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12last
Photographer
Przemyslaw Stradczuk
Posts: 14
Glasgow, Scotland, United Kingdom


4 different models and 4 times either cancelled or like today agreed at 11am and no message, phone call,  nothing at all... I know it's JUST tfp photo shoot but I prepare, call, message, wait and it's such a waste of time. How can they treat people like that? Is there on this forum a thread which says which models i should avoid? I don't have much time for pictures so I want to use it creatively and work with people who really want to do something nice... I'm so disappointed and at the same time hungry of doing nice shots sad(...
Dec 09 12 05:09 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Photography by Sean
Posts: 118
Atlanta, Georgia, US


I'm sure they're going to bumrush your thread and blame you for models being unprofessional for doing TFP shoots instead of paying the models. As if that's supposed to solve all your problems.....

It amazes me though, how I'd get flooded with messages from models who want to do TFP shoots. I would say that I've talked to well over 30 models in the past 6 months and I've yet to meet just ONE. It's crazy how they'll talk with you, plan out details, have you contact a MUA, etc., all to back out at the last minute with some bogus excuse. Either those types or the ones who contact you to set something up, then when you respond to them, they never reply again. That's why people who do photography professionally are better than me. I couldn't do it. I don't have the patience.
Dec 09 12 05:14 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Catnapping
Posts: 3,771
Brooklyn, New York, US


It's not just models that do this.

As someone else who mainly does TF shoots, I find that I have better luck booking people short notice, that way we both know that we'll have the time free. Also, I usually try to book multiple shoots in one day, that way if one person can't make it, I still have a few other shoots.

I also ask other locals who they recommend.

I just take it as part of the territory that I may end up shooting birds instead of a model.
Dec 09 12 05:18 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Przemyslaw Stradczuk
Posts: 14
Glasgow, Scotland, United Kingdom


Sean Alexandre wrote:
I'm sure they're going to bumrush your thread and blame you for models being unprofessional for doing TFP shoots instead of paying the models. As if that's supposed to solve all your problems.....

I would only pay a model if I would be earning from photo shoot... At the moment I can offer them improvement of their portfolio... and it's not the issue... it's just being honest and trustworthy to another human being... I don't know how to avoid those people?

Dec 09 12 05:24 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
gmillerimages
Posts: 10
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, US


I'm suppose to have a shoot today in two hours. This was a paid shoot. Model answered casting call about 1 week ago, since then tumbleweeds and crickets. Model not only never opened any of my emails but has since dropped her MM account.

She was perfect for the theme of my shoot. I would not have been thrilled trying to fit in another less than perfect model, or changing the theme on short notice.

So I sit...
Dec 09 12 05:26 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Przemyslaw Stradczuk
Posts: 14
Glasgow, Scotland, United Kingdom


Sean Alexandre wrote:
It amazes me though, how I'd get flooded with messages from models who want to do TFP shoots. I would say that I've talked to well over 30 models in the past 6 months and I've yet to meet just ONE. It's crazy how they'll talk with you, plan out details, have you contact a MUA, etc., all to back out at the last minute with some bogus excuse. Either those types or the ones who contact you to set something up, then when you respond to them, they never reply again. That's why people who do photography professionally are better than me. I couldn't do it. I don't have the patience.

Exactly! I'm starting to loose my patience... such a waste of time hmm

Dec 09 12 05:26 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Przemyslaw Stradczuk
Posts: 14
Glasgow, Scotland, United Kingdom


gmillerimages wrote:
I'm suppose to have a shoot today in two hours. This was a paid shoot. Model answered casting call about 1 week ago, since then tumbleweeds and crickets. Model not only never opened any of my emails but has since dropped her MM account.

She was perfect for the theme of my shoot. I would not have been thrilled trying to fit in another less than perfect model, or changing the theme on short notice.

So I sit...

I feel your pain... ehhh...

Dec 09 12 05:28 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Catnapping
Posts: 3,771
Brooklyn, New York, US


gmillerimages wrote:
I'm suppose to have a shoot today in two hours. This was a paid shoot. Model answered casting call about 1 week ago, since then tumbleweeds and crickets. Model not only never opened any of my emails but has since dropped her MM account.

