KEKnight wrote:
Will this be for studio or outside?

Indoor locations (not studio) and outside.

Leonard Gee Photography wrote:
Speedlights on manual are fine for direct flash and supplemental. Or if you don't need fast recycling at full power (sub 1-2 sec). They are also very compact for multiple units.

With modifiers and fast recycle at full power you need more than a speedlight. Metz or Norman 200c/400b, larger Elinchrom Ranger (400ws)/Profoto 600B and up to 1200 ws. Depends on what you need and how you shoot. Bigger ones can support 2 heads. Large, heavy backpack.

I have Hensel and Profoto battery generators (pack and head systems), but trying to do something more portable.

What Metz units would you recommend?

Giacomo Cirrincioni wrote:
I need a very portable (I'm thinking strobist style) lighting kit that I can fit in a backpack.

I have a lot of experience with almost every studio strobe or hotlight imaginable - I don't own a single speedlight and never have.  It's just not something that I've ever needed for the way I shoot.  So I have no idea what I'm doing in this regard or really where to begin.

What may make this a bit more complicated (or a bit more simple) is that my camera platform of choice is a Mamiya RZ67 Pro IID.  No TTL metering with this.  I do have a DSLR (Nikon) but it is not my go to.  I shoot both film and digital with the RZ.  For digital I try to never go above ISO 200.  With film (especially B&W) I go to 3,200.  My preference, however, is lower ISO setting, and especially prefer to shoot between 50 and 400.

So I need small, powerful battery operated strobes.  I was originally included to go Metz or Quantum and then build/buy/jerry rig modifiers for them, but Jay appears to have tested a number of options and I'd love to know your thoughts.

Anyway, my research on this begins today and this is my first step on that journey.  In case it matters, these will be taken to Europe.

Thanks!

Profoto has an battery powered mono light that might be worth considering. I've got an AB Vagabond battery that I can part with cheaply. The best move might be to carry the inverter and buy a battery over there.

In terms of speed lights vs Quantum, Quantum wins by a mile.

I use a Turbo 3 battery,  tu if I had to do it again, I'd buy one of the smaller ones the blade or the SC I think it's called.

They also make a cable that allowes you to remove the bulb and put it in a remote head. This allows you to put the light high up on a stand, and keep the body of the flash at normal height. There are a ton of benefits - less top heavy stand or hand held boom pole, the option of placing it in small spaces. When I shoot with it on a bracket, I wear the flash and battery and mount the remote head on an Israeli arm on a Custom brackets Mini RC. I can have the flash directly over head or anywhere inbetween for either horizontal or vertical.

The other unique thing about the quantum is the bare bulb option. It gives a hard light that's really unique. It can be cool in small places if you want to bounce it everywhere or turn a wall into a giant beauty dish. I like simulating natural light be kighting a room and lettjng the light pass through the doorway as if it were the sun. It's also an interesting match as a fill for sunlight.

In terms of the light itself, it seems like a "higher quality" of light. It's color temperature is way more accurate than an AB, and it's output is more consistent than a speed light.

It's got an "auto" mode, where it uses it's own built-in meter which way more accurate than TTL.

If you're shooting at 3200 there's a good chance that the speedlight will be too powerful at its lowest setting. The diffuser that covers the little reflector is removable and has two layers that snap into a plastic ring that holds it on the diffuser. The two layers are meant to hold gels for color matching and I've found them great for ND gels when shooting with a high ISO. There may be enough ambient light for the camera, but you still need to be able to control the direction and add fill. A very low output can be important.


I've never used the entire Turbo battery and I shoot a lot. It's much better than relying on AAs and having to carry a ton of spares. The turbo battery is something to consider even if you go a regular speedlight direction.


The T5-R is meant for bracket or stand use - there's no hotshoe connector. Like a strobe, it doesn't do HSS. The Trio has slightly less power, has the radio receiver built-in,  does HSS and can be mounted on a Nikon or Canon hotshoe - there are brand specific models.

MC Photo wrote:

Profoto has an battery powered mono light that might be worth considering. I've got an AB Vagabond battery that I can part with cheaply. The best move might be to carry the inverter and buy a battery over there.

In terms of speed lights vs Quantum, Quantum wins by a mile.

I use a Turbo 3 battery,  tu if I had to do it again, I'd buy one of the smaller ones the blade or the SC I think it's called.

They also make a cable that allowes you to remove the bulb and put it in a remote head. This allows you to put the light high up on a stand, and keep the body of the flash at normal height. There are a ton of benefits - less top heavy stand or hand held boom pole, the option of placing it in small spaces. When I shoot with it on a bracket, I wear the flash and battery and mount the remote head on an Israeli arm on a Custom brackets Mini RC. I can have the flash directly over head or anywhere inbetween for either horizontal or vertical.

