Model
vi0letdreamer
Posts: 5
DeKalb, Illinois, US
I've searched the forums but can't seem to find information on this topic. When is it appropriate to disclose to people interested in working with me that I have some old scars? Should I state it on my profile (though I'd feel weird about having it as public knowledge), tell people after they express interest in collaborating, or just show up to the shoot without saying anything? For context, they're all 1-2 years old. There are 5-10 long-ish ones on the front and 20-30 really short ones down the side of my forearm (like the lower panel of this: https://21494dc99b6f931a50cf-af837cc28e … hoto-1.jpg ). Additionally, there are 4 on my mid-thigh area (like this but a little pinker, though I've definitely noticed they're becoming more skin-colored as they heal further: https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-6 … db96dd68-c ). I've been able to edit them out myself in Photoshop but it mostly hasn't been necessary as they're not too visible from a distance. I'd appreciate some perspective from anyone who has dealt with this issue from either side of the camera. Edit: This is the photo they're most visible in https://www.modelmayhem.com/portfolio/pic/42545715 (I didn't edit them at all, they're on the arm with the flower tattoo and the thigh on the opposite side)
Model
Dea and the Beast
Posts: 4796
Saint Petersburg, Florida, US
It isn't anyone's business what the scars are from, but if prominent, I would offer a selfie and put a line about the scarring in your profile, just like if you had any other special body mods (implants, gauges, etc. ). I don't know if you can even them out a bit more, like stretch marks do, ( I tried with coconut oil and sun bed once a week.. works pretty well), but since you say they're not very prominent, depending on what shoot you'll do (a landscape nude won't matter.. beauty close-up- yes). All the best!
Photographer
Connor Photography
Posts: 8539
Newark, Delaware, US
I will not be turned off by cutting scares. It is so easy to fix in Photoshop either completely remove it or minimize the scare. It is no big deal. Actually I found it is unique and it is part of her character. YMMV
Model
Dea and the Beast
Posts: 4796
Saint Petersburg, Florida, US
Connor Photography wrote: I will not be turned off by cutting scares. It is so easy to fix in Photoshop either completely remove it or minimize the scare. It is no big deal. Actually I found it is unique and it is part of her character. YMMV What Connor said, some photographers especially like to shoot scars, and make quite beautiful art with body scapes, for example. Check for some older threads, I'm sure you'll stumble across some useful contacts.
Artist/Painter
Hunter GWPB
Posts: 8179
King of Prussia, Pennsylvania, US
Dea and the Beast wrote: It isn't anyone's business what the scars are from, but if prominent, I would offer a selfie and put a line about the scarring in your profile, just like if you had any other special body mods (implants, gauges, etc. ). I don't know if you can even them out a bit more, like stretch marks do, ( I tried with coconut oil and sun bed once a week.. works pretty well), but since you say they're not very prominent, depending on what shoot you'll do (a landscape nude won't matter.. beauty close-up- yes). All the best! I like to know about things I may have to deal with, or that I may be able to use in a creative manner. I agree with the amazing woman above me, that it is none of my business or concern how something occurred. If you feel that sharing your story can help to educate people, or to help people that may be experiencing what you have experienced, please feel free to help others. Someone's else's idle curiosity is something you can indulge or ignore. In your profile, you can mention the scars and provide the link (I have not looked at the photo yet), just as you have here. Edit: I came back and looked at your links. The third one, I can't see the marks at all. Only in the close ups. Maybe a MUA would chime in, but I would expect that those could be easily hidden with make up. As a painter, ultimately stuff like that matters little because I am certainly not going to try to paint them in.
Photographer
Risen Phoenix Photo
Posts: 3779
Minneapolis, Minnesota, US
Agreed, I have seen a few slight scars which are no problem to fix and scars on arms tha looked like they went through a meat grinder. The later was impossible to fix. In that case the model should disclose they have significant and prominent scaring. The reason doesn't mater, but the photographer needs to know what he is dealing with. Especially if the model expects to be pad.
Photographer
Eagle Rock Photographer
Posts: 1286
Los Angeles, California, US
it's a matter of honesty. Photographer who gets surprised by cut marks has a right to feel cheated or at least misled. Nor is it easy to remove cut marks quickly in Photoshop. Especially when the shoot (such as a swimwear catalog) might require the use of dozens or more different photos from the shoot.
Photographer
Vector One Photography
Posts: 3722
Fort Lauderdale, Florida, US
You tell them you have scars as it may effect their photo or their concept. You do not tell them how you got the scars as it is none of their business, is a private fact, and is something you decide to discuss or not discuss and to whom you discuss it with.
