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Innocence Lost
this lose pages? I seemed to remember it at least 2 pages before. Rob Dec 19 07 07:25 pm Link I too relish the days when I just took a camera out and shot without knowing what I was doing at all. At first professional photography seemed like a lot of fun, because you get to experience a new area of photography, and it brings the bread in. After awhile though, I experienced a big slump. Shooting was getting monotonous and boring. Since i was shooting kindda similar stuff all the time. That's when i began soul searching and asking myself what was it that I wanted from photography. I decided that yeah, I still want the money (though it may be boring jobs). But to not let the magic die off, I started to free more time from my shooting schedule to shoot things that I like. To relieve the feeling of shooting without much planning. Now that the business is on track. I face a new kind of excitement. Since my clients very much leave me to do what I like now, every new shoot is a new challenge with new possibilities to do sometime different. By constantly keeping a lookout for fresh ideas, I suppose it sort of keeps the magic living. Cheers! Dec 20 07 12:17 am Link Excellent contribution, Gerald. Thank you. Dec 30 07 10:48 pm Link GAETANO CATELLI STUDIOS wrote: There is a reason for that. It is because you are no longer shooting YOUR vision YOUR way, but someone else's vision their way. Dec 30 07 11:17 pm Link Stephen, that was the absolute best read I have had on this site all year, and no doubt better than any I will ever read on this site. Thank you for that. I think it's why some authors do ghost writing--they can "tinker" without the extra BS and baggage trail that normally ensues from their work. And I think it's something many of the capitalists, pros, and experts should attempt to appreciate in the hobbyist, amateur, and serious amateur approach. Sometimes that's all they want to do is produce in the manner which you have long outgrown and gravely miss. Without the responsibility. Without the drudgery. Without the schedules. Without the constant and massive weight of expected perfection and extraordinary results. Sometimes to get orders of magnitude better it requires significant expenditures (time, money, and effort) and usually the profit motives that go with it, which eventually lead to where you are today. There's something to be said for being at the top of a field, but as nice as such a place may be there's also something to be said for being in the middle. When I was in the military, I had a lot of guys and girls working for me that intentionally didn't get promoted, despited the extra pay, respect, and responsibility. Many of them could be officers with their degrees, but chose to be enlisted for the love of what they do, and the freedom to continue doing it, their way. Look at all the reasons Udor took a sabbatical. The folks in the middle don't need to take sabbaticals. They don't need to take as many aspirin, either  And they're content in knowing that they'll never make it to the top, or get the accolades of such an achievement. Best of luck to you in finding the time and appropriate outlet or mechanism to scratch that itch... I'm sure it sucks going down a road expecting something new and exciting, but knowing full well that it will end up at the same destination, time and time again. Thanks again for your excellent insight, and to the OP for raising the topic. Useful threads on MM. Things that make you say hmmmm... Dec 30 07 11:29 pm Link studio36uk wrote: Was that on Mallorca by any chance? Sounds exactly like the place in Portals Nous that I lived for many a year... Dec 30 07 11:37 pm Link Renaissance Photo wrote: No, it was on the mainland on the Atlantic side around Cadiz way, not the Med side. Dec 30 07 11:41 pm Link studio36uk wrote: Great point Studio36 Dec 30 07 11:44 pm Link FashionTime wrote: I sometimes think it's merely a ploy so everyone can have a nice holiday in a warm place... on the client's dime... tax deductable to the client of course. Dec 30 07 11:51 pm Link studio36uk wrote: Good theory, except they don't shoot them in the summer. They're usually freezing their nips off in the winter. Dec 30 07 11:59 pm Link This is a fantastic thread. I am in the enviable position of having many, many better photographers to look up to and emulate (steal?). I'm no longer a starving student so I can afford lights etc. But even at my level, it's important to occasionally grab the POS camera and see how much I can do with it, unencumbered by gadgets and forced to think creatively rather than technologically, which is my habit. Here's an example of a photo made with a POS camera (not mine): http://www.flickr.com/photos/psteeper/2109070539/ I remember a video class I took where the instructor made an old, cheap VHS camcorder outperform a new digital one. Proper lighting was the key and it was cheap, guerrilla lighting at that. I want paying jobs but when I get them I get cautious and less prone to experiment. Dec 30 07 11:59 pm Link Renaissance Photo wrote: I'm sure they would rather freeze their nips off in Jamaica or Barbados than in NYC. Hell, in Spain we've been known to work in the water in January. Even here in 'ol Blighty, so far, it's been ca 50 degrees F in the day time. Comfortable enough as long