Connor Photography wrote:
We are in the seller's market.  Not enough houses on the market. 

which was the same scenario before the Housing market crash..Buy in now and pay top Dollar, lose Your ass with the next 'adjustment'.

I'll also disagree about Buying in over ones head, technically You can't without fudging the numbers or committing some type of fraud, besides, this is called being House poor, when the majority of funds are used to pay a Mortgage leaving very little to live on. No one wants to be House poor.

I will recommend to anyone looking to purchase a Home that they seek an (ethical) Realtor who has an ABR designation. What most consumers don't realize is that Real Estate Agencies are hired by the Seller to Market and Sell their property on the best terms and at the best possible price for the Seller. An ABR (Accredited Buyer Representative) designated Agent is fully versed in representing the Buyer in a transaction, with the Buyers best interest in mind.

Connor Photography wrote:
Looknsee, I share your view wholeheartedly.  It is unfortunate that so many people fail to see the pluses of owning your own home.  They set up so many road blocks in their head, they fail before they even start.  They don't have the gut and determination to go around the obstacle to reach their goals.   

No one here asks them to live beyond their means.  But there is nothing wrong to purchase a house that is a bit more than you can afford.  In a few years, when your finances catch up and mortgage payment remains the same, you will be golden.  One must learn how to manage their money wisely and save. Of course he or she has to have a stable job and career that they can grow.   If this is not the case, one must better themselves to compete, laying down a good foundation is the key when you are still young and capable.  You must learn how to sell yourself in front of the potential employer. 

Our society has lost its "can do" attitude.  Buying your first house is just a stepping stone in life.  I always use hardship in life as a learning lesson that God assigns me to do.  I don't feel bitter about hardship in life, because i know it will pass.   If you are healthy and mentally stable with a loving family behind you, you can create your own luck and make it big. 

I wish people start believing in themselves, and more importantly put it into action and fight.like hell.  If I can make it and my uneducated parents can make it, everyone can make it.  Oh yeah, owning a home is just small part.

Do you suggest people working freelance or on a contract job (definite end date) to purchase a home?
Let's throw in they don't have any down payment either.

Let's even say they do a FHA loan and don't have that small percentage to put down.
Not even an emergency fund for repairs.

Many people are in this scenario.

Jules NYC wrote:
Just to add and another reason I posed the question -

I meet many people acting superior that all they had to do was hook up with someone with money.
No hard work, no struggle, just a "WE're pregnant!" and the rest is home ownership.

Half of the time these women don't even have to get married lest be preggo.

I remember your other thread. 

Jerry Nemeth wrote:

I remember your other thread. 

What thread?

Jules NYC wrote:

What thread?

About conniving women getting pregnant to trap a man.

Jules NYC wrote:
Just to add and another reason I posed the question -

I meet many people acting superior that all they had to do was hook up with someone with money.
No hard work, no struggle, just a "WE're pregnant!" and the rest is home ownership.

Half of the time these women don't even have to get married lest be preggo.

You can also enter the HGTV sweepstakes and possibly win a house somewhere! We keep entering that, but so far no luck :-(

I had a neighbor (2 houses down the street from my first house) in PA where the owner died and left the house to the mailman. Interesting house too... she had bought a castle in Germany, had it dismantled and shipped here and then built a house around it.

Another true story was much more recent... an old friend of my wife lived in a little apartment near the beach (Santa Monica, CA), barely getting by on his bartending job. He used to help the owner out  with small repairs and things around the building, and eventually became the guy's unofficial caretaker when he got very old and sick. My wife's friend wound up, quite by surprise, inheriting the whole 20 unit building. At first he was completely befuddled and struggling with how to deal with this big change in his life, but now 3 years later, he's adjusted and doing quite well.

So... getting pregnant isn't always the only way.... who knows what surprises the universe has in store for us!

Jerry Nemeth wrote:

About conniving women getting pregnant to trap a man.

Ahhh, how could I forget? lol


There are some things in life I don't 'get'.  If you happen to meet someone that is blessed with good fortune, nothing wrong with that.  There is also nothing wrong with someone who wants a financially stable person.  Thing is, a lot of people live a charmed life without understanding how hard it is to acquire 'things' by hard work.

