Forums > Critique > Fun and Games > Why you should *not* give up. (models only)

Photographer

JA Sanchez

Posts: 6830

Miami, Florida, US

For models it's very common to be told things such as, "not tall enough, not slim enough, not the right look, too old, not 'commercial' enough, not tone enough, and so on"

Likewise, even successful models only book maybe 10% of the jobs they apply for. So have you ever thought, why continue to go through the aggravation? Why continue to compete with girls that keep getting younger, slimmer, taller and more beautiful? Have you ever considered that maybe you should just 'hangup your (designer) stiletto heels' and walk away from it all?

If you have felt this way before, or are currently feeling this way, then this 'critique' will present a counter-argument as to why you should consider going on.

Edit: I am no longer doing these particular critiques. If you are feeling a little bit down with regards to your modeling career, I invite you to read through the thread and you may find some responses that apply to your situation. If you have something urgent that you would like to discuss, you may also PM me.

Jan 21 10 11:39 am Link

Model

TrackBelle

Posts: 4497

San Francisco, California, US

I'm definitely not feeling this way now, but I previously have felt that way about my height.

Jan 21 10 03:59 pm Link

Model

Lloyd Wootten

Posts: 48

Chico, California, US

I feel this way about my height sometimes.

Jan 21 10 04:00 pm Link

Model

Eternal Fyre

Posts: 54

Circle Pines, Minnesota, US

This is just what I need. Thank you!

Jan 21 10 04:08 pm Link

Model

Shauni M

Posts: 113

Thief River Falls, Minnesota, US

this deff. sound nice. smile

Jan 21 10 04:32 pm Link

Photographer

JA Sanchez

Posts: 6830

Miami, Florida, US

TrackBelle wrote:
I'm definitely not feeling this way now, but I previously have felt that way about my height.

Your look is decidedly slanted toward the commercial side of modeling. At the tender age of 18, you are just starting to tap into your raw potential. If we can examine your portfolio, we can see an extraordinary amount of versatility, in fact I would say it's one of the most versatile model books I have seen from someone your age......not only on this site.......but anywhere.

Your figure is slim and camera friendly, but you are also able to carry a shot with just your (very unique by the way) facial features and expression.

Here we see dark and introspective and brooding:
https://modelmayhm-7.vo.llnwd.net/d1/photos/100113/19/4b4e942f35c1a_m.jpg

And here we see you ready to 'sing' with happiness and joyful exuberance:
https://modelmayhm-7.vo.llnwd.net/d1/photos/090801/17/4a74e06a9a435_m.jpg

Here we see you as the "I'm too cool for school bad girl, that doesn't give a damn and just wants to have fun.":
https://modelmayhm-7.vo.llnwd.net/d1/photos/090827/06/4a968cf3ef2c9_m.jpg

And finally we see you as a bundle of energy taunting the camera with dynamic motion, "Catch me if you can"
https://modelmayhm-7.vo.llnwd.net/d1/photos/080827/11/48b5732b8f65e_m.jpg

Finally you are intelligent, speak multiple languages and are very personable. With such talent and abilities at your disposal, you easily have 20 more years of modeling in your future. The best is definitely yet to come.

Jan 21 10 04:32 pm Link

Model

TrackBelle

Posts: 4497

San Francisco, California, US

Thank you smile

Jan 21 10 04:34 pm Link

Model

The Model Angela

Posts: 583

Mesa, Arizona, US

I'm new to this, and I am by no means what most people think of as a "model". I never intended to get into modeling, but a friend of a friend needed someone to test his new camera out on, I found that I enjoyed it, and here we are.

I don't get discouraged from comparing myself to other models, because I wrapped my head around the fact that I'm not 5'10" and 120 lbs a long time ago. What I do get discouraged about is that it's difficult to find photographers to work with (either I can't afford their rates, or they're not interested in TFCD).

*edited for clarification*
I can't get more experience without working with a photographer. Photographers don't want to work with me because I don't have enough experience. It's a vicious circle.

I'd be interested in what you think.

Jan 21 10 04:36 pm Link

Photographer

JA Sanchez

Posts: 6830

Miami, Florida, US

Lloyd Wootten wrote:
I feel this way about my height sometimes.

Your 5'10" frame is no cause for concern, you are actually within the acceptable height range for a male model.

