Photographer
Tony Jones Photo
Posts: 64
New York, New York, US
My lighting rig is 3 Alien Bees (B800) and a big piece of bleached muslin which I hang from the ceiling. I shoot through the muslin for a soft light effect and bounce off the ceiling or wall for hair highlights, etc, and fill. That's it. Total cost, maybe $1,200. Stands and umbrellas I find lying around. I did buy one fairly expensive boom light stand which I love. Use a couple of old Photoshop Bibles as the counterweight. With Alien Bees, counter weight isn't a big problem. And it's great to put those out-of-date reference books to some use.
Photographer
Robert Sanders
Posts: 905
Los Angeles, California, US
Tony Jones Photo wrote:
My lighting rig is 3 Alien Bees (B800) and a big piece of bleached muslin which I hang from the ceiling. I shoot through the muslin for a soft light effect and bounce off the ceiling or wall for hair highlights, etc, and fill. That's it. Total cost, maybe $1,200. Stands and umbrellas I find lying around. I did buy one fairly expensive boom light stand which I love. Use a couple of old Photoshop Bibles as the counterweight. With Alien Bees, counter weight isn't a big problem. And it's great to put those out-of-date reference books to some use. Tony,
This is fun advice and I like your humor, but if my clients walked into my studio and saw three ABs with a cloth for a modifier, and books holding it all down? The next words from their mouths would be, "get a rope!" Hell, my business insurance cost annually champions your one time lighting equipment costs - just shooting pictures and having a solid business are two different apples.
Robert
Photographer
TBJ Imaging
Posts: 2416
Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, US
Tim Mills wrote:
Hi Thomas, My comments were meant as a comedic response to all this techno talk, NOT as a critique of your work.
You are extremely talented! Whatever you choose, I'm sure you will make the most of.
Seriously....You have a good thing going! I say upgrade what you're already using, you are obviously comfortable with that line, and get great results!
The last thing you want is your new equipment slowing your flow.....
Also, maybe invest in some more brand new safety pins! : ) I may go out and get a few myself.
Much Respect,
Tim haha....my saftey pins are quite small.....I would need fewer if I went with the larger version.
I really want to get better quality. The Flashpoints I use are all over the place when it comes to color. Plus the tubes burn out really fast.........I just wanted to see what others recommend for a better lighting system. Plus there are a few tecniques I want to play around with that I just can't do with my 2 light system. So far I have leaned a lot from this thread. I am a total moron when it comes to equipment. I had never even heard of Chimera before this thread. Checked out the site and was blown away by all the stuff you can buy. I need to leave my house more often...haha
Thanks again
Thomas
Photographer
Zave Smith Photography
Posts: 1696
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, US
Thomas,
After your last post I think that you should not buy any lighting equipment yet. What you should really do is go work with somebody whose lighting you love and see what they do and with what they do it with.
Photography is the art of many ways. When we spend to much time within, we only learn one way......
Photographers tend to have big egos and we all want to do it our way. Be smarter than that.
Photographer
Kelvin Hammond
Posts: 17397
Billings, Montana, US
N Stiles Photography wrote:
What's your point? That AB's are equal? Look at the stats-- they aren't equal. They may do everything you need them to do, but that's the same as me saying my Saturn is equal to a Porsche, b/c when I get to work you can't tell what I drove to get there. I mean... I don't need to drive faster than 80 or so... I get to my desk at the same time as the Porsche guy?? I own a Jag. Last month, the OE starter relay crapped out on me. Jag wanted $85 for the relay, but I got one that does the same thing at a hot rod shop for $6.89.
Car seems to start up just like it did with the OE part. Been using it for 5 months now.
For the image conscious, there's nothing like spending more (if only for bragging rights). However, it goes without saying that the bigger and prestigious the client list, the more one wants to insure that nothing goes wrong. That said, probably only the top 1% of shooters would ever have an opportunity at Playboy, which means that everyone else doesn't need to sweat the small stuff.
 (meant with humor)
Photographer
Robert Sanders
Posts: 905
Los Angeles, California, US
Zave Smith wrote:
Thomas,
After your last post I think that you should not buy any lighting equipment yet. What you should really do is go work with somebody whose lighting you love and see what they do and with what they do it with.
Photography is the art of many ways. When we spend to much time within, we only learn one way......
Photographers tend to have big egos and we all want to do it our way. Be smarter than that. Not sure where you got this idea Zave, but if someone contacted me asking if they could stop by, or drop in during a shoot, or even work with me just so they could learn my lighting prefs, I'd tell them to walk. You make it sound so simple, "just go work with somebody" as if all the pros are running around aligning goodness with random photographers, always with an open door, so they can swap spit and share fine tidings. Shish, it is much more complicated than that... you have to qualify to work with most seated photographers, not just walk through the door.
