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Dead US (Iraq War) Soldiers being Shipped as Cargo
Family Upset After Soldier's Body Shipped As Freight. A soldier's family said fallen soldiers and Marines deserve better and that one would think American war heroes are being transported with dignity, care and respect. It said one would think upon arrival in their hometowns they are greeted with honor. But the family said that is just not the case. Dead U.S. troops are supposed to come home with their coffins draped with the American flag -- greeted by a color guard. But in reality, many are arriving as freight on commercial airliners -- stuffed in the belly of a plane with suitcases and other cargo. http://www.turnto23.com/news/5524802/detail.html# Is this how the Bush administration supports the Troops?.....Shipping them in the cargo hold and then shipping them like you would your Grandma back home for burial. At least the DOD/President could at least give them the dignity of having their coffins FLAG DRAPED.....but then again that would bring home the reallity of this war breed by coruption. Simply disgraceful......I am inching closer to being ashamed to call myself an american. Its nice to see them shipped as if they are the US Mail. I have wrote US Senator Patty Murray asking for her to look in to this matter....This administration integrity or lack of is crumbling and their regard for others exposed right along with it. Dec 13 05 09:09 pm Link I am wondering... what is the SOP for transporting dead bodies on airplanes? I wouldn't be surprised if deseased people are always shipped in the cargo bay (if sent in civilian planes), hence as cargo... Hey... with the amount of US soldiers dying in Iraq, I actually heard that they are being normally flown in cargo plains back to American soil. Surprising? Nope, not to me. Udo Dec 13 05 09:21 pm Link UdoR wrote: UdoR..... Dec 13 05 09:34 pm Link eyetoeye-Images wrote: This is indeed disturbing. I am writing my congressman now as well. (as soon as I finish verifying it with a second source.) Dec 13 05 09:36 pm Link bencook2 wrote: Here is another link from Channel 10 in San Diego.... Dec 13 05 09:45 pm Link Sadly...I think it is indicative of how those soldiers are often viewed by the men who send them to war. If each and every soldiers life MATTERED to the powers that be they would never be sent into action unprepared and would never be sacrificed without a need and a plan. To me the wealthy power brokers that often historically sent people to war (but never their own sons and daughters) look upon human beings the same way many Multi-national corporations view human beings...as assets. I recall sitting outside of a business class at one time at a University and listening to the lecture that was telling the young business people how to calculate the true cost of their "human capital". They were basically being told to calculate very carefully how much their humans cost versus their machinery. In a war fought "over there" it is easy for those in charge to forget the very real human cost of each and every human being ours or theirs. If they forget the human cost on our side (or deliberatly try to HIDE the human cost by forbidding photos and etc.) you end up with soldiers being shipped home as freight. If they forget the human cost on the other side we end up with more people hating us and a new generation of terrorists in training. And here is the thing...I actually think that Bush does care. I wonder though about Cheney, Rumsfield, Wolfowitz and some of the others that are actually making the decisions...I don't think they care near as much as they should. I think if they REALLY cared about our soldiers they would not have sent them in without a REALISTIC plan to get them out. One thing is for sure...there is NO reason for any US soldier who dies in this conflict to have his or her remains conveyed in the most respectful and militarily proper means available. We owe it to them, their families, and ourselves to acknowledge fully the price they paid in their duty to our country. Dec 13 05 09:49 pm Link So what would you propose, a first class seat? Sorry but this is old news, generations old. Dec 13 05 09:51 pm Link After reading the latest article and thinking for a moment I would like to add: I don't think the commercial carriers in any way disrespect our soldiers, or the remains of our soldiers. I do think that military transport would be more appropriate, or at minimum an honor gaurd and a flag draped coffin. And yes, the story is generations old...but that is not a good enough excuse. Dec 13 05 09:52 pm Link First, I do believe it is standard operating procedure for any airline to put a dead body in the cargo section. (could be wrong) next, What commercial airlines are flying out of Iraq? Well, I read more. Sounds bad but not sure if as bad as it is being made out to be. Like I stated. I do believe it is normal for bodies to go in cargo. A place in the seating area would be strange to me. But some kind of guard should see that body off and one be present for the bodies return to the states. Dec 13 05 09:52 pm Link As I understand it Us Military personnel who die overseas are sent to