The question that begs asking is, "Are you prepared to go out and knock on some doors?" The biggest thing holding back most people is their fear of rejection and failure. Ironically not giving it 100 percent is a sure way to fail.

What you should really be asking yourself is how much are you putting into modeling? Is it a hobby, something you want to do for fun when there is not some other activity going on, or do you really put all of your heart and soul into trying to land work, trying to get signed, and into each and every photoshoot, no excuses?

Don't fall into the trap of building imaginary walls in your head because you view yourself as 'too short' for modeling. Go out there and work on the cold days when those 6'1 guys are sleeping in, or at night when they take their girlfriends out.........be a man that 'makes things happen', and things just may start going your way.

Jan 21 10 04:48 pm Link

Photographer

JA Sanchez

Posts: 6830

Miami, Florida, US

Eternal Fyre wrote:
This is just what I need. Thank you!

I can tell that your are a 'one of a kind girl'. You don't model for the money or recognition, but because you love to show who you really are to the camera and your creativity to the world. Modeling is in your blood as a form of self expression, as essential to your very being as air and water.

So why would you think about quitting? Is it because the mainstream 'Madison Avenue' crowd doesn't approve of your alternative look and your work? Screw Madison Avenue, since when have you ever cared about what they thought? You're not doing this for them, you're doing it as a form of self expression. You don't model because you want to, you model because you are compelled to do so.

And you know what, there are people out there that appreciate what you do and what you bring to the table. You won't find them reading Vogue or Elle, but they are out there, and they love you.

Jan 21 10 04:58 pm Link

Model

Eternal Fyre

Posts: 54

Circle Pines, Minnesota, US

Thank you very much. I really needed a different perspective. smile

Jan 21 10 05:00 pm Link

Photographer

JA Sanchez

Posts: 6830

Miami, Florida, US

Shauni M wrote:
this deff. sound nice. smile

You're a naturally talented girl as far as your looks, but are you prepared to do the work it takes to be a model? In many ways natural beauty or talent can be as much of a hindrance as it can an advantage.

All of us that are old enough have known one 'genius' that knew he had such natural intellect that he never really paid any attention in school, never studied, never applied himself............so in the end he was surpassed by others that did not have his natural intellect.

Is this what is happening to you? Are you waiting for the world to embrace you because you were born with pretty features? Don't wait too long, because it's not going to happen. Do research on what it takes to model.........what genre you have to fit into, and then mold yourself into what you have to be in order to succeed at it.

Natural talent is not going to get you there as a model. No one is going to kick down your door, rub your shoulders and tell you........."Come on, this is what we have to get done today for your career. We need to go to the gym, we need to hit casting calls, how is your diet?...Come on, let's get on the ball." No stranger is going to care about you that much until you show that you care yourself first.

You have the talent, but the desire is just as important. And by desire I don't mean waiting for something to happen........nothing will happen unless you force it to happen through your sheer determination and will power. So don't waste what God gave you, go out there and make the dream come true, don't wait for a 'genie in a bottle'.

Jan 21 10 05:11 pm Link

Photographer

JA Sanchez

Posts: 6830

Miami, Florida, US

The Model Angela wrote:
I don't get discouraged from comparing myself to other models, because I wrapped my head around the fact that I'm not 5'10" and 120 lbs a long time ago. What I do get discouraged about is that it's difficult to find photographers to work with (either I can't afford their rates, or they're not interested in TFCD).

*edited for clarification*
I can't get more experience without working with a photographer. Photographers don't want to work with me because I don't have enough experience. It's a vicious circle.

I'd be interested in what you think.

It's interesting that you note those 5'10 and 120lb models in your post. You will have to take my word for this since I know quite a few girls like that.......to them, you are close to the bravest person alive.

I assure you that quite a few of those girls that you think are perfect, struggle daily with body image. Likewise I am sure that seeing someone like you go out there and not be afraid to show who you are in front of the camera really does inspire admiration for you from a wide spectrum of people.

As far as finding photographers, you need to look for people that are shooting genres that would be complimentary for your look. Obviously fashion and glamour photographers are going to be looking for something different. Not necessarily because they don't appreciate your look, but because they need a different type of look for the segment of the market they are looking to break into.

