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Forums > Digital Art and Retouching > Finding a retoucher on MM to collaborate with? Search   Reply
12last
Photographer
Jakov Markovic
Posts: 1,126
Belgrade, Central Serbia, Serbia


I've been going trough the website, searching for retouchers that are within my price range, yet which do a good job.

Now, I do understand that everyone has their own style, method ,artistic preference... etc... but 95% percent of the people here that present themselves under the "retoucher" label are clueless!

I've contacted a few retouchers, some of whom I think do a good job, and some of whom I think do a great job, but their prices are way out of my league.

It's not that I can't cope with the work I'm getting at the moment, but I would love to be able to focus more on photography, rather than retouching.

So, any advice? Any recommendations?
Mar 13 13 11:18 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
AB Studios
Posts: 14
Salina, Kansas, US


Mar 13 13 11:31 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jakov Markovic
Posts: 1,126
Belgrade, Central Serbia, Serbia


AB Studios wrote:
http://www.modelmayhem.com/1711210

This is what I am talking about, clicking 3 times with a healing brush doesn't make you a retoucher.

Mar 13 13 11:35 am  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Natalya Belaya
Posts: 339
Donetsk, Donetsk, Ukraine


Ready to cooperate! Take a look at my port!
http://www.modelmayhem.com/2766236
Mar 13 13 11:37 am  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Kristiana-Retouch
Posts: 289
London, England, United Kingdom


To get some help maybe you should give us a clue what is in your price range smile
Mar 13 13 11:39 am  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
TLretouching
Posts: 94
London, England, United Kingdom


Jakov Markovic wrote:

This is what I am talking about, clicking 3 times with a healing brush doesn't make you a retoucher.

Doesn't look like only healing brush use to me...

Mar 13 13 11:40 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jakov Markovic
Posts: 1,126
Belgrade, Central Serbia, Serbia


Natali-retoucher wrote:
Ready to cooperate! Take a look at my port!
http://www.modelmayhem.com/2766236

Your work is fine, it's not mind-blowing, but you don't destroy an image, and that is always a plus.

Maybe I should put up my own before/afters to just give a perspective of what I'm looking for.

Mar 13 13 11:43 am  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Avilio
Posts: 56
Tegucigalpa, Distrito Central, Honduras


Christiana1990 wrote:
To get some help maybe you should give us a clue what is in your price range smile

+1

Mar 13 13 11:45 am  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
alberta86
Posts: 64
Orlando, Florida, US


My advice for you is to post a challenge using 1 image in this forum
http://www.modelmayhem.com/t.php?forum_id=76

Let the retouchers know that you are looking for someone to collaborate with and hire from time to time.  That should get you a good response than the typical feeling of "doing free work".

If you don't find someone in the first challenge, post a second challenge and so forth until you find the retoucher you are looking for.  I believe that's what the forum is supposed to be for anyways.

For me retouching is a journey.  I learn something new with each image I work on.  With that said,  I still feel "clueless," especially with the image I'm working on now :-).

I'm sure you'll find someone if you post some challenges.  Good luck!
Mar 13 13 11:52 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jakov Markovic
Posts: 1,126
Belgrade, Central Serbia, Serbia


OK, here it is what I do. I would pay from TFP to 20$ an image.

But I really can't do anything with someone who blurs the whole thing.

It's just basic clean up, there isn't anything more to it.

http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/1279/23961562.jpg

http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/7979/84533346.jpg

http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/7421/27998552.jpg

[img=http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/9666/70732619.jpg][/img]

http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/1008/75948166.jpg
Mar 13 13 12:24 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jakov Markovic
Posts: 1,126
Belgrade, Central Serbia, Serbia


alberta86 wrote:
My advice for you is to post a challenge using 1 image in this forum
http://www.modelmayhem.com/t.php?forum_id=76

Let the retouchers know that you are looking for someone to collaborate with and hire from time to time.  That should get you a good response than the typical feeling of "doing free work".

If you don't find someone in the first challenge, post a second challenge and so forth until you find the retoucher you are looking for.  I believe that's what the forum is supposed to be for anyways.

For me retouching is a journey.  I learn something new with each image I work on.  With that said,  I still feel "clueless," especially with the image I'm working on now :-).

I'm sure you'll find someone if you post some challenges.  Good luck!

Honestly, I will post some RAWs, just because I think it's a fair thing to help out the community, but at the same time, I've just gone trough a couple of threads, and retouching done by most is just plain ignorant.