Not good advice at all.
Robert
Photographer
Zave Smith Photography
Posts: 1696
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, US
I am sure that if you called up a couple of great photographers and said, I would love to spend a week or a month watching you work and would gladly do what-ever you needed around the studio to help out while I am there I am sure that several photographers would say no but I am equally sure that a few would say yes. Myself, I have started having an intern around. I choose one person each semester and allow them to participate and watch not only the shootings but I try and teach them as much about the business side as I can. I even show them invoices and estimates and such. Why do I do this? Partly I get some free labor in return. Partly because I enjoy teaching and partly because it is fun to have some young, ernest energy around the studio. It is also my way of giving back. I guess I have reached a point in my profession where I do not feel threaten. I answer other photographers questions quite freely and I serve on boards like Stock Artist Alliance. What can I say, maybe I am an odd ball. We all have much to learn and the only way that I know to learn is to share. If I want to share in your knowladge I have to be wiling to share my own. Sincerely, Zave Smith www.zavesmith.com
Photographer
i left
Posts: 28
PLAYA DEL REY, California, US
Photographer
RacerXPhoto
Posts: 2521
Brooklyn, New York, US
Tito Trelles-MADE IN NY wrote:
I would buy a $2000 system...and a hooker.T I guess its a NY thing but this is the best suggestion in the 3 pages so far....LMAO
Photographer
Mortonovich
Posts: 6209
San Diego, California, US
Robert Sanders wrote:
Not sure where you got this idea Zave, but if someone contacted me asking if they could stop by, or drop in during a shoot, or even work with me just so they could learn my lighting prefs, I'd tell them to walk. You make it sound so simple, "just go work with somebody" as if all the pros are running around aligning goodness with random photographers, always with an open door, so they can swap spit and share fine tidings. Shish, it is much more complicated than that... you have to qualify to work with most seated photographers, not just walk through the door.
Not good advice at all.
Robert True. Which is why I thought bribery was a great idea.
Know Idea wrote:
I'd spend it on trip to Europe and bribe my way into an intern slot with someone who's lighting I admire.
Photographer
Robert Sanders
Posts: 905
Los Angeles, California, US
Zave Smith wrote:
I am sure that if you called up a couple of great photographers and said, I would love to spend a week or a month watching you work and would gladly do what-ever you needed around the studio to help out while I am there I am sure that several photographers would say no but I am equally sure that a few would say yes.
Myself, I have started having an intern around. I choose one person each semester and allow them to participate and watch not only the shootings but I try and teach them as much about the business side as I can. I even show them invoices and estimates and such.
Why do I do this? Partly I get some free labor in return. Partly because I enjoy teaching and partly because it is fun to have some young, ernest energy around the studio. It is also my way of giving back.
I guess I have reached a point in my profession where I do not feel threaten. I answer other photographers questions quite freely and I serve on boards like Stock Artist Alliance.
What can I say, maybe I am an odd ball.
We all have much to learn and the only way that I know to learn is to share. If I want to share in your knowladge I have to be wiling to share my own.
Sincerely,
Zave Smith
www.zavesmith.com Zave,
Interns and assistants are apples and oranges! I think you can see our Mr. Thomas is a bit above an INTERN status, a person has to be in school to carry that distinction anyway. I have people contact me weekly to assist and I make it very clear that the job has been filled... you can only have so many assistants on certain types of work. Again I say this, if I knew a person were assisting me just to learn my techniques then they would never see the dark of my studio. An assistant has to be behind the work, the client, the project, the energy that makes the work unique.
I don't hire Interns, can't put much stock there, but rather I lecture/field-trip college classes once each semester to show them my workflow and methods. Oh, and my lighting...
Robert
Photographer
Robert Sanders
Posts: 905
Los Angeles, California, US
Chip Morton wrote:
Robert Sanders wrote:
Not sure where you got this idea Zave, but if someone contacted me asking if they could stop by, or drop in during a shoot, or even work with me just so they could learn my lighting prefs, I'd tell them to walk. You make it sound so simple, "just go work with somebody" as if all the pros are running around aligning goodness with random photographers, always with an open door, so they can swap spit and share fine tidings. Shish, it is much more complicated than that... you have to qualify to work with most seated photographers, not just walk through the door.
Not good advice at all.
Robert True. Which is why I thought bribery was a great idea.