She was perfect for the theme of my shoot. I would not have been thrilled trying to fit in another less than perfect model, or changing the theme on short notice.

So I sit...

huh?

answering a casting call doesn't equal committing to a shoot. especially if you never worked out details in PM's.

Dec 09 12 05:29 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Photography by Sean
Posts: 118
Atlanta, Georgia, US


Przemyslaw Stradczuk wrote:
Exactly! I'm starting to loose my patience... such a waste of time hmm

A model messaged me yesterday asking if I'd be willing to shoot her. I liked her look, so I agreed. We worked out a time and date to do the shoot. She then asked me what kind of ideas did I have for her look. So I scoured the internet looking for pics to illustrate potential themes and emailed them to her. She calls me back later in the day to tell me that she has a shoot already scheduled on the day we planned to shoot. Mind you, she contacted me out of the blue...not the other way around. And still had the nerve to play games.

Dec 09 12 05:30 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Przemyslaw Stradczuk
Posts: 14
Glasgow, Scotland, United Kingdom


Catnapping wrote:
It's not just models that do this.

As someone else who mainly does TF shoots, I find that I have better luck booking people short notice, that way we both know that we'll have the time free. Also, I usually try to book multiple shoots in one day, that way if one person can't make it, I still have a few other shoots.

I also ask other locals who they recommend.

I just take it as part of the territory that I may end up shooting birds instead of a model.

I think I will start doing landscapes, architecture and my twisted photo manipulatons  again than bother with those fake people...

Dec 09 12 05:30 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Przemyslaw Stradczuk
Posts: 14
Glasgow, Scotland, United Kingdom


Sean Alexandre wrote:
A model messaged me yesterday asking if I'd be willing to shoot her. I liked her look, so I agreed. Strangely, she asked me what kind of ideas did I have for her look. So I scoured the internet looking for pics to illustrate potential themes and emailed them to her. She calls me back later in the day to tell me that she has a shoot already scheduled on the day we planned to shoot. Mind you, she contacted me out of the blue...not the other way around. And still had the nerve to play games.

Had that too a week ago hmm, but mine booked a bit earlier then that and cancelled saying that she is going somewhere abroad for studio shoot for 2 days and that it's too cold to shoot outside (not nude), like she didn't know when booking it's cold in London in December...

Dec 09 12 05:33 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Przemyslaw Stradczuk
Posts: 14
Glasgow, Scotland, United Kingdom


Is there like a wall of shame in here? Would be very helpful... But I guess everyone will start to blame everyone so maybe not the best idea hmm...
Dec 09 12 05:37 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
David Thorpe
Posts: 686
Brandon, Florida, US


Get a number and text them an hour before the shoot.  Let them know that you're going to text them, and that if they don't answer, you will assume they aren't going to show up.  That has saved me from waiting on a flaking model several times.
Dec 09 12 06:01 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Przemyslaw Stradczuk
Posts: 14
Glasgow, Scotland, United Kingdom


David Thorpe wrote:
Get a number and text them an hour before the shoot.  Let them know that you're going to text them, and that if they don't answer, you will assume they aren't going to show up.  That has saved me from waiting on a flaking model several times.

Will do next time (assuming that there will next time). I had the number but didn't call thinking that she is running late... stupid me...

Dec 09 12 06:03 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
David Thorpe
Posts: 686
Brandon, Florida, US


Przemyslaw Stradczuk wrote:

Will do next time (assuming that there will next time). I had the number but didn't call thinking that she is running late... stupid me...

I wouldn't call, a text message is less invasive.  But yeah, get in the habit of doing it.  Because of experience with flakes, I have a no number = no shoot policy.

Dec 09 12 06:07 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Photography by Sean
Posts: 118
Atlanta, Georgia, US


David Thorpe wrote:
Get a number and text them an hour before the shoot.  Let them know that you're going to text them, and that if they don't answer, you will assume they aren't going to show up.  That has saved me from waiting on a flaking model several times.

