Photographer

Dudley Watson

Posts: 1737

Roseburg, Oregon, US

I use PS Elements 4 for my editing purposes.  I may switch to Paint Shop Pro X2 in the future.

It's been said that 80% of what can be accomplished in PS, may be achieved in PSE.

Comments?

May 21 09 06:09 pm Link

Retoucher

Kevin_Connery

Posts: 3307

Fullerton, California, US

Dudley Watson wrote:
I use PS Elements 4 for my editing purposes.  I may switch to Paint Shop Pro X2 in the future.

It's been said that 80% of what can be accomplished in PS, may be achieved in PSE.

90% (or more!) of what many people need can easily be done in Photoshop Elements. That's not the same as having all the tools needed, though.

For just one example, if you need to do a CMYK conversion to deliver a press-ready file, it wouldn't matter if that's in the 1%, 10%, or 50% that's missing: you need it--and it's not in Photoshop Elements.

The full version of Photoshop supports a lot of things Elements doesn't, but if your style doesn't need those tools, you won't miss them at all.

So it really comes down to the specific things you need. Supporting 99.9% but missing one critical thing is no good, while supporting only 20%, but having everything you need would be just fine.

General limitations of Elements 6 vs Photoshop CS3/4 (I'm not sure what was added to PSE between v4 and v6, though, and you might have even more limits.)

Limited automation: no recording of Actions; no Scripts. (You can RUN some existing Actions via workarounds, but you can't record your own. Since I typically record a half-dozen temp ones every week...)

No CMYK. Limits masking and extremely hinders--almost eliminates--the ability to properly prepare files for press.

No LAB. Limits masking, makes some color correction very difficult, makes some color changes very difficult, makes some kinds of retouching more difficult.

No direct access to the underlying channels. This is a huge limitation for compositing and color correction.

No tool presets for quick access to commonly used settings.

Limited options on colorspaces. For typical use, that's not critical, as the major ones are supported. For some kinds of fine-tuning, it's a non-trivial limitation.

Limited Adjustment Layers.

No Calculations or Apply Image.

Layer masking is unavailable except via kludging.

No access to 16-bit mode. That's a substantial limitation for black-and-white.

No pen tool; limited vector capabilities. Not critical for some forms of photography; very important if doing graphics.

No Smart Objects/Smart Layers/Smart Filters.

No Vanishing Point. (Perspective cloning/pasting)

Limited HDR support.

A bunch of other things which probably don't matter to most photograph
The first four (bolded items) are enough to eliminate Elements for me as a production tool, and three of them been present since at least version 2--I think they were there in v1, but I'm not sure; I didn't use PS much until v2--other products were more powerful, and I mostly just used PS for conversions and calculations. Actions came later, in v4.

For a LOT of photographic work, Elements is absolutely fine; it's surprisingly powerful. But the limits are reached much sooner, and many relatively simple tasks in Photoshop are either impossible or very time-consuming in Elements. Depending on my clients, I often suggest they  use Elements and see if they run into problems. (Not any photographer who has to deliver CMYK files, though!)

May 21 09 06:21 pm Link

Photographer

RNokes collection

Posts: 1304

Denver, Colorado, US

I would take a look at lightroom.. I just had a class with Scott Kelby on the new lightroom and he doesn't use Photoshop for anything but working in multi layers..all the editing you can do in CS4 can be done in lightroom but easier and faster.. worth looking at...

May 21 09 06:35 pm Link

Model

Cadence Rose

Posts: 2689

Greenfield, Massachusetts, US

Dudley Watson wrote:
I use PS Elements 4 for my editing purposes.  I may switch to Paint Shop Pro X2 in the future.

It's been said that 80% of what can be accomplished in PS, may be achieved in PSE.

Comments?

It MAY be achieved, but it's also 80% harder and more time-consuming to achieve it. lol

May 21 09 08:26 pm Link

Photographer

MisterC

Posts: 15162

Portland, Oregon, US

But how important is that other 20%?

Would you like to produce work at 80% of the current quality you're achieving?

How would you like to make 80% of your current income?

May 21 09 08:27 pm Link

Photographer

Dudley Watson

Posts: 1737

Roseburg, Oregon, US

Thanks folks for the input.  I forgot about Lightroom, and will look into this option soon.

May 21 09 08:56 pm Link

Photographer

Eros Studios

Posts: 690

Boston, Massachusetts, US

Bottom line...
Paint Shop and PS Elements are decent little programs but they're not for professional work.

Buck it up and get Lightroom 2 and Photoshop CS4 and make them both part of your workflow... in the end that's what will get you the best work.  The initial cost of the full versions is a bit of a hit on the wallet but after that the costs of upgrades isn't bad.

May 22 09 05:29 am Link

Photographer

Fotographia Fantastique

Posts: 17339

White River Junction, Vermont, US

Kevin_Connery wrote:
No CMYK
No direct access to the underlying channels
Layer masking is unavailable
No pen tool

Seriously?

You'd be better off buying an older discounted version of CS than a brand new version of Elements. Especially if you plan to do any graphic design.

May 22 09 05:41 am Link

Photographer

Fotographia Fantastique

Posts: 17339

White River Junction, Vermont, US

Double post.
MM hiccup.

May 22 09 05:41 am Link

Photographer

R A V E N D R I V E

Posts: 15867

New York, New York, US

RNokes collection wrote:
I would take a look at lightroom.. I just had a class with Scott Kelby on the new lightroom and he doesn't use Photoshop for anything but working in multi layers..all the editing you can do in CS4 can be done in lightroom but easier and faster.. worth looking at...

I LOVE lightroom. MOST of the editing can be done in lightroom in a much simpler way, yes. But not all, masking for instance IS A BITCH in lightroom, just make sure you keep Photoshop in your workflow, you can temporarily take an image out of lightroom, edit it in photoshop and the correctiosn will appear stacked in Lightroom smile

May 22 09 08:28 am Link