Cogito Ergo Zoom wrote:

That guy was just getting his jollies off, you need to come see me next time you do erotic work in SC 

Any type of interaction between the model and photographer should always be discussed before hand. If you agree to take it further then that's something you will have time to think about before the shoot begins.

I always get confused.  when they speak of 'film' are they talking about a very thin condom or a photographic technology?

Krystal Chandelier wrote:
He was grinding on us as if he was being filmed and shoving his face into our crotches, and rubbing his nose on our vagina's back and forth as if he was being filmed. He had me take the photos of him and the other female model because their wasn't anybody else too and he filmed me and him telling me he would take still shots from the film.

In the end the photos with the female model and I as well as the male model turned out awesome. The photographer said the photos with him didn't come out the way he wanted and wanted a redo.

I want to give the guy the benefit of the doubt, but my guess is he's trying to pull on over on you!  and by "pull one over on you" i mean he wants to sniff your vagina again. 

My question is, is that what your suppose to do during an erotic photo shoot

you do what is discussed before hand.  If you are okay with him rubbing his face in your snatch.....

and is it okay for him to get a hard on?

you'll get lots of different answers about this issue. 


I've seen some very good erotic work that included photos of the photographer.  Then I've seen some bad work. 

Even though I want to give this guy the benefit of the doubt, my guess is his mind wasn't on the work...... and it still isn't on the work.....

Vasilisa-art wrote:
So...since I don't do spread shots and a photographer's never photographed my anus I'm not a nude model?

Better go tell my mum I'm not doing nudes any more...and never did.

I'm gonna have to cancel our shoot.

Buna Photo wrote:
EROTICA is the sensual and/or artistic depiction of a nude model in a manner so as to arouse an intense emotional or physical reaction without portrayal explicit sexual acts.
PORNOGRAPHY is the depiction of explicit sexual acts for the sole purpose of sexually exciting the viewer.

i have shot explicit sexual acts in an artistic manner (or so they say).....  There are others who shoot similar content.  erotica according to your definition or porno?

Jessyka Ann wrote:
ick. personally I dont like hairy crotch.

This. Bravo! smooth is cool...

Stevie Lynn Leow wrote:
You're either naked or you're not. Done.

exactamundo

Shizam1 wrote:
Very technical, and you said anus a lot

I just finished corresponding with a model where I said I wanted to do some topless photos of her, and she said ok.

Then I get an e-mail that says - "You don't mean full frontal do you?"

I responded - No shirt, no bra, boobs hanging out for the world to see.  Now she wasn't so keen on "topless".

I mean come on!  Even before I got into photography I knew what topless meant, and so did most people I know.  It's a general term meaning man/woman with no covering on their upper torso!

I had a model respond to a casting call for fine art nudes.  Her question?  "Does that mean that I have to take my clothes off?"

Sometimes you just can't over-explain.  Good job, OP!

I have a somewhat shorter version that I cut and paste into every confirmation email involving any degree of nudity.

that_carioca wrote:
Interesting discussion...
Every time I am invited to a project, I mention that I do not do frontal nude, close up even less porn (no toys or "faking it").
If the talk goes on and a mood board is sent,  some times I get a girl in gynaecological position!

I was looking for a definition for this terms some time ago.

Eagle Rock Photographer wrote:
you could add this as addendum to your model release...

Everyone defines these terms differently. Spell out what YOU will or will not do. Place this in your profile: "I do not do frontal nude, close up even less porn (no toys or "faking it")."

Buna Photo wrote:
I had a model ask me, in a very detailed way, to tell her what I thought was an implied nude shot, and tell her in a detailed and clear way . I started writing, and realized that there was a lot that went into my views and over the years I have had to answer many connecting and similar questions for models. So I decided to write it all down and save it so that it was all available for any model that asked.

Here is what I came up with. It is a bit graphic, but only to be clear and precise.

I know not everyone will agree with me, after all I was asked what I think because not everyone thinks the same. I'd like to get some model feed back, what you agree with, and what you don't, and possibly why.

Thanks
Tim

Implied, Topless & Nude
I don’t know how many models I have heard from that think that they can still wear a bra and panties in an implied nude shot.

To me the breakdown is simple:
NUDE : “wearing no clothes”, which means no clothing of any kind, and every inch of your body may be photographed .
IMPLIED NUDE : “to make wearing no clothes understood without expressing it directly”  it would require a model to be nude but her genitalia, anus, and nipples would be covered in a photograph .
TOPLESS : “wearing no covering over the breasts or upper torso” would allow anything but a models genitalia and anus to be photographed .
IMPLIED TOPLESS:  to make wearing no covering over the breasts or upper torso understood without expressing it directly”  would allow a model to wear clothing that covers her genitalia and anus, but would require her to be topless. her nipples would be covered in a photograph .

For clarification purposes I understand female genitalia to the Vulva which includes the labia majora, clitoral hood, labia minora, and clitoris include basically everything from the top of the labia majora  crack or “crease” in front to the back side or base of the vaginal opening. Anus is the rectal opening and immediate surrounding area. Nipples are exactly and only that, although I consider her areola generally off limits too, but I have been known to Photoshop out a little areola if I have to. Although not included technically in the 3 areas listed above I consider the "taint" or perineum, the area between the base of the vaginal opening and the anus to be off limits for non nude shoots. I do not consider butt crack whether partially covered or completely visible to be nudity, just like you can wear a g-string at the beach and not be indecent.