Definitely going to be adopting that policy.
If I wanted to deal with flakes, I'd go outside when its snowing.

Dec 09 12 06:09 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Cherrystone
Posts: 36,020
Columbus, Ohio, US


David Thorpe wrote:

I wouldn't call, a text message is less invasive.  But yeah, get in the habit of doing it.  Because of experience with flakes, I have a no number = no shoot policy.

Invasive? Hell.....

Besides...what do you do when the model show up because she didn't get your text?

Texts can get lost in space, a voice on the other end is 100% sure thing.

Dec 09 12 06:18 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
David Thorpe
Posts: 686
Brandon, Florida, US


Small Fruit Pits wrote:

Invasive? Hell.....

Besides...what do you do when the model show up because she didn't get your text?

Texts can get lost in space, a voice on the other end is 100% sure thing.

The odds of a model not getting my text, especially if she knows to look for it, are very small.  If she doesn't answer and goes to the location, I won't be there and it's on her.  That hasn't happened to me as far as I know.

Dec 09 12 06:27 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
The Signature Image
Posts: 12,055
Gorham, Maine, US


Accept this fact: Neither all models nor photographers who belong to this site are professionals. That said, when a model fails to show or fails to call and cancel consider it their loss and move on.
Dec 09 12 06:36 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
O b s c u r a L L C
Posts: 616
New York, New York, US


Przemyslaw Stradczuk wrote:
4 different models and 4 times either cancelled or like today agreed at 11am and no message, phone call,  nothing at all... I know it's JUST tfp photo shoot but I prepare, call, message, wait and it's such a waste of time. How can they treat people like that? Is there on this forum a thread which says which models i should avoid? I don't have much time for pictures so I want to use it creatively and work with people who really want to do something nice... I'm so disappointed and at the same time hungry of doing nice shots sad(...

"Doctor, it hurts when I do this!"

There are some photographers who have blacklists. Ask to see them. Contact other photographers and network. Exchange stories about different "models."

It might be prudent to "hat tip" models who are punctual, courteous, and amiable. Or whatever positive traits you view as "professional."

Best of success to you and Happy Shooting!

Dec 09 12 06:38 am  Link  Quote 
Model
E e v a
Posts: 1,724
Nashville, Tennessee, US


Sean Alexandre wrote:
I'm sure they're going to bumrush your thread and blame you for models being unprofessional for doing TFP shoots instead of paying the models. As if that's supposed to solve all your problems.....

It amazes me though, how I'd get flooded with messages from models who want to do TFP shoots. I would say that I've talked to well over 30 models in the past 6 months and I've yet to meet just ONE. It's crazy how they'll talk with you, plan out details, have you contact a MUA, etc., all to back out at the last minute with some bogus excuse. Either those types or the ones who contact you to set something up, then when you respond to them, they never reply again. That's why people who do photography professionally are better than me. I couldn't do it. I don't have the patience.

Its ok. I got flaked on today from a paid shoot that I was casted to do. Life moves on. My best way is to always give out number for a final confirmation and to check references.

Dec 09 12 06:42 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Photography by Sean
Posts: 118
Atlanta, Georgia, US


Samantha Emme wrote:

Its ok. I got flaked on today from a paid shoot that I was casted to do. Life moves on. My best way is to always give out number for a final confirmation and to check references.

I give a # to everyone I book....

Dec 09 12 06:53 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Przemyslaw Stradczuk
Posts: 14
Glasgow, Scotland, United Kingdom


O b s c u r a L L C wrote:
"Doctor, it hurts when I do this!"

There are some photographers who have blacklists. Ask to see them. Contact other photographers and network. Exchange stories about different "models."

It might be prudent to "hat tip" models who are punctual, courteous, and amiable. Or whatever positive traits you view as "professional."

Best of success to you and Happy Shooting!

Thanks for a tip...

