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How do you decide "Paid Assignments Only"
I mean no offense to anyone by asking this, I'm just curious how models make this evaluation that from this moment on I will only model for those that pay. What was the moment of clarity that led to this decision. Jun 26 14 01:32 pm Link 1k-words-photograpy wrote: More than likely not enough paid assignments, or the belief that they no longer require TF jobs. Jun 26 14 01:42 pm Link Babybean wrote: +1 Jun 26 14 01:49 pm Link After a certain point, it becomes very difficult to find beneficial trade, and most of the people contacting you for trade will be offering work that is either not as good as what's currently in your portfolio, or of similar quality. Therefore, those offers serve no purpose to you anymore, not for images anyway. When the offers for non-beneficial, or neutral, trade far outnumber those that could benefit your portfolio development (and the more you shoot, the faster this happens), you must request pay. Also, for models who travel regularly, we may invest as much as $1000 into planning and completing a single trip. We must go home with a profit after already sinking a substantial amount of money into the travel effort. It's very difficult to accept trade while traveling at all, unless you want to come up short after returning home. It's rare that I can afford to do any trade while traveling -with the exception of situations where a photographer hosts me while I am in his/her area, in exchange for shoot time Jun 26 14 02:03 pm Link Most of my paid work offers are from mid level to established photographers. They're usually guys that want a certain quality and are wiling to pay for it. Most of my TFP offers are from hobbyists, beginners and guys that want to convince me that having stuff shot by them will be in my best interest. I'd rather just take the paid gigs. Jun 26 14 02:33 pm Link I think it happens when they decide they don't want to model unless they are getting paid. Is it the best business move? Depends on the person. I think someone like Mosh can say 'paid assignments only' and get them.  Many others are simply shooting themselves in the foot, and I will end up seeing no new work for months and months because of it.Jun 26 14 02:38 pm Link From what I can see, most of the time it's "models" that don't want to model. Jun 26 14 02:42 pm Link StephenByron wrote: I disagree. (My first reaction was less polite). Jun 26 14 02:50 pm Link 1k-words-photograpy wrote: Hi, Jun 26 14 02:51 pm Link Looknsee Photography wrote: that^ Jun 26 14 02:54 pm Link Often goes along with "No Experience" and "No Nudes" Jun 26 14 03:00 pm Link Looknsee Photography wrote: I'm not offended by your answer and I'm never offended when a model makes a business decision not to work for me for free or for pay. For me this is a business and I've been doing it long enough to know that sometimes it just doesn't work out. I was more so just curious how some of the models come to the decision is all. Jun 26 14 03:05 pm Link 1k-words-photograpy wrote: Unfortunately there won't be a macro one size fit's all type answer. Jun 26 14 03:09 pm Link I put this to avoid several requests of "free tests" (that only serve the person's portfolio and not mine). When I need a test I usually pick the photographer and I pay. If I choose well this investment will bring me further business and I can only gain by doing this. Surely the occasional tf happens but more often than not I had to cancel those in the past because of paid gigs that came in. I also find that the result of tf shoots is more of a hit and miss type of situation, sometimes you don't even get the pics or they don't really bring business so in the end I could have spent that time doing something more lucrative or simply relaxing. ..! Jun 26 14 03:27 pm Link "oh, look. I am young and pretty. Paid assignments only please and to hell with your experience and expensive equipment that I will use." Jun 26 14 03:29 pm Link I'm not a professional photographer and I don't care. The most important thing is to just to enjoy it Jun 26 14 03:43 pm Link I don't think I will ever accept 100% "paid assignments only", that's like saying, I will never help out someone in need when I get no money in return. But with that said, early on, I would almost only accept "paid assignments", for the following reasons. Everyone has bills to pay (the electric company does not accept images as a form of payment), and training/education costs for the work that they do (colleges and universities do not accept images as a form of payment either). There is also the "big picture", if every talent, or the majority, accepts TFP (willing to work for free), as it is now, directors, producers, will be inclined (and they do) to "hire" free "talent" instead of real talent and that in turn not only hurts real trained talent, but also produces bad results (notice that there have been no good talent in movies lately?) So this is a big problem that needs to change, in my opinion. The only time I think working for free are very well justified is when you have an experimental project and neither party is sure it will work but both of you want to do that, so go ahead and try it for free (in fact, some of my best work actually came from TFP's). That goes for both beginners and experienced, because as a beginner almost everything is an experiment, and as an experienced, you always want to try new things. But I still think free work should be the vast minority (which it is not). Jun 26 14 03:49 pm Link When I see "paid assignments only" with a local model it usually tells me that the model doesn't have the money to spend on the shoot...whether it be travel, clothing, etc., and she is looking for modeling to supplement her income. Traveling models are self-explanatory. I don't have a lot of money to pay models. If I did, I would hire more of them. However, I always offer to pay models at first contact...whether nude or otherwise. I also make it a point that they leave with at least $100. Why? I contacted them because they had a look that I want, and I want to make sure I cover their costs so they don't cancel at the last minute just because they can't afford the travel, etc. I also live in an area where many models are students, or have just left home, and are barely making ends meet. So I have to make the shoot worth their while. (I used to have flakes all the time, but rarely do anymore.) Jun 26 14 04:30 pm Link Sandra Vixen wrote: So if this ideal is followed