ArtisticPhotography wrote:

She doesn't support her sister's choice, which was "my sister made the choice to have my niece out of wedlock". The other big choice would have been to abort her niece. She's a horrible person to talk about her niece like that.

Also, "It drives me nuts that she brought my niece into all that on purpose."

The fact that she said "made the choice" as well as "into all that on purpose" lead me to think that her sister's pregnancy was a planned one.

If I am correct on that, the other choice would have been to take steps to not get pregnant.

Lisa Andresen wrote:
I agree my sister made the choice to have my niece out of wedlock with a jerk. He treats her horrible he is abusive and controlling and they are off and on more than the weather. It drives me nuts that she brought my niece into all that on purpose. Not to mention she can't afford anything she get all her help from link and medical card.

I love my niece and my sister and all I can do now is be here for her when she finally hopefully one day decides to leave him. But what she did and the life she planed for her daughter is something she will have to live with every day.

how is it relevant that it is ''out of wedlock''? if she were married he'd still be a jerk and they still wouldn't be able to afford good care, so it's totally irrelevant...

Anna Adrielle wrote:

how is it relevant that it is ''out of wedlock''? if she were married he'd still be a jerk and they still wouldn't be able to afford good care, so it's totally irrelevant...

+1

ArtisticPhotography wrote:

Wow, hard to believe you're advocating abortion. Just don't be a terrible jerk and tell the little girl that, ever. That'd be horrible.

I would have thought that you, of all people, would be glad she chose life.

What are you talking about no where in my post do I say anything about abortion. I love my niece and I can't imagine my life without her. What part of she was a planned baby do you not understand?

I am not for abortion but I am for birth control and being stable before having a child.

Anna Adrielle wrote:

how is it relevant that it is ''out of wedlock''? if she were married he'd still be a jerk and they still wouldn't be able to afford good care, so it's totally irrelevant...

It's called that's what happened and I was giving the facts. So calm down killer...

Lisa Andresen wrote:
I agree my sister made the choice to have my niece out of wedlock with a jerk. He treats her horrible he is abusive and controlling and they are off and on more than the weather. It drives me nuts that she brought my niece into all that on purpose. Not to mention she can't afford anything she get all her help from link and medical card.

I love my niece and my sister and all I can do now is be here for her when she finally hopefully one day decides to leave him. But what she did and the life she planed for her daughter is something she will have to live with every day.

for chrissakes, if she had only married him first. all that other nonsense would have never happened.

GK photo wrote:

for chrissakes, if she had only married him first. all that other nonsense would have never happened.

I never said that I am glade they aren't married she only knew him 5 months before getting pregnant with his kid. She should have never been with him in the first place. I simply telling what happened and they aren't married.

You guys are purposely targeting me because you know my beliefs on marriage so feel free to lay off anytime now.

Lisa Andresen wrote:

I never said that I am glade they aren't married

why was their marital status even an issue? and who brought it up?

Connor Photography wrote:
why did they bring the child into this world while they are not capable of raising them.  Many of them have razor cut scars all over their arms and legs.

Simply obsession for child regardless of hypocrisy in our society on this topic.

Eridu wrote:

Glad I could help  pick up the tab for that while I was working 50 hr weeks, taking out loans at 5-8% in order to further my education so I could make more money and, as luck would have it, pay even more taxes in order to cover the check for others.

Wadda Country

in my state you are required to work 35 hours a week in order to get $200 a month in food stamps and get healthcare for you and your child. i very much appreciate people who pay their taxes, because if it wasn't for them, i would not have been able to provide for my boy while i worked my ass off to get hired, and promoted, and get off welfare for good. thank you, thank you very much! i know your comment was meant to be taken sarcastically, and i completely understand your quick-to-judge attitude about single mothers. maybe you think that we are lazy, or that we enjoy living off the system, that we think we are above everyone else because we found a loophole, a way to leech off everyone while we drive our nice cars and get our nails done every thursday in preparation for the weekend. and yeah, some do that. and i can't speak for everyone, but i know i am not the only young mother who fought for a better life, for myself and my boy. i make more money than my mother does now, and pay plenty of taxes. so thank you. thank you for getting me over the hump! now i can be a hardworking, taxpaying, model citizen. all thanks to you!!!

Lisa Andresen wrote:
It's called that's what happened and I was giving the facts. So calm down killer...

it's so funny how other peoplee seems to have the same remark about your post as me, yet somehow I'm the killer. alrighty then. are you always this defensive or do I just happen to bring that out in you?

Connor Photography wrote:
Recently I have encountered lot of teen single mother, why did they bring the child into this world while they are not capable of raising them.  Many of them have razor cut scars all over their arms and legs.   