Photographer
Connor Photography
Posts: 8539
Newark, Delaware, US
Risen Phoenix Photo wrote: Agreed, I have seen a few slight scars which are no problem to fix and scars on arms tha looked like they went through a meat grinder. The later was impossible to fix. In that case the model should disclose they have significant and prominent scaring. The reason doesn't mater, but the photographer needs to know what he is dealing with. Especially if the model expects to be pad. That is why it is so important that every model in their portfolio should has a series of unretouch boring digital Polaroids. Buyers can examine the good before ordering.............LOL However, there is NO need to explain why there are tattoos, piercing, scares or whatever !!!
Photographer
AgX
Posts: 2851
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, US
vi0letdreamer wrote: ... or just show up to the shoot without saying anything? ... Personally, I would find the above to be very poor etiquette. Perhaps think of it this way: you already know that the scars might be an issue for the photographer (as evidenced by you starting this thread). If you go ahead and disregard that issue, you're indicating that you don't care that it may or may not cause the photographer additional time in editing, or that it may affect the shoot concept, or the images, or the wardrobe decisions, or... In my opinion, that's disrespectful of another person's time and effort. I shoot scars often, but I want to know about them (and request snapshots, if they aren't evident) ahead of time so I can build them into my shoot plan (or not).
Photographer
J Ranold
Posts: 184
Munich, Bavaria, Germany
vi0letdreamer wrote: When is it appropriate to disclose to people interested in working with me [...]? Should I state it on my profile (though I'd feel weird about having it as public knowledge), tell people after they express interest in collaborating, or just show up to the shoot without saying anything? It might be useful to separate two questions: a) should you mention you have scars(?), and the other thing: b) should you mention where they come from(?). To me it seems that your actual concern is less about having scars, but rather about how you got them. a) Pointing to the other replies, there was good advice already. In some models' bios I read lines like "I have some scars here and there, but they can easily be covered/edited out..." It may help the photographer to cast the model and plan the shoot. Like Connor, there are plenty of photographers who are not Connor Photography wrote: [...] turned off by cutting scares. b) Regarding whether you should disclose how you got those scars: if you don't want the reason to be public, don't state it in your profile, and yes, it's wise to take public knowledge into consideration. The fact you have scars is one thing, an info probably useful for a photographer; how you got them is another thing. Like Dea (and others) said, this is no one's business and you are not obligated to tell anyone if you don't want to, so don't feel any pressure. *On a more personal side note) Actually, the most important thing is that you're fine. You are not alone with what you've been through and it is nothing you need to feel ashamed of. In fact, fights you've won show your strength and I am happy to see that you gained confidence. Especially when there are issues we can't hide completely, it can make us feel insecure and we start to worry what others may think, or we feel the urge to explain ourselves. Then it is time to gain confidence and going on with being creative. If one has health issues others should know about in case of emergency (e.g. allergic reactions) that would be something different, however, of course also no reason to feel ashamed. So, if it is about the scars, list them as an information that helps a photographer to set up the shoot. If it is about where they come from, you can be confident, since honesty doesn't mean you have to pour out your soul to anyone and everyone.
Photographer
Rays Fine Art
Posts: 7504
New York, New York, US
My opinion only, but I feel that if there's a reasonable cahnce that they might affect the photographer's work or work flow, he should know in advance, so it's pretty much a matter of how much information you want to give out before getting some information from the photographer. I'd say that a line in your profile like, "I have several scars that may or may not be visible in the final photographs. I'd be happy to discuss them with you when we plan the shoot." would be more than sufficient. All IMHO as always, of course.
Model
MatureModelMM
Posts: 2843
Detroit, Michigan, US
Rays Fine Art wrote: My opinion only, but I feel that if there's a reasonable chance that they might affect the photographer's work or work flow, he should know in advance, so it's pretty much a matter of how much information you want to give out before getting some information from the photographer. I'd say that a line in your profile like, "I have several scars that may or may not be visible in the final photographs. I'd be happy to discuss them with you when we plan the shoot." would be more than sufficient. All IMHO as always, of course. I think Ray's answer is the perfect solution. Yes, you definitely need to make photographers you will be working with aware of any scars or other issues before they book you to work with them. However, you do not need to go into any great detail in your profile unless you choose to. It would be fine to discuss them further with the individual at the time you are making plans. Some people may want to be totally open about such things and go into detail in their profile, which is fine if that's how they feel, but you don't need to say any more than a statement that you have some scars. Including a shot where they are clearly visible also helps people decide if they are a challenge to retouch, or if they would want to have them showing. I have scars and discolorations from medical issues, which I have clearly stated in my profile and shown in some photos, and it has never been a problem for anyone to make a decision whether to work with me or not based upon that information.