I mean how can anyone possibly think a photographer, make up artist, or model could benefit from such senseless degradation of their work.

Mar 13 13 12:35 pm  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Alejandro Crespo
Posts: 111
Santa Cruz, Santa Cruz, Bolivia


If you have a set price range that you can afford, you should mention that to the retouchers you contact with, in addition to what are you looking for and what are the benefits that the person could get from you (future cooperation, etc) . IMHO.

I think its the same that with photography, its always easier to get an agreement with a client that give the info about their available budget for the project/shoot and not only asks:"Ehm, I like your work, I would like to cooperate with you, how much do you charge?", you can ask instead " I like your work, could you give me your pricing for X kind of photography with Y usage (online, magazine, bigboard,etc). My budget is somewhere around N$/picture and would like to know if we can work something around that. I have N pics that need retouching".

I really dont understand why people is so afraid to give away info that they cannot afford something. I had people contacting me with the same requests and they just arent capable of negotiate something.

You never know what a retoucher has in mind and the prices are usually negotiable (however, take in count that everyone is doing this for business, they have their expenses, a rock bottom price that cannot be negotiated) , maybe the kind of retouching you need can be done with a combination of manual and auto retouching with a good level of end results and the time involved for the retoucher will not be much and there is a N number of pics that you gonna need, so overall the retoucher can made the same 200$ within the same X hours of work with 1 pic or in N pics that meet your needs, so he can put down a little bit his prices for your individual case, of course if you need a picture for a bigboard the retoucher will spend a LOT of time on your image, and the cost involved on that will derivate from that.

Every retoucher have his hourly cost of doing business, if he retouches 0.2 pictures or 10 in that time its the same income, thats the bottom line, if you take in count only the $. However, there comes the personal aspects of every person, if they like retouching that, if they have other projects and would prefer to give them the time, etc, etc.

But dont expect that someone gonna retouch you a pic with an exceptional quality for some pennies if your picture isnt so awesome, that they just need it for their portfolio.

Better quality - Fast delivery - Lower price. Choose two.
Mar 13 13 01:39 pm  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
TrueCasey
Posts: 33
Minneapolis, Minnesota, US


(Please ignore my MM portfolio, it has not been updated recently)

I've been working very hard recently to increase my skill in retouch and not create formulaic plastics. My latest is here:

NCS Retouch - Progression

It's an image I retouched but placed in a Flash SWF so that you can see the picture's progression. The main emphasis was on remolding the nose (per the photographer's request).

I may not be the best, but I am a very fast learner and (since I am still in the learning phase) willing to work for a low rate. If you are willing to have a bit of patience and advise me on any mistakes, I think that we could do some great work together!
Mar 13 13 01:56 pm  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Sfumato Studios
Posts: 21
New York, New York, US


Jakov Markovic wrote:
Now, I do understand that everyone has their own style, method ,artistic preference... etc... but 95% percent of the people here that present themselves under the "retoucher" label are clueless!

Can't argue with that. The main problem I see on MM is that retouchers know all these powerful techniques (carving, split frequency, IHP) but completely overkill the image.

I've contacted a few retouchers, some of whom I think do a good job, and some of whom I think do a great job, but their prices are way out of my league.

It's the law of supply and demand. Those pricy retouchers already "get it". The vast majority don't. I suggest finding an affordable retoucher who may not be perfect yet, but you can see they have potential, passion and technical skill.

What they really need is a mentor to guide them on what is a professional level image. In the long run, it will be a mutually beneficial relationship.

Mar 13 13 02:22 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jakov Markovic
Posts: 1,126
Belgrade, Central Serbia, Serbia


Sfumato Studios wrote:

Jakov Markovic wrote:
Now, I do understand that everyone has their own style, method ,artistic preference... etc... but 95% percent of the people here that present themselves under the "retoucher" label are clueless!

Can't argue with that. The main problem I see on MM is that retouchers know all these powerful techniques (carving, split frequency, IHP) but completely overkill the image.


It's the law of supply and demand. Those pricy retouchers already "get it". The vast majority don't. I suggest finding an affordable retoucher who may not be perfect yet, but you can see they have potential, passion and technical skill.

What they really need is a mentor to guide them on what is a professional level image. In the long run, it will be a mutually beneficial relationship.

This is exactly the kind of person that I'm looking for. One that has covered the basis, and wants  to do something exciting.

