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Photographer
Square Jaw Photography
Posts: 349
Odenton, Maryland, US


Good Day,

I am a trying to put together a shoot involving a Demure Nude pose (implied, to some.) All parts will be covered. As a photographer who's just began shooting models recently, I was looking at hiring a model for pay, hoping to get a decently experienced one. I had heard that the basic low rates around my area $20-$40/hr.

I posted a casting call with the entire concept I had in mind, where and what time, and what I was looking to pay ($30 an hour, three hour minimum, $10 in fuel compensation or more depending on distance, for a total minimum of $100.)

I got barely any bites. I had it up for three weeks and no bites. Then I contacted models I've worked with with the deal. They seemed interested at first, right up until the time I stopped hearing from them!...


So all that just to ask this; I'm not looking to pay a fortune, or use an unexperienced model TFP. What do most models at the basic level ask for in compensation?
Apr 30 13 11:37 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Carle Photography
Posts: 9,227
Oakland, California, US


Experienced nude models (might) take a job for 50/hr but are more likely to accept jobs in the 75-100 hour range.

Or you can go with a 4 hour half day rate.
200-300 ish

You CAN hire a model for less but as you have noticed the lower the rates, the fewer models will be interested.

The models with experience and that are in demand are busy booking jobs at a higher rate so they skip over the lower paid jobs.

Also, breaking up the rates into pay/gas/food/train fare...does not matter. What DOES matter is the bottom line. Offer your bottom line make it VERY easy to understand.
100.00 for 3 hours.

Also your exact location, a model who has to travel less then 5 miles will be more likely than a model who has to travel 25 miles to get to your place. A model needs to know where she had to work before she accepts a job.
Apr 30 13 11:43 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Square Jaw Photography
Posts: 349
Odenton, Maryland, US


Yeah, I've seen those that demand high rates that deserve it, and those that demand those same rates that do not have the port to match.

Many of the photogs I talk to or work with say they pay between $20-50 depending on the model. One says he doesn't ever pay. I figure if I'm the one looking, I should be willing to fork out some hard earned green. Yet I don't yet have the budget to spend $400 on a shoot, not including MUA and hair.
Apr 30 13 11:48 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Boreal Photography
Posts: 292
Duluth, Minnesota, US


Square Jaw Photography wrote:
Good Day, I am a trying to put together a shoot involving a Demure Nude pose (implied, to some.)...

I started out paying $10/hour for full nude (fine art nudes) and had plenty of beautiful art models locally (college town) anxious to work for that, just advertized in a local grunge alternative newspaper.  At a certain point I wanted a certain level of model and so even worked my way up to paying $100/hr for exceptionally beautiful nude models well endowed shall we say and who were willing to be body painted and such.  So I think anything in that range is possible.

Apr 30 13 11:48 am  Link  Quote 
Model
The Original Sin
Posts: 13,894
Louisville, Kentucky, US


Square Jaw Photography wrote:
Yeah, I've seen those that demand high rates that deserve it, and those that demand those same rates that do not have the port to match.

Many of the photogs I talk to or work with say they pay between $20-50 depending on the model. One says he doesn't ever pay. I figure if I'm the one looking, I should be willing to fork out some hard earned green. Yet I don't yet have the budget to spend $400 on a shoot, not including MUA and hair.

I lived and worked in that area, and was told fairly often my rates were too low ($75/hr).

That said- there are some pretty amazing models in that area.  Who can do their own HMUA work.  You might consider paying them a half-day rate and come out better in the long run.

Apr 30 13 11:51 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Carle Photography
Posts: 9,227
Oakland, California, US


What the guy next door pays has no relation to you.

If he/she can get models for 25/hr then that is great, but YOU'RE not getting those models.

If you are ALSO providing MUA and hair then again add that to your bottom line.
Some models might take a lower cash job that includes MUA & Hair & a few prints.

Networking in person will help as well, once you have a great reputation then people are more likely to work with you for lower rates. Go to events, attend group shoots.

Barter might also work.
What do you have to offer that a model might need?
In the past I have gotten item other than cash as pay.
Food
Pre paid debit cards
Cameras
Clothing
Apr 30 13 11:55 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Square Jaw Photography
Posts: 349
Odenton, Maryland, US


Randall_Oelerich wrote:

I started out paying $10/hour for full nude (fine art nudes) and had plenty of beautiful art models locally (college town) anxious to work for that, just advertized in a local grunge alternative newspaper.  At a certain point I wanted a certain level of model and so even worked my way up to paying $100/hr for exceptionally beautiful nude models well endowed shall we say and who were willing to be body painted and such.  So I think anything in that range is possible.