So basically you need to go after the art photographers and more creative types. It may be a hard road, but through a sparkle personality and perseverance you can succeed. Why should you go on?......Why would you consider quitting when so many people admire your courage for what you are doing? They say to themselves, "If she can do it, then maybe I should try a little bit harder."

You're the underdog, and deep down everyone loves to root for the underdog.

Jan 21 10 05:32 pm Link

Model

The Model Angela

Posts: 583

Mesa, Arizona, US

SouthFLpix wrote:
You're the underdog, and deep down everyone loves to root for the underdog.

Thank you so much. I really appreciate you taking the time for a "boost". It means a lot to me... this brought me to tears, which doesn't happen often.

Thank you.

Jan 21 10 05:43 pm Link

Model

Emily Smiles

Posts: 295

Columbia, South Carolina, US

me?

Jan 21 10 05:48 pm Link

Model

Sonja Melissa

Posts: 55

Sarnia, Ontario, Canada

I do feel this way about my height... being only 5"3 lol.

But I would like more insight. Thanks!

Jan 21 10 05:50 pm Link

Model

Ashley Alexiss

Posts: 291

Los Angeles, California, US

Short & thick.. Not very promising but there's always an exceptional person smile

Jan 21 10 05:50 pm Link

Model

Classy Dame Plus Model

Posts: 35

Leesburg, Virginia, US

I seem to get a 50/50 positive/negative reaction from most MM-ers. Who knows.

Jan 21 10 05:55 pm Link

Model

Brittany Pires

Posts: 1

Brent, Florida, US

shorter and very thin. blonde hair and blue eyes< i feel too commercial

Jan 21 10 06:04 pm Link

Photographer

JA Sanchez

Posts: 6830

Miami, Florida, US

Emily Smiles wrote:
me?

Why would you be considering quitting at 5'10 and 16 years old with a great look? You are, however, not a in a major market such as NYC, and that can create a problem.

For you I think what I will do is share an inspirational modeling story, that I do not think you are familiar with.

Back in the 1961 a beautiful girl named Vera von Lehndorff decided to try her hand at modeling in NYC. She was turned down by absolutely everyone that would listen despite being 6'1 and having a great look.

So what did she do? A year later she changed her name to the more 'mysterious' sounding Veruschka and went to castings dressed from head to toe in black clothing.

The agents were blown away by this quiet beauty that dressed all in black and who went only by Veruschka, no last name. Almost overnight everyone in the fashion world wanted to book this 'mysterious' new beauty, and soon she became one of the highest paid models in the entire world.

Let this be a lesson to you. Even with a great look, if Veruschka had given up after that attempt in 1961, her dreams would have ended right there on the spot. Natural beauty or talent is absolutely no guarantee that you will succeed. You need to be bold!....For you, this may mean that you might have to consider moving somewhere where models have a better chance of finding work.

Why shouldn't you give up? Because it would be a ridiculous thing for a 16 year old - 5'10 beauty to do, and I'm sure just about everyone will agree with me here when I say that.

Jan 21 10 06:10 pm Link

Photographer

JA Sanchez

Posts: 6830

Miami, Florida, US

Sonja Melissa wrote:
I do feel this way about my height... being only 5"3 lol.

But I would like more insight. Thanks!

You know, contrary to popular belief, not all models under 5'10 are automatically dead in the water. There are other types of modeling which do not have height requirements, such as promotional and glamour modeling. While you probably will not be doing those through an agency, they can certainly provided some added income and something else too.........*FUN*.

By modeling you open yourself up to meet so many like minded artists, be they photographers, MUAs, designers, stylists and many more. Can anyone put a value on the life experience you gain modeling, the friendships you make, the struggles you endure while fighting for your dream?

It's clear that not every girl can be on the cover of Vogue, but what you can do is cultivate friendships and experiences which you will value for as long as you are here on this earth.......*and* make some money on the side to buy cool things with.

Are those things not worth pursuing? Absolutely they are. You are a pretty girl, suitable for a lot of 'freelance' (outside of an agency) assignments, and you also seem quite friendly and fun to work with.

As a photographer, I love reading this from your profile:
"I'm considerably short, so that may be a downfall.. but for what I lack in height, I make up for in energy and open-mindedness."

That's what I love to hear! Keep saying that you have unbelievable energy, that you are open-minded, and that you LOVE, LOVE, LOVE to work..........