as the wind isn't blowing. LOL Dec 31 07 12:05 am Link When you have a hit, people want to pay you to repeat it over and over, except for/with them. If your hit happens to involve 14 lights, before you know it you're int 14 light jail. That's basically what brought me here - distort a few drum room mics while making a record and that's all anyone wants, so photography is my current source or creativity even though I'm in a creative profession for a living. Plus the two seemingly different art forms can have a bit of conceptual transference and the photography has returned some inspiration to the recording already. Dec 31 07 01:27 am Link I read every post before participating. In a way they left me feeling saddened for many of you. While my career has certainly had it's rocky moments, it has been more rewarding than anything else I could imagine doing. About the only thing I don't care for any longer is the amount of time I have to spend in post process. If I'm posting in MM forums, you can bet your ass I'm in the studio post processing. New Years Eve and I have a job to deliver on Tuesday. Yuk! But that's the only yuk you will get from me about my job and my life. I'm blessed and I know it. I started in 1970 as an assistant in a catalog house. Knowing what I know now, that was a huge mistake. I should have been pounding on Arnold Newman's door or Irving Penn's door. I would have achieved my goal much quicker, but that's life and you have to learn to deal with it. In 1974 I became an engravers apprentice at a union trade shop in Chicago. I spent two years making color separations and duo/tri/quad tones of some of the finest photography ever seen. I learned enough in that job to last most people a lifetime, but I didn't want to be an engraver, I just wanted to learn the process to help make me a better photographer. In 1976 I took a job as first photographer at another catalog studio. One of their clients approached me about starting my own studio and doing their work. I've worked for myself ever since. Most of my career was spent shooting product and food. In 1989 that changed with the advent of proprietary imaging systems and LVT film recorders. I bought in whole hog. By 1997 my company was billing over 2 million annually and my take home was in the 700,000 range, and I was never less happy in my life. I had become a paper pusher and a money counter. My employees hated me and I hated them. Thanks to a nefarious brother-in-law story, that all changed in June of 97'. I went through some very hard and very broke times. I was able to keep most of my equipment, but I lost my house and business buildings. I remember trying to feed a family of 6 on vapor, lots of pasta with no sauce. My wife, who stood by me under horrible circumstances, called me a dummy for not seeing the truth of the situation. Here I was shooting product, and imaging it into scenes in which shit flew through the air for no reason but to make some asshole art director happy, and she told me I should be shooting people. She said that would make me more happy than anything. I looked at her like she was a fool (not a smart idea with my wife) and told her no one could make a living taking pictures of people. She told me she thought I could and reminded me that I was the first person to take a camera to a party, I was always shooting portraits of friends and their families, I loved presenting them with prints and watching the reaction on their face when they saw their loved ones after I had done my magic. Tone separated BW silver prints the quality of which no one had ever before seen (the engravers apprenticeship came in handy there) Guess who turned out to be the real fool. I stopped going after product imaging jobs and started working on a commercial portrait portfolio. To pay for the time learning to shoot people, one of the most fortunate events of my life took place. Bergger Products found out I was making portraits on BW film, scanning them on a drum scanner, retouching them, then plotting the resultant files to BW film on my LVT film recorder, then making giant enlargements on traditional BW silver based paper. They wanted to be a part of that process, so they started repping me to their clients to provide my services. Because of them, I got to learn how people like Irving Penn, Victor Skrebneski, John Sexton, Patrick Demarchelier, Herb Ritts and a host of others, made thier images and performed their magic. I was scanning their raw film and retouching to their mark ups. I learned more about photography in one 15 minute mark up session with Victor Skrebneski, than I had learned in the entire 25 years preceding it. Because of my unique experiences, I was able to put together a people portfolio that was marketable. After 9/11 happened, the retouch work dried up along with the galleries that supported the work. It was time to see if I could actually make a living shooting people. At first, I would take any job just for the experience. Now I'm pretty selective and I won't take jobs that won't help advance my career. Some of the jobs I'm asked to quote on are those famous 6 figure jobs that some have alluded to earlier in this thread. Some are not so grand in terms of fee, but their content is more important. I spent several weeks this summer in Texas shooting cotton farmers for the ad agency that handles the Fibermax brand