|
Forums >
Model Colloquy >
Bringing an escort to a shoot.
The only thing irritatingly hypocritical about this issue, considering what I've seen people saying on here is: A model has a bad experience with a photographer: She's told to just suck it up and understand that it comes with the territory. Resorting to bringing an escort is still, like, rude and stuff, and you're putting the photographer at risk, and blah blah blah. A photographer has a bad experience with an escort: No escorts again ever! It's silly and ridiculous for a model to even want one. Doesn't she realize what a HUGE risk that is to ME? It seems to be the norm that the photographer's concerns always outweigh the models concerns. And I don't think it's a coincidence that this dynamic exists whilst most photographers are male and most models are female. But when it really comes down to it, it's pointless to tell someone else what's best for them to do in this regard. Different people have different tolerance levels for risk. Some people are easily distracted by the presence of another person who isn't really do anything useful. Some people don't care and are able to work as they usually would if the person were not there. Some people feel more confident in their ability to protect themselves, others do not. Some have had more bad experiences than others. Some have never had a bad experience at all. There are too many variables involved to come up with any concrete "rule" that could universally apply to everyone. So just do whatever you feel is best for you based on the factors you have to deal with. Simple as that. Jan 19 16 03:43 pm Link gotta love to hate this place. Within hours of this thread being resurrected, I get contacted by models, wanting to shoot TFP, with profiles which state that they bring escorts to all shoots, no exceptions. Jan 21 16 10:02 am Link Hero Foto wrote: I just ask them if the escort goes around the world. - Blank stare.. Jan 21 16 10:44 am Link Neurotica Photography wrote: Well said. Jan 21 16 06:33 pm Link Hero Foto wrote: No Exceptions, No TFP Session. Jan 21 16 11:20 pm Link TerrysPhotocountry wrote: QFT. Jan 22 16 03:10 am Link I'm a female photographer. My husband is also a photographer and at times is my lighting assistant. I let both male and female models know that he will be on set as my assistant. If I have a MUA or hairstylist at my apt/studio, I let them know that too. Once the lighting tests are done, he fades away and doesn't interfere. Most don't have issues. I shot a model who brought her "comfort" dog with her. She explained the dog helps with her anxiety when she drives. I didn't have a problem because it was an underwater shoot in a yard. Another model, always brings her mother. Also an underwater shoot so it wasn't a problem. Mom was a doll. But shooting in a small space where I had 4 models, 3 MUAs and 2 hair stylist, I had to say no to her. Jan 22 16 04:56 am Link For what it’s worth, here is my take on things: The single most important thing a model needs to do is to carefully look at the photographer’s work and to really observe how he sees women. If he continually puts woman in sleazy outfits and poses - even if he doesn’t do anything inappropriate - they’re still going to dealing with a guy who likes his women tacky. If they are nervous about their physical safety - the should check out the photographer’s website and references. They might want to be extra careful if they are going to his apartment as opposed to a professional studio. They should tell friends where they are going and plan on texting them periodically. If they want to have a friend drop them off and and meet the photographer, personally, I have no problem with that. I always tell them that if my hunchback and limp freak them both out, they’re free to walk out. But that’s where it ends for me. Once the shoot starts, I have no interest in somebody standing just off camera watching me work. Even worse is when the model keeps looking off camera for their friend’s approval. She needs to be focusing on me and my approval and my feedback. And if they promise their escort won’t watch, that means they are “exploring" my studio while I’m distracted shooting. That’s not something I’m ever gonna feel comfortable with. Jan 22 16 05:38 pm Link There are basicly 2 answers, they depend on the reputation & depth of experience of the photographer and the experience of the model 1. if you are an established "known" photographer with your own studio and your name on the door, you may not have to put up with models who'd like to bring an escort. 2. if you are a new photographer, just starting to use experienced or inexperienced models, allowing or encouraging an escort makes your intentions clear. 