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12last
Photographer
Looknsee Photography
Posts: 20,854
Portland, Oregon, US


There's talk about this year being the last football pro bowl...

...  No player played hard last year; it was a joke.
...  Ratings are very low.
...  The game is totally meaningless.

I know I won't miss it.  Would you?
Jan 25 13 02:29 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Mike Kelcher
Posts: 12,712
Minneapolis, Minnesota, US


For the players who did well during the season, it's a paid trip to Hawaii. While that's good for them, they probably could afford to pay their own way.

It's nice for the people of Hawaii, they get to watch a game.

Other than that, it's not worth the cost of the electricity it takes to run the television.
Jan 25 13 02:34 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Dan K Photography
Posts: 5,409
STATEN ISLAND, New York, US


I doubt I have ever watched more then 5 minutes total. I wouldn't miss it.
Jan 25 13 02:35 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
TrianglePhoto
Posts: 569
Chicago, Illinois, US


Why bother to play the game... Just name the teams and then have everyone show up to Hawaii for a massive autograph session and a lot of drinking...

Just make it a Comicon for football...
Jan 25 13 02:36 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Christopher Hartman
Posts: 53,743
Buena Park, California, US


TrianglePhoto wrote:
Why bother to play the game... Just name the teams and then have everyone show up to Hawaii for a massive autograph session and a lot of drinking...

Just make it a Comicon for football...

Pretty much this! make a big fan day that's in Hawaii.  have skills contests like they do in baseball before the All Star game.  Though I'm not sure what you can really have them do other than a QB accuracy challenge and a kick challenge.

Jan 25 13 03:22 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Good Egg Productions
Posts: 15,100
Orlando, Florida, US


Christopher Hartman wrote:

Pretty much this! make a big fan day that's in Hawaii.  have skills contests like they do in baseball before the All Star game.  Though I'm not sure what you can really have them do other than a QB accuracy challenge and a kick challenge.

If they teamed up with the Punt, Pass, Kick skills thing for kids, it would actually mean something.  The Pro Bowl USED to mean something to those selected in the 80's when player salaries weren't ridiculous.  A bonus trip for the families to Hawaii was a big deal.

Now, it's more of an obligation for the players to be selected to play in the game.  I say drastically change what the Pro bowl game is, or kill it.

Jan 25 13 04:29 pm  Link  Quote 
guide forum
Photographer
Robb Mann
Posts: 10,006
Baltimore, Maryland, US


At least in Baseball the good players actually play, and the game determines home field advantage for the World Series.
Jan 25 13 04:34 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Farenell Photography
Posts: 17,857
Albany, New York, US


Robb Mann wrote:
At least in Baseball the good players actually play, and the game determines home field advantage for the World Series.

That's only a recent change courtesy of the 2002 All-Star game where both teams ran out of subs.

The players play but they don't want for fearing of getting hurt for an essentially meaningless game, as happened to Ray Fosse when Pete Rose ended his career w/ a play at the plate during the 1970 All-Star game.

Jan 25 13 04:42 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
C h a r l e s D
Posts: 9,304
Los Angeles, California, US


TrianglePhoto wrote:
Why bother to play the game... Just name the teams and then have everyone show up to Hawaii for a massive autograph session and a lot of drinking...

Just make it a Comicon for football...

That's a really, REALLY great idea!

Jan 25 13 04:44 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Instinct Images
Posts: 22,465
San Diego, California, US


Looknsee Photography wrote:
There's talk about this year being the last football pro bowl...

...  No player played hard last year; it was a joke.
...  Ratings are very low.
...  The game is totally meaningless.

I know I won't miss it.  Would you?

I understand why players liked going to Hawaii on a free vacation and they always enjoyed being known as an All-Star but the game has become a joke. It's certainly better to have it played before the Super Bowl other than not having the players from the teams in the Super Bowl.

Would I miss it? Not at all.

Jan 25 13 04:54 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Art Silva
Posts: 8,932
Santa Barbara, California, US


Robb Mann wrote:
At least in Baseball the good players actually play, and the game determines home field advantage for the World Series.

+1

I would hope that the Pro Bowl would go back to being played AFTER the Super Bowl, that way all those players selected that are in the SB would be able to show up.
This two week in between conference championship games and the Super Bowl with a pro bowl mixed in Just Doesn't Work!

Not sure how you could make the pro bowl game itself competitive being that the SB is always played in a neutral stadium but there has to be SOMETHING they can play for other than a bonus check.

