers would not knowingly sell to a person with a record, but how would they know? Even before the buying panic, I've seen gun ads posted where the price was strangely high and I thought to myself "Who would pay that much? - Oh, I think I know."
its' pretty clear. When a hurricane is imminent, people stockpile batteries, water and other supplies. Now that Obama won his second term and is going after gun control, guns are selling like hotcakes. Floridians are no different than any other American citizens. They see the threat of the Democratic party coming to piss on the 2nd Amendment and are buying weapons while they can.
Prices of AR-15's doubled and sometimes tripled after Sandy Hook for the same reason.
Hey modeled - I hear they put on a pretty big gun show in Orlando. You might want to catch the next one just for amusement:
http://www.floridagunshows.com/
While the prices of ARs and AKs have jumped from $700-$1000 to $1500-$2500, they are NOT moving at those prices. I have spent the last two months dealing with idiots trying to hike prices because they don't know better or are trying to scam panicked people.
Guss W wrote: Hey modeled - I hear they put on a pretty big gun show in Orlando. You might want to catch the next one just for amusement:
http://www.floridagunshows.com/
My dad and I used to go a long time ago... may be fun to revisit 20 years later. thanks
Mac Wolff
Posts: 3,659
Litchfield Park, Arizona, US
Thank goodness I bought all my AR's and auto handguns before all this craziness,when I bought my 30rd mags they were 8 bucks apiece now their 40 and ya cant find any.
According to manufactures they cant keep up with the demand for weapons or ammo
SensualThemes
Posts: 3,018
Swoyersville, Pennsylvania, US
First they came for the gun owners. I cheered em on, I don't like guns
Then they came for the wealthy and the business people. Fuck those slave owners!
Then they came for the religious. Screw them, I don't need a god to be happy
Then they came for the independent journalists and the right-to-know filers. Don't they know secrets are secret for a reason! Terrorists! Lock em up!
Then they came for me. And there was no one I could turn to.
Daniels Light
Posts: 4,911
Fort Lauderdale, Florida, US
First - I'm not against private ownership of guns.
But ...
With new technology in weapons hitting the market almost everyday, can't the gun enthusiast see the day when some type of line needs to be drawn on private ownership of new weapon types?
Does the average citizen need a remote-controlled, radio-activated gun bot with turret 50mm and 360 degree coverage?
Doesn't it make sense to start drawing that line now rather than wait for the Gun-Bot 3000?
SensualThemes
Posts: 3,018
Swoyersville, Pennsylvania, US
Daniels Light wrote: First - I'm not against private ownership of guns.
But ...
With new technology in weapons hitting the market almost everyday, can't the gun enthusiast see the day when some type of line needs to be drawn on private ownership of new weapon types?
Does the average citizen need a remote-controlled, radio-activated gun bot with turret 50mm and 360 degree coverage?
Doesn't it make sense to start drawing that line now rather than wait for the Gun-Bot 3000?
Why should 'the right to bear arms' stop at today's technology? It didn't stop with ball and powder muskets
Pinups4 wrote: First they came for the gun owners. I cheered em on, I don't like guns
Then they came for the wealthy and the business people. Fuck those slave owners!
Then they came for the religious. Screw them, I don't need a god to be happy
Then they came for the independent journalists and the right-to-know filers. Don't they know secrets are secret for a reason! Terrorists! Lock em up!
Then they came for me. And there was no one I could turn to.
That's how it works...when they can divide the masses into groups, they can always go after the "other guys" and no outside the group being gone after cares...because, after all, it's not me...it's THEM! THOSE PEOPLE!
It started with sin taxes...and easy way for the government to increase revenue because those who don't drink or smoke (and soon those who don't drink Coca Cola) don't care...let THOSE OTHER PEOPLE pay the tax. I don't drink, I don't smoke and I don't drink Coca Cola...but I see what is wrong about group specific taxation.
The media tells us how divided the country is between Republicans and Democrats...each holding the idea the other is evil and ruining the country. You know what, we all live here, together...none of us are leaving for another planet...so we need to figure out how to find middle ground solutions to our country's problems.
We can fight against each other and solve nothing...but we will all starve together some day when it all falls apart around us.