Hey Chip, bribery is good, very good. Abduction and threats work too sometimes...
Photographer
Zave Smith Photography
Posts: 1696
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, US
I completely agree that assistants and interns are very different. My assistants are very seasoned professionals who are in the mid 30s. They have real responsibility and they are there to serve the shoot.
Interns, I do not pay. Interns are there to learn and in return they lend a helping hand or two.
Assistants can and sometimes know more about certain aspects of a job than I might. That is why I love them and pay them well. But on the same notion, I believe that my assistants have learned a lot from me and I try to help them with their careers whenever I can.
I have been at this a long time but there are still many times I pick up the phone and ask my fellow photographers how to handle something. There are many times when my fellow photographers will tell me, great shot! but did you think about trying this.........
/Users/zavesmith/Desktop/John Pasukonis1167.jpg
Photographer
Zave Smith Photography
Posts: 1696
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, US
I completely agree that assistants and interns are very different. My assistants are very seasoned professionals who are in the mid 30s. They have real responsibility and they are there to serve the shoot.
Interns, I do not pay. Interns are there to learn and in return they lend a helping hand or two.
Assistants can and sometimes know more about certain aspects of a job than I might. That is why I love them and pay them well. But on the same notion, I believe that my assistants have learned a lot from me and I try to help them with their careers whenever I can.
I have been at this a long time but there are still many times I pick up the phone and ask my fellow photographers how to handle something. There are many times when my fellow photographers will tell me, great shot! but did you think about trying this.........
/Users/zavesmith/Desktop/John Pasukonis1167.jpg
Photographer
TBJ Imaging
Posts: 2416
Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, US
I am not really in the position to go intern or anything like that. I want to upgrade my system and start shooting more. I do great just getting in there and trying new things. So my main concern is getting some nice equipment. Once I get it, I know I will work my ass off learning how to use it and doing a lot of cool stuff with whatever I decide to buy.
So I see alot of people say ProFoto is a great way to go but $7500 is not enough to do it right. Please tell me more. How much are we talking for a really nice setup? $10000? $12000? I see those Acute 2 packs and they are around $4000.....are those the cheaper versions of Profoto? Again....thanks for the help in this thread. I appreciate it
Thomas
Photographer
Legacys 7
Posts: 33899
San Francisco, California, US
Norman system. I first started using it school of all of the system that's available. I just like that system.
Photographer
Legacys 7
Posts: 33899
San Francisco, California, US
DuckFive wrote:
7500 can disappear like a wallet in a room full of gypsies in my possession. but if i could spend it before they got to it, i'd probably grab a 2400R Acute kit and as many modifiers as i could afford...ot I could just drop it all on a pro-7 or d4 pack. Sup Duck? Damn, I thought I'd never see you post. But me knowing you personally, I agree with the money thing. Lmao! I'll still take the Norman pack. But I like my Travelites. As a matter of fact, I'm going to expand this system.
Photographer
Taverner Photography
Posts: 228
Pasadena, California, US
Profoto D4, Mola Dish, 3 umbrellas, and an Eilinchrome Octabank
Photographer
c d embrey
Posts: 193
Huntington Beach, California, US
I DP for a successful commercial shooter in Orange County, CA, He uses Profoto Acute generators and heads. They stand up to heavy use, no problem. Here are some prices and descriptions from the Samy's Camera web site. http://www.samys.com/ All prices are mailorder! Acute2R 2400 ProValue Pack, Specially priced kits include: One Acute2R Generator Two Acute2 fan cooled heads w/ UV protection glass Quartz flashtube 250 watt modeling light Zoom reflector and plastic protection caps. Custom fitted Tenba Air Case designed to accept three heads. Samy's Camera price $4152.95 or get it without the Tenba case for $3749.00 OR you could get the same kit with a 1200R generator and case for $3374.00. Without case $3084.00 For what you do 1200 may be enough, you have to decide. The shooter I work for has 2 2400Rs and one 1200R. Another Acute head, for a total of 3. $800.00 So for 4953.00 you would get an Acute 2400R with 3 heads and an airline shippable case. That leaves over $2500.00 for modifiers. Here are a few prices. One of my favorites! Profoto 7-foot reflectors are large umbrella-like reflectors. They give a unique hard light, but since the light source is large, the light appears soft with a unique brilliance. Having two focusing positions, the spot position gives a directed parallel light from a large light source. This position gives a hard light with a unique wrapping quality that also could be perceived as a soft light with a distinct crisp appearance. In the wide position, the reflector gives a 100° angle that makes it possible to light a very large area evenly. The Profoto 7-foot reflectors are very easy to set up and dismantle quickly. Multiple diffusers can be used for additional control. Supplied with deluxe travel bag. $1290.00 This is a really bitchin' lighting tool! Or maybe you would like a Profoto Acute 2 - 2400 W Ringflash Lamphead $801.00 I think you can have a nice set up for your $7500.00
Photographer
Legacys 7
Posts: 33899
San Francisco, California, US
c d embrey wrote:
I DP for a successful commercial shooter in Orange County, CA, He uses Profoto Acute generators and heads. They stand up to heavy use, no problem.