of Bayer AG's, Bayer Crop Science division. The art director is a friend and we had a great time, but the success of the project is what truly matters. Bayer's budget for the year 2008 at the ad agency has been increased as a result of my work. It has been so well received that the end client is demanding me for more of their work. It's mostly because when we went there, I told the client, my friend, I didn't give a rats ass about his project or his client's needs. I cared about my portfolio and my pictures, and I wasn't going to let the client or anyone else ruin this opportunity. You have to know when an opportunity is biting you in the ass, and you have to know how to act on it. I shot enough soft core please the client type shots, but I also shot what I wanted to shoot. I ignored the account person that tagged along, when she said we were using up too much of the farmers time. I didn't listen when they said my normal joking or dirty visual techniques would not be received well by the farmers. I did what I wanted to do, and at least for a while, until the next opportunity/test, I'm their fair haired boy, and they won't quote anyone but me for the next jobs (unless I fuck up). I shoot every job I do for myself. They come to me for my eye and I won't let anyone deter me from my objective. I won't listen to the ever famous "oh, we can't do that". I find a way to do it. Sometimes you have to wait until the second leg of the job to get your way, sometimes it takes some effort to prove your point, but if you aren't shooting for you, get a job at a factory or behind a desk, because it's all drudgery at that point. My ambition to succeed is keen even at my age. I shoot mostly with younger people, and I listen with a chuckle as they call me gramps, but I'm one of the busiest photographers in Chicago and I feel it's because I try hard all the time, I never let up and I'm doing something I love with a passion... and they know it. I just got back from Nashville, where I photographed LeAnn Rimes for Shure Microphones. I just got back from Tucson where I shot backgrounds for another Shure ad featuring Juanes, a very popular hispanic performer. My agent just finished quoting another Shure ad that will have me shooting in Smashbox studios in LA. I'll be leaving Smashbox to shoot Richard Petty's race team for P&G through Satchii and Satchii NYC at a car racetrack out there. I'm having the time of my life doing what I love to do... my way. You can too. Dec 31 07 01:05 pm Link What a wonderful essay, Bob. Thank you. And thank you to the rest of the top photographers for contributing. JD Dec 31 07 01:50 pm Link Hello Chip... and Mr.Randall, nice note. I thought about how to address this and find I can take it many ways. I have spoken to many pros about this current state of affairs and offering to seminar this very subject with the LADIG...hopefully. But's it is a mouthful, so I'll state my response on the idea... "Someday My Prints Will Come" I remember this statement as a poster that sat behind the counter of a known NYC lab back in the days of my assisting years. After 4 years of School of Visual Arts, I began by being the studio mgr. to Eric Meola. Working for this renowned pro pretty much openned the doors for my career, both as an assistant and a shooter. But what I would like to talk about is the way we work today. When film was our medium of choice, there was a glass ceiling to reach and those who broke through in their craft, became heros and superstars. I worked for all those characters and found myself on a path of curiousity and achievment. This drive to manipulate the image and alter what we think we see and to express my ideas unconsciencely, was my mantra, my found passion as a photographer. I found myself drawn to directors like Federico Fellini and artists like Rene Magritte, Dali.. the impressionists and many other classical works of art. It was art in the museums that became my muse while working for these great pros. I had the oppotunity to work on the Marlboro campaigns, Coke, tons of beer ads, travel the world with corporate work and advertising alike. Yes it was a great high to be considered one of NY's top assistants for a bit, but that all goes away when one makes the jump to shoot on their own. It take guts to count pennies for days and hope to find a job that will not only pay the rent but allow you to keep shooting. And it has and like Mr. Randall, I can truly say I would not have it any other way. I have never felt like I had worked a day in my life as a photographer. Now...what do we have today? Lets just start with MM....what do we have here? What I see is a level of photography that never existed before. Now anyone can show the world..."look at me"... and get a response. How wonderful to share in this and have a small audience to express their feelings also. When I was starting out, my work was only shown to professionals and you recieved professional responses. You pounded the pavement with heavy books and saw as many people as you can. Some hired and yet many did not. Waking up with NO was common and only made you stronger. You reached for that glass ceiling and with each image found a way to make it work. You shared with you buddies techniques and helped each other along the way... a rather "healthy" competition existed amoung ourselves then. Today we work from the