Daniels Light
Posts: 4,911
Fort Lauderdale, Florida, US
Pinups4 wrote:
Why should 'the right to bear arms' stop at today's technology? It didn't stop with ball and powder muskets
And that's why gun control measures will get stronger support from the average American than is really warranted by effectiveness ... they read statements like yours (basically green-lighting thermonuclear weapons for individuals) and they say, "Those gun dudes are crazy ... we shouldn't be trusting them with a stick of gum ..."
If the gun control measures pass, it will be because the NRA and some gun enthusiasts seem to have no self-control and they reinforce this image on blogs and interviews daily.
hbutz New York wrote: Be reminded that law-abiding citizens purchasing firearms makes us safer.
Correct! Just like bingeing for months on cupcakes, pies and beer makes us thinner.
Americans are not criminals, not most of us aren't anyway. In this country, we put way too much trust and power into our elected officials and police. We have become subservient to them, allowing them to introduce and enforce legislation rather than representing us.
No one has ever claimed that Americans are criminals, only that maybe 80% off them are too irresponsible and immature to possess a deadly weapon to appease their paranoid, 'macho', hero fantasies.
Also, choosing between overzealous police or unresponsive politicians, and your average beer-bellied-buffoon, Dirty Harry fantasizing fool 'packin' heat' on a beer and chips shopping trip to Walmart ... we're FAR safer with the police and politicians.
The photograph of the "evil looking gun" demonstrates how ignorance causes panic. No "automatic" or military firearm has been sold to a citizen in this country for nearly 80 years. The so-called "assault" weapons have no more firepower than a simple revolver. Even if a criminal got their hands on an automatic weapon, such as the M1 with a 1000 rounds per minute specification, it would empty its 30 round magazine in under 2 seconds. That would be quite a short confrontation.
Number of homicides committed by automatic weapons in this country in the past 80 years: (2) two. You're being lied to. The general public does not own military weapons, only military style weapons. Understand what defines an "assault" weapon - pistol grip, barrel shroud, folding stock i.e. "evil looking features."
Glock pistols are, technically, "automatic weapons", Israeli UZIs (a gang favorite) are fully automatic weapons (and SOMEBODY sold it to them). TWO deaths in 80 years? I suppose cigarettes causes 3 deaths sometime back in the mid-fifties, but that's unverified rumor, eh?
Mac Wolff wrote: Thank goodness I bought all my AR's and auto handguns before all this craziness,when I bought my 30rd mags they were 8 bucks apiece now their 40 and ya cant find any.
According to manufactures they cant keep up with the demand for weapons or ammo
I think...
Shit, I can't tell you what I think. Dang MM rules.
So, you can just read what I quoted and imagine what I think. It'll be fun.
Mac Wolff wrote: Thank goodness I bought all my AR's and auto handguns before all this craziness,when I bought my 30rd mags they were 8 bucks apiece now their 40 and ya cant find any.
According to manufactures they cant keep up with the demand for weapons or ammo
Cuica Cafezinho wrote: I think...
Shit, I can't tell you what I think. Dang MM rules.
So, you can just read what I quoted and imagine what I think. It'll be fun.
So? He bought what he bought...why would MM's rules prevent you from saying something resonable? What, are you going to call him names and other such things because of what he purchased? Seriously?
SAND DIAL
Posts: 5,965
Santa Monica, California, US
Guss W wrote: I guess the folks that made that video weren't aware of Florida law that says you can't record voices surreptitiously. Now they are outlaws, and outlaws shouldn't have guns.
nathan combs
Posts: 3,687
Waynesboro, Virginia, US
Daniels Light wrote: First - I'm not against private ownership of guns.
But ...
With new technology in weapons hitting the market almost everyday, can't the gun enthusiast see the day when some type of line needs to be drawn on private ownership of new weapon types?
Does the average citizen need a remote-controlled, radio-activated gun bot with turret 50mm and 360 degree coverage?
Doesn't it make sense to start drawing that line now rather than wait for the Gun-Bot 3000?
