glenn my name today wrote:
well Tim got brigged for 4 days for it.

I wouldn't have written what he wrote, but I don't feel he deserves to be punished for it.

I can relate to what Tim said having lost a son to suicide in 2006 and wrestling with emotions that include not respecting him for his decision.

He was a prominent member of a major "prankster" site and during the many threads that were made in his honor, there were a few responses a lot like Tim's.

Christopher Hartman wrote:

I suspect he was sick. If you look at his port, in December he indicated he wasn't scheduling ANY shoots until further notice.

I saw that on his port early in Jan as a model I am going to work with was supposed to shoot with him and just to see if he had anything new up.Found that quite odd.Probably a clue of somesort?

timothy dolph wrote:

So GW, are you telling me that George checked out himself.  That's bullshit.
That totally changes my whole perspective on him.  I have had friends and relatives to do the some thing and I have all lack of respect for them in the afterlife.  Sorry, It sux but that is how i feel.

And my feeling are the same for Van Gogh, Hemingway, Cobain, Ledger, and my cousin Nick at age 14 as well.

Life is hard enough for the living.  How bad could it have really been for George?.  Somewhere between being elected president and living under a bridge I would assume.  Though I do not know the exact circumstances, how did it really come down to this?  How bad could it of REALLY been?

In my own experience, I have lived a pretty eclectic life so far.  Many, many, many ups and downs mentally, physically, spiritually, artistically, romantically, financially, ...  But I have never given up.  Why take the easy way out.

I have more respect for Elvis, James Dean, Stan Winston, Helmut Newton, Bob Carlos Clarke, and most of all... my best childhood friend since 8 years old:



Chief Petty Officer - Jacques Fontan - Special Operations Navy SEAL Team 10, whose MH-47 Chinook helicopter was shot down near Asadabad, Afghanistan, June 28, 2005.  A total of 11 SEALs and 8 Army Commandos died that day as they were attempting to rescue 4 other SEALs from a forward listing post that were engaged in a fire fight against overwhelming Taliban forces.  It was the greatest single loss of life for Navy Special Warfare forces since World War II.  If you are interested in the story... http://www.talkingproud.us/Military102207.html

So back to the OP, am I to forgive Robert Hoffmann and wish him a R.I.P. for what he did?  I never knew him... How bad could it of REALLY been?Could the reason be a terminal incurable illness or just an "F" on his report card?
I will, however, wish all this friends and family members of Onyx Photography a L.I.P. for they are the ones that will have to endure the unanswered questions for the rest of THEIR lives.  A long road for recovery.

Sorry if I hurt feelings on this reply post.  It's not very P.C. now is it?

"I have wrestled with death. It is the most unexciting contest you can imagine. It takes place in an impalpable greyness, with nothing underfoot, with nothing around, without spectators, without clamour, without glory, without the great desire of victory, without the great fear of defeat."
- Joseph Conrad, Heart of Darkness

The fact that you do not know the exact circumstances which drove George to do such a thing is precisely the reason why you should keep your mouth shut about the matter. Cool avi, by the way.

Dave Wright Photo SF wrote:
Take a minute to send a few messages to photographers you admire.

fbimagery wrote:
Bingo.
and this goes for everyone who has touched your life in a positive way. Life is too short, and Death comes unexpectedly to some, and how much effort is it to send  an email or message or even say hello to someone whom you feel has enriched your life at any point?....

Such a simple gesture ... contacting those you admire and love. You may never know it, but it could save their life. 

May Mr. Hoffmann find the peace and happiness that eluded him. May his family and friends also find peace. May we all celebrate the good and profound ways in which he positively impacted our lives.

timothy dolph wrote:
So GW, are you telling me that George checked out himself.  That's bullshit.
That totally changes my whole perspective on him.  *snip*

I understand your point Tim. Really I do. However, I choose to look at suicide under a different light. My opinion won't be popular either because some (possibly even you) might misinterpret my post as glorifying the act. However, I am not.

Sometimes suicide is the BRAVE and HONORABLE thing to do. Sometime people are suffering from a physical, terminal illness and they choose to die on their terms before the illness leaves them no choice.

Sometimes people suffer from a mental illness so debilitating that their minds are buried deep in a pit of hopelessness and despair. There is simply no perceivable way out and, without someone recognizing their plight and intervening on their behalf, they choose to fight the feelings and take charge of their lives in one final act.

I don't think for one minute that victims of suicide act in a cowardly or selfish manner. Their line of thought is simply well beyond that.