Model
Kelly Kooper
Posts: 1240
Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
vi0letdreamer wrote: I've searched the forums but can't seem to find information on this topic. When is it appropriate to disclose to people interested in working with me that I have some old scars? Should I state it on my profile (though I'd feel weird about having it as public knowledge), tell people after they express interest in collaborating, or just show up to the shoot without saying anything? For context, they're all 1-2 years old. There are 5-10 long-ish ones on the front and 20-30 really short ones down the side of my forearm (like the lower panel of this: https://21494dc99b6f931a50cf-af837cc28e … hoto-1.jpg ). Additionally, there are 4 on my mid-thigh area (like this but a little pinker, though I've definitely noticed they're becoming more skin-colored as they heal further: https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-6 … db96dd68-c ). I've been able to edit them out myself in Photoshop but it mostly hasn't been necessary as they're not too visible from a distance. I'd appreciate some perspective from anyone who has dealt with this issue from either side of the camera. Edit: This is the photo they're most visible in https://www.modelmayhem.com/portfolio/pic/42545715 (I didn't edit them at all, they're on the arm with the flower tattoo and the thigh on the opposite side) I had this moment when I was photographing a model a few years back. Her scars were a combination of old and new (some I suspected were only a few days old), which made it a different situation to yours. If they were entirely old, I wouldn't think anything of it. We all have a past and old scars mean you've moved past whatever it was so I would retouch them without saying a word to you about it, New scars were more of an issue because they meant the problem was existing. In this instance, the model and I had developed a good working relationship so I felt I could check in with her and see if there was anything I could do to help. She told me she was getting help so I let it go but depending on my interaction with the model, I may not have said anything. As with most things dealing with people, how you react is sometimes on a case by case basis, depending on the situation. EDIT. Perhaps you could state on your profile that you have these scars, like you have here, without needing to mention why or how. It could be from a few different things and you certainly don't need to tell everyone everything
Photographer
Znude!
Posts: 3317
Baton Rouge, Louisiana, US
I think it's wise to let people know ahead of time. It wouldn't be necessary to post it in the profile but upon first contact you should let them know if the scars might be a part of a shot. Based on a lot of what people shoot now days scars might be a preferred feature. I shoot traditional beauty shots. And one of the people I've worked with and who I hope to work with again soon has had surgeries which left scars. It's my opinion that the scars add to her personality, beauty, and are a great sign of her inner strength. We talked about the scars before the shoot and she was offering ideas on how to hide them. We did shoot some with them hidden but my favorite shots show the scars off well. She's a great person to work with. I think her life experiences made her better and stronger. I admire her for her bravery. Here is a nude which shows her scars. https://www.flickr.com/photos/znude/251 … 659046792/ or this link if you don't have a flickr account http://znude.com/mm/_DSC3396.jpg
Photographer
Risen Phoenix Photo
Posts: 3779
Minneapolis, Minnesota, US
Connor Photography wrote: That is why it is so important that every model in their portfolio should has a series of unretouch boring digital Polaroids. Buyers can examine the good before ordering.............LOL However, there is NO need to explain why there are tattoos, piercing, scares or whatever !!! Thats what I said
Photographer
Rob Photosby
Posts: 4810
Brisbane, Queensland, Australia
On several occasions, I have had models turn up with self-harm scars that were not disclosed beforehand. My best guess is that they were sufficiently inexperienced that they did not realise that the scars would a problem, but ignorance does not change facts. Your scars are sufficiently prominent and sufficiently extensive that I would be irritated if their existence was not fully disclosed beforehand. Discussing how they got there hardly matters because such clusters of fine linear scars have only one likely origin.
Photographer
goofus
Posts: 808
Santa Barbara, California, US
I've shot a couple models with such scars one even required me NOT to retouch them out.... not that I would anyway they are part of the models history... I would never want to make that go away in general..I like scars - they show a lived life
Photographer
Python Photos
Posts: 609
Rawlins, Wyoming, US
I agree with the general consensus that telling the photographer about significant scars before the shoot is good practice but that describing the situation isn't necessary. I've occasionally run into models who had a few bruises on arms or legs. I editing them out of the final photos, and that's fine. I don't want anyone to have bruises from abuse of any kind, but life is life. If a model picks up a bruise or two from living an active life, I'm happy to see that she's living an active life. I've shot with one model who has extensive neck scars from cancer surgery. In one shoot, I editing the scars. In another shoot, we highlighted the scars because we were producing pictures for a cancer survivor website about scars.