That's the route I'm hoping to take as well. One day, when my skillset expands, I'll want to pay for the best.

I consider the concept very artful, but with rates that low I'm worried that they may see me as a GWC. I made my casting call as detailed as possible, and straight to the point. Yet no one bit.

Apr 30 13 11:57 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Square Jaw Photography
Posts: 349
Odenton, Maryland, US


Death of Field wrote:
Go to events, attend group shoots.

Still a n00b to this, so what sort of events? I like workshops, is that what you have in mind?

Apr 30 13 11:58 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Carle Photography
Posts: 9,227
Oakland, California, US


Copy your casting here:

You can get advice on how to make it better.
Apr 30 13 11:59 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
J O H N A L L A N
Posts: 9,734
Santa Ana, California, US


You indicated that the better models were interested at first, but then stopped responding.
That suggests to me that the rate's fine, but that something else during the communication swayed them the other way.
Might want to review, what your communication is like and if something you're inadvertently doing/saying may be affecting your success.
Apr 30 13 11:59 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
AJScalzitti
Posts: 12,209
Atlanta, Georgia, US


Square Jaw Photography wrote:
Yeah, I've seen those that demand high rates that deserve it, and those that demand those same rates that do not have the port to match.

Many of the photogs I talk to or work with say they pay between $20-50 depending on the model. One says he doesn't ever pay. I figure if I'm the one looking, I should be willing to fork out some hard earned green. Yet I don't yet have the budget to spend $400 on a shoot, not including MUA and hair.

If you are including hair and makeup in the project be sure to list it.  Its not compensation but it does mean you are not asking the model to do even more work for the money (they will assume so).

Remember market/location matter when considering rates, where in some markets finding a model for $20-50 is easy other may be $50-75.  Also be on the lookout for the traveling models, they could be more but are usually very experienced and often published.

Apr 30 13 12:02 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Carle Photography
Posts: 9,227
Oakland, California, US


AJScalzitti wrote:
Remember market/location matter when considering rates, where in some markets finding a model for $20-50 is easy other may be $50-75.  Also be on the lookout for the traveling models, they could be more but are usually very experienced and often published.

Markets are more of a factor then locations.
I have worked in many "locations" and booked 125/hr & 25/hr and all sorts of pay rates in between. Even with the photography, some clients have a budget of 2k others 50.00.

If you're trying to cater to the "fine art model 25/hr" market then you have to produce work that fits that genre as well as have a strong network that supports you.

Apr 30 13 12:09 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Boreal Photography
Posts: 292
Duluth, Minnesota, US


GWC can be a problem; I had already established myself as an artist doing life drawings of models, so I had some art to show potential models, they respect artists for the most part. if you are GWC then yeah you might have to pony up the cash initially. But once you have some pics, put em up on a nice website, have references of models to share with potential models, it should go well. But college students will often work cheap, real cheap, so advertise in a local college newspaper or grunge alternative paper, and of course say they can bring an escort even their boyfriend (normally frowned on) to feel safe with the GWC/you.
Apr 30 13 12:10 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Square Jaw Photography
Posts: 349
Odenton, Maryland, US


Death of Field wrote:
Copy your casting here:

You can get advice on how to make it better.

I deleted it, but I will recreate it and post it here, momentarily.

Apr 30 13 12:11 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Square Jaw Photography
Posts: 349
Odenton, Maryland, US


Randall_Oelerich wrote:

That's the route I'm hoping to take as well. One day, when my skillset expands, I'll want to pay for the best. I consider the concept very artful, but with rates that low I'm worried that they may see me as a GWC. I made my casting call as detailed as possible, and straight to the point. Yet no one bit.

Well, Im no GWC, but I am wondering if those I've spoken with see me as such. I myself am a Combat Cameraman in the US Marines, and have taken imagery in Iraq, Afghanistan, Kuwait, Jordan, and all across the US and the world in general. I now serve as an instructor for our school in Maryland.

But model photography is new to me. It took me forever to figure out what GWC actually stood for! lol. Just going to soak up whatever advice, opinions, and ideas I can and continue honing and growing in this field.

Apr 30 13 12:15 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
J O H N A L L A N
Posts: 9,734
Santa Ana, California, US


Randall_Oelerich wrote:

Square Jaw Photography wrote:
....

