lll wrote:
Discussed to death.  Try this list, I just re-bumped it.

- lll's Ring Flash Light Compact CF Raw List

And then use the Search Function, please.

See, this is what I don't understand about these forums.  A new guy will come on here and always, if the question is a common one, almost immediately someone will write "do a search!"

Towards someone who is an admitted beginner this is slightly rude, don't you think?

I clicked on your link, and much of it is not relevant to the question asked and also out of date. Most of it may just confuse a beginner.

And you know, almost all the questions on here have been asked before, so why bother having a forum?  No one forces you to click on these questions, do they?

Maybe people come on here and ask these questions because they want real time, contemporaneous advice from people who can look at their port and give them suggestions which are more likely to be targetted towards their precise needs?

IMHO in photography you can only learn so much from books or the internet before needing some real, human to human interaction.  This forum could be the next best thing.

Derek Ridgers wrote:

See, this is what I don't understand about these forums.  A new guy will come on here and always, if the question is a common one, almost immediately someone will write "do a search!"

Towards someone who is an admitted beginner this is slightly rude, don't you think?

I clicked on your link, and much of it is not relevant to the question asked and also out of date. Most of it may just confuse a beginner.

And you know, almost all the questions on here have been asked before, so why bother having a forum?  No one forces you to click on these questions, do they?

Maybe people come on here and ask these questions because they want real time, contemporaneous advice from people who can look at their port and give them suggestions which are more likely to be targetted towards their precise needs?

IMHO in photography you can only learn so much from books or the internet before needing some real, human to human interaction.  This forum could be the next best thing.

Buy Profoto and forget all the rest

The problem with these forums is that the search feature is hidden on the first page and very limited. It helps sometimes when someone points people to the correct location for a search.

Real time answers will get you the same results as what has already been discussed many times before. MAC or Windows? Nikon or Canon? RAW or jpg? Escort or no escort? Should I pose nude or not? (that answer is always yes ) I don’t think anyone is trying to be rude, but helpful in pointing out common topics. A better search feature would help this out a lot.

S P GRAPICS wrote:
I am new to a studio lighting.  However, I love the control and the result that I got from strobe.  What do you recomment for a beginner like me?  What Brand what made?  How many?  1? 2? or 3?.  I love result I get from umbera and soft box. 

Thank you for your help in advance. 

David :-)

This all depends on what your budget.  Do you want low grade, medium grade or high grade strobes?

Warren Leimbach wrote:
Tell us more about what you want to shoot.  Parties?  Basketball?  Ants?  Portraits of remote villagers? 

That will help us give you better answers.

The answer to those questions--and some others (common aperture and ISO speed used) are sufficiently important that most any answer which doesn't include a reference to them should be taken with a pound of salt.

FWIW, the specific thread lll probably meant was his lll's Best Camera Monitor LCD Lighting Power List one.

A decent source of other questions needing to be answered are also included in my Photo.net article: Studio Lighting - making the equipment decision.

Sandy Ramirez wrote:
If you are serious  Profoto or Dynalites.

Or Speedotron, or Balcar, or Elinchrom, or Norman, or Comet, or ...

Kevin Connery wrote:

Or Speedotron, or Balcar, or Elinchrom, or Norman, or Comet, or ...

You forgot Broncolor

Kevin Connery wrote:
Or Speedotron, or Balcar, or Elinchrom, or Norman, or Comet, or ...

Sandy Ramirez wrote:
You forgot Broncolor

Nah. That's the second . in the ...

Paramour Productions wrote:
I don't blame the new people, I blame a poor education system which has moved away from teaching people how to learn and instead simply teach them to regurgitate "information"...

I'm not sure that's the reason, but the results match.

When I started looking some years back, I was careful to ask "what questions do I need to consider when buying studio lighting", and the two most common answers were "Buy White Lightning" and "Buy Photogenic". No reasons, no questions about what/how I shot: just brand names.

Paramour Productions wrote:
Or Broncolor or Hensel...

The reason we post research options instead of sounbites is because 1) most of these broad questions cannot be answered simply in a few paragraphs and 2) at least two thirds of the answers given on these forums are complete bullshit, delivered by someone with limited knowledge who will then argue with you for six pages about how, for example in this case, Alien Bees are just as good as Profoto.

I don't blame the new people, I blame a poor education system which has moved away from teaching people how to learn and instead simply teach them to regurgitate "information"...

Ok In the interest of helping out better...

Why say Profoto, Dynalite, Broncolor, Hensel, et al over say anything made by Paul C Buff (Alien Bees, White Lightings, monoblocks in general).

Pack systems are inherently easier and far more flexible. They usually are modular and can be adapted to fit nearly any situation. Say you have a Octabank on a Alien Bee on a super boom seven feet up. Say you need to change a power setting. It is a hell of a lot easier to walk up to a pack and change the power than say finding a ladder to climb up to change the power. Hell in the case of Profoto D4's you can change the power from your computer (the D4's software allows control of packs via USB - as many as you can daisy chain together).

Packs in truth are not as expensive as they sound. A used Dynalite Kit with two heads may run you about what a new AB kit would cost. Most pack kits are also far more durable, and can take a hell of a lot of punishment. Finally power and accesories - you won't find a monoblock that outputs 4800ws.

If you are going into this for a career, consider a pack system an investment, much like your lenses. They'll last you longer, and they are worth it.