quite corners of our studios or homes, spilling out all we can muster through our machines, and from these inhuman distances we tire ourselves with dry eyes and little sleep. We distract ourselves with other worlds that exist outside of our lives, we spend time here on MM looking to see if we make a difference with each other. Our glass ceiling of film has gone away...and I think of Paul Simon singing about Kodachrome. Yes it seems to me that our business has drastically divided itself into ... who knows how many directions, but I will talk about two that affect me as a professional. What is the digital artist and who is the photographer? In 1996 I started a company with a friend, who became my digital artist...we where called 2wist Photo LLC. We were the first, and I say first because no one else in advertising was doing this at the time, to become a digital artist/photograhper team at a time when the internet just started out. Was I lucky...yes to be atop that crest of the wave that began this era of photography... But it had another edge to that sword. Because of the novelty of digital and the use of the computer as a tool, the photographer..being me... was becoming a simple "polariod" to the end product. I say this because of our team work, we were showcased in many articles about our work with professional magazines about photography and some TV shows interviewing us. It was great...but I soon began to feel a bit left out. The emphasis was on the computer use and not the beginings of the image. And since I did not, at the time, have the skills to work on the computer myself, I had allowed those feelings to affect my well being and my thoughts about my career. By the time 9-11 hit, my partner decided to quit the business and raise a family with her husband. We did very well as a business and made a ton of money...the most being a job that paid us over $40,000 for a shot! That was a tremendous high for us... but every wave ends. After the tragedy of 9-11, I found myself in a digital world without movement for myself and my ideas...I collaborated with a wonderful digital artist, but again saw the writing on the wall that in the end, I was not in control of my images. Yes I couldv'e shot straight images and did and made money, but my passion was in the fantasy, the altered image, the very thing I was seeking to create when I entered the world of photography...to reach that glass ceiling and break through. But in my path to follow those passions, I have discoverd over the years of teaching myself how to create anything I can think up...I have realized that the industry no longer has a need for that craftsman. Yes I do get paid for my art... but that comes few and far between these days. The industry, as far as ad agencies go, always find a way to narrow the margin to the simple image. I recently found myself in a situation where I was passed up on a major hair campaign, because the art director found that they needed someonw who can shoot against a white background...well I start there, but what I show is always different. Today I am now creating a site that address my issuse and treating my business more like a business and giving them what they want. I keep the other work as my "personal" work...and it seems that what is shown may not be as important as to how you present it. As a photographer in the advertising market, if you don't show what they want, they won't go the extra mile to see where you come from and the one who does - gets the job. Books are rarely needed these days and a site with your own URL is most important. I have listened to these concepts as a board member of APA and now being associated with the LADIG, I here it all over. Many of us are frustrated wiht the many paths one can take these days, with many being dead ends. There are no answers anymore to becoming a succesful photographer and I feel those days of craftsmanship may be part of the past. It's American Idol time and who can scream the loudest seems to get the most attention. We all look for the greener grass and as a species we are less attentive to what may be important, as to what seems important. We follow the crowd and want only to become a piece of the pie. I have always followed the path of becoming the pie and letting others ask for a piece. Perhaps it's my training when I assisted, but when I meet a young artist shooting for a magazine and saying to me..."wow I can get paid for this"...that just throws me! We have diluted ourselves our business and our craft to a point that so many now believe it to be so easy to call oneself a photographer. Yeah...you can, but the craft and the knowledge of leading others into the art of photography is slowly dimishing to the symbols and idols we help raise to the heights we wish to be a part of and not taking the time to address what the hell we are all doing. With this I have found myself creating in other ways...Whether I am teaching pros about photoshop (a concept I never thought I would be doing) to writing a book, to my ventures in front of the camera with a new production I yet cannot discuss. I have begun to understand how I can make a difference in this new world, but it's not always in how I thought my life would pan out as a photographer, but to allow this new world to show me that there are other paths that can lead to the dream. I think allowing