Photographer
Carle Photo
Posts: 475
New Orleans, Louisiana, US
Python Photos wrote: I've occasionally run into models who had a few bruises on arms or legs. I editing them out of the final photos, and that's fine. I don't want anyone to have bruises from abuse of any kind, but life is life. If a model picks up a bruise or two from living an active life, I'm happy to see that she's living an active life. Most of my broken bones, ER visits, sprains, bruises, in the past 10 years have come from modeling jobs.
Photographer
Mary Durante Youtt
Posts: 520
Barnegat, New Jersey, US
I shot a model with old self scars. She told me that some photographers retouched them and others didn't. I prefer no surprises. I wasn't looking for flawless.
Photographer
Python Photos
Posts: 609
Rawlins, Wyoming, US
Ionalynn wrote: Most of my broken bones, ER visits, sprains, bruises, in the past 10 years have come from modeling jobs. Did you have fun though?
Photographer
Jaysen R Lee
Posts: 547
Anaheim, California, US
Photographers upset over self inflicted scars? Selfish bastards! LOL.
Photographer
Natural Means
Posts: 936
Yamba, New South Wales, Australia
vi0letdreamer wrote: I've searched the forums but can't seem to find information on this topic. When is it appropriate to disclose to people interested in working with me that I have some old scars? Should I state it on my profile (though I'd feel weird about having it as public knowledge), tell people after they express interest in collaborating, or just show up to the shoot without saying anything? For context, they're all 1-2 years old. There are 5-10 long-ish ones on the front and 20-30 really short ones down the side of my forearm (like the lower panel of this: https://21494dc99b6f931a50cf-af837cc28e … hoto-1.jpg ). Additionally, there are 4 on my mid-thigh area (like this but a little pinker, though I've definitely noticed they're becoming more skin-colored as they heal further: https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-6 … db96dd68-c ). I've been able to edit them out myself in Photoshop but it mostly hasn't been necessary as they're not too visible from a distance. I'd appreciate some perspective from anyone who has dealt with this issue from either side of the camera. Edit: This is the photo they're most visible in https://www.modelmayhem.com/portfolio/pic/42545715 (I didn't edit them at all, they're on the arm with the flower tattoo and the thigh on the opposite side) I think the consensus is its desirable that you mention the scars (could be on profile, or in early communication), no one needs to know the whys or how's unless you want to discuss it.
Photographer
Eric212Grapher
Posts: 3771
Saint Louis, Missouri, US
Rays Fine Art wrote: My opinion only, but I feel that if there's a reasonable cahnce that they might affect the photographer's work or work flow, he should know in advance, so it's pretty much a matter of how much information you want to give out before getting some information from the photographer. I'd say that a line in your profile like, "I have several scars that may or may not be visible in the final photographs. I'd be happy to discuss them with you when we plan the shoot." would be more than sufficient. All IMHO as always, of course. +1, but change to "I have several scars that may or may not be visible in the final photographs. I'd be happy to share the password to my unretouched images with you when we plan the shoot." Since you are a VIP, you can easily add a password-protected folder of "unedited, no makeup" shots. Many still refer to these as Polaroids. You show your face without makeup. Generally, one with your hair pulled up, and another with your hair hanging down. Smile in one, and expressionless in the other. Profiles, too. Full length shots of your front, sides, and back. Then shots of your tattoos, piercings, and scars. For fun, add a closeup of your toes, knees, or armpits - tell people someone asked for them. Give the password out to those that ask when you start planning a shoot. This places the burden on the photographer. You've disclosed that fact you have some scars. You've offered to share the images at the time of booking. If they don't ask or don't look through the images, that is on them. Some will be scared away. No worries. Better they not complain when you arrive. Side note: talk with a gifted make-up artist. They may have a trick or two up their talented sleeves. I had one expert in concealing tattoos. Others, well, they just applied a ton of makeup, and it looked lousy and stained clothing. You are not the only model who has marks. Tell the nosy folks you rescued a kitten but it turned out to be a bobcat, or you dated Johnny Depp when he was portraying Edward Scissorhands. No one needs to know unless you want them to know.
Model
vi0letdreamer
Posts: 5
DeKalb, Illinois, US
Update: I've been informing people who express interest in working with me through messages and sending them links to the pictures in my portfolio where the scars are most visible and everyone has reacted positively so far
Photographer
PM_Photography
Posts: 129
Westwood, Massachusetts, US
vi0letdreamer wrote: ....Should I state it on my profile (though I'd feel weird about having it as public knowledge... Just keep in mind that even your post in this forum is open to some of the public. Nothing on the internet stays secret!
Model
vi0letdreamer
Posts: 5
DeKalb, Illinois, US
PM_Photography wrote: Just keep in mind that even your post in this forum is open to some of the public. Nothing on the internet stays secret! Well yeah but as far as I know, your forum posts don't show anywhere on your profile
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