That's the route I'm hoping to take as well. One day, when my skillset expands, I'll want to pay for the best. I consider the concept very artful, but with rates that low I'm worried that they may see me as a GWC. I made my casting call as detailed as possible, and straight to the point. Yet no one bit.
GWC can be a problem; I had already established myself as an artist doing life drawings of models, so I had some art to show potential models, they respect artists for the most part. if you are GWC then yeah you might have to pony up the cash initially. But once you have some pics, put em up on a nice website, have references of models to share with potential models, it should go well. But college students will often work cheap, real cheap, so advertise in a local college newspaper or grunge alternative paper, and of course say they can bring an escort even their boyfriend (normally frowned on) to feel safe with the GWC/you.

A couple things.
- A model's rate is not necessarily reflective of their worth. Particularly on the Internet it may actually be more reflective of how predatory they are.
- You might just as easily (if not more so) be viewed a GWC (and a good target), for being willing to pay too much.

Apr 30 13 12:15 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Marin Photography NYC
Posts: 6,623
New York, New York, US


Do more TF shoots with locals and shoot what they want. Then from time to time try to offer trade for genre for example: if a model needs some glamour or fashion, say you will do it return for some implied shots etc. I do it all the time and I only shoot TF these days because I have no budget for this currently.
Apr 30 13 12:20 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Amber Dawn - Colorado
Posts: 6,046
Castle Rock, Colorado, US


you do lack the experience shooting nudes, maybe the models are turned away by that. I know I would be even if you were paying.
Apr 30 13 12:24 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Boreal Photography
Posts: 292
Duluth, Minnesota, US


Square Jaw Photography wrote:

Well, Im no GWC, but I am wondering if those I've spoken with see me as such. I myself am a Combat Cameraman in the US Marines, and have taken imagery in Iraq, Afghanistan, Kuwait, Jordan, and all across the US and the world in general. I now serve as an instructor for our school in Maryland.

But model photography is new to me. It took me forever to figure out what GWC actually stood for! lol. Just going to soak up whatever advice, opinions, and ideas I can and continue honing and growing in this field.

Just to clarify, somehow that segment above that looks like I was writing it was actually from another poster. Something messed up in the html code here on this forum.

Apr 30 13 12:26 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Square Jaw Photography
Posts: 349
Odenton, Maryland, US


Marin Photography wrote:
Do more TF shoots with locals and shoot what they want. Then from time to time try to offer trade for genre for example: if a model needs some glamour or fashion, say you will do it return for some implied shots etc. I do it all the time and I only shoot TF these days because I have no budget for this currently.

That actually sounds like a good idea, thanks!

Apr 30 13 12:33 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Lucas_Smith
Posts: 215
Los Angeles, California, US


Never pay for models. Neeeeever.  :-)

They need you much more than the reverse.  Not intended to be an aggressive or condescending comment, just the truth.
Apr 30 13 02:18 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Will Snizek Photography
Posts: 1,387
Beckley, West Virginia, US


If you live near a college, $20/hour is plenty.  Most art classes pay nude models much less.
Apr 30 13 02:41 pm  Link  Quote 
Artist/Painter
sdgillis
Posts: 2,422
Portland, Oregon, US


Square Jaw Photography wrote:
Yeah, I've seen those that demand high rates that deserve it, and those that demand those same rates that do not have the port to match.

True to some regards.  You might have to contact 40 directly who were online in the past 10 days. 

It's also nearing finals season for those who are in school who do this on the side, so you might wait until the summer when activity goes up.

Apr 30 13 02:52 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
C h a r l e s D
Posts: 9,304
Los Angeles, California, US


Will Snizek wrote:
If you live near a college, $20/hour is plenty.  Most art classes pay nude models much less.

Sure about that?  The rate here in CA is $18.00 - $25.00 per hour.

Apr 30 13 02:52 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Gallery-MG
Posts: 75
Arlington, Virginia, US


Square Jaw Photography wrote:
I posted a casting call with the entire concept I had in mind, where and what time, and what I was looking to pay ($30 an hour, three hour minimum, $10 in fuel compensation or more depending on distance, for a total minimum of $100.)

My advice is to not rely too much on casting calls.  Reach out to the models you might want to work with and offer your budget.  If she declines, move on to the next.

So all that just to ask this; I'm not looking to pay a fortune, or use an unexperienced model TFP. What do most models at the basic level ask for in compensation?

This is hard to answer.  If by "basic" you mean "inexperienced," the range varies widely.  There are some who will accept $30/hr, and others who want $125(!)/hr.  You have to decide for yourself if the model has that value.  (You might as well hire an experienced model at some point.)