oneself to see these differences and allowing them to become a part of the workflow is an answer that works for me at this moment. Once I asked a fellow photographer if he created a business plan incorporating all this new stuff...I recieved a piece of loose leaf paper, torn edges...of a drawing of a spiral with arrows coming and going in all directions. He looked at me and frankly stated...this is all I can come up with these days! To my best advice at this time. If you want to make it count then make sure you can deliver the goods. In the end, the money/client wants the final product to work successfully and for as cheaply as possible. Only after years of proof can one become stable enough to negotiate terms and conditions. But again...why should we. We should be standing up for our rights as artists and make clients understand that digital does not mean cheaper or faster...actually it is quite the oppposite and when I read about how one wants to go back and shoot film without a crowd surrounding them...I can truly relate. We need to start addressing these very issues and not just making them blogs of discussions. Talk is cheap and always will be. Organizations like APA and ASMP are fighting for our rights as artists and by thinking we are all part of this by only reading about it and keeping tight here on MM is a waste of all our time and one day we won't have a business to ascend to...so think about it. I would love if fellow memebers here would research these groups and begin to understand the real business and move out of this MM shell. If we want to become pros then join the pros and step up to the plate. Everyone here is the future of our business and we all need to become very aware of what is happening to our craft. We did it in the late 60's when these organizations began... We can do it again. As always, with kindness, PixelFisher Jan 01 08 08:08 pm Link First of all, I'm glad this post hasn't dwindled into one liner comedy (I say this without stopping to read any replies, as usual, I'll read them after I reply to the original topic). And second is: nice topic, Chip Morton. My photography experiences have brought me to burnout, I think 3 times, and a point of realization that I had to change something. Each time I changed: what, who and why I picked up a camera. I shot for yearbook in high school and for extra money at OU, the campus newspaper. I used a Canon AE-1, a 50mm lens, and TriX, and the occasional TMZ. Did I mention that I shot Henry Kissinger, Anita Hill and Eduardo Najera? After 10 semesters of the student publications gig (insert "burnout" here), I was "discovered" by a prominent local wedding photographer. I became his assistant, but we only worked Saturday's, just me and him. I made enough in a day's work that it was well worth it. My photography life went from one small bag to a Pentax 6x7 in a giant flight case, 3-4 lights, 4-5 lenses, getting to use an EOS system for the first time.... I finished college and went to work for an architect (my major) 40 hours a week. Then after 7 years of the wedding gig, (insert "burnout" again) I quit after the peak of wedding season was done, one year. I decided to give my Saturday's to my kids. A few months later, he called and said he owed me a final pay check, I show up and I accept the D30 body (his first DSLR) in lieu of payment. I ordered a 50mm 1.4 and pretend I was back in high school. I was finally happy shooting again. It must have been a few years before I bought a single other accessory, not even a flash, no lens cap. I'm also a musician, and I end up shooting musicians, and I could do this after kids were in bed, seven nights a week. This was about the time I was being published in every local weekly entertainment rag, what seemed like almost every issue. The third burnout came after I shot and designed a yearbook for each of my kids, a K class of 13 students, and a PK-5 school of 575. So, now... I protect photography as a "hobby" and I will never dub it "work" again. I want to enjoy it, and have fun and joy while doing it. Because I love doing something so much, like Chip describes a passion for doing it, I decided to protect it as a "hobby" at all costs. I don't care if I shoot models. I have booked exactly one shoot off of MM in almost 4 years. However I have shot about 20 models in the same time frame that I know or met in real life. I shot 7 weddings last year and 2 this (2007) year. I'll leave you with a visual analogy for burnout. We all hold the key to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. http://youtube.com/watch?v=Ks2P09qfcIk Truly, Scott Mellgren Jan 01 08 11:55 pm Link I've been shooting for fun and/or profit since 1966. I've done art shows, I've been published in books, magazines and newspapers. I've been a full-time shooter, part-time shooter, sometime shooter and, currently, am only a sporadic shooter, 'cause I have a full-time job as an editor. For some reason, the magic of taking pictures has never faded for me. I'm nowhere near Mr. Eastwood's level in the business, so I've never had the pressure he deals with regularly. But journalism has its own pressures, and I've dealt with them. Frankly, if my joints hadn't started giving out, I'd probably still be shooting full-time. Last weekend, I did a bunch of pictures by window light with a camera and (mostly) an 85mm lens. A few were