What new tec do you speak of ? The AR is a tec that has been around a long time. Ok scopes have gotten better. What makes a AR work has been around for 100+ years
Olympic athlete Oscar Pistorius was taken into custody and charged with murder Thursday after a 30-year-old woman who was believed to be his girlfriend was shot dead at his home in South Africa’s capital, Pretoria.
...
It was reported that the woman may have been trying to surprise Pistorius for Valentine’s Day and he thought she was an intruder breaking into his home. The shooting prompted discussions on talk radio shows about the country’s gun control laws.
Whew! What a relief that this sort of insanity doesn't happen in the USA. -- No, it's not the gun, you see -- same thing would have happened without a gun -- (ceaseless stupidity).
What new tec do you speak of ? The AR is a tec that has been around a long time. Ok scopes have gotten better. What makes a AR work has been around for 100+ years
Apparently there have been major advancements in gun technology. Easily available, military style semiautomatic assault rifles are capable of shooting down planes and blowing up railroads!
DHayes Photography wrote: Apparently there have been major advancements in gun technology. Easily available, military style semiautomatic assault rifles are capable of shooting down planes and blowing up railroads!
I think modern gunpowder is made with unobtainium and the bullets are some alloy of adamantium.
I'm sure Ben Franklin, tech advisor to the forefathers, predicted all the advancements in firearms technology that we have today.
I wonder, with all the foresight that any intelligent person living today would have, who would lock into incontrovertible law a provision that all citizens be allowed, without restriction, to accumulate and carry deadly weapons?
If all the FF were to rise from the dead today and see what the 2nd amendment has wrought, they may very well feel horrified enough to campaign AGAINST it -- and it seems completely reasonable that the NRA types would take these guys out back and put one in the back or each one's head ... then go back out front and call themselves "good Americans" -- "protectors of the Constitution."
I'm sure Ben Franklin, tech advisor to the forefathers, predicted all the advancements in firearms technology that we have today.
I wonder, with all the foresight that any intelligent person living today would have, who would lock into incontrovertible law a provision that all citizens be allowed, without restriction, to accumulate and carry deadly weapons?
If all the FF were to rise from the dead today and see what the 2nd amendment has wrought, they may very well feel horrified enough to campaign AGAINST it -- and it seems completely reasonable that the NRA types would take these guys out back and put one in the back or each one's head ... then go back out front and call themselves "good Americans" -- "protectors of the Constitution."
Sickening. Shameful.
actually, if they rose from the dead today, they'd likely all pull out weapons and shoot the myriad of liberal lawyers who've pissed all over the US Constitution.
Ronin_LLC wrote: While the prices of ARs and AKs have jumped from $700-$1000 to $1500-$2500, they are NOT moving at those prices. I have spent the last two months dealing with idiots trying to hike prices because they don't know better or are trying to scam panicked people.
It makes my job harder.
Funny, my friend (the largest dealer in Virginia) was completely OUT OF STOCK 2 weeks ago and was unable to attend a gun show in Northern Virginia that he has attended every time for the last 15 years.He is having NO PROBLEM moving any AR variants he lays hands on. And yes, at the higher post-election prices.
Same thing happened AFTER the '94 Clinton AWB.
And that's why gun control measures will get stronger support from the average American than is really warranted by effectiveness ... they read statements like yours (basically green-lighting thermonuclear weapons for individuals) and they say, "Those gun dudes are crazy ... we shouldn't be trusting them with a stick of gum ..."
If the gun control measures pass, it will be because the NRA and some gun enthusiasts seem to have no self-control and they reinforce this image on blogs and interviews daily.
Actually it is likely to be the fault of the same low information voters who came out 3 months ago. It will be the low information type who thinks that the "assault weapons"being discussed are full auto weapons, because that is what the Dems and media have lied and told them. Just like the '94 AWB campaign when Democrat congresspeople (Barbara Mikulski is STILL in congress) who would go to the police shooting range, fire a Thompson machine gun, then hold a press conference right after talking about how we had to keep "those type" weapons off the streets.
The low info type who thinks "why do you NEED that?" is a reasonable response when discussing constitutional issues.
The low info type who thinks that government is the way to stay safe. Even after they have seen government failure following Katrina,Sandy, the northeast blackout, looting, L.A. riots, etc, etc.