Mar 13 13 03:31 pm  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
MicheleCheeseman
Posts: 301
Redding, California, US


I agree with the above posters that say you should put up a challenge (or test) to see what some retouchers can do for you.... I love playing on other people's images big_smile
Mar 13 13 03:54 pm  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
alberta86
Posts: 64
Orlando, Florida, US


Jakov Markovic wrote:

Honestly, I will post some RAWs, just because I think it's a fair thing to help out the community, but at the same time, I've just gone trough a couple of threads, and retouching done by most is just plain ignorant.

I mean how can anyone possibly think a photographer, make up artist, or model could benefit from such senseless degradation of their work.

There's an easy way around that.  Look at the retoucher's portfolio before you give them the RAW file.  Your contest, your rules.

Mar 13 13 04:56 pm  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Avilio
Posts: 56
Tegucigalpa, Distrito Central, Honduras


alberta86 wrote:
There's an easy way around that.  Look at the retoucher's portfolio before you give them the RAW file.  Your contest, your rules.

+1

Mar 13 13 05:57 pm  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Natalia_Taffarel
Posts: 7,665
Buenos Aires, Buenos Aires, Argentina


honestly... with your attitude I wouldn't work with you for all the money in the world smile
Mar 13 13 06:00 pm  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Paul Snyder
Posts: 89
Columbus, Ohio, US


Natalia_Taffarel wrote:
honestly... with your attitude I wouldn't work with you for all the money in the world smile

+1

Mar 13 13 07:12 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Marin Photography NYC
Posts: 7,194
New York, New York, US


Jakov Markovic wrote:

Honestly, I will post some RAWs, just because I think it's a fair thing to help out the community, but at the same time, I've just gone trough a couple of threads, and retouching done by most is just plain ignorant.

I mean how can anyone possibly think a photographer, make up artist, or model could benefit from such senseless degradation of their work.

My advice is if you want or need, try not insulting the very people you are trying to recruit.? You can catch more bees with honey than vinegar.....Just saying...You are frustrated ok, take it down to a less offensive tone maybe?

Mar 13 13 07:26 pm  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Chase Retouching
Posts: 39
Kansas City, Missouri, US


Natalia_Taffarel wrote:
honestly... with your attitude I wouldn't work with you for all the money in the world smile

Yeah, that was my feeling as well, even if I'm not at your level of talent (hey, retouching isn't where I make my money lol). I get your points, and I don't disagree with a lot of them, but the way you express it doesn't give me any motivation to work for you at all. It comes off incredibly elitist, so if you think you're that much better than so many of us you should stick to doing it yourself.

The skilled retouchers that you seem to be looking for have a lot of skill that took time and effort to develop, so try expressing an appreciation for that in a positive way. People at the top of any field are always in high demand, so they get to pick and choose who they work for. Remember that.

Mar 13 13 07:46 pm  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
MP_DigitalStudio1
Posts: 1,041
San Francisco, California, US


popcorn
Mar 13 13 07:52 pm  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Elise Iglio
Posts: 30
Richmond, Virginia, US


Chase Retouching wrote:

Yeah, that was my feeling as well, even if I'm not at your level of talent (hey, retouching isn't where I make my money lol). I get your points, and I don't disagree with a lot of them, but the way you express it doesn't give me any motivation to work for you at all. It comes off incredibly elitist, so if you think you're that much better than so many of us you should stick to doing it yourself.

The skilled retouchers that you seem to be looking for have a lot of skill that took time and effort to develop, so try expressing an appreciation for that in a positive way. People at the top of any field are always in high demand, so they get to pick and choose who they work for. Remember that.

+1

Mar 13 13 08:11 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Star
Posts: 17,939
Los Angeles, California, US


Computers, software, etc... are not cheap. You should be budgetting about 50-100 an hour for a mid level retoucher, stop thinking of retouching as a by the image thing. Not many good retouchers will touch a by the image quote, because you could straddle someone with 3 hours work for $20.