with a small zoom. No lights. No reflectors. No nothing. Just me, a girl (or two) and a camera. The process was delightful. Some of the pictures are OK. But it reminded me of how magical picture-taking can be when people just let go and shoot. Maybe I'll never have a real profit motive for shooting again (even though I do occasionally make a profit, still). But I hope I never lose the joy of shooting, just for shooting. And in a few years, maybe I'll be doing what Roger's doing, just not as well. Jan 03 08 06:50 am Link Mostly to bump but also to add a perspective. I started shooting in 1977 when I was the editor and journalist of a Punk Rock magazine. The photographer was sick and loaned me his Zenith TTL. We used to spend hours in the darkroom poring over negatives looking for the shot that captured what we thought of the band and that would best accompany the text. It was magic. Later I was offered a job in the press working in Fleet Street London. I turned it down because I wanted to shoot what I wanted; not to order. (I now realise that I didn't want to have to live up to the high expectations of others. It is a recurring theme in my life). I stopped shooting when punk became less relevant and I didn't want to keep on doing the same ol same ol. I took a job in IT. I picked up a camera again when a friend, a dancer needed her portfolio updated to audition for a job on a cruise liner. She was pretty and slim and I really enjoyed doing this. She showed her work to the other dancers who asked me to shoot them and one eventually went to work for English national Ballet who showed her work to opera singers etc and I shot them too. I shot for love and invitations to dress rehearsals and end of run parties. In the meantime, in IT where there were no expectations of me I climbed the greasy corporate pole and became a senior executive with one of the largest financial institutions in the world. I often wonder if I should have made different career choices and stuck to shooting. I have had a few photos published and get agency models to test and have a nice reputation in the small pond in which I swim. I choose nowadays to style myself as a "Gentleman Photographer". I want to get better, I plan on planning some great shoots this year. The whole process stays fun for me. But and there has to be a "but". Now I am reasonably good at corporate work and handle milliions of dollars of budget, I wonder. "Wouldn't this be better if the frisson of "having to produce" was present in my thoughts and shoots?". I guess the thing to do is enjoy while you can and nit regret things you can't change. I am not melancholy reading this thread or writing in it. I loved the stories of Bob et al. They made me wonder what if....... Jan 03 08 08:25 am Link Kevlar Vest Girl wrote: Thank's Bob!! Jan 03 08 12:59 pm Link A few people have chimed in and made comments about how they 'only use 1 or 2 lights' or 'dont need production teams' to do shoots. Its all well and good to talk about how you want to shoot or want to light, but there are many times in a pro studio that you NEED a couple more lights. There are also times where you NEED a couple of assistants and a stylist or 2 to get the shot done. If you have worked in a pro studio you already know this. If you have never worked in a busy studio, you have no idea of what it takes to coordinate a shoot. Sorry, but its true. Go assist in a busy studio for a couple weeks and talk about it after that. I too love running out on a beautiful afternoon with a model, who brings all her own clothes and accesories, and makeup, to a location with no plan and getting some great shots. What if you have 1 day to shoot a bunch of outfits and you need to find earings and necklaces and all the other crap you need to style a shot. Add 1 stylist to get the model dressed. And the model has a great face but does crap makeup so you need to make that happen, hopefully you can find a stylist that does good clothes AND makeup. And you need to shoot in a cool old house cause the client wants that amazing interior you showed them in your portfolio, except the one youre shooting in has crappy light. So you need to light it, now you need someone to help carry and run 3 or 4 packs, so you'll have enough light to make it look 'natural'. Let me tell you, dont try to tell a client that you only shoot in nice days in places that have great light. This is just an example, but you see what i mean. Dont get me wrong, there are lots of shoots I do where i use just natural light, or a reflector, or 1 or 2 heads. My point is that if you are a professional you need to be able to do many other things too. And sometimes when you have more of the uglier shoots than the beautiful ones you can get discouraged. You also can get down because you know that you NEED to go out and make photos to pay for the overhead that you need to do business, it doesnt matter if you FEEL like taking some photos of some random medical device for an ad, rent is due next week. Its a business and it can def be a grind at times. Let me tell you, i think its still better than an office job tho. There are some very talented amateurs and hobbyists, I dont take anything away from what they are shooting, but its not the same as running a studio as a business. If you think about it there are some parallels to owning a restaurant. The world has lots of people who can make really amazing meals, but they have no idea how to operate a restaurant. I think you find a lot more amateur photographers getting great results because of the advances that digital photography offers, and the web gives all of us the ability to widely distribute our images for comments. Taking great pictures is only 1 part of being a great pro photographer...... Jan 03 08 09:08 pm Link Cool for bringing this topic back up chip it was very interesting the first time it was brought up and I'm excited to see other responses. Jan 03 08 09:12 pm Link Kevlar Vest Girl wrote: Thank you. Jan 04 08 05:20 am Link Just for the spirit of the original poster...a couple of weeks ago...grabbed a girl...grabbed a camera...and headed out to the park to have some fun...   