There was a time where it wasn't that difficult to buy a house.  Today, it isn't that easy without a running start.

Lightcraft Studio wrote:

You can also enter the HGTV sweepstakes and possibly win a house somewhere! We keep entering that, but so far no luck :-(

I had a neighbor (2 houses down the street from my first house) in PA where the owner died and left the house to the mailman. Interesting house too... she had bought a castle in Germany, had it dismantled and shipped here and then built a house around it.

Another true story was much more recent... an old friend of my wife lived in a little apartment near the beach (Santa Monica, CA), barely getting by on his bartending job. He used to help the owner out  with small repairs and things around the building, and eventually became the guy's unofficial caretaker when he got very old and sick. My wife's friend wound up, quite by surprise, inheriting the whole 20 unit building. At first he was completely befuddled and struggling with how to deal with this big change in his life, but now 3 years later, he's adjusted and doing quite well.

So... getting pregnant isn't always the only way.... who knows what surprises the universe has in store for us!

Just Wow!

I should enter the HGTV contest; I like that idea!

If I win, I will surely let you know.
lol

The universe certainly does have surprises for us all!
Is it like Santa Claus?  I've been a good girl type of thing?

Cosmically I should get a return on my good deeds.
haha

sospix wrote:
I have a family living in one house here locally that would really like to buy it (and, I think I'd be willing to sell in a few years, at least to them)  .  .  .  having sold houses to long term tenants in the past, I've learned (sometimes the hard way) that the down payment is a necessity to have all parties involved reach an understanding that they're no longer in a "tenant/landlord" situation, and have moved on to a "buyer/seller" scenario.

My story involves that first house of mine (<1,000 sq. ft; cost me <$90K; now worth >$1M).  I lived there happily for a few years, but bought my second house (even closer to work).  I decided to remodel that second house, increasing its size to ~2500 sq. ft.  On the day we got our building permits, the Bay Area experienced that 7.1 earthquake that brought down a section of the Bay Bridge & interrupted the World Series.  The remodeling took a few months, I moved in, and rented my first house to a young woman.  She kept the property neat and paid her rent on time for seven years.

Seven years later, I decide to leave California for Portland, Oregon (where I am now).  I decide to sell both my California houses, and when I visited that first house (after appropriate forewarning to the tenant) to show my realtor, the tenant was there.  I told her then & there that I was going to sell the house, and I suggested that her mortgage would be roughly the same as her rent.  I suggested that since she stayed here for seven years, she clearly liked the property & if she bought it, we'd offer her a good deal.  Which we did.  We gave her a break on the price, a break on the realtor commission, and I did more "repairs" than were necessary after the inspection.

Little did I know that her boyfriend was a fledgling lawyer.  A couple of years later, he sent me a "demand" letter, claiming that the property was damaged by the 7.1 earthquake.  So, I replied...
...  My best source of info about any potential damage was from my tenant, who didn't report any
     damage in the seven years of her occupancy,
...  They would have to prove that I knew about damage & didn't disclose it, and since I didn't know
     of any damage...
...  His letter referenced "witnesses" -- I asked him for the names & contact info for these witnesses,
and so on.  They never did reply to that letter of mine.

As an aside, I would never carry a buyer's mortgage.  I just don't know enough about banking & what to do when things go wrong.

Connor Photography wrote:
Looknsee, I share your view wholeheartedly.  It is unfortunate that so many people fail to see the pluses of owning your own home.  They set up so many road blocks in their head, they fail before they even start.  They don't have the gut and determination to go around the obstacle to reach their goals.   

No one here asks them to live beyond their means.  But there is nothing wrong to purchase a house that is a bit more than you can afford.  In a few years, when your finances catch up and mortgage payment remains the same, you will be golden.  One must learn how to manage their money wisely and save. Of course he or she has to have a stable job and career that they can grow.   ...

Y'know -- I think I've been super-lucky.  I think I timed my real estate purchases right in the middle of a golden age of real estate.