Here are some prices and descriptions from the Samy's Camera web site. http://www.samys.com/ All prices are mailorder!
Acute2R 2400 ProValue Pack, Specially priced kits include: One Acute2R Generator Two Acute2 fan cooled heads w/ UV protection glass Quartz flashtube 250 watt modeling light Zoom reflector and plastic protection caps. Custom fitted Tenba Air Case designed to accept three heads. Samy's Camera price $4152.95 or get it without the Tenba case for $3749.00
OR you could get the same kit with a 1200R generator and case for $3374.00. Without case $3084.00 For what you do 1200 may be enough, you have to decide. The shooter I work for has 2 2400Rs and one 1200R.
Another Acute head, for a total of 3. $800.00
So for 4953.00 you would get an Acute 2400R with 3 heads and an airline shippable case.
That leaves over $2500.00 for modifiers. Here are a few prices.
One of my favorites! Profoto 7-foot reflectors are large umbrella-like reflectors. They give a unique hard light, but since the light source is large, the light appears soft with a unique brilliance. Having two focusing positions, the spot position gives a directed parallel light from a large light source. This position gives a hard light with a unique wrapping quality that also could be perceived as a soft light with a distinct crisp appearance.
In the wide position, the reflector gives a 100° angle that makes it possible to light a very large area evenly. The Profoto 7-foot reflectors are very easy to set up and dismantle quickly. Multiple diffusers can be used for additional control. Supplied with deluxe travel bag. $1290.00 This is a really bitchin' lighting tool!
Or maybe you would like a Profoto Acute 2 - 2400 W Ringflash Lamphead $801.00
I think you can have a nice set up for your $7500.00 I've used every system that has been mention except the A.B. and may be one more. School I am currently attending has every damn power pack that you can think of. Norman is my favorite.
Photographer
TBJ Imaging
Posts: 2416
Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, US
c d embrey wrote:
I DP for a successful commercial shooter in Orange County, CA, He uses Profoto Acute generators and heads. They stand up to heavy use, no problem.
Here are some prices and descriptions from the Samy's Camera web site. http://www.samys.com/ All prices are mailorder!
Acute2R 2400 ProValue Pack, Specially priced kits include: One Acute2R Generator Two Acute2 fan cooled heads w/ UV protection glass Quartz flashtube 250 watt modeling light Zoom reflector and plastic protection caps. Custom fitted Tenba Air Case designed to accept three heads. Samy's Camera price $4152.95 or get it without the Tenba case for $3749.00
OR you could get the same kit with a 1200R generator and case for $3374.00. Without case $3084.00 For what you do 1200 may be enough, you have to decide. The shooter I work for has 2 2400Rs and one 1200R.
Another Acute head, for a total of 3. $800.00
So for 4953.00 you would get an Acute 2400R with 3 heads and an airline shippable case.
That leaves over $2500.00 for modifiers. Here are a few prices.
One of my favorites! Profoto 7-foot reflectors are large umbrella-like reflectors. They give a unique hard light, but since the light source is large, the light appears soft with a unique brilliance. Having two focusing positions, the spot position gives a directed parallel light from a large light source. This position gives a hard light with a unique wrapping quality that also could be perceived as a soft light with a distinct crisp appearance.
In the wide position, the reflector gives a 100° angle that makes it possible to light a very large area evenly. The Profoto 7-foot reflectors are very easy to set up and dismantle quickly. Multiple diffusers can be used for additional control. Supplied with deluxe travel bag. $1290.00 This is a really bitchin' lighting tool!
Or maybe you would like a Profoto Acute 2 - 2400 W Ringflash Lamphead $801.00
I think you can have a nice set up for your $7500.00 WOW...thanks for all of that info. I will probably be looking into that company since they seem to be the go to guys right now.
Photographer
TIMOTHYBECKER
Posts: 442
Brooklyn, New York, US
a sweet ass location lighting kit.....
profoto/broncolor
or maybe go a cheaper route to have some extra in my wallet. i gotta get drunk some how!
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(meant with humor)