Justin Foto wrote:

What's wrong with that? I'm from the UK, everyone does that there!

First of all, you aren't Hassy 501, and who said anything was wrong with it?

Lumigraphics wrote:

My hair won't stay combed over.

You should have that Swedish chic sit on your head.

Robert Randall wrote:

You should have that Swedish chic sit on your head.

Jesus Christ !!!!!!!!!!!!

*rofl*

Shutterbug5269 wrote:

The odd thing is, nudes seem to be the only reliable gigs I am able to get. (Paid, TF or otherwise)


I shit you not, EVERY SINGLE non-nude shoot I have booked in the last 2 years the model has either canceled, postponed indefinitely, or no-showed.

I guess the nekkid chicks just like me for some reason.

I have had the same thing. For nude shoots the models show up while clothing shoots I have had an issue. Even the paid shoots I'm having a 1 in 5 flake. It's not me though. The clients are hiring these girls and I don't know them until they show up.

Swedish Snowbunny wrote:
and from my own personal experience, everytime I got nude the photographers would ask if they could eat my pussy, or just lick it my pussy so they could get  a taste or they would try licking my nipples...weirdos!  luckily, i met husband who said that was insane

Uh Yeah. I'm buying that...

Conceptually Black wrote:

So you only charge them the first time you shoot them TF*... still not TF*...

Correct, the first time is NOT TF*. Too many flakes and that is just MY way of attempting to weed through them.

Lumigraphics wrote:

My hair won't stay combed over.

which is why we all see it...

glamour pics wrote:

You say it's "TF" ("Trade For...") but you require a "sitting fee!?" What's a sitting fee? And how much do you charge? And for what? And how is it a trade if you're asking for greenbacks?

Its all been answered if you read the remainder of the thread.

Robert Randall wrote:

I know some folks will think I'm bashing an amateur with this question, but in reality, it's just a question... are you under 5'8" tall, do you wear glasses, are you bald, and were you a hall monitor in middle school? I'm conducting a survey to find out if the resulting data will support my perceptions. Oh, and did you play organized soccer in your youth?

I'm 6'2" 200lbs. No glasses or contacts. Green eyes. I'm am not bald I have blonde curly hair. I was involved basketball, racquetball, volleyball, track, swimming and was on the chess team. Never a hall monitor.

Swedish Snowbunny wrote:
and from my own personal experience, everytime I got nude the photographers would ask if they could eat my pussy, or just lick it my pussy so they could get  a taste or they would try licking my nipples...weirdos!  luckily, i met husband who said that was insane

I agree sex is practiced and enjoyed by millions of wierdos.
Who's your husband Ned Flanders.

Robert Randall wrote:

You should have that Swedish chic sit on your head.

Ewww.

c_h_r_i_s wrote:

I agree sex is practiced and enjoyed by millions of wierdos.
Who's your husband Ned Flanders.

Or Jerry Brudos, and she thinks all are like him.

Lumigraphics wrote:

Robert Randall wrote:
Oh, and did you play organized soccer in your youth?

I thought the ratio was 12 soccer hooligans for every actual player. Didn't I read that somewhere?

All in the past

Robert Randall wrote:

First of all, you aren't Hassy 501, and who said anything was wrong with it?

A point well made.

Fotticelli wrote:
Get nekkid or get lost is my policy.

myopia in a craft that depends upon the ability to see.....

imagine that!

"get lost" never sounded so good.

Robert Randall wrote:

I know some folks will think I'm bashing an amateur with this question, but in reality, it's just a question... are you under 5'8" tall, do you wear glasses, are you bald, and were you a hall monitor in middle school? I'm conducting a survey to find out if the resulting data will support my perceptions. Oh, and did you play organized soccer in your youth?

Height: 5 foot eight (or a little over)
Glasses? nope
Bald?  Nope (premature gray runs in my gene pool thankfully)
Hall monitor in middle school? nope
Organized soccer? nope

Justin Foto wrote:

I think this says a lot about the confidence level and commitment of the average nude model.

Considering I live out in the boonies, I guess it does, doesn't it?

PBK Photography wrote:
Was reading another thread and this question came to mind...

...

Do you (models) give in to photographers (that you really want to shoot with) who will only shoot under those conditions?

...

I think one of the reasons why this question isn't being answered is because, doing so may make the responder a potential target for the minority who prowl for model types susceptible to exploitation they didn't want and/or need?

In other words, any model answering that question with a "yes", may automatically fall into someone's "sheep" category.

Robert Randall wrote:

You should have that Swedish chic sit on your head.

I'd still be going bald

Conceptually Black wrote:

which is why we all see it...

Like that's a bad thing?

Yun Blair wrote:
There are plenty of models who will pose nude. So why push a model to do nudes or implied nudes if he/she does not want to do them? That is just creepy.

Requiring nudity is not the same as pushing someone to shoot nude who doesn't want to. I only shoot nudes. Models who do not want to shoot nudes... don't shoot with me, because I tell them that I only shoot nudes. If they don't want to, they go shoot with someone who has different requirements, and I keep on shooting with models who want to shoot nudes. Coercing a model into a shoot she doesn't want to be in is creepy and just plain wrong. Having immovable standards of work isn't... as long as the two don't overlap.

Robert Randall wrote:

I don't assault amateurs, on the contrary, I like to help them whenever I can. However, some of those amateurs have very thin skin and they seem to have a difficult time with the truth. That, when combined with a questionable skill set and low self esteem, can make them somewhat argumentative and petty. Some of them just can't seem to let it go, and they stalk me all over the place, calling me names and making fun of me.