I think it might be more difficult to dip a toe into real estate today.  In good areas, real estate prices have skyrocketed while wages have stagnated.  That makes it so much more difficult to buy a decent first house, because the purchase requires a significant down payment plus a significant monthly commitment for the PITI.

FIFTYONE PHOTOGRAPHY wrote:
which was the same scenario before the Housing market crash..Buy in now and pay top Dollar, lose Your ass with the next 'adjustment'.

I'll also disagree about Buying in over ones head, technically You can't without fudging the numbers, this is called being House poor.

No one has a crystal ball to predict when the next housing crash or how deep it will go.  I prefer treating real estate as a a long term investment, but not a get rich quick tool. The market will always come back up; just like stocks.  If you can qualify the mortgage and able to meet the payment, you can weather the storm when housing is down.  The problem is not the housing crash; but if your job is secure or not in the crash.  One must make that determination themselves. 

House poor means many things to many people.  One has to decide how much risk they are willing to bear; this is personal.  My guiding principle is that I like my housing cost (either mortgage or rent)  at around 20 to 25% of my total income.  When we bought our house our mortgage went up to 33% of our income.  We are certainly not considered house poor; many other do not agree.  I know of many went up 40% of their income.   

Some people willing to take the risk, some people don't.  Who are we to judge them or laughing at them being house poor?

Jules NYC wrote:
There was a time where it wasn't that difficult to buy a house.  Today, it isn't that easy without a running start.

Things in that regard really haven't changed, if anything, its easier now more than ever before.

According to the Census Bureau, home ownership rates were around 48% back in 1890. In 1950 it was 55%.... in 1970 it was 63%... they're still around 64% now.

On the other hand its easier in some other countries... percentages in the 80's in places like Russia, Estonia, Latvia, Mexico, India, Croatia, Slovakia... but lower (50's and 40's) in Switzerland, Denmark, Austria, Germany, Hong Kong, England, etc.

Looknsee Photography wrote:
I think it might be more difficult to dip a toe into real estate today.  In good areas, real estate prices have skyrocketed while wages have stagnated.  That makes it so much more difficult to buy a decent first house, because the purchase requires a significant down payment plus a significant monthly commitment for the PITI.

With due respect, I am not sure if I agree.  Father told me all the time, land does not grow on trees. There is a limited supply. 

I agree that housing is very expensive now, it is not easy to go into the business. But it is all relative.  If we can turn back the time back to the 60's or 70's, the people who are complaining about the current price of real estate is expensive will do the some complain about the price in the 60's. 

For those who can figure out a way wins.    Humans are created equal, but those who are putting their hearts and souls into their dreams will come ahead. 

Yes, we both were lucky.  But there was no free lunch given to us.  We created our own luck.

Connor Photography wrote:
With due respect, I am not sure if I agree.  Father told me all the time, land does not grow on trees. There is a limited supply.

My father used to say that too!

He also used to say "There are two types of people in the world:  property owners and property renters". That one really stuck in my mind.

Lightcraft Studio wrote:

Things in that regard really haven't changed, if anything, its easier now more than ever before.

According to the Census Bureau, home ownership rates were around 48% back in 1890. In 1950 it was 55%.... in 1970 it was 63%... they're still around 64% now.

On the other hand its easier in some other countries... percentages in the 80's in places like Russia, Estonia, Latvia, Mexico, India, Croatia, Slovakia... but lower (50's and 40's) in Switzerland, Denmark, Austria, Germany, Hong Kong, England, etc.

I'm pretty conservative about owning a HUGE debt.  I think one needs to have something saved in case of an emergency and a down payment to start.

The next order of business is actually LIKING your job.  I know, I know, not everyone does but imagine not digging your job, worried about when it will end and having this ginormous debt?!

To me even 100K is a shit ton of money!!!!!!!!

Jules NYC wrote:
There was a time where it wasn't that difficult to buy a house.  Today, it isn't that easy without a running start.

