Digital Photo PLUS wrote:
Why are you wasting your time on film photography? Was it your choice?

You don't need to learn how to drive a horse buggy to learn how to drive a car.

Those who learned on a stick shift understand their cars better than those who learned on an automatic transmission.  Those who started in film have a deeper understanding of photography.

The accumulation of knowledge is never a waste of time.  It's why the Boy Scouts still teach the art of making fire when matches are plentiful, for example.  Knowledge is power.

Digital Photo PLUS wrote:
Why are you wasting your time on film photography?

Well, this is completely insulting and 100% bullshit as well.

Thanks for the understanding of the art form of film photography, asshole.

hbutz New York wrote:

Those who learned on a stick shift understand their cars better than those who learned on an automatic transmission.  Those who started in film have a deeper understanding of photography.

The accumulation of knowledge is never a waste of time.  It's why the Boy Scouts still teach the art of making fire when matches are plentiful, for example.  Knowledge is power.

And if you learn to paint and grind your own pigments, that may help too.  But the antiquarian sort of stuff can be saved for later if you think you need it.  There's much more important stuff to be learned up front.

Bella la Bell wrote:
...
This is the 2nd roll of film I have developed and it was over exposed to the point of useless...
...

Have you figured out why yet?  Were you following what your hand-held meter said?

ArtisticPhotography wrote:

DEKTOL
not Dectol

salvatori. wrote:
Well, this is completely insulting and 100% bullshit as well.

Thanks for the understanding of the art form of film photography, asshole.

I completely agree. I'm developing a few rolls when I get home today. I love how it makes you more methodical in how you shoot. And the anticipation when waiting to see what you've got after developing and making a contact sheet.

But no need for the name calling.

Bella la Bell wrote:
I am now getting sick every time I enter the developing room. The chemicals are beyond what I need to be around... let us say this is 3rd time I have vomited it is that bad.
This is the 2nd roll of film I have developed and it was over exposed to the point of useless...

This will be the first art class I am now thinking about dropping. .

Thank you digital photographers for now having that awful smell on you when you shoot. And thank you film photographers for being patient as can be.

Has to be one of the funniest things I've read on MM.

Bella la Bell wrote:
And thank you film photographers for being patient as can be.

You don't bake an awesome croissant by popping the frozen mass for 30 seconds in a microwave oven.

You knead and roll the dough and add the key ingredients including real butter, not margarine.

The final image of a photograph comes from many forms of creative work. Film and digital elements are only the obvious ingredients.

Anybody who berates film or digital or any other art form not to their liking are misinformed and lost souls who have yet to comprehend art.

.

Andialu wrote:
...
I completely agree. I'm developing a few rolls when I get home today. I love how it makes you more methodical in how you shoot. And the anticipation when waiting to see what you've got after developing and making a contact sheet.
...

What do you mean anticipation?  Didn't you spot check on site with Polaroids?
My anticipation is instantly satisfied with the little LCD screen.  Saves re-takes.

Andialu wrote:
But no need for the name calling.

I respectfully disagree. I have been shooting/developing/printing for over three decades. When someone who just thinks all the new shit is so fab that they discount what goes through my veins... I get pissed.

His lack of respect for my craft elicited my lack of respect for him. And tough-titty-toenails to anyone who wants to forget the two centuries of an art form that allows digital photography to be possible.

Guss W wrote:
What do you mean anticipation?  Didn't you spot check on site with Polaroids?
My anticipation is instantly satisfied with the little LCD screen.  Saves re-takes.

Nope. I don't have a Polaroid back for my Hasselblad. Yesterday I shot with my Asahi Pentax 35MM without a net. I just used the meter it has built in, no digital.

salvatori. wrote:

I respectfully disagree. I have been shooting/developing/printing for over three decades. When someone who just thinks all the new shit is so fab that they discount what goes through my veins... I get pissed.

His lack of respect for my craft elicited my lack of respect for him. And tough-titty-toenails to anyone who wants to forget the two centuries of an art form that allows digital photography to be possible.

Fair enough.

c_h_r_i_s wrote:
Has to be one of the funniest things I've read on MM.

