Strategic Photo Studios wrote:
Nude African American Models are Rare.  This is a myth that alot of photographers think.  Theres actually alot of nude african american models out there.  Like any other group, african american models would like to be compensated for their art.
Would love  feed back!!!!!!

rare? not a lot of photographers think that at all... in fact some photographers and a ton of models think that there are too many of them showing off skin complaining that they could look more sophisticated than nude. there's a thread on it on here somewhere. just do a search for it.

Tony Lawrence wrote:
As far as money goes money should have nothing to do with
what you will or won't take off.

Absolutely. Goes for anyone. Not that I don't want to see people profit for what they do, but if cash is all there is in it, there's going to be discontent, bad feelings, antagonism, mutual contempt, and so forth. All the things that art (whether museum-hung art or stuff in a magazine or just stuff for our own walls and scrapbooks) should be about overcoming.

And the pictures will probably suck anyhow.

Tony Lawrence wrote:
In general I've found Black women to be more conservative.

This is my experience as well.

I live just outside of DC (like 5 miles from the city's border) who nickname if you don't know is Chocolate City.  You would think I would not have trouble finding a black llama that wants to pose nude for reasonable compensation ot even TFP but I do.

Basically, like everywhere else, you have llamas that will pose nude for a fee (usually the glamour or adult work) but it is rare that you can find women of color that will pose nude just to build their ports for figure or artisitic work.

Thuy Anh wrote:

rare? not a lot of photographers think that at all... in fact some photographers and a ton of models think that there are too many of them showing off skin complaining that they could look more sophisticated than nude. there's a thread on it on here somewhere. just do a search for it.

Marko Cecic-Karuzic wrote:
A couple of weeks ago there were a string of threads started mostly by Afro-American models complaining that all anybody ever seems to want from them are bootylicious shots.

The OP is right! What you guys are talking about is something entirely different. He's talking about nude, you are talking about scantily clad or booty shots, neither of which are nude, certainly not artistic or glamour nudes (I think that this is what he meant. OP correct me if I'm wrong).

CristinaLex wrote:
ME being a black model I will truthfully say that I will never pose nude for the cam unless I am getting paid...This is my body I am exposing for the world and I do not want to fell like I showoed my all with nothing in return....

white models are maybe more comfortable with their bodies, But black women or models doo have a lil more to offer body wise, breast, buttoxs, so I dont think that you will find a nude african american model that will pose "for art"  and not for cash..

You also have to think that when most f these black women model for mags or these explicit videos they get some sort of pay for it to expose their all...Unlike artistic nude where some photographers want you too bear it all but they are not looking to pay....But this is all what I think and what not...



OHHH YEA....you also have to think that a lot of black models get approached by all sorts oof photographers to try to get these models to pose nude all the time...soo a lot of those ofers are turned down without a second thought....Black models get wrongfully exposed all the time

I agree with you 100% and it has been my experience that when black models do pose nude they dont get the same results in comparison with a white models, we always get something in the way of porn or soft porn and I really dont like that! It might be because our body types are just full enough that it makes it look sorta like we are posing for porn or that most photographers just dont know how to shoot our body type and make it look like art! Whatever the case may be I wouldnt pose nude unless it was compensated or it was a very very good artistic photographer and would help my portfolio rather than hurt it!

CristinaLex wrote:
I will never pose nude for the cam unless I am getting paid...I dont think that you will find a nude african american model that will pose "for art"

Porchia wrote:
I wouldnt pose nude unless it was compensated or it was a very very good artistic photographer and would help my portfolio rather than hurt it!

So my question for you two would be do you think I'm good enough of a photographer for either of you to work for trade?

Basically, when I even bring up nude work with a African-American model the first thing out thier mouth is related to monetary compensation; art never gets mentioned. That's all good but it tells me that the model are more concerned about getting paid than getting excited about the potential artistic value of the images. Maybe this is why all you see are these glamour and adult nude images of Black models - the guys taking them are wanting to see a return on investment know the quickest way to make that money back is shooting the "booty" shots and what not.