Turkey vulture... that's a new one.

Turley vultures only feed on carrion and trash ( nothing living) so not sure the analogy works.

PBK Photography wrote:
To clarify- Yes (bad policy) It was only if you were willing (poor excuse) but the upside was I did learn how to do them well and that what most of my clients still come to me for.

Roxy Mae  NFB wrote:
i can see it now

"No TF* unless you are willing to show me your tities, otherwise here are my rate:...."


so other words pay me to photographer you clothed which is not fun or exciting or show me your tities so i can be "excited" about the shoot. lol

How about, "your look / stats don't fit my needs for my commercial portfolio work, but for art nudes, height and body type are less relevant.  If you are interested in that style, I'd be happy to also shoot commercial / fashion for your port.  Or, I can shoot any style you like for a reasonable rate, depending on what you need."

I don't think that's at all unreasonable, or "GWC."  It is business.  A trade is unfair if one party can't benefit from it.

Roxy Mae  NFB wrote:
lemme get this right in order to shoot on a tf* basis i would have had to shoot nude?(according to your old policy)....wow

Sasha W wrote:
hehe my thoughts too. but i've heard/seen that ALOT!! or if u want me to pay the model she have to be naked. that makes me wonder what these photogs are really thinking about. lol

I don't know what "those photographers" are thinking about.  But, when I say that, I'm thinking, "this model doesn't fit my needs for clothed shoots, but we might be able to make some art nudes that work for me. 

Is it really that difficult to understand?  A TFP shoot is not just the photographer doing whatever the model wants.  Nor is it the model doing just what the photographer wants.  Each party gets to request or require concepts that will benefit them.

PBK Photography wrote:
Currently, I no longer require nudes to shoot a model TF* (I just require a one time sitting fee and will shoot models TF* for as long as we want to continue working together).

You require a sitting fee (payment) to shoot TF*?

Maybe I don't understand what TF* means - time for payment?

Conceptually Black wrote:

So if the work I am looking to do TF* requires nudity and I tell models this, I am just a "GWC taking nude pictures"?

I must have the same problem...

If you want me to devote an entire day of my life to a model she needs to be willing to be a blank canvas for our art.

Jessyka Ann wrote:
you would like that wouldnt you? *devilish grin*

Lumigraphics wrote:
Yes. Now get on your bicycle and start riding this way first thing in the morning.

I'm headed out east, for a fee, and with her consent, I might just bring her back.  (after I do a shoot with her, of course. . . . )

Moore Photo Graphix wrote:
Is it me, or some folks not understand the concept of You Catch More Flies With Honey Than Vinegar? It seems too many people (models, photographers, etc.) believe TF* automatically means free work. Not so fast! As someone who has done TF* shoots in the past, I never forced anyone to do anything that they're not comfortable doing or discussed beforehand. It was able getting the model the images they need for port. The main objective for TF* is helping each other out, nude or non-nude. In other words, both sides need to benefit from the shoot. If I wanted nude images, I work with those who have no problem doing nude modeling. If I wanted clothed images, I look for those who can do clothed images. I follow the KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) method when it comes to doing shoots. It all boils to down to working with those who add value to the portfolio. It's not rocket science! It making things less complicated than they have to be!

And if the images they needed for their port had no plausible benefit to you? But they still wanted a TF*?  You'd NEVER ask if they'd be willing to due nudes?

LA Woodward wrote:
So, my opinion on this matter...

Nudity is irrelevant.  Who pays who (if anyone pays) is determined based on skill, supply-demand, and quality of portfolios.  If you (photographer) have a low quality portfolio with little diversity and have a hard time getting models to book with you, and I am in crazy demand by photographers and have lots of photos in my portolfio by photographers with much greater skill than you, then I'll quote you my rates.  And vice versa.

My rates don't change on whether or not I'm naked, so why should yours?  We're trading modeling skills and photography skills, for either cash or photos. If we're trading services for nudity, isn't that borderline prostitution?

If I say "I will shoot commercial for your port, if I get to watch you change clothes" that is creepy, and perhaps "borderline prostitution."  If I say "I need to shoot styles that benefit my port, if I'm going to not charge for shooting styles that benefit your port; what is so complicated about that?

PDF IMAGES PHOTOGRAPHY wrote:
LETS ALL GET NAKED

Fuck yeah!

MikeRobisonPhotos wrote:

If I say "I will shoot commercial for your port, if I get to watch you change clothes" that is creepy, and perhaps "borderline prostitution."  If I say "I need to shoot styles that benefit my port, if I'm going to not charge for shooting styles that benefit your port; what is so complicated about that?

Agree....a TFP is a trade...I try to give the model what she wants/needs, but I expect to get what I need for my portfolio...as long as everyone is up front about it, what is the issue?

PDF IMAGES PHOTOGRAPHY wrote:
LETS ALL GET NAKED

We used to do that years ago, at night sneak into the local open air pool in the summers and skinny dip by the light of the silvery moon.

MikeRobisonPhotos wrote:

If I say "I will shoot commercial for your port, if I get to watch you change clothes" that is creepy, and perhaps "borderline prostitution."  If I say "I need to shoot styles that benefit my port, if I'm going to not charge for shooting styles that benefit your port; what is so complicated about that?

There are probably models who would go for that, TFW (trade for watching.)