3. In either case, if you are using a model who is new or inexperienced, saying an escort that won't interfere is welcome, makes them feel much more comfortable. I think the horror stories about boyfriends some of the photographers are telling are myths. Of the few models I've used who did bring an escort (only about 1/3), it was always a girlfriend, never a boyfriend. It seems that the offer of allowing them to bring an escort usually makes them comfortable and they don't bring an escort The studio I rent is a little small, so the escort usually stays in the dressing room or the lobby The attitude that an experienced photographer "doesn't have to put up with model's escorts" is just arrogant. Why not work with a new model's fears, build a relationship and give a new model a good first few experiences with modeling. On the other hand, if you ego is so big that you'd rather use a different model than your first choice who wants an escort, then use your second runner up by all means Jan 22 16 05:40 pm Link I really don't get it why these arrogant photographers think a model should suck it up and take the risk if they want to be a model? There should be no "risk" in being a model. Jan 22 16 05:53 pm Link Douglas Aurand wrote: You just keep thinking that. Jan 23 16 01:49 am Link crx studios wrote: So if a model gets a call from Joel-Peter Witkin or Nobuyoshi Araki they should slam the phone down? Jan 23 16 02:17 am Link or if Jimmy Savile picks up a camera.. Jan 23 16 08:03 am Link Douglas Aurand wrote: It's a job plain and simple. Check references and if they think they "need" an escort they shouldn't be doing the shoot at all. Jan 23 16 08:16 am Link R.EYE.R wrote: Yeah, well, Jimmy Saville used to grope people on live TV in front of a studio audience. No number of escorts would have deterred that guy. Jan 23 16 02:07 pm Link I personally do not mind escorts even if it's a BF as long as everyone is professional and no one gets in the way. I've never had to do this, but if an escort was an issue, i would ask the escort to leave or I will leave.  Jan 27 16 11:47 pm Link This debate has been going on since before MM even existed. If a model wants an escort, that's fine. She can find plenty of photographers who allow or even encourage it. If a photographer doesn't want to allow escorts, that's fine too. There are plenty of models who work without them. There is something for everyone here. Arguing back and forth about the pro's and con's is futile. If there was ever going to be a consensus about this issue, it would have been figured out many years and several thousand threads ago. Jan 31 16 12:15 am Link Unless the escort is heavy set bf/gf threatening to punch the living day-lights out of me, I won't really object. I'd prefer them not ambling around and messing with stuff. Rather help in the shoot by holding a reflector/diffuser, or a light. Talking too much, directing the model is a strict no-no. Having said that, I am yet to face such an intrusive escort. Most of my shoots have been solo, and in public places. I make my escort rules amply clear while discussing the project with the model Jan 31 16 01:59 am Link Lieza Nova wrote: Agreeing with this completely. Jan 31 16 03:33 am Link I generally avoid models who insist on bringing a chaperon (I prefer that word to "escort"). I shot with a few early on, and never had a problem with the chaperons. They all stayed out of the way and most were even quite helpful taking down and packing away equipment afterwards. Many of the models who wanted to bring them, however, were very difficult, full of drama, and just generally unpleasant to shoot with. I've never had a problem with an "escort", but I have had problems with the girls who brought them. Of course, not all were like that, but there were enough to form a real association in my mind between "escort" and an unpleasant shoot. Two exceptions to this are girls who instead of telling me they were bringing an "escort", informed me that they needed an "assistant" to help carry their things and that they would provide their own. If you want to bring someone with you, call that person an "assistant", give them something to carry, and the two of you will probably be much more well received. Jan 31 16 05:48 pm Link Lieza Nova wrote: +1 Jan 31 16 06:33 pm Link Good luckJan 31 16 08:04 pm Link This is coming from a young model. I started when I was 17, only going to shoots with another model. I turned 18, and I went to one shoot alone. Nothing bad happened. But bags, shoes, minor hair and makeup fixes. My friend came to the next few shoots. My experience, a photographer has never told me I could not bring an escort. It is also in my profile one of my 2 escorts will be with me. One is my male manager. He's been in the industry a while, published, ect. He has my best interest. Not like I think a photographer is going to try to get me to shoot and try anything twisted. Does he want a bad rep out there? No. **Side note about would you bring an escort to full time jobs. I shoot nude. I am getting naked. I have also stripped. Do you go to a strip club that does not have body guards, which is the same as an escort. So YES I do have an escort at my job. ** Side note about the safety thing. I myself have huge social anxiety. Modeling is probably the weirdest