If African-American models are unwiling to shoot art nudes with photographers wanting to shoot them for art sake then it's no surprise that the vast majority of nude imagery of them are images that focus on their sex objectification rather than a celebration of their human form?

CristinaLex wrote:
white models are maybe more comfortable with their bodies, But black women or models doo have a lil more to offer body wise, breast, buttoxs, so I dont think that you will find a nude african american model that will pose "for art"  and not for cash..

I actually will, but photographers must remember what comes along with my fantastic smile and wonderful personality (52" hips).  There's a lot to my body and evidently that's not all that high in demand.  Ahwell.

CristinaLex wrote:
You also have to think that when most f these black women model for mags or these explicit videos they get some sort of pay for it to expose their all...Unlike artistic nude where some photographers want you too bear it all but they are not looking to pay....But this is all what I think and what not...

Not true.  Most booty mags, mens mags and even hair mags do not pay.  They "over promise" exposure and the fact that getting your name and face out there will pay for itself.

CristinaLex wrote:
OHHH YEA....you also have to think that a lot of black models get approached by all sorts oof photographers to try to get these models to pose nude all the time...soo a lot of those ofers are turned down without a second thought....Black models get wrongfully exposed all the time

I dunno about this.  Then again. . .I don't have fiftymillion emails asking me for shoots.  *lol*

Porchia wrote:
I agree with you 100% and it has been my experience that when black models do pose nude they dont get the same results in comparison with a white models, we always get something in the way of porn or soft porn and I really dont like that! It might be because our body types are just full enough that it makes it look sorta like we are posing for porn or that most photographers just dont know how to shoot our body type and make it look like art! Whatever the case may be I wouldnt pose nude unless it was compensated or it was a very very good artistic photographer and would help my portfolio rather than hurt it!

Hear hear! Especially on the part about not knowing how to shoot our bodies. I did an artistic shoot recently with some partial nudes:


and they came out pretty nice. But when it comes to full nudes, there's such a low chance I would do it...too high of a chance it'd end up looking like soft porn, etc. Plus the stigma to become a booty model or viewed that way is so high nowadays...every black girl out there is a "model" w/ her booty up in the air...it's easier to stay away from that by just keeping your clothes on. For really good pay perhaps, but there's little that makes taking the chance worth it.

CristinaLex wrote:
ME being a black model I will truthfully say that I will never pose nude for the cam unless I am getting paid...This is my body I am exposing for the world and I do not want to fell like I showoed my all with nothing in return....

white models are maybe more comfortable with their bodies, But black women or models doo have a lil more to offer body wise, breast, buttoxs, so I dont think that you will find a nude african american model that will pose "for art"  and not for cash..

You also have to think that when most f these black women model for mags or these explicit videos they get some sort of pay for it to expose their all...Unlike artistic nude where some photographers want you too bear it all but they are not looking to pay....But this is all what I think and what not...



OHHH YEA....you also have to think that a lot of black models get approached by all sorts oof photographers to try to get these models to pose nude all the time...soo a lot of those ofers are turned down without a second thought....Black models get wrongfully exposed all the time

Cristina,

I love you girl, but I think you are a little rough on the artistic photographers. We, don't just want our models to just take it all off for no pay, our photography offers less financial return, as opposed to fashion and glamour, which can yield tremendous paydays. Art photography is more a labor of love and a passion rather than a commercial venture. Some try and exploit those values and misuse the genre by claiming "Art" but showing smut or porn.This is sad, because I have far too few images in my prefferred style of photography, with models that represent my ethnic background.

Being from a multi-cultural family and growing up in innercity Brooklyn, I feel the lack of African American nude Art models is an offspring of a legacy of being exploited. Minorities in general have a relatively recent history of being exploited for our talents and attributes and with todays generation becoming more independant, perhaps there is a sense of "No More" becoming more prominent.

I also think that it just might be a case of averages. This country is over 80% Caucasion.... 20% everyone else... only a tiny percentage of the entire population models, and only a small percentage of models, pose nude... makes the tiny percentage of a tiny percent, an extremely tiny amount when only counting 20%....

....hmmmm.....

Then again, I'm only 50% right most of the time....