Birth control is readily available for everyone, why didn't they seek this option.  I understand that many told me that how much they love their kid.  The kid changed their love.   Will they still love their kid when they become a teenager and no longer as cute as when they are 2 and 3 yrs old.  Will they have sufficient means to put them thru school and college?  The cycle continues. 

It is troublesome when so many children growing up in a dysfunctional family.  We, as a whole, will pay for it one way or another.  What should we do? 

Many things in the world are sad.

I was 33 and my wife was 30 when our first child was born.  We both worked our whole lives, and we STILL couldn't "afford college" for them without financial aid and the like.

Lisa Andresen wrote:

What are you talking about no where in my post do I say anything about abortion. I love my niece and I can't imagine my life without her. What part of she was a planned baby do you not understand?

I am not for abortion but I am for birth control and being stable before having a child.

Your wording is that you support aborting your niece. You said your sister chose to bring her into the mess. That decision is made after she's pregnant. Besides, it doesn't appear that she chose to get pregnant, so there was no choice there.

Now to double-back and say you weren't for aborting your niece is even creepier yet.

If you support your sisters decision to keep the baby, then you have to support the rest of the situation. Otherwise, you're just a nasty, judgmental person. If you don't support her bringing the baby into the mess, you're just a horrible person.

You can go preach about your religion and your relationship to God, but then you turn around and do horrible things. A best your being nasty and judgmental. When you die and go to meet St. Peter, do you think he'll care more about how you wag your tongue in a false show of religion or do you think he'll care about your actions, such as not fully supporting your sister when she needs you the most?

Hypocrites like you are the ones who give religion a bad rap. Either love your neighbor or don't, but don't profess to doing it and then bitch about them behind their back, not support them when they are in need, and second guess their decision to bring a child into the world.

Lisa Andresen wrote:

It's called that's what happened and I was giving the facts. So calm down killer...

Anna had a good point. Why was it relevant. It's not. It's just you being judgmental. If you were being supportive, it really wouldn't matter.

It's another example of you being hurtful, judgmental and hypocritical instead of being tolerant, loving and religious.

There used to be this guy. It was a long time ago. His name was Jesus. He was for unconditionally loving your neighbor. He was for turning the other cheek. He preached acceptance. Even if you don't believe in him, his philosophy was good. You ought to go look him up. Your Bible seems to be about someone else.

Anna Adrielle wrote:

it's so funny how other peoplee seems to have the same remark about your post as me, yet somehow I'm the killer. alrighty then. are you always this defensive or do I just happen to bring that out in you?

I thought your post was fine, on topic, etc. She's just a hypocrite who is wrapping herself in a cloak of religion to hide her judgmental, intolerant views.

ArtisticPhotography wrote:

My kids were pretty good. They slept well, ate like pigs, and were seldom sick. My older son is in college and my younger son is a senior in high school. Knock on wood but neither of them have ever missed a day of school.

I think, if anything, they take MORE time and attention when they get older than when they are younger. But they're great kids and I enjoy the heck out of them.

Mine all had ear problems, so there were lots of late nights and sleeping sitting up.  My youngest, she had breathing issues from 6 weeks on (she got RSV) and turned blue once.  Scared the hell out of me.  I love them and enjoy them very much.  But I think they are so much easier now that they are older.
However, I do miss snuggling with them when they were new and sniffing their heads.  lol

ArtisticPhotography wrote:

Your wording is that you support aborting your niece. You said your sister chose to bring her into the mess. That decision is made after she's pregnant. Besides, it doesn't appear that she chose to get pregnant, so there was no choice there.

Now to double-back and say you weren't for aborting your niece is even creepier yet.

If you support your sisters decision to keep the baby, then you have to support the rest of the situation. Otherwise, you're just a nasty, judgmental person. If you don't support her bringing the baby into the mess, you're just a horrible person.

You can go preach about your religion and your relationship to God, but then you turn around and do horrible things. A best your being nasty and judgmental. When you die and go to meet St. Peter, do you think he'll care more about how you wag your tongue in a false show of religion or do you think he'll care about your actions, such as not fully supporting your sister when she needs you the most?

Hypocrites like you are the ones who give religion a bad rap. Either love your neighbor or don't, but don't profess to doing it and then bitch about them behind their back, not support them when they are in need, and second guess their decision to bring a child into the world.

Wow this is a twist of words if I have ever seen them. I never said I want her to have an abortion the word abortion never came up. I simply said I wish my sister would have thought things through before planning a child. I wish she would have found a guy who really cared for her and loved her before attaching herself to him forever marriage or no marriage.

I love my niece I would never not want her here and I don't ever want her to think she isn't wanted. She is my sisters world and my sister is a good mother. She is just going to have to struggle for awhile because of some of the bad choices she made.

ArtisticPhotography wrote:

I thought your post was fine, on topic, etc. She's just a hypocrite who is wrapping herself in a cloak of religion to hide her judgmental, intolerant views.

