Kincaid Blackwood wrote:
This has been what I've encountered as well. Many of the local AD/CDs went to places like Portfolio Center and Creative Circus which, though they are not 4-year universities, they do educate and equip. Ad agencies respect their graduates because they know that they have what it takes. Portfolio Center in particular (the one of the two with which I'm most familiar) has a very impressive faculty in their design/art-direction dept. Their students have reasonable expectations of getting jobs at good ad agencies and not as a lackey in the mail room.

I would agree, I think there were some changes in the executive staff at CC and they are a little behind PC.  Both still very good, then you can throw in SCAD for 4 year programs or several others...

Fred Greissing wrote:
My wife worked in Milan Italy, the advertising capitol of Italy (worlds 9th economy).
Agencies were TBWA and DDB (both worldwide Madison Ave ad agency).
She had no college education. High School grad.

Well not that I disagree but I think perhaps she a bit above average Fred, not something most could expect without a degree.  Especially these days where it's practically the price for admission for any corp job.

Zack Zoll wrote:
That's a requirement at most of the 'better' schools. If you go too long without working or exhibiting, you are considered to be in breach of contract, and your ass gets fired, even if you're the chair.

It's interesting how many people get hung up on job opportunities, or what your teachers will teach in their lectures.  That's not how ANY college works.

Let's say you're a biology major. Your teachers aren't going to teach you anything that you couldn't pick up from a book, and you're not going to graduate with a job offer. What you get is the experience of having a people  help you learn, and the educational reinforcement of doing things like dissections, rather than looking at photos - all the while, with someone who(hopefully) has done all this before, and can correct your mistakes for you and explain why you're wrong and how you can do it better next time. You're paying for experience.

A photo degree is no different. I have no idea why people seem to be insisting that a photo degree that doesn't come with a job offer is a waste of money. Law degrees don't come with job offers, and they cost much more.  Ditto for music, bio, business, and pretty much anything else that doesn't include a residency.

Education is only a waste of money if you're a bad student.

Your post is just plain horribly incorrect!

1.  "Let's say you're a biology major. Your teachers aren't going to teach you anything that you couldn't pick up from a book, and you're not going to graduate with a job offer."

Hmmm... Unlike some law schools where some students are offered jobs in their Senior year (less now than back in the 80's/90's.)  Students in the bio-sciences are finding word right out of school making over $50k per annum; Even the military has biology based jobs (Officer only) requiring only undergrad degree; even as a 2nd LT, a fresh face out of school would make $45K, medical, 30 days vacation/yr., etc.; not likely for some gal with a MFA.

2.  Yes, it DOES depend on what's being taught at many schools because it has a bearing on whether or not certain students will even consider those schools.  Today students compare notes online in area particular forums, over which school is better  based on curriculum in many areas, particularly in the medical field, but also in psychology, forensics, accounting (everyone wants to get the meat and potatoes of what's covered on the CPA exam).   The bottom line is that it does matter to a LOT of students.

3.  Law degrees often DO come with job offers, as well as a host of other "real" majors of study     If you're trying to get on with big law in Chicago, New York... and you're at the top of your class at Yale- you're likely to land a nice job whether you're offered one or not.  Conversely if you graduate at the top of your class at University of North Dakota, your options are very limited.  What school you attended in grad or professional school often matters a lot.  It has less of a bearing on how much income you will make over years of practice but that's another thread.

4.  The reason why a lot of students (depends on your major)  are focused on job placement is because that is why *most* students attend college today- for better income or a better job.  Period.  The fact is that some schools have better contacts and job resources than others, so students wondering about job "placement" (not an accurate word, but you know what I mean) are being reasonably inquisitive.

AJScalzitti wrote:
Well not that I disagree but I think perhaps she a bit above average Fred, not something most could expect without a degree.  Especially these days where it's practically the price for admission for any corp job.

in high school i met a friends dad who didn't graduate past high school,  went on to join the military and after that a huge safety company with over a hundred installations in Canada.  He started it on a huge loan. I've met many who did the same..so I believe Fred. If you are highly networked and especially skilled in social skills ..that said I think all education and life experience can help anyone and teaches character rather than specific skill..but even then..
Who you know and their influence carries more weight. How likable and how hungry you are for success. How driven..uni and college can be a prerequisite to a lot of large agencies but many of them will look at your experience above anything else, at least from what I've seen..no clue about Italy. Personally I would rather hire someone with drive and passion than someone with none and an ivy league education looking just for a "job"

Can be successful without it, depending on who you are..and who you know..and whether you can connect with the right people

But then again you can achieve that any multitude of ways ..same result.

Marin Photography NYC wrote:
Total waste of money!

Get a business degree.

Take some photography workshops instead.

52k for two years? Hell no!

This.