Well it is sort of weird, esp. since there's not much smell to film. Stop bath was the worse part, IIRC, but still not bad. It's just film. Take the canister outside with you and sit in the lounge or take a walk or something. What's the big deal. Once it's in the canister you go wherever you want. It's not like prints. Heck, you can use a bag and load the canister if you want, and you could do it in the middle of a park in the middle of the day.

If film is bothering you, old fixer is for prints is going to kill you. But ... none of it is terribly bad.

ArtisticPhotography wrote:
...

If film is bothering you, old fixer is for prints is going to kill you. But ... none of it is terribly bad.

I think "panther piss" is about the kindest description of fixer smell that I have heard.

Andialu wrote:
...
I completely agree. I'm developing a few rolls when I get home today. I love how it makes you more methodical in how you shoot. And the anticipation when waiting to see what you've got after developing and making a contact sheet.
...

Guss W wrote:
What do you mean anticipation?  Didn't you spot check on site with Polaroids?
My anticipation is instantly satisfied with the little LCD screen.  Saves re-takes.

When I had the means to shoot film, I never really knew what I would get--I used to experiment with pushing film and using unusual film-developer combos. Once developed, I'd scan them to see what information could be gotten from them, and then I'd move to make prints. A lot of beautiful, haunting low-light images could be produced.

I never found the same thrill in digital. So sterile. It's good for documentary purposes, and some people know how to work magic with the end results, but I always prefer a more tactile approach to art making.

OP: you should definitely make sure that things are well-ventilated when you do them. I've developed film in a basement bathroom without major smell issues thanks to the vent. If you feel it's affecting your health, I would talk to your instructor about it.

Poses wrote:
...
When I had the means to shoot film, I never really knew what I would get--...

For an artist who produces on speculation, that may work, but I would imagine that it's hard to sell a client in advance on serendipity.

Guss W wrote:

For an artist who produces on speculation, that may work, but I would imagine that it's hard to sell a client in advance on serendipity.

True

Poses wrote:
When I had the means to shoot film, I never really knew what I would get--I used to experiment with pushing film and using unusual film-developer combos. Once developed, I'd scan them to see what information could be gotten from them, and then I'd move to make prints. A lot of beautiful, haunting low-light images could be produced.

I never found the same thrill in digital. So sterile. It's good for documentary purposes, and some people know how to work magic with the end results, but I always prefer a more tactile approach to art making.

Whereas I was always a bit frustrated with the darkroom and some of the lack of control involved when trying to achieve something specific.

Though, that may have been partially due to the fact I was never in control of the darkrooms I used, so... meh.

ASYLUM - Photo wrote:
Whereas I was always a bit frustrated with the darkroom and some of the lack of control involved when trying to achieve something specific.

Though, that may have been partially due to the fact I was never in control of the darkrooms I used, so... meh.

I've never been into the dark room. I prefer to load the film using a dark bag and develop in a dark tank. Then scan and print on glorious exhibition fiber.

Digital Photo PLUS wrote:
Why are you wasting your time on film photography? Was it your choice?

You don't need to learn how to drive a horse buggy to learn how to drive a car.

Hey!  If she wants to take a film class, so what?   I teach film photography.  People with the desire to learn how to shoot and develop film are NOT necessarily "wasting" their time.  There are things she can do to avoid exposure to chemical fumes.

Guss W wrote:

I think "panther piss" is about the kindest description of fixer smell that I have heard.

Yeah, I can buy that. That's from someone who's been in a darkroom.

I sort of miss the darkroom. It was always very tranquil.

Guss W wrote:

And if you learn to paint and grind your own pigments, that may help too.  But the antiquarian sort of stuff can be saved for later if you think you need it.  There's much more important stuff to be learned up front.

I don't think there was much spray and pray in that form of artwork.. Learning film will force one to stop and think rather than just spray and pray and most likely rely on the camera. Not to mention, rely on photoshop.. I'm not sure why you would have an issue with that..