I am reminded of the victims of 9/11 who leaped to their deaths from the open windows. It is my belief that their decision to jump was their one final means of taking charge of their own lives. They must have wondered, "do I stay inside this building and burn alive? Or do I decide, on my own terms, how my life will end?" I think it was an incredible act of bravery that allowed them to make their decision.

George was likely in a sort of burning building himself. He had a decision to make and regardless of our feelings on the matter he made it on his own. I hope the man believed he was going someplace better and I wish his family and friends peace in knowing that, if just for a few moments, George was in control.

Danny

Ariana Diabla wrote:
This is very sad ... No matter how it happened.. He was very very talented. I was a big fan of his work!

i very much agree. and it sounds like he was a very good guy too.

Photo-Retoucher wrote:
I'm writing for George's family and close loved ones.


Every time a legend leaves without facts given out the public will always jump to extreme conclusions. This is NOT the case with George. Please do not spread rumors and make these accusations of George because he would not be proud of many of the responses going on and it doesn't show much consideration to his family.

I was a good friend and working partner of George's...so for all of us that was close to him I ask for everyone to just remember everything he has ever shown to the world because he'd prefer to keep it like that exactly.



Thank you



-Bianca

Thank you Bianca for sticking up for a wonderful man who is no longer able to defend himself. It really is beneath contempt to speak badly of people who can no longer defend themselves. I know the truth and only a very few people do. Why people should want to know the gritty details of the death of somebody they never even knew is beyond me. His fiancee is being tortured by people emailing her hate mail and going so far as to set up fake my space accounts to send her nasty emails. Talk about fucking warped minds. Sad losers with nothing else to do but, gossip about somebody they never even knew. George was extremely private and it is just awful people are judging him when they know absolutely nothing. They hear a rumour and assume it is true....  May God forgive them. Nobody has the right to judge another human being when they nothing of the facts and they shall never know the truth,never....

I consider myself lucky to have known him.... a nicer man I never met. He leaves us the legacy of his beautiful work. I am honoured to have know him. A man in a million he was. I know he is at peace now and hopefully all the gossip mongers will crawl back in the holes they crawled out of or find something else to worry themselves with. 

RIP George.......... :-( I miss ya

Nicola Ward wrote:

Thank you Bianca for sticking up for a wonderful man who is no longer able to defend himself. It really is beneath contempt to speak badly of people who can no longer defend themselves. I know the truth and only a very few people do. Why people should want to know the gritty details of the death of somebody they never even knew is beyond me. His fiancee is being tortured by people emailing her hate mail and going so far as to set up fake my space accounts to send her nasty emails. Talk about fucking warped minds. Sad losers with nothing else to do but, gossip about somebody they never even knew. George was extremely private and it is just awful people are judging him when they know absolutely nothing. They hear a rumour and assume it is true....  May God forgive them. Nobody has the right to judge another human being when they nothing of the facts and they shall never know the truth,never....

I consider myself lucky to have known him.... a nicer man I never met. He leaves us the legacy of his beautiful work. I am honoured to have know him. A man in a million he was. I know he is at peace now and hopefully all the gossip mongers will crawl back in the holes they crawled out of or find something else to worry themselves with. 

RIP George.......... :-( I miss ya

thank you very much.....I know what she is going through and talk to her often about it.....I hope everyone will just appreciate everything George has done and continue loving his work...

Photo-Retoucher wrote:

thank you very much.....I know what she is going through and talk to her often about it.....I hope everyone will just appreciate everything George has done and continue loving his work...

thank you.... I speak with her several times a day. It would break her heart to see this thread.  Yes... it would be so nice if everyone just remembered what an amazing artist he was. He leaves us an amazing legacy in his beautiful work. Nobody could ever imitate his work he had his very own style ;-)

Nicola Ward wrote:

Photo-Retoucher wrote:
Nobody could ever imitate his work he had his very own style ;-)

I know myself..

ValerieMarie wrote:
the best are always gone too soon.

Yes...but we have to continue appreciating their work forever...

( ANT ) Mgaphoto wrote:

Sad! I always admired his style

I admired his unique visions as well

timothy dolph wrote:

So GW, are you telling me that George checked out himself.  That's bullshit.
That totally changes my whole perspective on him.  I have had friends and relatives to do the some thing and I have all lack of respect for them in the afterlife.  Sorry, It sux but that is how i feel.

And my feeling are the same for Van Gogh, Hemingway, Cobain, Ledger, and my cousin Nick at age 14 as well.

Life is hard enough for the living.  How bad could it have really been for George?.  Somewhere between being elected president and living under a bridge I would assume.  Though I do not know the exact circumstances, how did it really come down to this?  How bad could it of REALLY been?