the Military Mortuary at Dover Air Force Base in Delaware, usually by Air Force planes and are given full Military Honors upon arrival where they are then preped for transport to their final resting place. The military provide a Survivor Assistance Officer and Chaplain to help the family thru this stressfull time and the paperwork for survivor benefits and relocation if necessay. This is far more than the " we regret to inform you.." Telegram used in WWII. I am sure that if Military transport is available to the final destination is available that would be the first choice but often it would add delay to reuniting the family. To try to make this into an Bush bash is to disrepect those who have died in service to their country and as a vetern and an American I find it offensive. Dec 13 05 10:37 pm Link Robert Helm wrote: I didn't see any Bush bashing. Dec 13 05 10:46 pm Link BodyPainter Rich wrote: "Is this how the Bush administration supports the Troops?....." Dec 13 05 10:57 pm Link BodyPainter Rich wrote: Bush rushed to war by failing to allow the Wepeons inspectors and going back to the UN for a mandatory second vote, he is also remember the Commander in Chief and was the one who ordered the bombing In Iraq to begin so the responsibilty of this failed policy rest entirly upon his head. This article is again another example of this administration doing things on the CHEAP need I say more? Dec 13 05 11:07 pm Link Robert Helm wrote: AN invitation to bash, maybe...but not a bash. It was a question, a rhetorical question, but a question none the less. I think it is a legitimate question. I also wonder why "supporting our troops" does not seem to include pay raises for them, more services for their families at home, or better care and facilities for veterans. At least not from what I have been hearing. Dec 13 05 11:15 pm Link I decided to ask my mother her opinion. My oldest brother is in the Iraqui Gulf right now on the USS NASSAU and I wanted her answer to all this! She said that for her it would not matter how they sent his body home as long as it got here. She said so many people have no body to bury and that his soul is no longer there, its just a shell for us to put in the ground! She would be happy to get him 3rd class Parcel Post if necessary! But hey, everybody has their own opinion. Just thought you might be interested to know what someone with a vested interest in all this thought! She also added "Let's see what their opinion would be if they actually sent a son or daughter over there." Just some food for thought! ~krystina Dec 13 05 11:18 pm Link BodyPainter Rich wrote: I agree this is horrible. But there is bush bashing. We only see what we want to sometimes. Dec 13 05 11:20 pm Link eyetoeye-Images wrote: Thanks! Dec 13 05 11:20 pm Link Krystina Rainey wrote: Thank you for sublimly supporting this adminidstration.....In other words it is also ok for the DOD to short change his paycheck and feed him outdated food in the field just as long as he makes it home........BTW each and every american has a VESTED intrest in this corupt war both emotionally and economicly.....for my $$$$ I expect the best for each and everyone of them. Dec 13 05 11:27 pm Link Shipping dead soldiers back as freight cargo has been done for decades. It's not a new practice by any stretch of the imagination. You have to take into account the logistics involved. Flags have never remained draped over coffins during shipping/transport. Doing so would be considered a breech of flag etiquette (the flag could potentially touch the ground during shipment.) The flag should only remain on the coffin during presentation/procession. Dec 13 05 11:39 pm Link i would be more concerned about how your kids are being treated in day care centers...how is grandma being treated in that nursing home???...worry for those on the green side of the grass. Dec 13 05 11:42 pm Link I think the families biggest issue (and the local congressman who's made it his current cause) is the lack of a flag on the coffin and a bit of respect by the baggage handlers (and we know how they treat luggage). The TV station had to pump up the story by talking about the body being in the cargo hold with the baggage. Where else are they going to go? The bodies all come through the mortuary facility at Dover. I grew up in base housing and have actually been to the facility. All the bodies are escorted by an honor guard off of the military aircraft they arrive in (remember the images that had everyone up in arms from the first gulf war?) and taken into a special white hangar (not used for anything else) carried by real live pall bearers. They are then transfered to the mortuary facility for final transit to wherever they are going. The facility makes every effort to get them to their families as quickly as possible. If that means on the next military plane to a base close to them that's one thing, but if they don't live near an Air Force base, they will be transfered via commercial carrier. I, too, believe that there should be a flag on the coffin and some better protocol for the handling of military dead via commercial carrier. I also agree with the comment about military pay and support for families (it's only gotten worse since my dad retired in 1983). Think about it this way, my dad was on call, 24/7/365 due to his being on flying status, to go anywhere in the world that the government needed him to go, combat zones included, for about $40,000/yr when he retired as a Chief, that works out to about $4.65/hr. The year he was in Vietnam he was making about $13,000/yr, about $1.48/hr. You land in the middle of a fire fight in a C-123 (looks like a 2 engined baby brother of a C-130) at an Army firebase, offload troops, supplies, and take on wounded for that hourly rate. I think cops, fireman, the military, and teachers in the US are WAY underpaid for what they have to do. Sorry, my own little rant... Dec 13 05 11:48 pm Link Couldn't agree more Rick, and good point BCG. Dec 14 05 12:10 am Link William Kious wrote: What Ground??????.......The floor of a cargo hold is no different then the roller they use to support the casket....no etiquette issues here.....if you want to see the support of my point do a google search for Iraq Casket photos....here I did the work for you... Dec 14 05 12:26 am Link having been a supervisor for Pan Am, i can assure you that the fallen who come home via civilian airlines recieve the greatest amount of respect from the ground crews...i would be more concerned with the fact you wont be getting your social security and your kids will be forced to be in the 80% tax bracket just to pay the interest on the deficit. Dec 14 05 12:30 am Link where the hell is the respect? at least military flights with the flag in place, and we need to do some blowing, them, not us or friendly forces for a change. Dec 14 05 12:34 am Link As a Veteran of the United States Navy, I'm quite satisfied with how things are. It's not like they should be riding in coach for kripes sake!! At least theyâre getting here. Edit: I wonder how many posting to this thread that are upset are Veterans? Dec 14 05 12:37 am Link what blows is cnn has become the media outlet for the godless heathens who are killing and wounding them...what blows is that no one is here in san antonio covering the rehab of the fallen men and women...get your priorities str8. Dec 14 05 12:39 am Link BCG wrote: Indeed! /t Dec 14 05 02:02 am Link BCG wrote: CNN? Tonight I watched a CNN special that showed how the war had turned toward our favor in Iraq. And they portrayed the story with class (no yelling, talking heads screaming at the guests to shut up), and allowed the soilders to say what they wanted to say without interrupting them. It was very well done. Dec 14 05 02:16 am Link Tim Baker wrote: As a vetern myself, I'd be shocked to hear a ground-pounder publically say that we were losing the war. Dec 14 05 08:24 am Link The coffins are flag draped and returned to the US on military cargo planes. Depending on logistics, some are sent back to their hometowns on commercial flights in the cargo holds and again, depending on logistics there may or not be an honorguard at their hometown airport BUT there is an honorguard at the point of their orignal arrival point onto American soil. What I find really disturbing is that they sometimes play 'taps' on tape, out of a little boom box during the funeral. Dec 14 05 08:33 am Link eyetoeye-Images wrote: Well first of all, military people ask to join, sign a contract, and agree to do what they are told for a certain number of years, no questions asked. So obviously with more and more joining it can't be that bad. Dec 14 05 08:49 am Link call me crazy but i think it would be hard fitting coffins in airplane seats. Dec 14 05 08:52 am Link Wow...taps out of a boom box....that is kinda tacky in my book. And as far as those of us who don't have "people" over there not having a vested interest...give me a break. We may have less at stake emotionally but just because I'm too old and my kids are too young to go does not mean that we don't all share the cost, or the responsibility for the actions of our country. Nor does it mean that we do not care about what happens. Dec 14 05 09:53 am Link Krystina Rainey wrote: Yeah... well... we brought the war over there, right? Dec 14 05 11:34 am Link As of February of this year 60+ Photojounalists have lost their lives in Iraq (all were colleagues, some were acquaintances and 2 friends of mine). This insurgency touches everyone in one way or another. I came back in 01 and swore it would be my last hot zone ever. I changed my direction in within my chosen field to a kinder more artistic venue. Do I miss it...sometimes. Will I ever go back, never. Just my 2 cents Dec 14 05 11:46 am Link Im'age NY (INY) wrote: Sorry to hear that! Dec 14 05 11:51 am Link My brother was just killed in Iraq and his body was treated with respect including the American Flag covering his casket. His body was then escorted off the plane by local military here in Georgia. Within 48 hours, President Bush phoned my father's home and expressed his condolences. I hear what a lot of people are saying, but this administration is doing good in areas as well. Dec 14 05 12:24 pm Link Chance wrote: I don't know you, but I mean it when I extend you my sincere condolences! Dec 14 05 12:29 pm Link Thank you Udo Dec 14 05 12:31 pm Link |
