Photographer
robert christopher
Posts: 2706
Snohomish, Washington, US
should it always be facing the camera, or do you aim it at the strobes?
Photographer
CBC Photography
Posts: 4
Los Angeles, California, US
Facing the camera, unless you are metering a kicker or background light, then point it at the strobe.
Photographer
Morton Visuals
Posts: 1773
Hope, Idaho, US
If you are metering individual lights (to determine a ratio or to ensure that a highlight doesn't blow out), point it at the light. If you are metering for your overall exposure, point it at the camera lens.
Photographer
LinguaDentata
Posts: 6413
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Metering is art... because you're trying to make the photo match the one that's in your head.
It depends on what you're metering and what results you want to get...
Just keep in mind that meters don't meter for 18% gray or 12% gray. They measure light so that an object with a luminosity of 110% relative to the light intensity of your strobe will give complete saturation to the medium... (that's an SI standard) and that's with the dome down or a flat meter.
The round dome is technically unscientific and only gives an approximation.
So, if you point the meter with the dome down at a light... and you're shooting with one light, it guarantees you that you won't have blown highlights. And the whitest whites (with 99.99% reflectance) will register as 91% saturated on your medium.
The really scientific approach would be to meter all the lights separately, then manually calculate how much light is falling on the subject and overexpose by about 5% to make sure the highlights are registered at about 96% and allow 4% for variation.
Obviously, that approach is quite tiresome and people don't want to do that. This is where the spherical dome in the light meter comes in. It just so happens that it averages a decent exposure if the meter is pointing on the camera... most of the time.
Then you'll just get to know how different objects look like. IE backlit hair. Blonde can be blown out at -2 stops. Some brunettes, if the hair is really diffused can take -.5 stops and still not be blown.
In the end - take your meter and shoot. You'll find out what works for you.
Photographer
Tim Summa
Posts: 2514
San Antonio, Texas, US
Andrew Vorobyov wrote:
Metering is art... because you're trying to make the photo match the one that's in your head.
It depends on what you're metering and what results you want to get...
Just keep in mind that meters don't meter for 18% gray or 12% gray. They measure light so that an object with a luminosity of 110% relative to the light intensity of your strobe will give complete saturation to the medium... (that's an SI standard) and that's with the dome down or a flat meter.
The round dome is technically unscientific and only gives an approximation.
So, if you point the meter with the dome down at a light... and you're shooting with one light, it guarantees you that you won't have blown highlights. And the whitest whites (with 99.99% reflectance) will register as 91% saturated on your medium.
The really scientific approach would be to meter all the lights separately, then manually calculate how much light is falling on the subject and overexpose by about 5% to make sure the highlights are registered at about 96% and allow 4% for variation.
Obviously, that approach is quite tiresome and people don't want to do that. This is where the spherical dome in the light meter comes in. It just so happens that it averages a decent exposure if the meter is pointing on the camera... most of the time.
Then you'll just get to know how different objects look like. IE backlit hair. Blonde can be blown out at -2 stops. Some brunettes, if the hair is really diffused can take -.5 stops and still not be blown.
In the end - take your meter and shoot. You'll find out what works for you. Amazing, truly a gifted response. We all stand in the shadow of this personâs grasp of theory and applied technology.
You asked: where do you point your light meter? I have no clue as to how anyone could possibly answer such a question. Again, amazing!
Sorry, got to go the model is here and I think I pointed the Minolta IV in the wrong direction with an inaccurate 180 degree dome; but donât despair sheâs a collage girl and will never catch me at the mistake, sheâs tooooo smart for this simplistic photographer, besides, perhaps I will just bump her boobs thirty times taking meter readings!!! Bad Timmy!
Photographer
David Pankhurst Photo
Posts: 893
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Andrew Vorobyov wrote:
Metering is art... because you're trying to make the photo match the one that's in your head.
It depends on what you're metering and what results you want to get...
Just keep in mind that meters don't meter for 18% gray or 12% gray. They measure light so that an object with a luminosity of 110% relative to the light intensity of your strobe will give complete saturation to the medium... (that's an SI standard) and that's with the dome down or a flat meter.
The round dome is technically unscientific and only gives an approximation.
So, if you point the meter with the dome down at a light... and you're shooting with one light, it guarantees you that you won't have blown highlights. And the whitest whites (with 99.99% reflectance) will register as 91% saturated on your medium.
The really scientific approach would be to meter all the lights separately, then manually calculate how much light is falling on the subject and overexpose by about 5% to make sure the highlights are registered at about 96% and allow 4% for variation.
Obviously, that approach is quite tiresome and people don't want to do that. This is where the spherical dome in the light meter comes in. It just so happens that it averages a decent exposure if the meter is pointing on the camera... most of the time.
Then you'll just get to know how different objects look like. IE backlit hair. Blonde can be blown out at -2 stops. Some brunettes, if the hair is really diffused can take -.5 stops and still not be blown.
In the end - take your meter and shoot. You'll find out what works for you. Well, as a professor of photography, I have to say this is one the biggest loads of nonsense i have ever read on MM.