In my own experience, I have lived a pretty eclectic life so far.  Many, many, many ups and downs mentally, physically, spiritually, artistically, romantically, financially, ...  But I have never given up.  Why take the easy way out.

I have more respect for Elvis, James Dean, Stan Winston, Helmut Newton, Bob Carlos Clarke, and most of all... my best childhood friend since 8 years old:



Chief Petty Officer - Jacques Fontan - Special Operations Navy SEAL Team 10, whose MH-47 Chinook helicopter was shot down near Asadabad, Afghanistan, June 28, 2005.  A total of 11 SEALs and 8 Army Commandos died that day as they were attempting to rescue 4 other SEALs from a forward listing post that were engaged in a fire fight against overwhelming Taliban forces.  It was the greatest single loss of life for Navy Special Warfare forces since World War II.  If you are interested in the story... http://www.talkingproud.us/Military102207.html

So back to the OP, am I to forgive Robert Hoffmann and wish him a R.I.P. for what he did?  I never knew him... How bad could it of REALLY been?Could the reason be a terminal incurable illness or just an "F" on his report card?
I will, however, wish all this friends and family members of Onyx Photography a L.I.P. for they are the ones that will have to endure the unanswered questions for the rest of THEIR lives.  A long road for recovery.

Sorry if I hurt feelings on this reply post.  It's not very P.C. now is it?

"I have wrestled with death. It is the most unexciting contest you can imagine. It takes place in an impalpable greyness, with nothing underfoot, with nothing around, without spectators, without clamour, without glory, without the great desire of victory, without the great fear of defeat."
- Joseph Conrad, Heart of Darkness

Danny Does Glamour wrote:

I understand your point Tim. Really I do. However, I choose to look at suicide under a different light. My opinion won't be popular either because some (possibly even you) might misinterpret my post as glorifying the act. However, I am not.

Sometimes suicide is the BRAVE and HONORABLE thing to do. Sometime people are suffering from a physical, terminal illness and they choose to die on their terms before the illness leaves them no choice.

Sometimes people suffer from a mental illness so debilitating that their minds are buried deep in a pit of hopelessness and despair. There is simply no perceivable way out and, without someone recognizing their plight and intervening on their behalf, they choose to fight the feelings and take charge of their lives in one final act.

I don't think for one minute that victims of suicide act in a cowardly or selfish manner. Their line of thought is simply well beyond that.

I am reminded of the victims of 9/11 who leaped to their deaths from the open windows. It is my belief that their decision to jump was their one final means of taking charge of their own lives. They must have wondered, "do I stay inside this building and burn alive? Or do I decide, on my own terms, how my life will end?" I think it was an incredible act of bravery that allowed them to make their decision.

George was likely in a sort of burning building himself. He had a decision to make and regardless of our feelings on the matter he made it on his own. I hope the man believed he was going someplace better and I wish his family and friends peace in knowing that, if just for a few moments, George was in control.

Danny

I already knew you were amazing but this even furthur proved it.
+2 to you for writing this.

Tabatha Miami wrote:
It is not OUR position to judge others. Clearly, Onyx HAD DEEP UNDERLYING problems, probably depression that led him to take his own life.

I suffer from depression and can relate to ONYX choosing to end his life. If I decided to do so as he chose to do, it would be because I do not enjoy life - If I were happy, I would not end my life.

a HUMAN ad wrote:

I suffer from depression and can relate to ONYX choosing to end his life. If I decided to do so as he chose to do, it would be because I do not enjoy life - If I were happy, I would not end my life.

Suicide is not the solution to depression
Seek help
Seek your happiness
Find the ways to enjoy and do what makes you happy
There is hardly any one who is happy %100
We all try our best and keep fighting
Appreciate your self your work your friends and close once
Do you know how many people were sad when they heard the news about George?
I wonder if he knew how many people loved him, including me...
I only met him once for a shoot, but he changed my life forever,his work inspired me and i travelled to USA to meet him to have his photos!! And will continue to travel and work with talanted people like him no matter what it takes...
Seek and do not end whatever is given to you
It is given for a reason
Some one some where loves you:)

Bad Ass Photography wrote:
Does anyone know how old he was??  Just curious.

late 30's? i believe his myspace says 36?

Tina Marie Blonde wrote:
They really should delete this whole thread or whatever its called here.  Lets just remember his talent, this is not a place to discuss delicate personal issues like this.

Congratulations on bumping it so now people can continue posting in it. It was fine buried where it was.