I believe this is true.  10 years ago when I bought my house, I had to go through the ringer to get qualified and win the bid.  I felt like I was being interrogated.  It was stressful and I was pissed.  But, I knew it was going to be worth it.  Haha, I thought I just had to sign papers and hand them a check.  lol

A few years prior to when I bought, my mom, a real estate agent, was telling me that almost anyone could buy a house.  There were people making half what I make being approved for twice the loan amount.  These people eventually couldn't make their mortgage payments and lost their house.  But, they've stopped all that nonsense.

Lightcraft Studio wrote:
Things in that regard really haven't changed, if anything, its easier now more than ever before.

According to the Census Bureau, home ownership rates were around 48% back in 1890. In 1950 it was 55%.... in 1970 it was 63%... they're still around 64% now.

So between 1970 to 2017, 47 years, it's only gained 1%.  While 1950 to 1970, 20 years, it gained 8%.  If anything, that only shows it is harder to buy a house today.

Jules NYC wrote:

I'm pretty conservative about owning a HUGE debt.  I think one needs to have something saved in case of an emergency and a down payment to start.

The next order of business is actually LIKING your job.  I know, I know, not everyone does but imagine not digging your job, worried about when it will end and having this ginormous debt?!

To me even 100K is a shit ton of money!!!!!!!!

It is a lot of money... certainly!

And yes, buying a home is the single biggest financial commitment most of us will ever do in our entire lives... so it is something to be taken very seriously and done with a lot of thought.

Any time I bought a house I did think long and hard. There were times when banks and brokers would say "with your current income you can get a much bigger house".... but I always thought about what would happen if I were to lose my job. Even buying modestly, I would have been totally screwed in about 2 months if something happened to my job.  That's a big consideration for sure.

But, as they say... "you can't steal second base without first taking your foot off first base". Manage your risks, do your homework and make wise choices, and give it your best shot.

Lightcraft Studio wrote:
He also used to say "There are two types of people in the world:  property owners and property renters". That one really stuck in my mind.

I always say to my employees:  We need CEO and we need even more Walmart greeters in our society, decide for yourself what is the best path for you. 

I am willing to open the door for you; the rest is up to you.

Connor Photography wrote:
I always say to my employees:  We need CEO and we need even more Walmart greeters in our society, decide for yourself what is the best path for you.

I was always very much a contrarian in that regard. I turned down promotions to VP several times because I didn't want to wind up like so many "executives" we had... no one knew what they did other than hold pointless meetings all the time.

I did software development, and even though I did have teams working for me I still kept the luxury of being able to assign to myself the most challenging parts of projects. I liked programming, and knew that by keeping my skills current I was portable... I could go anywhere if need me.  I had to worry about mortgage payments.

I was the only non-VP in my large corporation to enter that select class of people the IRS calls the "Highly Compensated Executives" which means all sorts of IRS rules and paperwork.... I always said screw the title... but I'll take the money, the stock options, the big office with the window.... and that somehow always worked out for me (and the companies I worked for).

Lightcraft Studio wrote:

It is a lot of money... certainly!

And yes, buying a home is the single biggest financial commitment most of us will ever do in our entire lives... so it is something to be taken very seriously and done with a lot of thought.

Any time I bought a house I did think long and hard. There were times when banks and brokers would say "with your current income you can get a much bigger house".... but I always thought about what would happen if I were to lose my job. Even buying modestly, I would have been totally screwed in about 2 months if something happened to my job.  That's a big consideration for sure.

But, as they say... "you can't steal second base without first taking your foot off first base". Manage your risks, do your homework and make wise choices, and give it your best shot.

Exactly.  Too many people think it's perfectly fine to sign away their life without great forethought.

I will know when the time is right.  For now, I'll just do what I do and be the ant, not the grasshopper.

Jules NYC wrote:
Do you suggest people working freelance or on a contract job (definite end date) to purchase a home?
Let's throw in they don't have any down payment either.

Sure, why not! 

I don't like contracted positions.  As an employer, I like to invest in my people.  I often don't hire people as a pair of hands, I hire their brain  to take the company to the next step.  Perhaps, I am in research and development, and not a production plant.  Unfortunately this is the norm for lots of companies.  Therefore you must be aware of your marketability for your profession, keep reinventing yourself, document every new things that your learn, get your CV current and be attractive to the next company.   

