Thomasio wrote:
Has anyone used a voltage inverter to power strobes outside, using a car battery?

I have two 500 w/s strobe heads to power... I own a voltage inverter that converts DC to AC, but I'm not sure how long it will take to power up the strobe heads.

Has anyone done this? Was the cycle time usable?

Thanks,

~T~

Well, there's two issues to consider.   One is making sure your AC inverter has enough capacity to handle your strobes.  The next is whether the inverter is a "pure sine" inverter, which delivers a nice curve of power, unlike regular inverters which deliver a "modified sine wave" of power.

At a *minimum*, you'd need a 1000 watt surge/peak capable converter.  That's around $300 for a pure sine model.  I would suggest something with a higher peak though, like 1000 continuous, 2000 peak, pure sine--about $450.

If you're willing to risk a modified sine wave, a 900 watt continuous, 1800 peak, modified sine converter is about $90.

A car battery would be your best bet for remote power, although you could get by with a multi-amp-hour sealed lead acid battery.

Mr. Anthony

Thomasio wrote:
Is "pure sine" marketing hype, or is there a real danger of damage with the non-"pure sine" V.I.?

My strobe heads are quite pricey, I'd hate to junk them but I know, all too well, the power of baseless marketing claims...

T.

Some electronic equipment requires pure sine wave inverters (which are actually cleaner than what you get off your home line!).  I think that's what Alien Bees use in their Vagabond portable power system.  http://www.alienbees.com/battery.html

It's not hype at all--there's a real difference in what's delivered, and some gear is sensitive.  But many of us power laptop computers off modified sine inverters in cars and cigarette lighters...you'd think they'd be *more* sensitive than a monolight.  But I'm less willing to take a risk...

So, for me, I use a pure sine model.  But I think the bigger worry is how much your flashes are going to draw at the instant of flash and recharging.  That's why capacity of the inverter is going to be important.  I know someone else who shoot far more than I do with an inverter system, so I'll ask him if he uses pure sine or not and what inverter size.

Mr. Anthony

Brandon Ching wrote:
I've heard that many strobes rely on timing the power of the draw to know when it's full. The pure sine wave is constant. A modified or step pattern sine wave is interrupted and throws off the clock cycles of the strobe, drawing more power to the flux capicator and sending you back in time to November 5, 1955 with the risk of disintegration.

ROTFLMAO!!! Thank you Brandon, I almost choked on my coffee...

To the OP, if you have anything other than "disposable" strobes it's not worth the risk to feed them bad power - they are not designed for it, and don't have protection built-in for it. Kinda like feeding your kids meat that's been out on the counter at room temp for a few days. May be okay, but certainly runs the risk of causing serious damage (or death).

OK, not a GREAT analogy, but the only one I could come up with when I'm on my first cup of coffee...

Thomasio wrote:
That Vagabond seems like the way to go.

Argh... does the draw on the bank account *ever* get easier w/ photography?

T.

The vagabond 150 and 300 systems include a battery too.  If you want to save some bucks, just buy two vagabond 150 inverters.

Or get yourself a pure sine inverter...read the description of what's included here:
http://www.alienbees.com/vagabond.html?item=V150 and decide whether you could just get a pure sine inverter directly and more cheaply.

Mr. Anthony

dfstudios wrote:
Even just a 400ws Speedotron and an inverter blows out the fuses on my car. (Yes I tried it). Vagabond from AlienBees gets my vote.

Huh?  Are you running it through the cigarette lighter?  The inverter I use clamps directly to the battery and bypasses the car's electrical system altogether.

Mr. Anthony

Huh?  Are you running it through the cigarette lighter?

Yeaah, I thought I should get a fuse in there somewhere to protect the power supply. Popped those fuses really well.

Mr Anthony wrote:
Huh?  Are you running it through the cigarette lighter?

dfstudios wrote:
Yeaah, I thought I should get a fuse in there somewhere to protect the power supply. Popped those fuses really well.

Your inverter should have a fuse already.  I don't think the fuse to the lighter was designed to handle the kind of draw a monolight/large inverter will pull.


Mr. Anthony

Mr Anthony wrote:
Your inverter should have a fuse already.  I don't think the fuse to the lighter was designed to handle the kind of draw a monolight/large inverter will pull.

After frying my Nissan electrical system I checked into it further to see what kind of "protection" would be needed. My smallest PS is the 400WS Speedotron. It has low power consumption for steady and model lights but there is a brief 20amp draw at the start of the recycle. On 115-120 volt house current the slow blow circuit breakers handle the transient even on 15 amp breaker. Due to Ohm's law or something like that, when I dropped down to the 12 volt that comes from the battery I would need to increase the fuse to 200amp just to handle the PS transient with a 100% efficient inverter.

Thomasio wrote:
Is "pure sine" marketing hype, or is there a real danger of damage with the non-"pure sine" V.I.?

Real.