Photographer
Karl Blessing
Posts: 30911
Caledonia, Michigan, US
I use an ambient meter pointed at the camera, first in the models' position, then on the backdrop's position. And if any other areas are hit with light I meter those as well to see how I need to adjust the lights for exposure balance. For example Cattie in my avatar right now I just shot that way... she's across the street at CVS, I'm still shooting her but I just popped on to upload the polaroid I just did in the studio, but yes I used the minolta autometer in the manner expressed above.
Photographer
David Pankhurst Photo
Posts: 893
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Second Glance wrote:
If you are metering individual lights (to determine a ratio or to ensure that a highlight doesn't blow out), point it at the light. If you are metering for your overall exposure, point it at the camera lens. Correct! Mention that it assumes you are using an ambient, not a reflected lightmeter...for a ratio reading, use the flat diffuser pointed at each light. For overall exposure, use the dome pointed at the camera position to catch and average all the light falling on the subject.
Photographer
LinguaDentata
Posts: 6413
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
David Pankhurst Photo wrote:
Well, as a professor of photography, I have to say this is one the biggest loads of nonsense i have ever read on MM. Which part?  lol
Photographer
Legacys 7
Posts: 33899
San Francisco, California, US
robert christopher wrote:
should it always be facing the camera, or do you aim it at the strobes? Remember there are two types of metering. Reflective and incident. In the studio. I always aim the meter from subject directly to camera depending on where the light is at.
Note: if you are shooting on all white b.g. and don't want uneven lighting on the b.g. Even your lights out on both sides and meter all the way across making sure that the reading consistent all the way accross. That is another use for the meter.
Photographer
c d embrey
Posts: 193
Huntington Beach, California, US
When working with hot lights I meter the key and set the rest by eye. That's one of the reason that I like hot lights, quick and easy to do.
If using strobe I meter each light to get the look I want. When reading individual lights shield dome from other lights.
As said before. pointing dome at camera will give good average on front of face but does nothing about back or rim lights.
Chuck
Photographer
Transposure
Posts: 202
Milford, New Jersey, US
Photographer
Billy Monday
Posts: 2745
Frederick, Maryland, US
David Pankhurst Photo wrote:
Well, as a professor of photography, I have to say this is one the biggest loads of nonsense i have ever read on MM. Assuming that the OP was referring to an incident meter, I think Vorobyov's answer is pretty helpful.
Tell us, professor, where he went wrong?
Photographer
WIP
Posts: 15973
Cheltenham, England, United Kingdom
Wow! we don't have professors of photography in the U.K.
As for the op's answer point the meter anywhere you like appart from where the sun don't shine and directly in the sun.
Just think what your exposing for and what you want to retain in the final image.
Photographer
c d embrey
Posts: 193
Huntington Beach, California, US
c_h_r_i_s wrote:
... point the meter anywhere you like appart from where the sun don't shine and directly in the sun. If the sun is the key light, why wouldn't you take an incident reading from it? The sun is just another BFL (this is a technical term, the B stands for big, and the L stands for light). Been doing it for over twenty years.
Chuck
Photographer
WIP
Posts: 15973
Cheltenham, England, United Kingdom
'Directly' as in straight into it.
I favour a spot meter.
Photographer
c d embrey
Posts: 193
Huntington Beach, California, US
c_h_r_i_s wrote:
'Directly' as in straight into it.
I favour a spot meter. No definitely not a spot meter! 8-)
The original question was about an incident meter, and I thought you were talking about that.
Chuck
Photographer
Billy G Photography
Posts: 422
Cape May, New Jersey, US
David Pankhurst Photo wrote:
Correct! Mention that it assumes you are using an ambient, not a reflected lightmeter...for a ratio reading, use the flat diffuser pointed at each light. For overall exposure, use the dome pointed at the camera position to catch and average all the light falling on the subject. Thank you that's how I was taught when I went to school way back, thought maybe things changed some.
Photographer
robert christopher
Posts: 2706
Snohomish, Washington, US
thanks everyone, i'll look at those sites later. i watched a photographer once setting up his lights and he seemed to be pointing the meter in completly random directions but i now can see there may have been a method to his maddness. i'll practice more.
Model
Jared H
Posts: 603
When pointing at the camera for the overall exposure and shooting digital you should place the meter in the highlight and not the shadow... ... I believe.  Same thing for slides... ... I think.
Photographer
Daguerre
Posts: 4082
Orange, California, US
Andrew Vorobyov wrote:
Metering is art... because you're trying to make the photo match the one that's in your head.
It depends on what you're metering and what results you want to get...
Just keep in mind that meters don't meter for 18% gray or 12% gray. They measure light so that an object with a luminosity of 110% relative to the light intensity of your strobe will give complete saturation to the medium... (that's an SI standard) and that's with the dome down or a flat meter.
The round dome is technically unscientific and only gives an approximation.
So, if you point the meter with the dome down at a light... and you're shooting with one light, it guarantees you that you won't have blown highlights. And the whitest whites (with 99.99% reflectance) will register as 91% saturated on your medium.