Jules NYC wrote:
Let's even say they do a FHA loan and don't have that small percentage to put down.
Not even an emergency fund for repairs.
any people are in this scenario.

Down payment is the biggest hurtle for everyone. You are not alone.  You must learn how to save, up your income whenever you can and reduce your expenses.  Invest your money in mutual funds. There is no quick way but you will get there in no time.  I have been there. 

By doing so, you accomplish two things: 
1.  Money saved.
2.  With the liquid cash saved, you will have a renew confidence on yourself.  You gain new outlook in life, you will carry yourself better, in terms this will open doors for you.  Things will fall into places. 

You are young, you can take more risk then old folks.  I don't worry too much about emergency. 

Pay attention to the first home-buyer program if any.  Maintain your credit score, don't be afraid to get a small loan and pay it back sooner.  There is no rules how to to your first down payment as long as it is legal.   

You have been planning ahead, you already won the first battle.  Now go to win the war.  Be focused and fuck the noise.   

Good luck

Jules NYC wrote:
Exactly.  Too many people think it's perfectly fine to sign away their life without great forethought.

Some people do it on purpose. My wife has a long time friend in L.A. who has done that multiple times... he keeps changing his name, buying a house and lives there for a few years without paying until they finally force him out. He's at the point of almost getting tossed out again now and has been coming here to FL to buy yet another house. He's looking for an owner-finance deal, presumably so he can sucker them into lending to him.

He's got a group of his friends in L.A. who do that sort of thing as a matter of routine. One time you see them and they're living large in some mansion, driving a Bentley or Rolls Royce, then the next time you see them they're in debt for millions and hiding out... then the cycle repeats over and over and one month they're multi-millionaires and the next they're dodging debt collectors.

It's a crazy world out there!

Jules NYC wrote:

Sounds nice. You could never get that in CT.

I sometimes consider moving but if it's this difficult to find a dynamic (or any) full-time job up here, it would be that much more excruciating. somewhere else with less work.

LOTS of work in TX....and owning a home is affordable

FlirtynFun Photography wrote:
LOTS of work in TX....and owning a home is affordable

I heard Houston is booming.  Thing is, I can't handle the heat in TX.  Never been but I need lush, green grass and New England autumns.

portraiturebyBrent wrote:
The timing of this thread couldn't have been better, as I have a certified check sitting on the counter in the amount of the final payoff for my mortgage. As soon as the Payoff Statement arrives, and it may be in the box today, the check gets put in the mail and I'm finished.

Lots of wisdom has already been imparted. Buy what you can afford in a neighborhood you'll be happy to live for many years. The homes around me were built about 20 years ago and all but a couple are still owned and occupied by the original purchasers.

That's fantastic!!!!!

Mary Durante Youtt wrote:
I finally had enough $$$ saved to put 20% down on a modest home when I was 45.  I was a single working mom from age 25.  I always lived below my means in small 3 room apts.  I was able to pay for her college education, her wedding etc.

Congrats, that a hell big accomplishment in my book.  20% percent down in NJ is not a small change..... LOL

Mary Durante Youtt wrote:
I finally had enough $$$ saved to put 20% down on a modest home when I was 45.  I was a single working mom from age 25.  I always lived below my means in small 3 room apts.  I was able to pay for her college education, her wedding etc.

That IS great.

Jules NYC wrote:
On the flip side, anyone here notice that people who have lived in big houses, lots of property can't downgrade?  Having a large house (esp. if someone dies) is a HUGE burden, etc.

Nah -- A good house in a good neighborhood usually sells (unless we are talking about vast extremes).  My mother recently passed away -- she was pretty well off, and had two condos (in Philadelphia & near Ft. Lauderdale).  Both were big & expensive.  Both had multiple offers before they were placed on the market.

Eventually, a large home gets to be a burden -- just keeping it clean is a lot of effort, and lots of people look forward to downsizing.

Jules NYC wrote:
On the flip side, anyone here notice that people who have lived in big houses, lots of property can't downgrade?  Having a large house (esp. if someone dies) is a HUGE burden, etc.

