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What does "Collab" mean to you?
Obviously it's short for "collaboration," but does it always imply TFP? Feb 28 21 05:42 pm Link Obviously it depends on who you are asking I often use it when contacting a model in the hopes that it will encourage an agreement and understanding that we will both receive the benefits of making something that would be not for pay but for the experience of working on something. I personally am a little perplexed when I am offered the opportunity to "collaborate" or "make art" with somebody whom I am required to pay to do their part, at that point it becomes a job and I now need to realize its about time and money and I should focus on what I get for my dollar. Of course for me it also has to do with what I have to offer as a photographer which tbh has room for improvement at least now I get the occasional person that does want to work on something if I can come up with ideas. Feb 28 21 06:39 pm Link Please allow Me to overstep My boundaries of expertise j_francis_imagery wrote: At the Professional level, No. Mar 01 21 02:43 am Link Typically when a model messages me about collaberating they want to get paid, so it doesn't neccearily mean TF. I've also found that some models who use the term collaborate, think it means they have equal copyright to any photos produced, so I'm always leary of that. What I don't like about the term, is it can imply all roles of a shoot and the product of a shoot are all equallly shared, when in fact being the subjet of an image and being the creator of an image are each very different roles, each of which has it's own unique legal rights, benefits and issues. When I hire an independent contracter, whether that's a model, plumber or electrician, I am hiring them to do a specific job. I don't talk about it as a collaboration with me. A trade simply means that person is receiving someting of value, such as photos rather than money in return for their service. Trading does not however mean the roles or product are somehow magically shared. The important thing I find is clearly articulate shoot terms and not make assuptions about what a shoot entails or does not based on any term used. At least half the rants I've seen on here are due to shoot terms not being made clear and one party making assumptions they should not be making. Mar 10 21 09:22 am Link FIFTYONE PHOTOGRAPHY wrote: +1 Mar 10 21 09:37 am Link IMO 'collab' does not always imply TFP. I've collaborated with models, hair stylists, makeup artists, clothes designers and sometimes with other photographers. The compensation on offer can vary between collaborators and it doesn't necessarily exclude some amount of monetary remuneration and/or discount. Compensation doesn't need to be equal, but I endeavour to make my collaborations a win win for all those involved. Mar 10 21 06:59 pm Link When doing what we do, nothing should ever be implied. Mar 10 21 09:06 pm Link FIFTYONE PHOTOGRAPHY wrote: +2 Mar 11 21 12:09 am Link Collab, like TFP has various meanings to models, and photographers. "Collab", yeah, those big words are a pain. Topic never comes up as my work is always paid. Mar 11 21 09:31 am Link In My small unrelated to anyone else world, "Trade" means no money is used and equal posting rights to the social media world with equal tagging credits wherever possible are expected or at least appreciated. "Collab" means we will discuss and work out the concept to a hopefully mutually expected outcome. I "collab" with clients. I trade with models or dancers to help bring out my ideas. I will trade to do a model or dancers concept if they intern also work to create one of mine = still trade. I have no time for all the spammers in IG that ask "Collab?" in reference to their product designs. No thank you, I will not work for you for free. I will not provide you with models. Mar 11 21 02:34 pm Link Not a damn thing. Doesn't tell me if there is money involved and who pays and who gets paid. I like the TFP (trade for prints) and the updated version for digital. At least then you know what to expect(except for quantity). Apr 20 21 09:22 am Link "Collab" means someone doesn't know how to spell, or is too lazy to type the whole word or is trying to appear to be trendy. "collab" isn't a word and has no meaning as such. Apr 21 21 12:59 pm Link When a model and I have communication about a collaboration, it’s understood that it’s tfp. Apr 23 21 07:11 am Link j_francis_imagery wrote: Negative. Apr 24 21 02:31 am Link 63fotos wrote: Understood by whom? Apr 25 21 02:21 pm Link j_francis_imagery wrote: Many people on internet modelling sites automatically assume that 'collaboration' means 'TF'. For that reason, amongst others, I avoid use of the term. May 10 21 06:11 am Link when offered collab(oration), first of all, be polite, don't ask questions about money and kick back the same vague lingo -- for example, immediately approve "in the frames of mutual enigmatication", to be sure that neither side comprehends nothing of the terms. so, both sides feel better this way. Jun 20 21 10:30 pm Link Collaboration – 8 Ways to Work With Other Photographers A Post By: Andrew Faulk https://digital-photography-school.com/ … ographers/ Jun 25 21 10:53 pm Link Weldphoto wrote: Isn't it often code for broke? Aug 24 21 01:41 am Link Collab . . . shouldn't that mean that you are sharing a laboratory with another person ? Aug 24 21 08:55 am Link Ken Marcus Studios wrote: . Aug 24 21 10:13 am Link j_francis_imagery wrote: It means you are sharing an education with someone of the opposite sex Aug 24 21 01:59 pm Link Hey I came to this thread for some clarity on what actions are appropriate in situation I found myself in recently. A photographer reached out and wanted to “collab” on a boudoir shoot at their studio in exchange for digital files as they had just bought new props. I told them I was not comfortable doing a boudoir shoot but if they wanted to do fashion I’d consider it. They said no worries and if I’d be willing to do a headshot shoot instead so I agreed. I sent photos of every garment I was bringing before hand for approval. I drive the 2 hrs to the studio for a 1 hr shoot and it turns out to be their apartment, the props are a black curtain they are using to shade the sun on their balcony and a vintage couch (I’ve seen both in several shoots of theirs) The living rooms is small and crowded with stuff so I’m being told to pose in an area of about 3x4 feet to not show their belongings. I was under the impression we’d be doing headshots so that shouldn’t have mattered but I was pressured for portrait and full body. I was also under the impression there’d at least be new props, proper light boxes , backdrops or something