The boxer, Muhammad Ali called himself 'The Greatest'. At first it was a joke when a 18 year old fresh out of high school kid said that. At 22 when he became heavyweight champion, he looked right at the reporters whom had laughed at his earlier claims and yelled 'I shook up the world! I shook up the world!' The laughing turned to jeers.

Then at 32 when he defeated George Foreman in Zaire, Africa...........the jeers now turned to cheers. He had done the impossible and turned them around. Now he's 'The Greatest' to everyone. Before he made us believe it, first he believed it himself......18 years old, out of high school, from a low income family. No future to hope for but what he believed in his mind.

So be like Ali.........go out there and shake up the world a little and see what doors open for you.

Jan 21 10 06:30 pm Link

Model

Annie RS

Posts: 5699

Baltimore, Maryland, US

Me please? Thank you.

Jan 21 10 06:32 pm Link

Model

Donauta

Posts: 47

Brooklyn, New York, US

would love ur opinion.. I took a long break but I can't seem to stay away

Jan 21 10 06:36 pm Link

Photographer

JA Sanchez

Posts: 6830

Miami, Florida, US

Ashley Alexiss wrote:
Short & thick.. Not very promising but there's always an exceptional person smile

From your profile:

"I'm a very determined individual. I love bringing a positive vibe to my place of work. I moved 3000 miles to pursue my career and make my dreams come true and I won't stop until they do"


That's all I have to read and I know that you are going to do well. Sure it will probably not be shooting for Vogue, but you will find some other avenue which suits your talents. I see that you also have acting and dance experience, so perhaps that will be 'your ticket'.

How can I be sure you will succeed? Let me tell you a little story about determination and persistence.

Back in WWII, there was this skinny kid named Harold Ripslinger. Now Harold wasn't one of these big muscular 'manly men', but he wanted to be in the Army to serve his country. The Army turned him down again and again saying he was just too scrawny to make a good soldier. Finally after continuing to apply they relented and let him join.

'Rip' served on a bomber airplane that went down in Africa when it went off course and ran out of gas. Everyone ejected but found themselves in the middle of the desert. They decided to try to follow some tracks in the sand and walk out.

The temperature was 130 degrees, there was no food, and only enough water for about 1ounce per day for each person. Still the men were young, fit and tough.........they made it 80 miles before making this entry in their journal.

"Still having prayer meetings for help. No sign of anything, a couple of birds; good wind from N. –Really weak now, cant walk. pains all over, still all want to die. Nites very cold. no sleep."

That is their exact words, verbatim. The men sat down at this point and basically gave up, but a few decided to keep going to find help, one of them was Ripslinger. Unfortunately there was no water to be found and eventually all the men died and their bodies were recovered years later, and a funny thing happened.

The skinny kid Harold Ripslinger, who had been rejected numerous times for being too scrawny and 'wimpy' to be in the army.........well he had walked 107 miles in the baking desert sun, 27 more then the soldiers who had stayed behind.

How did Ripslinger make it farther then anyone else? Well no one had ever taught Rip how to give up, and so he never did.


So there you have it. Determination is worth at least 107 miles in desert sun with negligible water and no food. And by the way......you may be thick, but it's in all the right places. wink

Jan 21 10 07:04 pm Link

Model

SamaraM

Posts: 73

South San Francisco, California, US

I think this is a beautiful forum, and the time you take to respond with so much insight, is really quite special!

Jan 21 10 07:09 pm Link

Photographer

JA Sanchez

Posts: 6830

Miami, Florida, US

Classy Dame wrote:
I seem to get a 50/50 positive/negative reaction from most MM-ers. Who knows.

You are another one of those people that are here to sort of break barriers. Your success will not come in the form of big campaigns or editorial sheets, but in the fact that you had the courage to go out there and do something despite not fitting the conventional mainstream idea of beauty.

So why should you go on? Well modeling for you is not going to be a career, so therefore you are not tied down to meeting any specific 'standards' or expectations set by the industry. You can sort of carve out your own path and work only on projects that move you.

Along the way you will no doubt be a role model for many other girls that feel ostracized because they do not meet the very 'strict' criteria typically imposed on working models. Like others that find themselves walking 'the road less traveled', you will no doubt be paid in life experiences and friendships which you otherwise would not have been privy to.