Albie

Jakki Browne wrote:
I think black nudes are rare, but those Black Tail porno style "nekkid" photos aren't rare at all!

I agree. I have noticed here and elsewhere a lower number of real models (having pics taken by a tog not a bf) that do artistic nudes among the black models.

The "booty" shots are images of young black girls bsed into thinking they could be models if xyz strip to a thong. The guy doing this aren't GWCs cause they have real cash,  they're pornagraphers, and not very talented at that. Also they taint young girls making it hard to use them in a real shoot.

I am only ranting out of personal experience of the works of some of these type and thier "work" here in Baton Rouge.

Jakki Browne wrote:
I think black nudes are rare, but those Black Tail porno style "nekkid" photos aren't rare at all!

I agree. I have noticed here and elsewhere a lower number of real models (having pics taken by a tog not a bf) that do artistic nudes among the black models.

The "booty" shots are images of young black girls bsed into thinking they could be models if xyz strip to a thong. The guy doing this aren't GWCs cause they have real cash,  they're pornagraphers, and not very talented at that. Also they taint young girls making it hard to use them in a real shoot.

I am only ranting out of personal experience of the works of some of these type and thier "work" here in Baton Rouge.

CristinaLex wrote:
ME being a black model I will truthfully say that I will never pose nude for the cam unless I am getting paid...This is my body I am exposing for the world and I do not want to fell like I showoed my all with nothing in return....

white models are maybe more comfortable with their bodies, But black women or models doo have a lil more to offer body wise, breast, buttoxs, so I dont think that you will find a nude african american model that will pose "for art"  and not for cash..

hmmmm,,,so the sanctity and sacredness of your body has monetary value huh?

Jakki Browne wrote:
I think black nudes are rare, but those Black Tail porno style "nekkid" photos aren't rare at all!

As a casual viewer of Black Tail magazine (insert jokes) I've noticed that most
of their models are dancers.  Which makes sense because the magazine doesn't
pay much.  Less then $1,000.00 total.  Many of the models have fan clubs and give
the clubs they dance in and if they are in movies.  Magazines like Players have lots
of old images and often poor quality photography.  There are several exellent books
of Black female nudes by photographers like Uwe Ommer which I have also.
Beautifull women in exotic locations.  Beyond all the booty shaking and short skirt
wearing you see in videos and movies many black women are pretty conservative.

PhotoJoe wrote:
Not to difficult to find in a big city like New York.
Maybe you need to look in the right places.

Contrary to common belief there are many photographers not working in either New York or Los Angeles. I try to get to Chicago once a year and Houston about 6-8 times a year. Other than that since NOLA got destroyed Im nowhere land.

Tony Lawrence wrote:
As a casual viewer of Black Tail magazine (insert jokes) I've noticed that most
of their models are dancers.  Which makes sense because the magazine doesn't
pay much.  Less then $1,000.00 total.  Many of the models have fan clubs and give
the clubs they dance in and if they are in movies.  Magazines like Players have lots
of old images and often poor quality photography.  There are several exellent books
of Black female nudes by photographers like Uwe Ommer which I have also.
Beautifull women in exotic locations.  Beyond all the booty shaking and short skirt
wearing you see in videos and movies many black women are pretty conservative.

Ommer's book is the bomb!

Mickle Design Werks wrote:

CristinaLex wrote:
I will never pose nude for the cam unless I am getting paid...I dont think that you will find a nude african american model that will pose "for art"

So my question for you two would be do you think I'm good enough of a photographer for either of you to work for trade?

Basically, when I even bring up nude work with a African-American model the first thing out thier mouth is related to monetary compensation; art never gets mentioned. That's all good but it tells me that the model are more concerned about getting paid than getting excited about the potential artistic value of the images. Maybe this is why all you see are these glamour and adult nude images of Black models - the guys taking them are wanting to see a return on investment know the quickest way to make that money back is shooting the "booty" shots and what not.

If African-American models are unwiling to shoot art nudes with photographers wanting to shoot them for art sake then it's no surprise that the vast majority of nude imagery of them are images that focus on their sex objectification rather than a celebration of their human form?