I wouldn't recommend a non-sinewave inverter for any newer electronics, especially the newer strobe units. Old-style Speedos and Normans don't seem to mind, but all of the newer designs
do some tricky stuff inside, and are far less tolerant of squarewave input.

Frankly, if I had to do it over, I'd probably go for a Honda EU1000 or EU2000 generator. It's pretty quiet, and has a much longer runtime than a battery unit would (8 hours of as many shots as you want)--as well as working with my newer packs and monolights, not just the old packs.

Dave Mullins wrote:
Here is another option for portable power for strobes:

http://www.innovatronix.com/cgi-bin/pro … /index.asp

I am looking to get two of them in the near future when I get paid for a full page ad pix I did a few months ago.

Malodave

I think this will be the best choice for me because it's made for photographers. This reminds me of the Visatec strobes with the battery pack/charger that comes with the kit. I used it..I wonder if I can find something local that's similar instead of a generator.

Dave Mullins wrote:
Here is another option for portable power for strobes:

http://www.innovatronix.com/cgi-bin/pro … /index.asp

I am looking to get two of them in the near future when I get paid for a full page ad pix I did a few months ago.

Malodave

This looks to be the perfect unit,For the non make it yourself photographer..

Price is very resonable for a pure sine wave inverter..Pure sine is a must!!!

(:------

Hj

First Shot Studios wrote:
I'm somewhat in the process of building a Vagabond on steriods based on something like a pair of deep cycle Optima batteries and a Tripp Lite 3000W sine wave inverter.  I am looking ot power my 3000W/s pack in the middle of nowhere without running the genset.  We'll see how that works out.

In the meantime, I'm quite happy running my Honda EU series genset for this purpose, but even as quiet as it is I hate listening to it and smelling exhaust, not to mention dragging it around (though I'm not sure my hopped up vagabond is going to be much lighter).

Patrick

It will work Great!!

(:--------

Hj

global vision wrote:
amazing how many engineers know everything about clipped curves on here isnt it.....ugh......i have used a clipped sine wave inverter multiple times without problems...if your strobes are computer controlled they may run into problems....i use a calumet and novatron..the novatron works fine with a 1000 watt continuous  (1500 peak) inverter...the calumet tends to have problems with tripping itself sometimes....you can pick up a small honda generator with 800watt continuous for about $400...its small and quiet....
good luck.......the cheaper alternative is a really LONGGGG extension cord

All well and good, but I've heard you (me) need a permit to run the generator in public.

Thomasio wrote:
Has anyone used a voltage inverter to power strobes outside, using a car battery?

I have two 500 w/s strobe heads to power... I own a voltage inverter that converts DC to AC, but I'm not sure how long it will take to power up the strobe heads.

Has anyone done this? Was the cycle time usable?

Thanks,

~T~

Thanks for fielding that question .... One inexpensive solution to proratble is the Norman Ac/Dc unit. Check out B&H. Depending on how much juice you want/ need it seems like a viable solution for a short or at least well planned shoot.

Thomasio wrote:
Is "pure sine" marketing hype, or is there a real danger of damage with the non-"pure sine" V.I.?

My strobe heads are quite pricey, I'd hate to junk them but I know, all too well, the power of baseless marketing claims...

T.

My day job is as an electronic engineer.  "Pure sine" is not hype.  If your strobes can't take the square or triangle wave from a cheaper inverter, you will end up with a very expensive repair bill.  Should you dammage the strobes,  I could fix them for you, but I'd have to charge you extra cause you've been warned!

Mr Anthony wrote:

Some electronic equipment requires pure sine wave inverters (which are actually cleaner than what you get off your home line!).  I think that's what Alien Bees use in their Vagabond portable power system.  http://www.alienbees.com/battery.html

It's not hype at all--there's a real difference in what's delivered, and some gear is sensitive.  But many of us power laptop computers off modified sine inverters in cars and cigarette lighters...you'd think they'd be *more* sensitive than a monolight.  But I'm less willing to take a risk...

So, for me, I use a pure sine model.  But I think the bigger worry is how much your flashes are going to draw at the instant of flash and recharging.  That's why capacity of the inverter is going to be important.  I know someone else who shoot far more than I do with an inverter system, so I'll ask him if he uses pure sine or not and what inverter size.

Mr. Anthony

Computer power supplies are extremely well protected devices and can run on just about kind of signal of the proper voltage range.  Strobes however, aren't meant for the hands of idiots, and are made to a lesser standard.

Dave Mullins wrote:
Here is another option for portable power for strobes:

http://www.innovatronix.com/cgi-bin/pro … /index.asp

I am looking to get two of them in the near future when I get paid for a full page ad pix I did a few months ago.

Malodave

Been researching these - they lo0ok good and there is a review of them on Rob Galbraith site of them too. Other guys on the web are also quite happy with 'em.

I mean at $249..................

their recycle times wasnt bad unless you Speedy Gonzales that like ripping a gig card in 10 secs............