Jan 21 10 07:16 pm Link

Photographer

Rebecca Newman Photography

Posts: 1631

Tampa, Florida, US

SouthFLpix wrote:
For models it's very common to be told things such as, "not tall enough, not slim enough, not the right look, too old, not 'commercial' enough, not tone enough, and so on"

Likewise, even successful models only book maybe 10% of the jobs they apply for. So have you ever thought, why continue to go through the aggravation? Why continue to compete with girls that keep getting younger, slimmer, taller and more beautiful? Have you ever considered that maybe you should just 'hangup your (designer) stiletto heels' and walk away from it all?

If you have felt this way before, or are currently feeling this way, then this 'critique' will present a counter-argument as to why you should consider going on.

Only 5'6" sad

Jan 21 10 07:19 pm Link

Model

Sonja Melissa

Posts: 55

Sarnia, Ontario, Canada

SamaraM wrote:
I think this is a beautiful forum, and the time you take to respond with so much insight, is really quite special!

Strongly agree! I thank you for your reply!
kudos to all the effort you are putting in these critiques

Jan 21 10 07:47 pm Link

Photographer

JA Sanchez

Posts: 6830

Miami, Florida, US

Brittany Pires wrote:
shorter and very thin. blonde hair and blue eyes< i feel too commercial

I think there are few things more beautiful then a model who goes on to become a designer, or a fashion editor. Why is that?

Well only an unrealistically tiny percentage of women are able to turn modeling into a long-term money making venture. For the vast majority of even agency girls, this is a part-time thing to make some extra money, meet new friends, visit interesting places, and have good times, all while doing something you love.

"It was the best of times, it was the worst of times.", Charles Dickens once wrote. To me that describes modeling for the vast majority of women. It's a seemingly impossible dream, but anytime you can live a dream for even a day, a week, or a month.......who can say no to that?

So later on to come back triumphantly and to work with other girls that 'were as you were' in your younger years has to be a tremendous satisfaction. You never really leave the world you love, it's just that instead of being 'Alice' in her wonderland, you become the narrator telling the story of 'another Alice'.......as her designer.

Why should you go on? You should soak up every experience you can like a sponge being dipped into 'the mana of life'. Every day you spend modeling will be a day you will never forget, be they good or bad...........those days will shape forever the person whom you will become. Those stories, those little adventures, those struggles you will pass down countless times to a new generation of struggling beauties.

And who knows......maybe one of those beauties whom you help groom will one day walk down the runway in a major fashion show wearing your designs, on the day that a major buyer decides to carry them for a national retailer. In that instant you would see both your dream and her dream come true at the exact same time, and who can say no to that?

Jan 21 10 07:57 pm Link

Photographer

JA Sanchez

Posts: 6830

Miami, Florida, US

Annie RS wrote:
Me please? Thank you.

You actually seem very tuned into your market, which is artistic nudes, glamour, and artistic photos in general. Certainly with this type of modeling you can continue as long as you find it satisfying. Understanding and going after your particular niche is a very important part of finding lasting success as a model. So let's discuss specifically what you need in order to be able to continue modeling long-term without any other income being needed.

All you need is 1000 people from anywhere in the entire world, that become fans and will support you by buying your material.......(prints, merchandise, ect).

If each of these 1,000 people spends $100 a year on you, then that is a $100,000 income. Even if you have only 500 fans spending $100 a year, then that is still $50,000 every year. Of course, any paid modeling assignments would be additional income on top of that. Even if you don't want to do it forever, you can do it long enough to pay for any schooling that you might need to transition to whatever other career path you want to pursue.

Is that an achievable goal? Absolutely, I think it is. There are billions of people on Earth, all you need is 1000 of them that you can cultivate into a fanbase. Given your youth and your look (which is exotic enough to appeal to many different cultural groups) that should definitely be an attainable goal.

So why shouldn't you quit? Because you have the look that can earn you a living doing something you love.

Jan 21 10 08:30 pm Link

Photographer

JA Sanchez

Posts: 6830

Miami, Florida, US

Donauta wrote:
would love ur opinion.. I took a long break but I can't seem to stay away

If you can't stay away, then it seems logical to assume that it's something you have in your blood. If that's true, then you owe it yourself to apply all your energy into seeing if something can come out of this.

Even if it doesn't, you will know that you really tried to pursue your dream to the best of your ability. If you don't, then you will always wonder "What if I would have tried harder, gone out to more castings, networked more, and generally gave it 100 percent of myself?"