The low info type who doesn't even realize that there are guns NOT on the AWB list that have the EXACT same capabilities (rate of fire, caliber, size) as weapons that ARE on the list because they have "scary" looking features.
The low info type who doesn't stop to realize that there are over a MILLION defensive uses of firearms a year.
The low info type who doesn't realize how many MILLIONS of Americans CURRENTLY carry a weapon DAILY and have for the last 20 years as crime and MURDER have gone DOWN by 50%. I'm not even drawing a causal relationship, just pointing out that as MORE and MORE people have exercised their constitutional rights, crime and murder went DOWN.
The low info type that thinks gun bans are the solution, even though those areas with gun bans have HIGH crime and murder rates (Chicago topped 500 murders last year). The same low info type that doesn't even know that murder rates in DC PLUMMETED following the Heller decision which now allows DC residents to own a gun WITHIN the city. DC used to be called "the Murder Capitol of the world", last year it had about 100 murders (down from previous years of about 400)
The same low info type with faith in government solutions who doesn't even realize that HIIPA regulations (government) make a "mental health" background check (government) almost useless.
The same low info type who has never stopped to realize that if ANYTHING bad happens to them, the police have NO obligation (based on legal precedent ) to the individual. Nor have they stopped to realize the truism, when seconds count , the police can be there in MINUTES. Talk to your local police/EMS service, find out what the average response time is. In my area, it is about 12 minutes.
I recognize that the media will do their best to find the kookiest of the bunch (NRA, pro-gun types), but if the voters were better informed as a rule, they would see that for what it is. With 50 plus million LEGAL gun owners and HUNDREDS of millions of LEGALLY owned guns, if we were all so dangerous as the media tries to paint us, we really would be living in a Mad Max world.
Technically Glocks are SEMI-automatics...unless you own some of the full-auto mil-spec special pieces.
UZI's are available in a SEMI-auto format as well in the open market. If you are a gang member(1) who is using a FULL-auto UZI (2) in the commission of a crime (3), you have already committed at least a half dozen Federal Felonies under CURRENT gun law.
Words have meaning.
BTW, if 80% of 50-60 MILLION legal gun owners with 200 plus MILLION legal guns were really so dangerous, I suspect the crime rate would not have gone DOWN for the last 20 years?....
Olympic athlete Oscar Pistorius was taken into custody and charged with murder Thursday after a 30-year-old woman who was believed to be his girlfriend was shot dead at his home in South Africa’s capital, Pretoria.
...
It was reported that the woman may have been trying to surprise Pistorius for Valentine’s Day and he thought she was an intruder breaking into his home. The shooting prompted discussions on talk radio shows about the country’s gun control laws.
Whew! What a relief that this sort of insanity doesn't happen in the USA. -- No, it's not the gun, you see -- same thing would have happened without a gun -- (ceaseless stupidity).
Wow...and yet South Africa requires a license for both gun ownership AND ammo purchases , registration, tracing marks on all firearms, NO private transfers, a 4 MONTH waiting period, a statement of NEED, an EXTENSIVE background check, CHARACTER references, a SPECIAL endorsement to own a semi-auto (reports say a 9mm was used in the shooting you cite), and gun ownership is NOT guaranteed by law.
Should be a leftist paradise? Yet...
The government estimates from almost as many to twice as many illegal guns as LEGAL guns?
Their homicide rate is 6.5 times HIGHER than ours?
Their gun homicide rate is more then 6 times HIGHER than ours?
I am perplexed?.....
They did almost ALL of the things the left is telling me we should do hear in the US. And yet, all hell is breaking loose by comparison. I know, they missed high -cap mags, is that it?.....if they just ban high cap mags, it will suddenly come together?
Here's the problem with the law, esp. the ID law for ammo in NY.
The government and law enforcement know that outlaws can operate labs. They can make meth and crack and LSD. They now have that meth-in-a-bottle technology where you can make it in your car as you drive down the road. We're talking high-school dropouts who can learn to make drugs and do chemistry. They can set up labs. They can set up security. They can build subs to bring drugs into the country. They can do a lot of incredibly sophisticated things.
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