of the sort but after the first 10 minutes the photographer seemed to understand their “studio” was not cut out and had me pose outside at a bike trail a few blocks down with natural light. Had I known that’s what the shoot would come to I’d never have agreed or driven the 2 hrs there and 2 hrs back back without compensation. They told me they wouldn’t shoot several of the tops I already showed them prior to meeting because “ it wouldn’t fit their portfolio” and “they wanted sexy” although Im not sure I’ll want to be use anything from this shoot in mine. They only wanted me to wear the low cut tops I brought and I was repeatedly told to drop a bra strap and not hide my boobs etc. I was okay posing for a headshot in a fashion tank but I did not want to have to pose provacatively they way I felt I was being forced to. I was not allowed creative liberty and almost every pose was chosen and micromanaged by photog. I go home and the next day photographer emails me a model release form that was not discussed before hand because they want to use my images to promote their photoshoot packages that include hair , makeup and a client closet (I did my own hair + makeup and provided my own wardrobe for shoot) I feel that due to how things went down and the general general attitude of photographer I’m going to ask to be compensated for this shoot at my going rate in exchange for a signature to release photos that I approve of (aka they need to show me proofs because I felt coerced to do things I already said I didn’t want to and don’t want provocatively posed or non portrait/headshots out for this shoot) ) or not sign at all and take the loss of my time and gain no photos out of this. Photog hasn’t shown me any of the photos and it seems like they don’t plan to until I sign at the current moment. Thoughts? Suggestions? I feel like they pulled a bait and switch. I feel taken advantage of artistically. This was the first woman photographer I ever worked with which was a large part of why I agreed and thought they’d be trustworthy. They contacted me by email and ig after seeing my mm profile. When I looked at her port I wasn’t crazy about it but I narrowed it down to the fact that the subjects didn’t look like industry models but the quality/clarity of photos was good. I feel that they’re trying to use me as the poster child to market to people’s aunties. I’ve done probably close to 100 music videos , shoots and tfp/collab work and never had a shoot feel this wrong or go that south . Idk why I didn’t pack my suitcase back up and left like I know I should have, I just wanted the drive to be made worth it I suppose Side note: home studios are 100% okay. I’ve been in a dozen and produced great photos in simple and more complex setups. The issue wasn’t it being small or a home studio but being lied to, pushed for things I already said no to , being denied things already agreed to, not having any of my boundaries being respected in a “collab” and them wanting to imply credit for, advertise and profit off my hair/makeup and personal wardrobe. Sorry for the longevity Sep 18 21 01:07 am Link Kitana Mendoza wrote: Unfortunately it sounds like a loss. You were approached for a boudoir shoot, and although you made it clear to stick with head shots it wasn't the photographer's original intent. That's not to say a different concept can't be agreed to beforehand, but once the shoot starts some people will try to steer the model towards what they really wanted. Oftentimes the photographer's work can offer some guidance in this regard i.e. do they actually have any strong portraits (in the style you want) in their port? Sep 18 21 07:55 am Link Collaboration - my definition is that all on the team contribute equally for shared whatever. That could be part of the art sales, recognition in print, etc. Does collaboration mean the model gets paid automatically at the time of the session? If so that would indicate the model felt that the photographer did not contribute significantly to the shoot and thus was reduced to the role of a button pusher?. But what exactly does that mean with regards to copyright? Since one or more people contributed to the production of something do they all equally share copyright? I came across this copyright stumbling block during the pandemic when the remote tethered shoot sessions started. Some of the models stated that because they contributed significantly to the set design, wardrobe, lighting equipment, etc that the copyright was shared even though they were charging the photographer and the photographer was responsible for the direction of the session - posing, light adjustment, etc. I passed on those even though they were very intriguing. Sep 18 21 10:38 am Link Kitana Mendoza wrote: Sep 18 21 10:42 am Link Kitana Mendoza wrote: My suggestion is to learn from this bad experience and decide on some preventative measures you can take to avoid it from happening again. Sep 19 21 08:19 am Link Radically clear and honest communication. Some people can't handle it and run away, I am sure I've lost a few models like that that simply did not want to engage in this adult level communication. I now avoid all possible unclear terms, because what it means to me means something else to you. Will you be paying me money for this shoot/images? How much do you want me to pay for this shoot? How long are you willing to work for X number of dollars? And the final most important, which has bitten me in the back before, since I and model had different ideas about it. Is this a per hour rate or total for the shoot? I've had one or two models misunderstand that total per shoot rate and eagerly demand the per hour equivalent at the end of the session. Bummer, we both had to compromise, never again. How many images would you like me to send you after I finish working on the session? It's not sexy or fun to be this direct and clear. However, I find that the more experienced the model is the more they appreciate and respond positively to this. Oct 07 21 08:15 pm Link j_francis_imagery wrote: In the context of social media modeling, I would say yes, in general, especially if the model is independently monetizing the content being created. There are, of course, always exceptions. Jul 19 22 10:13 am Link In general, unless there are exceptions. Jul 19 22 10:23 am Link A collaboration would be an arrangement whereby two people, for example a model and a photographer work together on a project on a collaborative basis, that is to say that there would be creative input by both parties. Jul 22 22 09:56 am Link Jul 27 22 07:21 pm Link Can't delete. Why? Jul 27 22 07:21 pm Link |
), I have always shown up with spins and ideas and with the photographer's permission, I will run with it. 