You don't want to be one of those people who is always thinking about 'what might have been', do you? Do what you can now so that in the future your modeling photos will bring you a sense of pride and achievement, rather then thoughts of regret.

Jan 21 10 08:39 pm Link

Model

Ally Swearengen

Posts: 99

Washington, District of Columbia, US

I argue this question with myself before every shoot it seems.  Why should I go?  I'm "old" by most standards, too short, and have tattoos....what do you think?

Jan 21 10 08:51 pm Link

Photographer

JA Sanchez

Posts: 6830

Miami, Florida, US

Sonja Melissa wrote:
Strongly agree! I thank you for your reply!
kudos to all the effort you are putting in these critiques

You're quite welcome!



At this point I'm going to take a break from these critiques and continue at a later time. Thank you to everyone who took part.


To anyone that wants to read a quick little message from me.............Never quit doing what you love. Put all your heart and soul into it and you will be paid. Maybe not in money, but in life experiences, and friendships, and in other ways which you may not be able to clearly see until one day in the future when it will dawn on you.

Jan 21 10 09:00 pm Link

Model

Michaelnomore

Posts: 860

Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, US

I'd never give up my stilettos, but some days it's damn discouraging to say the least.  The world is not particularly warm towards male models.

Jan 21 10 09:15 pm Link

Model

Lloyd Wootten

Posts: 48

Chico, California, US

SouthFLpix wrote:

Your 5'10" frame is no cause for concern, you are actually within the acceptable height range for a male model.

The question that begs asking is, "Are you prepared to go out and knock on some doors?" The biggest thing holding back most people is their fear of rejection and failure. Ironically not giving it 100 percent is a sure way to fail.

What you should really be asking yourself is how much are you putting into modeling? Is it a hobby, something you want to do for fun when there is not some other activity going on, or do you really put all of your heart and soul into trying to land work, trying to get signed, and into each and every photoshoot, no excuses?

Don't fall into the trap of building imaginary walls in your head because you view yourself as 'too short' for modeling. Go out there and work on the cold days when those 6'1 guys are sleeping in, or at night when they take their girlfriends out.........be a man that 'makes things happen', and things just may start going your way.

Thank you, and you're right. If I'm serious, i need to maintain a hard work ethic and not worry about things like my height. I plan on putting myself fully into my aspirations as a male model, it's a tough world. I need to maintain a more active approach and your words have certainly inspired me to take a more serious approach.

Jan 21 10 10:23 pm Link

Model

Classy Dame Plus Model

Posts: 35

Leesburg, Virginia, US

SouthFLpix wrote:

You are another one of those people that are here to sort of break barriers. Your success will not come in the form of big campaigns or editorial sheets, but in the fact that you had the courage to go out there and do something despite not fitting the conventional mainstream idea of beauty.

So why should you go on? Well modeling for you is not going to be a career, so therefore you are not tied down to meeting any specific 'standards' or expectations set by the industry. You can sort of carve out your own path and work only on projects that move you.

Along the way you will no doubt be a role model for many other girls that feel ostracized because they do not meet the very 'strict' criteria typically imposed on working models. Like others that find themselves walking 'the road less traveled', you will no doubt be paid in life experiences and friendships which you otherwise would not have been privy to.

Thank you for your opinion. Most photographers on here can't even look beyond my weight and judge me at face value. I appreciate your honesty.

Jan 22 10 03:41 am Link

Model

Laura BrokenDoll

Posts: 3566

Modena, Emilia-Romagna, Italy

Not tall enough.
Hips not small enough.
Not commercial enough.
That's what I've been said before.

...please, give me a positive input tongue

Jan 22 10 05:15 am Link

Model

Faith EnFire

Posts: 13514

Milwaukee, Wisconsin, US

a positive spin would be nice. got a long shoot tomrorow.

you name it, I've been told it

Jan 22 10 05:19 am Link

Model

Erica Krenz

Posts: 83

Charlotte, North Carolina, US

I have felt this way quite a few times...this is just what I needed this morning smile

Jan 22 10 05:22 am Link

Model

Sarah Ivie

Posts: 67

WEST BLOOMFIELD, Michigan, US

I always feel that I am not skinny enough for this business and shedding hips is a very hard thing to do.

Jan 22 10 05:23 am Link