I will say you port is very very very good...But you could not convince me to do nude..WHy...because all your models are slim skinny women...I dont see a good pic that can show me how your worked around a models curves....a SHAPLY women..black or white...I dont relly gravatate towards photographers that shoot a whole lotta skinny...I had my shot at that and it wasnt a good experience..He was trying to confine my body into what he wanted it to be (skinny) and I didnt feel comfortable posing that way, I have hips you cannot hide them and dont try to slim them down....


I just dont feel comfortable with a photographer who cant or hasnt shot any curves..rather not take my chances....

CristinaLex wrote:

I know it's me..it's my own personal issue but I gotta say it:

if a woman "sells" her temple for 1000 dollars or 10,000 dollars...she still sells it....it still is ALL ABOUT THE MONEY....to me it's like saying: "Every woman will sell you sex, you just have to find the right price..."

CristinaLex wrote:
Elahi, Say it but...you can still say that models who get gigs are selling something if they get paid for that gig as well..clothes on..so if I can get paid for a gig with my clothes on....Why shouldnt I get paid for one without clothing...especially if I really dont need any nude in my port

I dont know why it seems soo wrong for a women who is exposing her body to a permanant image to someone who can do anything with it...to be paid or want to be paid....

it's your body
you can do what you want
maybe it's the way you say it
maybe it's the way I take it

it seems it's not about the art for you but about the money
it seems it really isnt about the sanctity of your body but about the price

images by elahi wrote:
it's your body
you can do what you want
maybe it's the way you say it
maybe it's the way I take it

it seems it's not about the art for you but about the money
it seems it really isnt about the sanctity of your body but about the price

Yea just like there is a PRICE if a photographer took my nude images and put them any where and every where...I dont need nude thats why I dont see it for the art...Its not for my body type, maybe later down the raod my mind could change but for now, a lot of nudes are geared towards slimmer models...photographers who do nudes I have yet to see int her port a models who has plentyful booty and breast..all I see is no ass and no chest models who can articulate that sophisticated image they want...and some black women have a lil more than some models and chose not to do nudes....So yea there is a price for my body right now untill I chose other wise and or change my mind and  find a photographer who can work with curves..



and who says that posing nude for free with someone who you think you can trust is sanctity?????...because I seee a lof of models on MM who shouldve gotten paid for posing nude due to how horrible their "artistic" nude shots look

Strategic Photo Studios wrote:
Nude African American Models are Rare.  This is a myth that alot of photographers think.  Theres actually alot of nude african american models out there.  Like any other group, african american models would like to be compensated for their art.
Would love  feed back!!!!!!

This seems to be true.  I have an open casting call (https://modelmayhem.com/posts.php?thread_id=44523) and I've only had 1 AA model respond.  This is a paid job and will deal with glamour and fine art nudes (like my shot https://modelmayhem.com/pic.php?pic_id=437e0b895ba8d).

Figure modeling is a legitimate form of modeling which takes as much skill, if not more, than fashion or glamour.  While I understand and respect personal preferences, I which more AA models were open to this very artistic form of modeling.

CristinaLex wrote:
I will say you port is very very very good...But you could not convince me to do nude..WHy...because all your models are slim skinny women...I dont see a good pic that can show me how your worked around a models curves....a SHAPLY women..black or white...I dont relly gravatate towards photographers that shoot a whole lotta skinny...I had my shot at that and it wasnt a good experience..He was trying to confine my body into what he wanted it to be (skinny) and I didnt feel comfortable posing that way, I have hips you cannot hide them and dont try to slim them down....


I just dont feel comfortable with a photographer who cant or hasnt shot any curves..rather not take my chances....

I can respect your reasoning.  I will say that it speaks to an insecurity that you have in trusting that a photographer I like me can't artistically capture the more shapely women. Some time you gotta risk and take a leap of faith.

It's not for a lack of trying on my part.  You have articulated every reason/excuse I've been given for models that I've contacted to not even attempt to work with photographers like me that desire to work these models.  How is a photographer to learn how to shoot the body types of these models? It's circular, I may not be able to afford to shoot you (even with all your limitations) so I get no experience shooting women with your shape and you can't be convinced that I can do you justice because you see no images that can prove to you that I can shoot a woman with more to her.  No one wins and the stereotypical perception continue to flourish.