through and the photographer is doing portfolio development how is he getting paid, do they pay each other? At some point don't photographers, models and other creatives waive their fees to do personal projects they agree on? Jun 26 14 05:52 pm Link I think ignorance or lack of understanding is a major factor, this covers all various tallant, not just models. I think "Paid Assignments Only" is a big turn off and shuts the door closed! Almost every big name Photog on this site has "Depends On Assignment" which is smart, even though they could command as much as they wish, they will get it, yet, they don't advertise it. OTOH, there was that young lady, who apparently went to FL, spent big bucks on 4 pictures, all same swimsuit! she listed "Paid only"!, I contacted her, was expecting reasonable rate, she quoted me an outrageous rate, much higher than the big name models on MM, I thought she might be trying to avoid shooting with me, I asked a friend of mine to contact her, he got the same rates! I told her -through PM- that I have no issue paying her rate, however, 4 pictures do not tell me much about her ability to pose or how she looks in various outfits, etc, etc. Never heard back from her. I think it is my right to see the product before committing to it! NO? Anyway, for the next 9 month, she had only the initial 4 pictures, eventually, she deleted her account! I think ignorance killed her chances! she was really really attractive, it was easy to tell that she "could" do it! however, when all you have is 4 pictures -high quality by the way- it just does not justify the price tag! Yes, everyone is free to demand whatever she or he wants, however, you BETTER have the port to back it up! Jun 26 14 09:12 pm Link 1k-words-photograpy wrote: If I have a specific personal project, I now expect to pay a photographer to work on it, because most trade situations simply do not produce high enough quality of work. Jun 26 14 09:56 pm Link Reading the difference between models' and photographers' responses in this thread is astounding. OP- even though I don't have "paid assignments only" on my profile, 90% of the work I do is paid. I started doing primarily paid work when most of the TF offers I got would not have been beneficial to me. Jun 26 14 10:11 pm Link Elizabeta Rosandic wrote: I've noticed that a lot of times they can't understand why their work won't benefit you. That is even true, frequently, for photographers with almost no experience, and 5 over-exposed photos in their portfolios. Jun 26 14 10:17 pm Link Koryn wrote: yyyyyyyyup.... Jun 26 14 11:23 pm Link So much model bashing in this thread Jun 27 14 12:15 am Link Jun 27 14 12:53 am Link If you're hired more than you have time for, it's time to start charging. The more busy you are, the more you charge. Jun 27 14 04:03 am Link I would never do it. It is better to receive 100 messages, reply ''no, thank you, I am not interested in TF shoots'' to 99 of them and get 1 from amazing photographer who you admire than say paid assignments only and lose some great opportunities. Jun 27 14 05:06 am Link MartaBrixton wrote: ^This is my mantra. Jun 27 14 05:58 am Link Great photographers do TF if it's worth it to them, Models the same As with makeup artists, etc. Paid assignments only keeps you working making money like one should. Anyone that wants to shoot with you will regardless of the labeling. TFs can get you many paid assignments. Jun 27 14 07:01 am Link If you have good numbers (age, height, etc. ) and have a decent port., no problem. Jun 27 14 07:10 am Link Lots of great comments already. Though I respect your attempts to gain a better understanding of your customer/clients point of view, Unfortunately, in the end it probably doesn't matter what the specific answer is. We all make decisions in our lives for any number of professional and personal reasons, and the world would work so much better if we could all respect them without questioning them too much  Though this is not much of an answer, I suspect you can answer much of it by asking yourself what circumstances would make you check that box.Jun 27 14 07:17 am Link Danielle Reid wrote: It is not about model bashing! The OP is asking a valid question, "When do you decide to do Paid only". I think this also should go for photographers, they do the same. Jun 27 14 07:24 am Link OMG!! $$$ makes the world go around. Live in the real world or make up some fantasy world of your own. Jun 27 14 07:34 am Link 1k-words-photograpy wrote: Probably the moment that they decided money was a good motivation... This isn't a hobby for everyone. Jun 27 14 07:39 am Link 1k-words-photograpy wrote: When the job offers your getting simply aren't equal to or better than what you've been getting. Or more likely, that the limited free time that we all have makes a person be super selective in how they utilize it. Jun 27 14 07:39 am Link Jules NYC wrote: I have worked with some photographers TF the first time we worked together and the next time they paid me. Jun 27 14 08:04 am Link A. I. Studios wrote: Hmm Jun 27 14 08:18 am Link 1k-words-photograpy wrote: Thanks. I appreciate you saying this. 1k-words-photograpy wrote: If it is a business for you, I assume that you are getting paid. I don't know about you, but if I'm getting paid, the whole team is getting paid. 1k-words-photograpy wrote: And there's where we part ways. Whether you feel the model should be focused on paid opportunities or not -- that is your opinion, not a fact. It's not your job to pass judgment on the quality of a model's portfolio -- you should be concerned about whether she meets your job requirements or not (or to be more succinct, whether you want to hire her or not). Jun 27 14 08:40 am Link A models job is to "model" some are better at posing than others, but the main reason to select a specific model is their looks, simple as that, doesn't matter if they are noobs with 4 cell phone selfies or a seasoned pro with a full portfolio, if the look fits, then it fits. Over the years I have shot with many seasoned pros and absolute noobs, Ive done trade shoots, Ive paid models, Ive been paid, blah blah blah. I have shot with some "Pros" that couldn't pose to save their lives and I've shot with some noobs that were absolute posing machines. Where does it say that a model has to have experience to get paid? If the model has the look I am looking for, then we negotiate a rate, whether it is paid, trade or a mixture. Of course this is just my opinion. 1k-words-photograpy wrote: ' Jun 27 14 09:52 am Link |