Except If you read my posts I never once said anything about my religion or my beliefs. I simply gave the facts of something going on in my own life that was related to the OP and you jumped all over me. So feel free to stop bringing my faith up and throwing it in my face because I sure as heck didn't start it you did.

ArtisticPhotography wrote:

Your wording is that you support aborting your niece. You said your sister chose to bring her into the mess. That decision is made after she's pregnant. Besides, it doesn't appear that she chose to get pregnant, so there was no choice there.

Now to double-back and say you weren't for aborting your niece is even creepier yet.

If you support your sisters decision to keep the baby, then you have to support the rest of the situation. Otherwise, you're just a nasty, judgmental person. If you don't support her bringing the baby into the mess, you're just a horrible person.

You can go preach about your religion and your relationship to God, but then you turn around and do horrible things. A best your being nasty and judgmental. When you die and go to meet St. Peter, do you think he'll care more about how you wag your tongue in a false show of religion or do you think he'll care about your actions, such as not fully supporting your sister when she needs you the most?

Hypocrites like you are the ones who give religion a bad rap. Either love your neighbor or don't, but don't profess to doing it and then bitch about them behind their back, not support them when they are in need, and second guess their decision to bring a child into the world.

I agree that if you support a baby being born and not given up to adoption, then you support the family-unit it encompasses.

Could it be and what is missing from the understanding here, is this:

Let's take religion out of the mix for a nanosecond.

We all know teenagers and adults have sex.
We know that we gain wisdom as we get older.
We can understand that people make mistakes.

Ok.

I think a 'traditional' view on having children is starting out with a loving husband and wife, having enough resources to raise the child/children and having an emotionally and financially stable environment to start.

There is no crime in wishing for those things for a new life.

I am not saying a younger/older single Mom can not love her child and that child can flourish in the world.

It is just nice to have the basic building blocks to start.
That's a good thing.

I have to admit it really angers me when a life is not considered, i.e., not using condoms/birth-control of any kind... having children to 'keep a man'/force into marriage, etc., using a child as a pawn in relationships, etc.

Not my experience in the slightest, but observe the world.
It's sad.

Jules NYC wrote:

I agree that if you support a baby being born and not given up to adoption, then you support the family-unit it encompasses.

Could it be and what is missing from the understanding here, is this:

Let's take religion out of the mix for a nanosecond.

We all know teenagers and adults have sex.
We know that we gain wisdom as we get older.
We can understand that people make mistakes.

Ok.

I think a 'traditional' view on having children is starting out with a loving husband and wife, having enough resources to raise the child/children and having an emotionally and financially stable environment to start.

There is no crime in wishing for those things for a new life.

I am not saying a younger/older single Mom can not love her child and that child can flourish in the world.

It is just nice to have the basic building blocks to start.
That's a good thing.

I have to admit it really angers me when a life is not considered, i.e., not using condoms/birth-control of any kind... having children to 'keep a man'/force into marriage, etc., using a child as a pawn in relationships, etc.

Not my experience in the slightest, but observe the world.
It's sad.

Thank you this is what I was saying. I love my niece very much. It just angered me that my sister did not consider these basic building blocks. And when I talked to her about it before she got pregnant when they were just trying. I told her my concerns and she blew me off and had a baby anyway.

Lisa Andresen wrote:

Thank you this is what I was saying. I love my niece very much. It just angered me that my sister did not consider these basic building blocks. And when I talked to her about it before she got pregnant when they were just trying. I told her my concerns and she blew me off and had a baby anyway.

You're welcome.
I hear you:)

Lisa Andresen wrote:

Except If you read my posts I never once said anything about my religion or my beliefs. I simply gave the facts of something going on in my own life that was related to the OP and you jumped all over me. So feel free to stop bringing my faith up and throwing it in my face because I sure as heck didn't start it you did.

Not bring up your faith. Are you now Peter?

Lisa Andresen wrote:
And when I talked to her about it before she got pregnant when they were just trying. I told her my concerns and she blew me off and had a baby anyway.

That's about as arrogant of a comment as I have ever heard. I doubt very much that the decision was even approaching being yours to make.

ArtisticPhotography wrote:

That's about as arrogant of a comment as I have ever heard. I doubt very much that the decision was even approaching being yours to make.

She can voice her concerns to her sister...I'm pretty sure they are close enough where they have that type of relationship. Yes, it's her sisters decision to make, but Lisa can still make her concerns heard.

ArtisticPhotography wrote:

That's about as arrogant of a comment as I have ever heard. I doubt very much that the decision was even approaching being yours to make.

No one is an island, especially not if they're family.

Some may think of child as just the kid of the mother who bore them, but the child is so much more.  A niece, a nephew, a grandchild, a sister or a brother, a cousin...