Apr 30 13 02:58 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Farenell Photography
Posts: 17,849
Albany, New York, US


Square Jaw Photography wrote:
I got barely any bites. I had it up for three weeks and no bites. Then I contacted models I've worked with with the deal. They seemed interested at first, right up until the time I stopped hearing from them!...

Those rates might be common & even on the high-end if the potential model was elsewhere (like if they found you off Craigslist or through a flyer found at college) but not here on MM.

Another thing causing hestitation is even though the project is techincally an implied nude shoot, doesn't remotely sound like it.

Square Jaw Photography wrote:
So all that just to ask this; I'm not looking to pay a fortune, or use an unexperienced model TFP. What do most models at the basic level ask for in compensation?

The basic asking rate for an inexperienced model can vary from next to nothing to TF* to $400/hr.

1. My feeling is to either bite the bullet & simply hire a nude model & do a nude shoot encompassing some of your implied ideas (think of it as an investment) or...

2. Maybe explain the concepts to a model with whom you already have a preexisting work relationship or...

3. Find some other venue like Craigslist, Tumblr, or FB where you can fire out a casting & see who from there bites.

Apr 30 13 03:04 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Eyesso
Posts: 652
Ormond Beach, Florida, US


Lucas_Smith wrote:
Never pay for models. Neeeeever.  :-)

They need you much more than the reverse.  Not intended to be an aggressive or condescending comment, just the truth.

Rock Star  smile

Apr 30 13 03:10 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
sidney_k
Posts: 873
Paris, Île-de-France, France


Lucas_Smith wrote:
Never pay for models. Neeeeever.  :-)

They need you much more than the reverse.  Not intended to be an aggressive or condescending comment, just the truth.

Let's turn the situation around, if you were a model, would you work with Lucas Smith, and why?

Apr 30 13 03:11 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Marin Photography NYC
Posts: 6,623
New York, New York, US


Carioca wrote:
Let's turn the situation around, if you were a model, would you work with Lucas Smith, and why?

He shoots for:

LA Models
Nous
Photogenics
Ford
Wilhelmina
Q (LA)
Arizona Mgmt
Vision
No Ties
Industry
Zuri
Wunder
Hollywood Model Management

as mentioned already - Rock Star! big_smile  We can't all be like him sad

If I was a model - HECK YEAH!

Apr 30 13 03:26 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Eyesso
Posts: 652
Ormond Beach, Florida, US


Carioca wrote:

Let's turn the situation around, if you were a model, would you work with Lucas Smith, and why?

Heck Yes.....his portfolio is bombasticly good.

Apr 30 13 03:31 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Will Snizek Photography
Posts: 1,387
Beckley, West Virginia, US


C h a r l e s  D wrote:

Sure about that?  The rate here in CA is $18.00 - $25.00 per hour.

You guys make more money in California. I didn't pay attention to where the OP was from honestly.

Apr 30 13 03:40 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Square Jaw Photography
Posts: 349
Odenton, Maryland, US


Will Snizek wrote:

You guys make more money in California. I didn't pay attention to where the OP was from honestly.

Actually, I'm a US Marine, from California. I'm currently stationed in Maryland. I look at the casting over in Cali as well, and it seems the same.

Apr 30 13 06:19 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
ShotbyRon
Posts: 767
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, US


If you can't afford to just drop $300+ on an experienced model (I know I don't) then just find an inexperienced model who might be open to the idea of doing nudes. Just be professional with them, build a relationship and NEVER pressure them to do something they don't want.

All nudes I have shot have been with random girls I've met in bars or around town. In fact, the first nude shoot I ever did was with a girl I met through a friend. When she first contacted me she said she wanted something simple and outdoors. As we built a relationship which each other, she wanted to try more and more revealing shots. Then one day out of nowhere during a bikini shoot she just stripped completely naked and we did a nude set in an open field and in a creek.
Apr 30 13 06:40 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Square Jaw Photography
Posts: 349
Odenton, Maryland, US


To "Death of Field"

Here is the casting I just posted. Sorry for the delay!

"Looking for fit female model for an outdoor demure (implied) shoot. The concept involves posing in a woodland environment with a recurve bow-and-arrow. The pose will be full nude using the environment to cover everything up.

The shoot pays minimum $100. The location is on a private property we have been allowed to use for the shoot. Travel will be compensated. The model is guaranteed images as well."
May 01 13 11:25 am  Link  Quote 
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