Jan 04 08 05:28 am Link Hmmm...interesting thread. The day job: I don't get paid an enormous amount myself, but I am in a small group of individuals who shoot production stills for tv and feature films. We shoot promotional images (dvd covers, posters, editorial, etc) and behind the scenes shots. On each show there is an army of people involved with lighting, set design, wardrobe, hair, makeup etc and tens of thousands of dollars are spent each day, sometimes more. Also, it's just me, I am my own still photography unit, so the shots need to be perfect. The work we do is seen by more people than almost any other type of photography (can you walk around for a day without seeing an ad for a tv show or movie?) so there's tons of pressure. So for my own personal work, it's just a model and myself. I am usually my own assistant, and I shoot film (35mm and large format). I am most creative when I have the most control and I am my own critic, especially if the model and I have a good collaborative vision. I'm still just that guy who loves to take pictures. Jan 14 08 05:41 pm Link TXPhotog wrote: This is as near as dammit to the situation I now find myself in. After the same 40 years in the business I am at last able to have fun again, shooting what I want when I want. The release of constant commercial pressure has been a godsend. Not that all my working life was in any way bad, it was not. There were those fun times, the good assignments balanced out the mundane work that paid the daily bills. Jan 14 08 05:50 pm Link Bump ... PLEASE more, more, more Feb 28 08 03:48 am Link wow, what a great thread. i'm not a player yet, but i like to make-believe in my studio. i've definitely worked for enough photographers to see how so many run their show. ny people, la people, and of course so many here in chicago. it's interesting when you are assisting because you find yourself so often saying to yourself, "who do i want to be?" you realize that all the best photographers bring something quite intangible to the party. one of the coolest guys i've had the pleasure of working for is this ny photog named paul aresu. we were shooting a recording star at harolds chicken shack in chicago, of all places. we'd set the shot up and were ready to roll. the star was about to come out of the trailer. well paul walked in to find me and three other assistants all taking turns at trying to figure out why this mamiya rz wouldn't play nice with the phase one back. he just walked in, saw us all clamoring like a bunch of mental patients over this camera, and walked right back out. didn't say a word. just cool as a cucumber. if there was any panic he wore it well. well, a few minutes passes and finally we get the back to work but only with one lens. everybody is converging on set now and paul walked up to see that we were still scrambling. we explained the problem and told him we could get the back to work but only, for some reason, with one lens. a lot of guys would totally freak out now and i was ready for it, but paul just sort of nodded and said, "which lens is it?" we told him it was the 80mm, he snapped his fingers, smiled and said, "i love that lens"... then he just picked up the camera and started taking all these great pictures of this chick with that 80mm... and i just remember thinking, wow, i want to be just like this guy when i grow up. after that first shot the stress just dissolved and we figured what the problem with the camera was and got it fixed... later, shooting her at this nightclub he told us he wanted to shoot her with just ring-light but that the client hated ring-light. so, he had us set up all these elaborate lights and turn all the model lights on but the slaves off and then he shot the whole thing with ring-light all the while the client thinking it was this big crazy set-up... lol...i thought, damn... this guy is so fucking cool! i'm not exactly sure why this story came to mind for this thread. maybe because there was just always a twinkle in that guys eyes like a kid on christmas morning, just so happy to get paid to play with these toys. i've worked for a lot of people. photographers that worry all the time or bitch all the time or complain all the time because the client is retarded and the plane was late getting in or what if they don't like it and can we still make it to the rental house and how are we on schedule. paul just had a good time. the rest of that shoot flowed like clockwork. now i'm starting my thing and i'm trying to figure out just where i fit in. just who do i want to be? what's my style? i'm totally