Jan 25 13 05:12 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Orca Bay Images
Posts: 32,233
Lodi, California, US


Robb Mann wrote:
At least in Baseball the good players actually play, and the game determines home field advantage for the World Series.

Hard to do in the NFL, since the Super Bowl is predetermined for a neutral field.

Jan 25 13 05:33 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Orca Bay Images
Posts: 32,233
Lodi, California, US


Good Egg Productions wrote:

If they teamed up with the Punt, Pass, Kick skills thing for kids, it would actually mean something.  The Pro Bowl USED to mean something to those selected in the 80's when player salaries weren't ridiculous.  A bonus trip for the families to Hawaii was a big deal.

Now, it's more of an obligation for the players to be selected to play in the game.  I say drastically change what the Pro bowl game is, or kill it.

That, and couple it with the massive autograph session and maybe a family day for the players and their loved ones.

Jan 25 13 05:35 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Orca Bay Images
Posts: 32,233
Lodi, California, US


The game itself is utterly meaningless, regardless of whether it's played the week before the Super Bowl or the week after. The Senior Bowl is more relevant.
Jan 25 13 05:36 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
EdwardKristopher
Posts: 3,338
Tempe, Arizona, US


TrianglePhoto wrote:
Why bother to play the game... Just name the teams and then have everyone show up to Hawaii for a massive autograph session and a lot of drinking...

Just make it a Comicon for football...

Now, this sounds like a plan!

Jan 25 13 05:38 pm  Link  Quote 
guide forum
Photographer
Robb Mann
Posts: 10,006
Baltimore, Maryland, US


Kinda funny to think about it. Being picked to go to the Pro Bowl is a big deal, but the actual game is a charade.

What if the game had a charity sponser or tie in? AFC could play for Breast Cancer, NFC for Leukaemia. Winning side gets $2m donation from NFL, losing side $500k?
Jan 26 13 03:19 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
37photog
Posts: 692
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, US


Robb Mann wrote:
At least in Baseball the good players actually play, and the game determines home field advantage for the World Series.

Thats the dumbest rule in all of sports!!   Gosh, I wish they would undo that immediately.  A team could have 112 wins, and end up playing on the road now to a wild card team with 86 wins.  Stupid.


The Pro Bowl is difficult to encourage playing for something. Too high a risk of injury, alot of players always loafed it a bit, and tried to have fun. Years ago, around 2000 NE had a RB in some rookie game on sand, and the kid totally blew out his knee. I forget his name, but he did come back, fortunately, but not sure if he was ever the same.

Really, the problem isn't the Pro-Bowl anymore, it's Roger Goodell's placing high hopes and expectations on what can be done to promote the silly one off game.  It was always a crappy "Oh, hey look the Pro Bowl." (5 minutes later changing the channel).  It was for the players, a 'Thank You'.  Goodell wanted to somehow turn that into some high TV ratings, money making extravaganza (Week before SB, Tried holding it in Miami - both dumb ideas). Just leave it as is, or ditch it. One things certain, people will never watch it. Punt Pass Kick is an ok idea, but that doesn't change the fact people won't watch it on TV. The charity idea is actually pretty good though, but I think the game is better as just having fun.  They'll never have an aggressively hit Pro-Bowl game, and that's why they'll never have ratings for it. It's a different sport than baseball, look at the NHL all star game, it's no defense.

Jan 26 13 08:02 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
ChrisFischerPhotography
Posts: 852
Otsego, Minnesota, US


Have a big Madden tournament for all the players selected, with the last few rounds televised live, and bracketed so that the final is NFC vs AFC. Winner gets a check for himself, a check for his charity, and the cover of next year's game.

My money would be on Chris Kluwe.
Jan 26 13 08:09 am  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
T
Posts: 53,557
Washington, District of Columbia, US


I hope so.
Jan 26 13 08:13 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Chris Rifkin
Posts: 24,412
Tampa, Florida, US


T wrote:
I hope so.

What are you nutz
Its football
What is left after the Super Bowl?????
Arena league is not the same
Hell,I watched every week of the XFL(Tommy Maddox league MVP,He Hate Me leading the league in rushing)

Jan 26 13 08:30 am  Link  Quote 
Makeup Artist
T
Posts: 53,557
Washington, District of Columbia, US


Chris Rifkin wrote:

What are you nutz
Its football
What is left after the Super Bowl?????
Arena league is not the same
Hell,I watched every week of the XFL(Tommy Maddox league MVP,He Hate Me leading the league in rushing)

I don't even like pre-season games. If the games don't count, I don't enjoy them. I LOVE NFL season but when it's over, it's over. I love NBA allstar games, it's fun.