This image was shot for one of my MUAs that I work with on a regular basis. It's not in my port because I wanted her to get recognized for her skills and not draw attention away from the awesome job she did.  The model (Chrystyna - Mayhem #79570) aint no skinny chick.



I wanted to showcase her beauty and I am currently planning out another shoot with her, hopefully by next month. I learned a lot from that shoot with her but I wouldn't have if she didn't have the courage to shoot with me.

BTW, Thanks for the love

CristinaLex wrote:
point blank...my body isnt meant for nude artistic...its meant for the skinnier crowd who can look less pornographic....

it all has to do with SHAPE

Christina:
I don't care what you say about not wanting to be photographed. You are beautiful and I have no doubt I could get beautiful images of your figure. And I am not changing that story one bit.

CristinaLex wrote:
Elahi, Say it but...you can still say that models who get gigs are selling something if they get paid for that gig as well..clothes on..so if I can get paid for a gig with my clothes on....Why shouldnt I get paid for one without clothing...especially if I really dont need any nude in my port

I dont know why it seems soo wrong for a women who is exposing her body to a permanant image to someone who can do anything with it...to be paid or want to be paid....

Being paid for a shoot (IMHO) is not about the model being compensated for her "marketability" weather she be clothed or not, but it is about what she needs/doesn't need in her port.  The same as when/why a model should pay a photographer.

CristinaLex wrote:
ME being a black model I will truthfully say that I will never pose nude for the cam unless I am getting paid...This is my body I am exposing for the world and I do not want to fell like I showoed my all with nothing in return....

This is because you're a black model or is this simply your limits as a model period?  I don't see the two as having any inherent connection at all.

CristinaLex wrote:
white models are maybe more comfortable with their bodies, But black women or models doo have a lil more to offer body wise, breast, buttoxs, so I dont think that you will find a nude african american model that will pose "for art"  and not for cash..

I think that while we can offer up all the stereotypical difference between models of various backgrounds, comfort with their bodies is not something I've seen to be in any way connected with race.  It simply depends on the person.

In fact, I've heard many a caucasian model express admiration on how black women seem to be much more comfortable in their bodies, as having (relatively) more weight and curves is seen to be an asset and encouraged with black women/models, whereas for white women it's quite the opposite and breeds a considerable amount of insecurity.

CristinaLex wrote:
You also have to think that when most f these black women model for mags or these explicit videos they get some sort of pay for it to expose their all...Unlike artistic nude where some photographers want you too bear it all but they are not looking to pay....But this is all what I think and what not...

Don't believe that.  I wouldn't say that most are paid.  Some, perhaps.  Many of those women do it for a promise and/or "exposure."  The more of this so-called exposure that can be had, the lower the likelihood that they'll be paid.

CristinaLex wrote:
OHHH YEA....you also have to think that a lot of black models get approached by all sorts oof photographers to try to get these models to pose nude all the time...soo a lot of those ofers are turned down without a second thought....Black models get wrongfully exposed all the time

Again, I think this occurance has little to do with color at all.  Attractive women period will get requests to pose nude.  Whether or not they accept the request is an individual choice, not a racial one...

Jayne Jones wrote:

Being paid for a shoot (IMHO) is not about the model being compensated for her "marketability" weather she be clothed or not, but it is about what she needs/doesn't need in her port.  The same as when/why a model should pay a photographer.

Janye many of the best known fashion and beauty models world wide have done
nudes.  From Iman to Nicole Campbell.  Trust me they didn't need it for their
portfolios.  Many models just enjoy working to create works of art.  If you are
trying to model to just get paid then stop.  Do it because you enjoy it first. 
There are lots of things that pay a whole lot better.  By the way in most cases
those models posing nude for photographers for art nudes are not being paid as
it isn't for clients but as a TFP that may be published.  Check out a magazine
called Photo (The French version.) Its really just on sites like these that 'models'
talk about being paid to show some skin.  Most agency models do TFP for known
and new photographers all the time.  Sometimes semi-nude and sometimes :gasp:
nude.