Dec 09 12 07:01 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Art of the nude
Posts: 11,781
Olivet, Michigan, US


David Thorpe wrote:
The odds of a llama not getting my text, especially if she knows to look for it, are very small.  If she doesn't answer and goes to the location, I won't be there and it's on her.  That hasn't happened to me as far as I know.

I've gotten texts several days after they were sent.  From my wife.  And I've had her get texts several days after I sent them.

Texts have their uses, but as indicated above, it's not at all 100% that they will be received and seen in a timely manner.

Dec 09 12 07:03 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Przemyslaw Stradczuk
Posts: 14
Glasgow, Scotland, United Kingdom


Sean Alexandre wrote:
I give a # to everyone I book....

Me too... And I'm not going out without models mobile number

Dec 09 12 07:04 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
JAE
Posts: 2,080
West Chester, Pennsylvania, US


David Thorpe wrote:
Get a number and text them an hour before the shoot.  Let them know that you're going to text them, and that if they don't answer, you will assume they aren't going to show up.  That has saved me from waiting on a flaking model several times.

That's what I do.  I will text a few hours before the shoot and if I don't hear back I don't go.  I always have a back up plan for what I want to do with my day (even if it's not shooting models) so if the shoot doesn't happen I'm not too upset.

Dec 09 12 07:09 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Przemyslaw Stradczuk
Posts: 14
Glasgow, Scotland, United Kingdom


JAE Photography PA wrote:
That's what I do.  I will text a few hours before the shoot and if I don't hear back I don't go.  I always have a back up plan for what I want to do with my day (even if it's not shooting llamas) so if the shoot doesn't happen I'm not too upset.

She text me yesterday evening: "see you later" after agreeing time of meeting.
And my backup plan came out accidentaly and im now at the gym, punching boxing bag and releasing my frustration and bad emotions smile

Dec 09 12 08:21 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
ontherocks
Posts: 22,209
Salem, Oregon, US


consider paying (either the llama or by doing group shoots, around here it's through meetup.com) until you have the clout to get the llamas on trade. for my part i still find getting new llamas on TF difficult (in fact it's harder now than it was when i started here years ago). some girls don't take this very seriously (stay out late partying the night before) or they get a better offer or find something better to do that day or get a chance to put in some paid time at work.
Dec 09 12 08:27 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
B R U N E S C I
Posts: 25,319
Bath, England, United Kingdom


Chalk it up to experience and try to check references in future, if they have any.

I've had two llamas cancel at short notice myself recently. The time of year doesn't help either as Christmas shopping is clearly more important to some than a trade photoshoot!  hmm



Just my $0.02

Ciao
Stefano

www.stefanobrunesci.com
Dec 09 12 08:38 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Moore Photo Graphix
Posts: 5,288
Washington, District of Columbia, US


Przemyslaw Stradczuk wrote:
Is there like a wall of shame in here? Would be very helpful... But I guess everyone will start to blame everyone so maybe not the best idea hmm...

Last time I check, MM is not in the business of getting involved personal disputes. Also, this is a social media site, and your rant will be seen by folks weren't your target audience, and it'll come back and bite in your in the back. I'll put to you like this. Imagine going to a KTM Motorcycle interview with Harley Davidson gear top to bottom on! It won't make a good impression. The time and energy that spent making this thread would have been better spent:

reviewing your selection
positing an ad on Craigslist, college newspapers, alt weekly papers
Joining Meetup and finding groups in your area
Contacting agencies to find the right models, etc.


It's not rocket science! Just common sense!

Dec 09 12 08:59 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
SPierce Photography
Posts: 19,579
Amherst, Massachusetts, US


Przemyslaw Stradczuk wrote:

I would only pay a model if I would be earning from photo shoot... At the moment I can offer them improvement of their portfolio... and it's not the issue... it's just being honest and trustworthy to another human being... I don't know how to avoid those people?

Sometimes, shit just happens. Other times, when you get a lot of models doing this - step back and see if there's something in the communications that gave them away- or is there something you may have said that can be misunderstood/mis construed, etc?