It reminds me of a line...

Wall Street (1987)
Darien Taylor: When you've had money and lost it, it can be much worse than never having had it at all!

Message to those people: get off your invisible throne and work a day in your life!

Why not!!!   Children grow up, leave the nest and parents get old.  Sell the big house, take the money and move to a smaller house/home, eventually to nursing home and die.  It is the cycle of life.

Having a big house or big property is a personal choice.  I certainly would not upset with the people who have a big mansion and I am not worry about their burden.  I am sure they know how to handle it when time comes.

Looknsee Photography wrote:
Eventually, a large home gets to be a burden -- just keeping it clean is a lot of effort, and lots of people look forward to downsizing.

Recently down sizing has been on our mind lately, we will start planning this accordingly.    Do I regret having a big house?  No!!!  IT was a great place to raise our family with many good memory.   This is more important to us.

FlirtynFun Photography wrote:
LOTS of work in TX....and owning a home is affordable

I was so close to buying a house in TX a decade ago.  You get your money's worth and then some.  TX measures things by the acre, we do it in square feet.  lol

But, alas, I couldn't leave my family and friends, race tracks, canyons, mountains, and beaches.

Connor Photography wrote:
Why not!!!   Children grow up, leave the nest and parents get old.  Sell the big house, take the money and move to a smaller house/home, eventually to nursing home and die.  It is the cycle of life.

Having a big house or big property is a personal choice.  I certainly would not upset with the people who have a big mansion and I am not worry about their burden.  I am sure they know how to handle it when time comes.

No, not everyone knows how to handle it when the time comes.
My mother is still mourning the death of her husband.  Ashes still in the closet, no memorial since January of this year.

On Mother's Day, it was said, "Your father left me with all this."  I said, "Isn't that nice/wonderful, etc.?"  She didn't express those sentiments.  A Yamaha grand piano to sell... putting the house on the market by next year... paying landscapers and repairs.  My Mom doesn't want to touch 'untouchable' money.  I get it.

So a big house living on Social Security (even my father's that worked like a workaholic his entire life) has to be a burden to someone not pushing a quick sell.  Don't even get me started on taxes.

I don't want to really get into personal details of my family but it's painful to see all of this unfold.  Easy solution for me but not for her.

It's like moving a mountain to get the woman to have a memorial.  I bet my Dad wouldn't give two shits talking about this if he were alive to comment...

Thing is, not everyone thinks unloading a big house is easy.  That means moving... then to where, etc.

Connor Photography wrote:
IF someone is smart enough to own a big house and successful in life, he or she is smart enough to plan for their retirement with a timely downsizing process.  The key is do it before it is too late.  This is not rocket science, it is just common sense.

My father was brilliant.  He was successful too. 
He was an architect and loved his house.  He didn't want to move and ultimately wanted to die in the house he built.  Can't blame a man for that.

I respect that you came to America with not much and made yourself a comfortable life.  It's a good thing.  My father came from very humble beginnings too and I still to this day respect the man tenfold.

He had mild dementia.  I watched him suffer through it.  Some sad moments but he still had his wits about him.  I don't blame him for leaving my mother a kickass house she can sell.  I didn't get a dime and don't expect anything either.  If anything, my mother will have to die before any monies left over are split three ways - my brother, myself and my half-sister that 'disowned' him before he died.  Really swell; she's a horrible person.

I doubt selling the house when he was going through all of that would have been 'smart'.

There is a lot more I can say about that but won't.  It may seem basic to you, but until you truly understand one's circumstance, you can't really make blanket, sweeping statements.  Dementia creeps in slowly, then *boom*, it's hard to articulate thoughts, words, etc.  Very frustrating for a wordsmith and eloquent writer.

I was smart enough to know even whilst processing & underwriting mortgages, I wasn't prepared to buy a home.

My brother has a house worth over 500K.  That's because he worked at the same damn place for 20 years +.  I chose a different path with artful experiences.

My corporate resume is fantastic now and so are my artistic skills.  That was MY sacrifice to be able to do either or as good as my peers. A house is just another venture to accomplish, all in due time.