The really scientific approach would be to meter all the lights separately, then manually calculate how much light is falling on the subject and overexpose by about 5% to make sure the highlights are registered at about 96% and allow 4% for variation.
Obviously, that approach is quite tiresome and people don't want to do that. This is where the spherical dome in the light meter comes in. It just so happens that it averages a decent exposure if the meter is pointing on the camera... most of the time.
Then you'll just get to know how different objects look like. IE backlit hair. Blonde can be blown out at -2 stops. Some brunettes, if the hair is really diffused can take -.5 stops and still not be blown.
In the end - take your meter and shoot. You'll find out what works for you. Holy Shit!!! Now repeat that 5 times fast...
It is interesting all the crazy ways to meter and still get results... proof that there is such a thing as luck!
The method that has always worked for me when shooting film, is to set the model, set the lights, and then hold the meter ON the model with the Minolta IV dome pointing directly at the CAMERA. I meter the model head to toe to see where my falloff is happening and how drastic it is. I meter the highlight, I meter the shadow, and that tells me my ratio, and if I need more fill or less.
It is the camera that is capturing the light that falls. So I have found the best results by putting the meter on the model and pointing the little dome at the camera.
Photographer
LinguaDentata
Posts: 6413
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Just so you know... I typed it up to give an idea as to how the meter works.
If you understand how the device was designed, then you can use it "properly".
When I meter, I think about what the meter measures and then just point it at a light... or the camera... whichever I think is best.
Photographer
Pilfering Photographs
Posts: 56
Santa Barbara, California, US
Just remember kids, DON'T spot meter the sun!
Photographer
WIP
Posts: 15973
Cheltenham, England, United Kingdom
Pilfering Photographs wrote:
Just remember kids, DON'T spot meter the sun! Or the same effect as another activity... you'll go blind.
Car studio; Hot lights, 5 lights to the left, 2 on the b/ground. 2 on the overhead flat and a few more picking out detail.... where do you point the incident meter ?
That why I use a spot meter on almost everything appart from studio flash.
Photographer
Mclain D Swift
Posts: 1279
Black Diamond, Alberta, Canada
I take a reading of all my lights with the meter facing the lights. I then set my exposure off the main light with the meter pointing at it (then I don't blow out my highlights). Seriously does it really matter if you point it at the light or at the camera? What are you gonna be out...1/2 stop? Whoopy.
Photographer
Brian Morris Photography
Posts: 20901
Los Angeles, California, US
robert christopher wrote:
should it always be facing the camera, or do you aim it at the strobes? At the moon for all of its power!
Photographer
Beth Herzhaft
Posts: 3
Los Angeles, California, US
It depends on the TYPE of light meter you are using - there are several types: Incident and Reflective. Incident reads the light falling ONTO the subject and reflective reads the light reflected OFF OF the subject. You find more online I am sure. But make sure you know which type of meter you have so you don't f**k up the exposure. bh
Photographer
Star
Posts: 17966
Los Angeles, California, US
I point it at the inside of my bag, I always forget to use it
Photographer
joe duerr
Posts: 4227
Santa Ana, California, US
c d embrey wrote:
If the sun is the key light, why wouldn't you take an incident reading from it? The sun is just another BFL (this is a technical term, the B stands for big, and the L stands for light). Been doing it for over twenty years.
Chuck Is that why your avatar could use an exposure correction???
Photographer
5th Floor Photography
Posts: 745
New York, New York, US
If this was in model matters it would be a different thread completely.
Photographer
GCobb Photography
Posts: 15898
Southaven, Mississippi, US
c d embrey wrote:
When working with hot lights I meter the key and set the rest by eye. That's one of the reason that I like hot lights, quick and easy to do.
If using strobe I meter each light to get the look I want. When reading individual lights shield dome from other lights.
As said before. pointing dome at camera will give good average on front of face but does nothing about back or rim lights.
Chuck This is what I did at my last shoot. My key was stationary. The rest just fell into place by visuals. Normally I point at the camera.
Photographer
RDPhotography
Posts: 68
Barrie, Ontario, Canada
You mean that Minolta IV is a light meter!?!?!??!? I thought it was a cell phone!
Photographer
Duckee
Posts: 243
Brooklyn, New York, US
at the lightsource... ????
Model
L Mami
Posts: 266
Los Angeles, California, US
depends...  ,right?
Photographer
c d embrey
Posts: 193
Huntington Beach, California, US
joe duerr wrote:
Is that why your avatar could use an exposure correction??? The exposure is what I wanted! It may not be what you would do, but thats OK.
She is standing in shade and that's what I wanted it to look like. I could have brought it up a stop or two and totally blown the background, but that is not what I wanted. BTW this is not as shot, it has been played with, stop, contrast, etc.
Chuck
Photographer
Squire Photography
Posts: 157
London, England, United Kingdom
throw it away and sunny 16!
Photographer
Dan Lippitt
Posts: 3266
Pontiac, Michigan, US
robert christopher wrote:
should it always be facing the camera, or do you aim it at the strobes? what's a light meter? i think i used one back in the olden timey days...
|
,right?
lol