Jan 26 13 08:33 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Chris Rifkin
Posts: 24,412
Tampa, Florida, US


T wrote:

I don't even like pre-season games. If the games don't count, I don't enjoy them. I LOVE NFL season but when it's over, it's over. I love NBA allstar games, it's fun.

And conversly that is the ONLY NBA game (weekend I love,though looks like I might have to start following my Knicks again as they are starting to resemble a somewhat good NBA team this year)because its all about individualism,the skill scompetitions are awesome,and even the game,its all freelance and fun,no defense,its pure schoolyard fun(has anyone ever fouled out in an allstar game?)
The NHL allstar game is fun as well,12-10 games,the poor goalies are the ones who are screwed in that one

Jan 26 13 08:49 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Looknsee Photography
Posts: 20,854
Portland, Oregon, US


TrianglePhoto wrote:
Why bother to play the game... Just name the teams and then have everyone show up to Hawaii for a massive autograph session and a lot of drinking...

Just make it a Comicon for football...

That's not a bad idea.

Jan 26 13 08:55 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Let There Be Light
Posts: 7,657
Los Angeles, California, US


Orca Bay Images wrote:
Hard to do in the NFL, since the Super Bowl is predetermined for a neutral field.

The Super Bowl site is predetermined but it's not always neutral if the home NFL team makes it to the Super Bowl in its own stadium.  The closest came in Super Bowl XIV when the Rams played in the game at the Rose Bowl while they played their home games at the LA Coliseum and SB XIX when the 49ers won the game at Stanford Stadium, which was a lot closer to the team headquarters in Redwood City than Candlestick Park was.

Jan 26 13 09:53 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Orca Bay Images
Posts: 32,233
Lodi, California, US


Let There Be Light wrote:

The Super Bowl site is predetermined but it's not always neutral if the home NFL team makes it to the Super Bowl in its own stadium.  The closest came in Super Bowl XIV when the Rams played in the game at the Rose Bowl while they played their home games at the LA Coliseum and SB XIX when the 49ers won the game at Stanford Stadium, which was a lot closer to the team headquarters in Redwood City than Candlestick Park was.

True, but it's rare. Two close-to-home SBs out of how many?

Jan 26 13 10:57 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Orca Bay Images
Posts: 32,233
Lodi, California, US


Robb Mann wrote:
At least in Baseball the good players actually play, and the game determines home field advantage for the World Series.
37photog wrote:
Thats the dumbest rule in all of sports!!   Gosh, I wish they would undo that immediately.  A team could have 112 wins, and end up playing on the road now to a wild card team with 86 wins.  Stupid.

Undoing it wouldn't accomplish what you want it to. Previously, the team with the better record didn't necessarily get home-field advantage in the World Series. Homefield advantage alternated between the AL and the NL from year to year.

The current rule about homefield advantage being determined by the winner of the All Star game is a pretty ingenious solution, in that it gives some added meaning to an exhibition game.

Jan 26 13 11:01 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Orca Bay Images
Posts: 32,233
Lodi, California, US


Art Silva Photography wrote:
Not sure how you could make the pro bowl game itself competitive being that the SB is always played in a neutral stadium but there has to be SOMETHING they can play for other than a bonus check.

The winning team gets to ram a broomstick up Roger Goodell's ass.

Jan 26 13 11:04 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
37photog
Posts: 692
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, US


Orca Bay Images wrote:
The current rule about homefield advantage being determined by the winner of the All Star game is a pretty ingenious solution, in that it gives some added meaning to an exhibition game.

Yeah, and it also gives an unjustified home field advantage to a team for ridiculous reasons in the climax series of the entire season.  Possibly affecting the outcome of the World Series for a stupid All Star Game?! Here's a novel thought, focus more on the WORLD SERIES THAN THE ALL STAR GAME!!

Stupid idea.  I know it used to alternate, which had it's reason (leagues didn't interplay, there's different leagues different schedules). There also weren't 8 extra teams in the post season either, so the season records were typically closer, and all teams had hard fought battles of winning their pennant.  But really with 12 playoff teams now, as opposed to 4 pre-1995, its time to address it with a common sense approach.

