Ms_Cassie wrote:
It is an insult to the model to do a photographer group shoot with say 10 photographers for a 4 hour shoot and it only pays $100 for the entire time. That means each photographer is paying $2.50 an hour to shoot a single nude model.... aka I'm doing 10x the work for literally no pay. This is an actual offer I've gotten before. And I'm just doing the math and they wanted to keep all the nude pics hahaha.

Nevermind how many photographers there are.

Is it worth $25/hr for you?  If not, chuck it and move on.  if one accepts, then the rate will increase.  That's what the market does.

Risen Phoenix Photo wrote:

Ms_Cassie wrote:
Thats impossible and draining for the model.  I was asked to provide 2 models for a class of 14 photographers.  What a cluster this whole event was.  Photographers sneaking around the set up to shoot up the models vagina. Shooting the models even during their very few breaks.  These models were my friends and they and I were disgusted.

I saw that you have some vaginas in your port, so I would guess that you did not sneak around to photograph them.

My opinion is that a woman should never be made to feel ashamed of her vagina, but unfortunately many people here do. If hiring a nude model, I expect that she will be nude and be happy to display her body in an artful manor. If there is a fear that her lips will show or other features of her anatomy will be evident and she feels the need to knock her legs together, then the authenticity of the shoot is ruined. She should call herself an implied model rather than nude. Grow hair if you want, but be free with your form. I'd rather did my eyes out with a fork than shoot the type of stuff that subordinates women and tells them there is something wrong with themselves.

Hiring and paying a models is solely based on what the model will offer and what the client wants.

Blaire_ wrote:
If the job is not something you want to do, just say no thanks and move on.  Group shoots are cool to me because it introduces me to several photographers at once and they get a small glimpse of my ability.  I have gotten paid work stemming from a group shoot.

As per your attitude, I don't think you're cut out for it.  In this industry, you can't take things (like job offers) as insults.  They will stop coming in.  I assure you.  It looks like you're just starting out.  You should take it where you can get it.  And be grateful for the opportunity to show your talent.

^^ best advice here. /end thread.

Ms_Cassie wrote:
What is with all these photographers asking to do group nude shoots for 4 hours and thinking that $100 flat rate for the whole time with 10+ photographers and they keep all the photos they shot thinking this is going to be okay? I'm just in shock this actually happens? Do models agree to these type of gigs?

I get so pissed at people who are resentful and jealous at what other people are getting. What the customer (the photographer paying for the opportunity to shoot you) gets and what the promoter earns from organizing the event is 100% irrelevant to you. Frankly, it's absolutely none of your business. If the organizers can charge $1000 per head and you only see $100 for the shoot, you have NOTHING to complain about. NOTHING. The fact is, they organized the event, marketed the event, handled the paperwork, handled the customer service, handled scheduling, handled the venue, handled the credit card processing etc.

The beauty about living in the United States of America is you have the freedom to do the same thing. If you don't like the pay being offered, I have a suggestion for you. How about -YOU- go organize such an event. Then you can pay the models whatever you feel is fair and you can keep whatever profits are left over. You even have the freedom to to give 100% of your profits to the models if you don't want to keep it and you feel that's the fairest thing. There, problem solved.

OnSite Photography ca wrote:

Risen Phoenix Photo wrote:

Ms_Cassie wrote:
Thats impossible and draining for the model.  I was asked to provide 2 models for a class of 14 photographers.  What a cluster this whole event was.  Photographers sneaking around the set up to shoot up the models vagina. Shooting the models even during their very few breaks.  These models were my friends and they and I were disgusted.

I saw that you have some vaginas in your port, so I would guess that you did not sneak around to photograph them.

My opinion is that a woman should never be made to feel ashamed of her vagina, but unfortunately many people here do. If hiring a nude model, I expect that she will be nude and be happy to display her body in an artful manor. If there is a fear that her lips will show or other features of her anatomy will be evident and she feels the need to knock her legs together, then the authenticity of the shoot is ruined. She should call herself an implied model rather than nude. Grow hair if you want, but be free with your form. I'd rather did my eyes out with a fork than shoot the type of stuff that subordinates women and tells them there is something wrong with themselves.

Hiring and paying a models is solely based on what the model will offer and what the client wants.

Sorry but most models I know don't appreciate spread shots nor do most galleries I know. I'm all for natural organic images but not photographers who sneak around to shoot it.

Koryn wrote:
It's not necessarily insulting, especially not for newbie nude models, who are just starting to book paid work, or do not have a fully developed portfolio yet.

It might not be the greatest deal for an experienced model, with a very developed, polished portfolio, and 3 or 4 years worth of paid work under her belt.

Even then, experienced models sometimes have openings come available last minute while traveling, and picking up a $100 gig for a 4 hours is better than earning nothing at all for a day, due to a last-minute cancellation.

You're going to discover that there are many factors that determine what is "fair" pay,  what that means to different people, and the fact is, models often get OFFERS of pay that are proportional to what their portfolios look like. The more time you put into building your portfolio, and the longer your list of great references becomes - the more you will be offered for jobs. Even then, you will have to negotiate, because the reality of the free market economy is that everyone is looking for the cheapest deal possible, and you have to learn how to build your business and provide a product that is exceptional, in order to motivate others to want to pay for it.

If you're not happy with the offers/opportunities you are currently receiving, then maybe it's time to put some effort into building your portfolio, building your business, developing your marketing/branding/promotional skills? It's not as simple as people like to believe.

+1

However, look, I'm going to come out and say it: Shady? No. Crappy deal? Definitely. I don't know what your modeling motivations and goals are, but unless you're in a real financial pinch or there's at least one photographer present whose work you like and who's willing to give you some edits, it's not even close to being an equally beneficial agreement. $25/hour I'd consider to be a kind of minimum wage for modeling for shooters whose work you have zero interest in, so that amount for a group shoot makes no sense. You're right, it's not figure modeling, it's just a photo gangbang with shooters who likely would never pay a model's rates for a 1-1 session. I disagree with Blaire on that point. It's possible you could get a photo or two from it, it's possible it could provide valuable connections for later but I seriously effing doubt it.

Don't be offended by the offer. Just say 'no, thank you.'