Oddly I find most who started with digital rely too much on their camera and in particular the LCD rather than understanding what the scene is actually producing.. I use to give a test to a class I taught that required students to black out their LCD and they could only take 36 shots.. It was amazing how many got 36 useless shots because they had no clue how to read a scene.. They just kept looking at their LCD which actually isn't very accurate either.. And the predominate common denominator, they never shot a single roll of film.. They were digital babies..

Reminded me a lot of lab techs, 1 hr techs, that never had to actually read a negative they just relied on the screen..  Sure sucked when the screen when out.. They wanted to shut the lab down.. Good thing us old timers actually understood antiquated knowledge..

Bella la Bell wrote:
I am now getting sick every time I enter the developing room. The chemicals are beyond what I need to be around... let us say this is 3rd time I have vomited it is that bad.

If you are the only one with this symptom, then it must be an isolated case.

If several of your are feeling this, then it is a matter of Environmental Health and Safety protocol to fix this problem, which is usually lack of adequate ventilation.

The school you are enrolled in, stand to default their license by providing dangerous levels of exposure of hazardous chemicals to students.

If you have the spare time:

Read This
V
V
V
http://www.subclub.org/darkroom/safety.htm

.

Bella la Bell wrote:
I have taken a film class before and it honestly was not as bad as this one.

I am now getting sick every time I enter the developing room. The chemicals are beyond what I need to be around... let us say this is 3rd time I have vomited it is that bad.
This is the 2nd roll of film I have developed and it was over exposed to the point of useless...

This will be the first art class I am now thinking about dropping. .

Thank you digital photographers for now having that awful smell on you when you shoot. And thank you film photographers for being patient as can be.

I think film photography is awesome.
I also get sick in the dark room.  .

Tropical Photography wrote:

I don't think there was much spray and pray in that form of artwork.. Learning film will force one to stop and think rather than just spray and pray and most likely rely on the camera. Not to mention, rely on photoshop.. I'm not sure why you would have an issue with that..

Oddly I find most who started with digital rely too much on their camera and in particular the LCD rather than understanding what the scene is actually producing.. I use to give a test to a class I taught that required students to black out their LCD and they could only take 36 shots.. It was amazing how many got 36 useless shots because they had no clue how to read a scene.. They just kept looking at their LCD which actually isn't very accurate either.. And the predominate common denominator, they never shot a single roll of film.. They were digital babies..

Reminded me a lot of lab techs, 1 hr techs, that never had to actually read a negative they just relied on the screen..  Sure sucked when the screen when out.. They wanted to shut the lab down.. Good thing us old timers actually understood antiquated knowledge..

Awesome post!   I totally agree!

ArtisticPhotography wrote:
...

I sort of miss the darkroom. It was always very tranquil.

You didn't bring a friend?

Tropical Photography wrote:
...
I don't think there was much spray and pray in that form of artwork.. Learning film will force one to stop and think rather than just spray and pray and most likely rely on the camera. Not to mention, rely on photoshop.. I'm not sure why you would have an issue with that..

Oddly I find most who started with digital rely too much on their camera and in particular the LCD rather than understanding what the scene is actually producing.. I use to give a test to a class I taught that required students to black out their LCD and they could only take 36 shots.. It was amazing how many got 36 useless shots because they had no clue how to read a scene.. They just kept looking at their LCD which actually isn't very accurate either.. And the predominate common denominator, they never shot a single roll of film.. They were digital babies..

Reminded me a lot of lab techs, 1 hr techs, that never had to actually read a negative they just relied on the screen..  Sure sucked when the screen when out.. They wanted to shut the lab down.. Good thing us old timers actually understood antiquated knowledge..

Spray and pray is a separate issue.  It was there with film too - motor drive if you could afford it.

But anyway, you've just told us that if taught right, the lasting techniques can be done with digital.

Guss W wrote:

For an artist who produces on speculation, that may work, but I would imagine that it's hard to sell a client in advance on serendipity.

What the hell do you think they did before digital!!? You digital kids are a riot.

Digital Photo PLUS wrote:
Why are you wasting your time on film photography? Was it your choice?

You don't need to learn how to drive a horse buggy to learn how to drive a car.

Apples and oranges. Can you do better with why it's a waste of time?