Apparently some people think that God forbid anyone have concern for someone else in this world. Apparently everyone should just be allowed to go to hell in a handbasket whenever they want to and you should just step over the dirt when they fall. Maybe mash their head into the pavement as you reach your destination.

Lisa Andresen wrote:

Wow this is a twist of words if I have ever seen them. I never said I want her to have an abortion the word abortion never came up. I simply said I wish my sister would have thought things through before planning a child. I wish she would have found a guy who really cared for her and loved her before attaching herself to him forever marriage or no marriage.

I love my niece I would never not want her here and I don't ever want her to think she isn't wanted. She is my sisters world and my sister is a good mother. She is just going to have to struggle for awhile because of some of the bad choices she made.

No. Stop lying. That's not what you said.

I agree my sister made the choice to have my niece out of wedlock with a jerk. He treats her horrible he is abusive and controlling and they are off and on more than the weather. It drives me nuts that she brought my niece into all that on purpose. Not to mention she can't afford anything she get all her help from link and medical card.

I love my niece and my sister and all I can do now is be here for her when she finally hopefully one day decides to leave him. But what she did and the life she planed for her daughter is something she will have to live with every day.

A. She made a choice to have the baby. That's a good choice. The other option is to not have the baby. That's called an abortion. That's what you are advocating.

B. She did this on purpose. Yes, that's called being a parent. Having an abortion is, again, the other option.

C. She needs economic help with her family. Okay, so what. Maybe you ought to get off of your high horse and help her yourself. That's what Jesus would do, not preach at her. She needs your help and all you are doing is being uppity.

D. You said, "all I can do now is be here for her when she finally hopefully one day decides to leave him". You're a piece of crap. You should be there for her NOW when she needs you, not fly in afterwards and tell her how wrong she was, how right you were, and how she should have listened to you. Be nice for a change, help her now, and stop being judgmental. It's her relationship, it's her s.o. and it's her child. It's not all about YOU.

E. You say, "life she planed for her daughter is something she will have to live with every day". You say that like it's a bad thing. I bet she's very happy with it and loves her daughter and wouldn't have it any other way. Meanwhile, you'll be nice and economically self sufficient and preachy and might find that there's never a "right" time to have a kid. Be joyous for her, don't condemn her.

Now, I'm Catholic and you're not; and the Protestants decided to cut out the Deuterocanonical Books books of the Bible a few years back; so I'm not exactly sure that books your Bible has.

We have 4 books called "The New Testament" which were written by the Apostles (as was Acts, but that's another story). Within them is the Gospel of Matthew. I'm not sure if you have that book, or not, but if you don't you might want to look it up. Within Matthew, you'll find an obscure verse that covers this.  It is Matthew 22:39.

ArtisticPhotography wrote:

No. Stop lying. That's not what you said.

I agree my sister made the choice to have my niece out of wedlock with a jerk. He treats her horrible he is abusive and controlling and they are off and on more than the weather. It drives me nuts that she brought my niece into all that on purpose. Not to mention she can't afford anything she get all her help from link and medical card.

I love my niece and my sister and all I can do now is be here for her when she finally hopefully one day decides to leave him. But what she did and the life she planed for her daughter is something she will have to live with every day.

A. She made a choice to have the baby. That's a good choice. The other option is to not have the baby. That's called an abortion. That's what you are advocating.

B. She did this on purpose. Yes, that's called being a parent. Having an abortion is, again, the other option.

C. She needs economic help with her family. Okay, so what. Maybe you ought to get off of your high horse and help her yourself. That's what Jesus would do, not preach at her. She needs your help and all you are doing is being uppity.

D. You said, "all I can do now is be here for her when she finally hopefully one day decides to leave him". You're a piece of crap. You should be there for her NOW when she needs you, not fly in afterwards and tell her how wrong she was, how right you were, and how she should have listened to you. Be nice for a change, help her now, and stop being judgmental. It's her relationship, it's her s.o. and it's her child. It's not all about YOU.

E. You say, "life she planed for her daughter is something she will have to live with every day". You say that like it's a bad thing. I bet she's very happy with it and loves her daughter and wouldn't have it any other way. Meanwhile, you'll be nice and economically self sufficient and preachy and might find that there's never a "right" time to have a kid. Be joyous for her, don't condemn her.

Now, I'm Catholic and you're not; and the Protestants decided to cut out the Deuterocanonical Books books of the Bible a few years back; so I'm not exactly sure that books your Bible has.

We have 4 books called "The New Testament" which were written by the Apostles (as was Acts, but that's another story). Within them is the Gospel of Matthew. I'm not sure if you have that book, or not, but if you don't you might want to look it up. Within Matthew, you'll find an obscure verse that covers this.  It is Matthew 22:39.

Just a thought here as an outsider.

You've really twisted what she said to mean altogether different things than what I got from it when I read it.

I wonder why that is?