redoing my book right now because i'm realizing that it was all over the place. i really need to figure out a few themes and then own them. what's my market? how the hell am i going to start shooting full time if i keep working for all these people? (don't get me wrong, it's a pretty sweet gig but it's time to move on). do i invest in testing or equipment? so and so is shooting now? when the hell will i get paid on that 6 day job?... etc... etc... it can get pretty stressful. especially since this is the only thing i know how, or want to do. and when you're in school it's so great to just run around with your camera. but then you grow up and have rent(s) to pay and a girlfriend who likes to eat at nice restaurants. people outside the business when i tell them i'm a photographer say, wow, like, how cool that you can take pictures for a living, do you ever do pet portraits? and i guess it is cool. but there's also something to be said for coming home from work and having the workday done with. unlike me where i pretty much think about this shit around the clock, which is why i'm typing some ridiculous post on MM at 4am while praying the mailman will bring me a check tmrw... well, i hope anyone finds this relevant all i know is when you loose that twinkle in your eye, you're done for. Feb 28 08 05:46 am Link studio36uk wrote: I love your expression: "a fool with bells on"!!! Feb 28 08 06:02 am Link A bump and a smile... May 04 08 02:31 am Link How in the world did I miss this fantastic thread! Thank you so much Stephen and Bob for your insights and sharing your experiences. I'm just a guy who's been shooting for 6 years in my garage and I do it for fun. Lately though, I had grown a bit unhappy with my work and felt I wasn't growing or enjoying the experience. I had begun to lose sight of the experience and feared just shooting and letting the chips fall where they may. I am now inspired by everyone's comments to rediscover the joy of shooting again. Salute... Jul 28 08 03:37 am Link I want to echo the thanks for this and say it actually adds some inspiration. I am still on the bottom, somewhere between the ground and the bottom rung of the ladder. I live for having my camera in hand. I am in heaven in the studio or out in the forest stalking something to photograph. I have an excellent job that makes some very good $$ for me and the family, but I think many days that I would walk away from it if I could pay the bills with my camera. Thanks again! Nick Jul 28 08 06:15 pm Link bump Sep 30 08 06:29 am Link WOW! Being new myself (both to photography and MM) and reading this thread, I would like to nominate it for being "perma-bumped" and maybe moved or copied to the newbie area and being recommended if not required reading. Nov 19 08 08:04 pm Link I really don't have any days to relish...I'm not a major shooter. I don't shoot commercial work, I don't get contracted to shoot major gigs, and I'm not in demand. However, the original post does hit a chord with me. Just last night I was talking to Raelyn and showing her a series of 6 pictures that sit above my TV. They're from my first shoot using people, 35mm film, and a series of candids. They're my two best friends, and still my two best friends, but thinking about the pictures are so very different. Raelyn told me that she likes my work because it harkens back to those pictures. But to me, well, it seems like they're so totally different. When I first started shooting I would go out with friends and just simply shoot whatever came to me. I'd follow the people around, shoot however I felt like it, and just shoot whatever happened the way it happened. But now, well, I take the time to compose, and to over think the shot. And try as I might, I can't go back to where I started. I'm too concerned about the technical aspects and not so much about just shooting. Looking at my portfolio now, I'm realizing that a lot of the shots are candids. I shot them as the model wasn't looking or moving between poses... But those were almost forced too. And I hate that. Nov 19 08 08:33 pm Link i really enjoy the circus , the pressure and the checks and the exposure and the greatest talents i can meet and all the new opportunities growing each years what do i regret ? what did i loose ? untill today nothing , but i made the choice of time over money to shoot less but better tb Nov 20 08 07:37 am Link Laura Ann Photography wrote: I am starting to get like this... starting to restrict myself to show all i can offer and forget to just freeflow with the shoots..... just be creative... we started out with it becaus ewe loved the freedom and creative exploration, and we find ourself restricting ourselves for "PHOT SUPERIORITY" Nov 20 08 12:19 pm Link I have no business in this thread, except as a second-hand witness to one of the key players mentioned in the OP. My observation (neither praise nor criticism): 1) The drive to succeed is similar to the inability to exhale. 2) Successful people have lost the freedom to suck. I'd explain, but Stephen pretty well expounded on number 2, and I think Bob epitomizes number 1. Nov 20 08 12:46 pm Link This deserves to be read again for spring. May 26 09 01:23 pm Link After 35+ years of shooting Hasselblads, Linhofs, and other high end gear, I have recently developed a love affair with a Holga. Seriously. May 26 09 01:34 pm Link |