Jan 26 13 11:29 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Art Silva
Posts: 8,932
Santa Barbara, California, US


Orca Bay Images wrote:

Robb Mann wrote:
At least in Baseball the good players actually play, and the game determines home field advantage for the World Series.

Undoing it wouldn't accomplish what you want it to. Previously, the team with the better record didn't necessarily get home-field advantage in the World Series. Homefield advantage alternated between the AL and the NL from year to year.

The current rule about homefield advantage being determined by the winner of the All Star game is a pretty ingenious solution, in that it gives some added meaning to an exhibition game.

look what it did with the SF Giants, in the 2012 all star game all the runs generated in that game for the NL was from the bats and legs from Giants players with good pitching led by Matt Cain... Fast forward to the World Series the Giants enjoyed the fruits of their all star game performance by opening the first two games of the WS at home.

The argument earlier about a wild card team having home field vs. 112 win team is stupid.
Although the Giants did it in 2010 and won, it always comes to who players the best in a five or seven game series. Bottom line is that in post season, to be a champion you have to win no matter where you play. Besides the all star game rewards only happens in the WS and doesn't affect wildcard series.

If footballs pro bowl can only determine SB location, THAT would be worth playing, ,for example, last years pro bowl was won by the NFC if I'm correct which means next weeks Super Bowl would be played in Candlestick thus rewarding great revenue for the city of San Francisco and the bay... That would be something to play for IMO. Heck the media has two weeks to set up shop anyways before game time so time and logistics shouldn't be too much of a problem.

Jan 26 13 11:57 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
37photog
Posts: 692
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, US


Art Silva Photography wrote:
If footballs pro bowl can only determine SB location, THAT would be worth playing, ,for example, last years pro bowl was won by the NFC if I'm correct which means next weeks Super Bowl would be played in Candlestick thus rewarding great revenue for the city of San Francisco and the bay... That would be something to play for IMO. Heck the media has two weeks to set up shop anyways before game time so time and logistics shouldn't be too much of a problem.

The NFL doesn't want inclimate/cold weather affecting the SB, though I think next years in in Meadowlands, NJ. Ultimately though it wouldn't work if teams like GB or Buffalo won, plus some smaller cities (Cincinatti, GB) probably lack the hotel room needs to host a SB. Plus, two weeks is not enough for the amount of visitors & media needing to come into town.  The media (including international) comes into town & books their rooms months in advance, then the fans of the winning city try coming into town for all the leftovers. Factor in the fact the city needs to clear the town out of any other conventions & concerts that night (auto show, flower show, NHL, NBA, concerts at next door arenas) and it's a logistical nightmare.

Jan 26 13 12:12 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Art Silva
Posts: 8,932
Santa Barbara, California, US


37photog wrote:

The NFL doesn't want inclimate/cold weather affecting the SB, though I think next years in in Meadowlands, NJ. Ultimately though it wouldn't work if teams like GB or Buffalo won, plus some smaller cities (Cincinatti, GB) probably lack the hotel room needs to host a SB. Plus, two weeks is not enough for the amount of visitors & media needing to come into town.  The media (including international) comes into town & books their rooms months in advance, then the fans of the winning city try coming into town for all the leftovers. Factor in the fact the city needs to clear the town out of any other conventions & concerts that night (auto show, flower show, NHL, NBA, concerts at next door arenas) and it's a logistical nightmare.

How is this different for MLB, NBA, NHL, NCAA... ?
Other than the GB weather factor cities plan for this kind of thing all the time, and if the city is too small to accommodate everyone the networks get bigger ratings for those who can not attend.

Jan 26 13 12:23 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Let There Be Light
Posts: 7,657
Los Angeles, California, US


Art Silva Photography wrote:
How is this different for MLB, NBA, NHL, NCAA... ?

Completely different than MLB, NBA and NHL. In those sports the champion is determined by winning a series of from four to seven games which take place in two cities.  The participating cities only have a few days notice in advance. The Super Bowl site is selected years in advance and is a one game winner-take-all event.

Jan 26 13 01:28 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
37photog
Posts: 692
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, US


Art Silva Photography wrote:
How is this different for MLB, NBA, NHL, NCAA... ?