In most implied topless or implied nude settings I would assume that the models nipples, anus, or genitalia may occasionally be visible to the photographer but should never be intentionally photographed. I would suspect that during an implied topless or implied nude shoot that it would be all but impossible to keep a models nipples, anus, or genitalia hidden from view at all times. I do also think that any model that is serious and professional about her work understands that there may be times when she is "overexposed" in front of a photographer, but in dealing with a professional photographer that situation should never be taken advantage of. All said there needs to be a certain amount of trust in the connection between model and photographer to create outstanding images.

It is entirely possible that model can be completely unclothed in a photo but because of the pose or the angle of the shot her vulva is not visible; I would not consider that shooting nude, but rather Topless with Implied Nudity. I don’t not consider models, who only expose only their breasts in photos, to be nude models either. Visible pubic hair does not mean nudity either, in most cases it’s just a little trashy. I look at cleavage, butt crack and front crease similarly, all are for lack of a better word exciting, but do not necessarily constitute nudity. 

Nudity, Erotica & Pornography
I shoot nudity, and the occasional Erotica, but nothing I consider Pornographic. It has nothing to do with morals, religious beliefs, whether or not it has artistic value, It is just an agreement I have made with my fiancé.

Here is how I view 18+ photography.
NUDITY is the celebration of the unclothed human figure. Photography of this sort has no intention of eliciting any sexual response or feelings in the viewer, but for some it may.
EROTICA is the sensual and/or artistic depiction of a nude model in a manner so as to arouse an intense emotional or physical reaction without portrayal explicit sexual acts.
PORNOGRAPHY is the depiction of explicit sexual acts for the sole purpose of sexually exciting the viewer.

I often use the Magazine names commonly used to describe the specific type of 18+ photography being discussed.
MAXIM: essentially clothed or partially clothed Erotica.
PLAYBOY: Erotica with no visible vulva, what I like to call almost nude.
PENTHOUSE: Nude Erotica with visible vulva, what I call nude.
HUSTLER: Pornographic with visible vagina and/or penetration.

To help models better understand what type of shots I feel fall into what category without having images to show I will describe some hypothetical shots for you. Any implied shot I would consider Maxim style, along with most Bikini, and Lingerie work. Maxim is the style I shoot most, I like my images to grab the viewers attention with beauty and sensuality, and provoke that emotional or physical response. Most topless shots , shots where the model has her legs closed, or shots where her hips are turned as to not show the pubic area I would consider Playboy style. You may also see the very front of the labia majora or as I call it front “crease” in a Playboy style shot. Penthouse has changed over the last 5 years, I use to consider them hard core pornography, but now they are very similar to playboy with the exception that not every model has to be a fake chest‘d blond. Penthouse style shots are ones where most of the parts of the models vulva may be visible, while her legs may or may not be spread. Shots with spread open legs, visible labia minora, (ladyhawk), clitoris or anus are also considered Penthouse style. While some models do, I never use the term “spreads” in reference to legs, it refers to the labia minora. If a model has open or spread apart labia minora (lips) and she is not actively spreading her lips in the photo, it is pushing the limits, but I would consider that Penthouse style as well. If a model is actively spreading her labia minora in the photograph, or her vaginal opening is gaping (pink shot) then that is where I consider the image to be pornographic and thus Hustler style. Other Hustler style shots would include any simulated or actual sexual act, simulated or actual masturbation, and penetration by fingers, toy or other item. A shot of a models face, or upper body only while she is masturbating would not be pornographic. Shots that show only the breasts, buttocks, or vulva like partial figure or close ups would also not necessarily be considered pornographic. Context is always a consideration, and these generalizations about style are not absolute. I purposely have not touched on bondage or other types of work that some mage consider fetish. I have no personal experience in that area and choose to let someone more versed than I handle that.

Buna Photo wrote:
. . .

gary yong wrote:
Could you please define the word  fetish for us

Eight year old zombie thread.
The OP has left the building and can hardly answer the question.

Mark Salo wrote:
Eight year old zombie thread.
The OP has left the building and can hardly answer the question.

Oh, what a relief! I was just about to jump in on this one!

Thanks, Mark!

John Jebbia  wrote:
Interesting to go through and click the profiles on this thread and find how many of them are no longer members. I, on the other hand am like a bad fart. I never go away!

I had a similar experience when skimming through the escort thread (you know which one I am referring too.) Kind of fascinating to see who was still around and who wasn't and - sadly - who have passed away.

Jason McKendricks wrote:

I had a similar experience when skimming through the escort thread (you know which one I am referring too.) Kind of fascinating to see who was still around and who wasn't and - sadly - who have passed away.

The escort thread is still alive?

"IMPLIED NUDE : “to make wearing no clothes understood without expressing it directly”  it would require a model to be nude but her genitalia, anus, and nipples would be covered in a photograph"

<<< uh No! that is still nude, just not explicit. The only thing you're implying here is that she has nipples under there and normal genitals under that hand or piece of fabric.
Now if those parts or parts of it were Off the frame, Yes she could be wearing clothing off the frame view which in turn would appear "implied nude" because we see a full image of just skin parts but for all we know she is actually dressed outside the borders of the viewfinder, we don't know for sure.

Come On People, lets get this shit right once and for all.

Greg Kolack wrote:

The escort thread is still alive?

Sorry it took so long to respond. The thread is indeed still alive.

https://www.modelmayhem.com/forums/post/27501

Jason McKendricks wrote:

Sorry it took so long to respond. The thread is indeed still alive.

https://www.modelmayhem.com/forums/post/27501

It was locked 11 years ago...

Greg Kolack wrote:

It was locked 11 years ago...

Ah, I may have misinterpreted what you meant by "alive". I had simply meant it was not hidden away like many of the epic threads in MM's past.