3 hours retouching a major breakout on the day of the shoot (all the flowers, the wreath etc... are actually already in the shot) But the skin was impossible to retouch, and it took hours to get it right. layering texture back on top, etc... Not very much good skin to pull from. Then there was the adding light reflections to the stones and placing in the stars.

http://photos.modelmayhem.com/photos/100325/16/4babebae7826d.jpg

this image is retouching free, just a bit of time in lightroom

http://photos.modelmayhem.com/photos/120329/17/4f750087c6e48.jpg

6 hours of retouching, this was a test shot chosen by the publication so everything had to be moved into the exact correct place, and they wanted Alison to be very, very thin, so lots of time using the transform tool

http://photos.modelmayhem.com/photos/110501/23/4dbe51517b6ad.jpg

30 minutes retouching- skin issues

http://photos.modelmayhem.com/photos/120113/00/4f0fe843952f7.jpg

no retouching, even the lens spots are still there
http://photos.modelmayhem.com/photos/110821/10/4e514486812d3.jpg


As you can see if i was charging by the image I could be very screwed, but also a client could get screwed. Better to charge by the hour, then you get exactly what you pay for.
Mar 13 13 08:28 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jakov Markovic
Posts: 1,126
Belgrade, Central Serbia, Serbia


Natalia_Taffarel wrote:
honestly... with your attitude I wouldn't work with you for all the money in the world smile

Hah, you really put me in my place.

I understand that there is a difference in quality, but at the same time I can't believe how people who abuse high pass and have no color sense at all go ahead and charge so and so for an hour of their time.

I just can't get my head around them getting any work.

I would have to rack up my prices if I were living in America or Japan, as the living cost is higher, but many of the mid-level retouchers charge that price even tough they live in much more affordable living environment.

I'm not looking for a top-notch painter/artist (I would go for Carrie, Natalia, Patrik, or even an agency like Impact Digital any day), I'm just looking for someone to tidy-up most of my images, but also be creative, nothing more than what I'm doing my self.

Mar 14 13 12:55 am  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Zorka
Posts: 193
Belgrade, Central Serbia, Serbia


Sometimes what we are looking for is much closer then we think... smile
Mar 14 13 04:34 am  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Alejandro Crespo
Posts: 111
Santa Cruz, Santa Cruz, Bolivia


Zorka wrote:
Sometimes what we are looking for is much closer then we think... smile

lol

Mar 14 13 05:06 am  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
ST Retouch
Posts: 328
Zurich, Zurich, Switzerland


Zorka wrote:
Sometimes what we are looking for is much closer then we think... smile

+1 smile
Exactly like this.
It is the same  in real life.
We are looking  for love everywhere, and at the end after years and years  we realize that our love lives in our neighborhood smile
Sometimes it's more than enough to take a look in the neighborhood to find your love.
And to pray that she/he wants us to be next to her/him at the end.

Mar 14 13 05:31 am  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Kristiana-Retouch
Posts: 289
London, England, United Kingdom


Jakov Markovic wrote:
many of the mid-level retouchers charge that price even tough they live in much more affordable living environment.

Actually a lot of great (and best!!) retouchers live in "affordable living environment" but they are much more talented than those who live elsewhere. Why should they sell their talent cheaper? PS costs are the same, computers and tablets as well.
Less you should care is where retoucher lives and how they spend their money wink

Mar 14 13 06:23 am  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Helene Popova
Posts: 1
Shcholkine, Krym, Ukraine


Good day
My name is Helene, im from Ukraine
Look at my portfolio, please.
If you like my work - i will cooperate with tou smile

http://www.modelmayhem.com/lamantina
Mar 14 13 06:50 am  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Alejandro Crespo
Posts: 111
Santa Cruz, Santa Cruz, Bolivia


Christiana1990 wrote:
Actually a lot of great (and best!!) retouchers live in "affordable living environment" but they are much more talented than those who live elsewhere. Why should they sell their talent cheaper? PS costs are the same, computers and tablets as well.
Less you should care is where retoucher lives and how they spend their money wink

Exactly, more affordable living environment doesnt involve the hardware (that usually is a lot more expensive than in "less affordable living environments" and one have to spend min 10k$ on that).

I would like to know TS reaction to lets say Nike/Chanel/etc wanting a shoot from him and willing to pay 400 EU (or far less than that) for a shoot just because thats what a serbian mid-range photographer charges for a session lol.

Mar 14 13 07:00 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jakov Markovic
Posts: 1,126
Belgrade, Central Serbia, Serbia


Hah, Zorka, you've been P.M.-ed.

I get what you guys are saying, but it's unrealistic for me to pay more to the retoucher than what I am charging for the shoot, and on top of that it turning out that that same retoucher doesn't do half as good a job as I would myself.

I hope my message is coming across?