The NCAA (both b-ball & football) are both pre planned in terms of location, so that's out.  NBA & NHL don't get nearly the hype of the Super Bowl.  In addition however, they along with the World Series are drawn out over a 7 game series, in two seperate cities.  The Super Bowl is one night, and one full on week of a media spectacle.  It really blows the 7 game series away in terms of media spectacle. Typically, the other sports don't get that much whopper ratings outside of the home cities. The Super Bowl is nearly always the #1 rated show of the year. 

Not saying its' better, I'm not always a fan & have missed/not watched a few altogether over the years, but TV & media spectaclewise, it's incomparable.

Jan 26 13 01:33 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Art Silva
Posts: 8,932
Santa Barbara, California, US


Logistically speaking many of those leagues with a series involved are harder to plan for when more than ONE game day is at a venue, so the argument doesn't make sense.
The SB has two whole weeks to plan for ONE game, a lot of things can be accomplished in 14 days prior
A block of 3 games + at one venue would be harder to plan for in that time. There is no excuse for the NFL not to organize in two weeks time at a given city compared to other sports.
By November cities that has a team in the playoff hunt can start planning for such an event. It's winter and a slow season for many so the chances to book extra rooms and tables comes as a bonus and a chance to pull in a profit and boost its economy if in fact the SB does come to town.
Jan 26 13 01:53 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Orca Bay Images
Posts: 32,233
Lodi, California, US


Orca Bay Images wrote:
The current rule about homefield advantage being determined by the winner of the All Star game is a pretty ingenious solution, in that it gives some added meaning to an exhibition game.
37photog wrote:
Yeah, and it also gives an unjustified home field advantage to a team for ridiculous reasons in the climax series of the entire season.  Possibly affecting the outcome of the World Series for a stupid All Star Game?!

The home-field advantage was unjustified before. It's marginally less unjustified now. Why have a conniption-fit about it?

Here's a novel thought, focus more on the WORLD SERIES THAN THE ALL STAR GAME!!

Here's another novel thought: No need to bounce off the walls for a rule-change that gave the All-Star game some additional meaning without otherwise affecting how the World Series was laid out.

Jan 26 13 06:19 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Orca Bay Images
Posts: 32,233
Lodi, California, US


Art Silva Photography wrote:
If footballs pro bowl can only determine SB location, THAT would be worth playing, ,for example, last years pro bowl was won by the NFC if I'm correct which means next weeks Super Bowl would be played in Candlestick thus rewarding great revenue for the city of San Francisco and the bay... That would be something to play for IMO. Heck the media has two weeks to set up shop anyways before game time so time and logistics shouldn't be too much of a problem.

Cities are awarded Super Bowls several years in advance. Some cities are custom-made for Super bowls and some need time to prepare. There's a lot more to prepping for a Super Bowl than making sure the media have the space they need to set up.

Jan 26 13 06:24 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
EdwardKristopher
Posts: 3,338
Tempe, Arizona, US


Looknsee Photography wrote:
There's talk about this year being the last football pro bowl...

...  No player played hard last year; it was a joke.
...  Ratings are very low.
...  The game is totally meaningless.

I know I won't miss it.  Would you?

Wouldn't be missed!  It really doesn't mean anything in the scheme of things!

Jan 26 13 06:49 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
GK photo
Posts: 27,452
Laguna Beach, California, US


i've never watched one, so either way, it won't effect me. i'm sure it's been way watered down, just like the mlb all star game. guys get selected,then don't go, allowing other guys to get an all star notch on their belts.

whatever...meh.

they should make the selections, fly the dudes over to hawaii, and have them play a poker tournament or something. all for charity, of course.
Jan 27 13 12:19 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Art Silva
Posts: 8,932
Santa Barbara, California, US


It's on today right? hmm
Jan 27 13 12:15 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Looknsee Photography
Posts: 20,854
Portland, Oregon, US


Art Silva Photography wrote:
It's on today right? hmm

Does anyone care?

I still like the "Comicon for Football Fans" idea.  I brainstormed a whole bunch of activities (many of which are tongue-in-cheek):

...  Q&A Panels.
...  Autograph booths.
...  Quarterback skills competitions.
...  Obstacle course competitions (a la Ninja Warrior).
...  Laser tag in a strip club setting.
...  Madden tournament.
...  Pro-am touch football games.
...  Appropriate Olympic event competitions (e.g. weight lifting, 100m dash, etc.).
...  Talent show.  (Please include Karaoke).
...  Competitions -- catching a greased pig.  (The pig's revenge).

Whatcha think?

Jan 27 13 12:52 pm  Link  Quote 
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