thing to choose when you have this, but I love modeling, the images, the people i get to meet. But I always have to have an escort for this reason. Feb 09 16 06:33 pm Link MichelleNikkita wrote: So, you have a sluggo? I think this will not go so well. Feb 09 16 06:44 pm Link MichelleNikkita wrote: 2 escorts? Feb 11 16 07:53 am Link MichelleNikkita wrote: Most of my shoots are nude shoots. If you bring an escort "There will be No Shoot!" Feb 11 16 08:00 am Link Derek Ridgers wrote: I might also add Helmut Newton, Ionesco, and Hamilton Feb 11 16 10:32 am Link MichelleNikkita wrote: I would allow a female to be your assistant. The male manager, no way ever. What industry is he in? Wht would I want to be second guessed by your "manager". Does he book all your shoots? Does he answer all the PMs? Feb 11 16 10:40 am Link Risen Phoenix Photo wrote: I have often wondered why a part time freelance model needs a manager. Feb 11 16 11:43 am Link I love the Mayhem! Feb 11 16 12:02 pm Link I love these threads, they go on forever around and around and never seem to resolve a single thing. However I do notice a pattern, those that speak out pro escort are generally new and inexperienced. Those against escorts tend to be experienced and have been around for quite a while. Does it mean anything maybe not a lot. Though it does seem to support the theory that eventually, models learn that demanding an escort holds them back and eventually all photographers will have enough escorts present as a problem on a shoot and cause them to move away from being pro escort. Yes, when I was new I did allow escorts. Due to having too many shoots derailed I generally will no longer shoot a model that requires an escort. But that's just what works best for me, your mileage may vary. Feb 11 16 04:40 pm Link Revenge Photography wrote: They are not meant to, if you know what I mean. The purpose of these threads is something else entirely.. Feb 11 16 07:53 pm Link ^ This user gets it! Feb 11 16 08:00 pm Link I strongly prefer for the models to bring an escort with them, especially when shooting with me the first time or out on location. What if you deal with a model who has a mental illness and whilst the shoot might go down well at the time, she later outs to others claiming to others that you as a photographer took advantage of her, or attacked her or made her feel uncomfortable in one way or another? I've been in the position of having a female model/musician who had a couple of serious mental illnesses alone with me at a practice session. It went down well, but her mind could play tricks on her and she would get delusions, and then after I dropped her home she told her folks (and mind you she was 27 years old at the time) that I had taken her into a back street and attacked her. And there was nobody to vouch for me, and her parents went along with it and told me to never ever contact her again. So my advice to photographers is in this biz you can never be too careful. There are erratic models and artists out there, and believe me some of them are very conniving in trying to ruin a photographer's otherwise good name. So be careful. Always have somebody else present at the shoots who can have your back in case something might go wrong. Feb 11 16 11:12 pm Link Dario Western wrote: In this business, productions only hire working pros from legit reputable agencies. No erratic, mentally illed, full of drama model-wannabes. Feb 12 16 01:56 am Link Dario Western wrote: A good thing she didn't have a crazy or dishonest escort with her because then there could be a witness and you could be locked up. Feb 12 16 02:41 am Link rmjpix wrote: ...........................enough, exactly................ Feb 12 16 03:09 am Link I encourage models to bring an escort (parents, sibling, friend) because I want to let them know that they can trust me. This is especially true if they are under 21. I also like when these guests start helping me with shots. I usually don’t like a lot of people at the shoot because it takes away from my ability to (1) get to know the creative team and (2) do my job well. You see, it's often a distraction to have a party going on when you're racing the clock and trying to chase light. What I don't like is when they bring a boyfriend (or really anyone who isn't encouraging) who makes it impossible for the model to relax. I discourage bringing photographer friends. Makes me very uncomfortable when they start stealing shots without my knowledge. That's a major faux pas in my book. Feb 12 16 08:28 am Link I am 17 and I of course bring my mother along to shoots. No photographer I've worked with has ever had a problem with it, they've all described my mom as completely helpful and patient. Even after I turn 18, I still plan on bringing her along at least for a few months. You shouldn't have a problem with it right off the bat, most escorts won't cause a problem Feb 18 16 10:40 pm Link Jensen Skinner wrote: Having a parent present when you are 17 is appropriate. Feb 19 16 08:21 am Link |