The other unique thing about the quantum is the bare bulb option. It gives a hard light that's really unique. It can be cool in small places if you want to bounce it everywhere or turn a wall into a giant beauty dish. I like simulating natural light be kighting a room and lettjng the light pass through the doorway as if it were the sun. It's also an interesting match as a fill for sunlight.

In terms of the light itself, it seems like a "higher quality" of light. It's color temperature is way more accurate than an AB, and it's output is more consistent than a speed light.

It's got an "auto" mode, where it uses it's own built-in meter which way more accurate than TTL.

If you're shooting at 3200 there's a good chance that the speedlight will be too powerful at its lowest setting. The diffuser that covers the little reflector is removable and has two layers that snap into a plastic ring that holds it on the diffuser. The two layers are meant to hold gels for color matching and I've found them great for ND gels when shooting with a high ISO. There may be enough ambient light for the camera, but you still need to be able to control the direction and add fill. A very low output can be important.


I've never used the entire Turbo battery and I shoot a lot. It's much better than relying on AAs and having to carry a ton of spares. The turbo battery is something to consider even if you go a regular speedlight direction.


The T5-R is meant for bracket or stand use - there's no hotshoe connector. Like a strobe, it doesn't do HSS. The Trio has slightly less power, has the radio receiver built-in,  does HSS and can be mounted on a Nikon or Canon hotshoe - there are brand specific models.

Thank you for this.  I'm looking at the various options/configurations now and, while it's a bit confusing, it seems that some permutation of this is the way to go.

Toto Photo wrote:
As I recall I read most of the posts in strobist.com in an afternoon and found them invaluable when I was at a similar crossroad. If you already know most of what he teaches, I'd at least try to find his post about the light stand which folds legs-upward resulting in the shortest, inside-the-pack footprint imaginable.

Manfrotto 5001B or LumoPro LP605.

-JAY- wrote:
On my phone at work right now, ill go into detail tonight, but it will be 2 main recommendations.

Multiple speedlites
Sunpak 622 super.

Both are enough for good apertures at ISO100

Good apertures for us on a DSLRs might not be the same as good apertures on MF. OP will often need a couple stops more light than we do.

MKPhoto wrote:
Good apertures for us on a DSLRs might not be the same as good apertures on MF. OP will often need a couple stops more light than we do.

I am well aware of the DOF differences in the formats, and the necessary power needed. However, here's an example of one of my YN560II's putting out f/11 at ten feet (ten feet to the stand, plus travel to the umbrella and back)





With my 4 way bracket, that's f/22, with 2.5 second recycle - f/36 at six feet.

My Sunpak 622 matches the (4) 560IIs fairly evenly, so f/22 - with a 1.5 second recycle with my TR-PAK II battery pack. I've got a bracket to fix two sunpaks in a modifier, so f/32 at ten feet (60@6') (got 2 sunpak 622s and 2 battery packs for $150 this weekend)

Sure that's a parabolic umbrella, but that same 4 way speedlite bracket does f/16 at 6' in a shoot through (fairly normal distance) so does the 622 - and both 622s are sitting pretty at f/22.

Four speedlites in a shoot through at 6-8ish feet, f/14 with some on half power



I'm often shooting at f/2.8-5.6 - and have everything on super low power for ridiculous recycle times. When I shoot MF, I'm usually at f/8 - f/11, so even most of these rigs are at 1/4ish power - that's instant recycle and hundreds of shots per charge.

Plus everything fits into my backpack.

Robert Lynch wrote:

Manfrotto 5001B or LumoPro LP605.

+1 on those.

-JAY- wrote:
OP is asking for a powerful, backpackable lighting kit.

The quad flash bracket and sunpaks both beat out anything else that fits those criteria that I have tested.

You should check out the Q Flash. A single T5D-R can overpower the sun without HSS and will recycle in less than 1 second.

MC Photo wrote:
You should check out the Q Flash. A single T5D-R can overpower the sun without HSS and will recycle in less than 1 second.

sigh

I really wish people would stop throwing this term around without proper qualification.  You can overpower the sun with any light.  It is just a question of how much an area you need to light.  Head shot? 3/4 length? Full length?  A car?  Group of 20 people?

The T5D-R is only 150 W/s, so it would have been impossible to do this with it:

-JAY- wrote:
OP is asking for a powerful, backpackable lighting kit.

The quad flash bracket and sunpaks both beat out anything else that fits those criteria that I have tested.

MC Photo wrote:
You should check out the Q Flash. A single T5D-R can overpower the sun without HSS and will recycle in less than 1 second.

So will four YN560IIs shot through an 86" umbrella at six feet for full body coverage. I have used a couple different qflashes, and haven't been impressed much in the price per performance. Sure they're fantastic, but I value utility and versatility over anything else, especially when travelling. What happens when I'm five miles up a mountain trail and need a main light, a fill light, a rim, a hair light, and a couple lights for the scenery? One Qflash won't help there, and enough to help wouldn't be easily backpackable.