Dec 09 12 09:02 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
gmillerimages
Posts: 10
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, US


Catnapping wrote:
huh?

answering a casting call doesn't equal committing to a shoot. especially if you never worked out details in PM's.

Hard to do when said model does not open PM's

Dec 09 12 01:51 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Gianantonio
Posts: 7,713
Minneapolis, Minnesota, US


Przemyslaw Stradczuk wrote:
4 different models and 4 times either cancelled or like today agreed at 11am and no message, phone call,  nothing at all... I know it's JUST tfp photo shoot but I prepare, call, message, wait and it's such a waste of time. How can they treat people like that? Is there on this forum a thread which says which models i should avoid? I don't have much time for pictures so I want to use it creatively and work with people who really want to do something nice... I'm so disappointed and at the same time hungry of doing nice shots sad(...

That's so weird.  Do you know if this happens to other photographers?

Dec 09 12 01:59 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
DivaEroticus
Posts: 14,325
Fayetteville, Arkansas, US


If I were there, I'd SO create with you.  No flaking, no bullshit.  srs
Dec 09 12 02:25 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Moore Photo Graphix
Posts: 5,288
Washington, District of Columbia, US


gmillerimages wrote:
I'm suppose to have a shoot today in two hours. This was a paid shoot. Model answered casting call about 1 week ago, since then tumbleweeds and crickets. Model not only never opened any of my emails but has since dropped her MM account.

She was perfect for the theme of my shoot. I would not have been thrilled trying to fit in another less than perfect model, or changing the theme on short notice.

So I sit...

Sounds like a classic case of putting all your eggs in one basket! You admitted there were other models responding your casting call. Why didn't you contact them when this model didn't give an immediate response? There's a reason my dad reminds of having a plan b, in the case plan a falls apart.

Catnapping wrote:
huh?

answering a casting call doesn't equal committing to a shoot. especially if you never worked out details in PM's.
gmillerimages wrote:
Hard to do when said model does not open PM's

Have you ever consider that said model responded to many casting calls from more than one photographer? No matter how your project was, she found something she thinks was better. You can never know what's happening in the mind of another person. Here's an idea! How about you and the OP move on because holding to anger is like drinking poison and expecting someone else to die.

Dec 09 12 02:39 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Paolo Diavolo
Posts: 8,172
Pleasant Hill, California, US


People waste your time, because they don't percieve your time as valuable to them.
Dec 09 12 02:52 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
Kelli
Posts: 24,176
Toronto, Ontario, Canada


Catnapping wrote:
It's not just llamas that do this.

Dec 09 12 02:58 pm  Link  Quote 
Model
P I X I E
Posts: 35,267
Toronto, Ontario, Canada


Shit happens. I've been flaked on by photographers as well. That's life.
Dec 09 12 02:59 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Przemyslaw Stradczuk
Posts: 14
Glasgow, Scotland, United Kingdom


Gianantonio wrote:
That's so weird.  Do you know if this happens to other photographers?

Yes, after reading people answers here I know now. Dont need to be sarcastic...

Dec 10 12 09:35 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Tony Lawrence
Posts: 18,983
Chicago, Illinois, US


There is a excellent book called;   The Four Agreements.   One agreement is too never take anything anyone says or does personally.   Its rarely about us.   Your work is excellent and you seem bright and well spoken.   So what's going  on?   Maybe the models decided that because she wasn't being paid it wasn't worth doing.   Reverse things.   If a model wanted too shoot and it meant travelling too her and you stayed up all night or were tired or were asked to go on a last minute date with a beautiful woman.   What would you do?   Certainly you'd call to cancel and some did.   Maybe you wouldn't.   Not because you are a as^hole but because you forgot because it wasn't really all that important to start with or maybe your cell phone wasn't working or a hundred other reasons.

In the future if you want two models book six.   Make sure models know no call to confirm no shoot.   Remember that unless you are paying many won't shoot and even with pay some won't.   Most of all.   Don't take it personal.   Try and not be bitter.   Plan other things and do them when sessions don't occur.
Dec 10 12 12:39 pm  Link  Quote 
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