Sandy Ramirez wrote:
Pack systems are inherently easier and far more flexible.

Arguable, and based on the specific pack. If you'll only be using one head per pack, you'll save money in almost every case using a monolight. If your pack only supports symmetrical output, multiple heads will be less easily controlled. If it supports assymetry but only on a block by block basis, you may need to juggle sockets to obtain the right mix.

For a very few packs--such as Profoto's D4 ($5500 for 1200 watt-seconds, without heads) or Elinchrom's Digital RX ($2200 for 1500 watt-seconds, without heads) none of the above apply.

Sandy Ramirez wrote:
They usually are modular and can be adapted to fit nearly any situation. Say you have a Octabank on a Alien Bee on a super boom seven feet up. Say you need to change a power setting. It is a hell of a lot easier to walk up to a pack and change the power than say finding a ladder to climb up to change the power. Hell in the case of Profoto D4's you can change the power from your computer (the D4's software allows control of packs via USB - as many as you can daisy chain together).

Packs in truth are not as expensive as they sound. A used Dynalite Kit with two heads may run you about what a new AB kit would cost. Most pack kits are also far more durable, and can take a hell of a lot of punishment. Finally power and accesories - you won't find a monoblock that outputs 4800ws.

If you are going into this for a career, consider a pack system an investment, much like your lenses. They'll last you longer, and they are worth it.

Without knowing how and what the photographer will be doing, answering is nearly as pointless as making blanket claims about pack systems which aren't "typical" features for most such systems, and implying things about monolights that have the same failing. Yes, some monolights will die early and/or not hold up to heavy use; others are quite robust. (I dropped my 8 lb Speedotron Force 10 on the floor from a 5-6' height, and the bulb didn't break; it still works fine. (Modeling light didn't survive, though.) Nor do most starting photographers-of-people need 4000+ watt-seconds in a single head.

Given enough time, money, and required flexibility, a mix of pack+head setups and monolights is usually more effective than solely pack or solely monolights--but not always. Prior to that point, some will be best served with monolights first, and others with pack setups first.

Derek Ridgers wrote:

lll wrote:
Discussed to death.  Try this list, I just re-bumped it.

- lll's Ring Flash Light Compact CF Raw List

And then use the Search Function, please.

See, this is what I don't understand about these forums.  A new guy will come on here and always, if the question is a common one, almost immediately someone will write "do a search!"

Towards someone who is an admitted beginner this is slightly rude, don't you think?




I clicked on your link, and much of it is not relevant to the question asked and also out of date. Most of it may just confuse a beginner.

And you know, almost all the questions on here have been asked before, so why bother having a forum?  No one forces you to click on these questions, do they?

Maybe people come on here and ask these questions because they want real time, contemporaneous advice from people who can look at their port and give them suggestions which are more likely to be targetted towards their precise needs?

IMHO in photography you can only learn so much from books or the internet before needing some real, human to human interaction.  This forum could be the next best thing.

Kevin Connery wrote:

Sandy Ramirez wrote:
Pack systems are inherently easier and far more flexible.

Arguable, and based on the specific pack. If you'll only be using one head per pack, you'll save money in almost every case using a monolight. If your pack only supports symmetrical output, multiple heads will be less easily controlled. If it supports assymetry but only on a block by block basis, you may need to juggle sockets to obtain the right mix.

For a very few packs--such as Profoto's D4 ($5500 for 1200 watt-seconds, without heads) or Elinchrom's Digital RX ($2200 for 1500 watt-seconds, without heads) none of the above apply.


Without knowing how and what the photographer will be doing, answering is nearly as pointless as making blanket claims about pack systems which aren't "typical" features for most such systems, and implying things about monolights that have the same failing. Yes, some monolights will die early and/or not hold up to heavy use; others are quite robust. (I dropped my 8 lb Speedotron Force 10 on the floor from a 5-6' height, and the bulb didn't break; it still works fine. (Modeling light didn't survive, though.) Nor do most starting photographers-of-people need 4000+ watt-seconds in a single head.

Given enough time, money, and required flexibility, a mix of pack+head setups and monolights is usually more effective than solely pack or solely monolights--but not always. Prior to that point, some will be best served with monolights first, and others with pack setups first.

Maybe it's just me - but I have yet to see a pack system that doesn't support asymetrical output, with the exception of the new Profoto Acute battery powered unit.

Most folks I know (and this may just be us folks here in NYC - not Lala land) usually do two heads per pack unless we are using Bi-tubes, then it's two packs per head.

A Speedo or Broncolor Mini-Pulsos is a far different (and far more expensive) animal to said Alien Bee's. They are designed like packs - Alien Bee's aren't.

The point is in the end the pack is a better option. I have never seen a monoblock in any Rental studio here in NYC on the equipment list. Guess we folks in NYC are just not getting it.

David Poata wrote:
Check out, 'Jeremy Du Brul's' very informative Blog, ADVICE ON PURCHASING FLASH EQUIPMENT

Interesting that he forgot to mention the one American company with 60% of the US market.

Paul C. Buff also known as www.Alienbees.com and www.White-lightning.com.

'Eyes Of Truelove" wrote:
Dynalite suits me fine until the bucks start rolling in

Outside of renting the occasional Profoto unit for a ringlight or the zoom spot, My Dynalights have been my mainstay