I really want to do more shooting, for that to happen I need someone to replace me at the retouching station.
Mar 14 13 07:17 am  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Alejandro Crespo
Posts: 111
Santa Cruz, Santa Cruz, Bolivia


Jakov Markovic wrote:
Hah, Zorka, you've been P.M.-ed.

I get what you guys are saying, but it's unrealistic for me to pay more to the retoucher than what I am charging for the shoot, and on top of that it turning out that that same retoucher doesn't do half as good a job as I would myself.

I hope my message is coming across?

I really want to do more shooting, for that to happen I need someone to replace me at the retouching station.

Your message should be then:

"I cannot afford a good retoucher"

Not "The retouchers that I try to find in my price range are worst than me". lol

Its the same case that if a bride is complying about the photographer she contracted to cover her wedding for 1/5 market price for the pictures he made lol.

The problem is you, not the retouchers, thats whats everyone is trying to tell you.

Mar 14 13 07:29 am  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Avilio
Posts: 56
Tegucigalpa, Distrito Central, Honduras


ST Retouch wrote:
+1 smile
Exactly like this.
It is the same  in real life.
We are looking  for love everywhere, and at the end after years and years  we realize that our love lives in our neighborhood smile
Sometimes it's more than enough to take a look in the neighborhood to find your love.
And to pray that she/he wants us to be next to her/him at the end.

Somebody is in love (?) tongue

Mar 14 13 07:37 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jakov Markovic
Posts: 1,126
Belgrade, Central Serbia, Serbia


I've been retouching for 5-10 bucks an hour, and I did a very good job, maybe not artistically excellent, but I've cleaned those images pretty well.

And I find it strange that I can't find anyone who does what I do for the same price.
Mar 14 13 07:49 am  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
ST Retouch
Posts: 328
Zurich, Zurich, Switzerland


Avilio wrote:

Somebody is in love (?) tongue

Hahah I am not smile, Lol
I can not find  smile , not  even in my neighborhood not even worldwide smile
It is very difficult to find woman who is perfect in the kitchen , perfect with dodge&burn with 50% opacity layer and to be beautiful:)

Mar 14 13 07:51 am  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Alejandro Crespo
Posts: 111
Santa Cruz, Santa Cruz, Bolivia


Jakov Markovic wrote:
I've been retouching for 5-10 bucks an hour, and I did a very good job, maybe not artistically excellent, but I've cleaned those images pretty well.

And I find it strange that I can't find anyone who does what I do for the same price.

So, you come to an international place searching for retouching at YOUR individual rate? lol.

But seriously, if you charged low fees it was you problem. Why everyone should charge the same?.

Think about it, why would someone, charge 5$ per hour for a delicate work that need a lot of attention, creativity, experience, and knowledge, if he can go and serve burgers in mcdonalds for x3 than that and dont worry about the business, accounting, equipment actualization (2-3k for a normal cpu, the same amount for a good monitor(or 2), calibration hardware, a tablet, special mouse,etc) and insurance, marketing, the reputation, and the health problems involved in staring a monitor for 15hrs a day, back and circulation problems?.

People who are doing this for a living have expenses, healthcare, insurance, a family to feed at last. If you didnt count all that in your retouching price, its your personal financial problem and shorterm point of view. Not everyone has that problem.

And people who is charging that low is because they're not living of it, and mostly using as side income or hobby. Are you expecting those people to do the same retouching that someone who lives from that?. And im only talking about the mid ones, add the individual creativity there and price for a job just go beyond your sight.

Mar 14 13 08:10 am  Link  Quote 
Retoucher
Zorka
Posts: 193
Belgrade, Central Serbia, Serbia


ST Retouch wrote:
I can not find  smile , not  even in my neighborhood not even worldwide smile
It is very difficult to find woman who is perfect in the kitchen , perfect with dodge&burn with 50% opacity layer and to be beautiful:)

As I told to OP, sometimes what we are looking for is much closer then we think... big_smile

P.S. I'm not that good in the kitchen, but we can always order something to be delivered!

Mar 14 13 08:11 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jakov Markovic
Posts: 1,126
Belgrade, Central Serbia, Serbia


At 10$ an hour I had plenty of clients, but never more than I could handle working 8 hour days.

If I had more clients, I would've raised my price.

I can not explain to people that you can't work for 15$ ah hour in McDonalds in China, or Russia, or Eastern Europe, or Africa, or South America.

North America, Japan, Europe and Australia are not the whole world!!!

Maybe I should make a retouching portfolio here.
Mar 14 13 08:21 am  Link  Quote 
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