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Not showing up... an industry DISEASE?
I have found that models and makeup and hair people have to be the most incompetent people in the world... I used to think it was the people working undesirable jobs that behaved like this, but nope, I was wrong. I have recently discovered why photographers kiss my feet when I show up on time and ready (ok I'm exaggerating), by hosting my very own model search for a project. Of the total of a hundred of so girls that expressed "interest" in the project, only half actually sent in their full information and pictures, of those about half responded when I required all girls to be interviewed by my talent manager... when a group interviews were set up for various areas, of the girls planning to attend, only about a quarter actually showed up or contacted me to reschedule... now, during the process, I believe 3 got into "car accidents", a few had "family deaths", and about 6 got so lost that they never made it (keep in mind these group interviews were held at malls)... but also... computers crashed deleting my emails, my emails never got to them, my voice mails were apparently deleted by verizon (or whoever) and all kinds of other things JUST HAPPENED! Now to top it all off, I had a makeup artist and a hairstylist not show up to a few of MY shoots... so this leads me to ask the question: why do girls respond to casting calls if they are uninterested?? and why do they not show up if they are?? if someone doesn't show up twice and makes up stories and IS INTERESTED... do they really think that they will be hired?? i understand that emergencies do happen... and they do happen to all of us... but statistically it is impossible for emergencies to happen at this rate to those that model... sorry... i don't believe it! Jul 24 05 11:39 am Link Believe it ... the ratios sound about right ... Jul 24 05 11:48 am Link back in my days of primarily testing and modeling portfolio work this was norm. It never happens now. Good Agency models don't flake on jobs where they make enough to pay a months rent and neither do artists. On budget stuff, yea, expect it...there is a good reason people are available and willing to work on a small budget, think about it. Jul 24 05 11:51 am Link And people think it's wrong to charge an application fee. I guess because it almost guarantees the model will show up. If not, heaven forbid you get compensated and/or pay the staff with that money for that time if they fail to show up. Jul 24 05 11:55 am Link You are not looking at a true industry that is based upon a real client relationship. I would say for the most part what percentage of the models & photographer have worked in the creative field where, your rep was meaning of showing for meetings & go-sees.....this is a new industry of net models/photographers...so you have money value to base a lot of your misgivings on no-shows.....if a model didn;t make it she didn't get the assignment or make any income. Here people struggle just to make ends meet, so the bottomline is MONEY! Just creating images for personal consumption, does't lead to much money being made. Jul 24 05 12:08 pm Link The part I really hate is when they email you on here or other "modeling boards" and state they really like your work and want to work with you. You then email them telling them what projects are going on, they email you back saying that would be great and to let them know when. Then you email them a scheduling list and try and set everything up and they "disappear". You wait a while as to not seem eager about it, but you don't hear anything back from them. So, you send them a "follow up email" just to see what's going on and they write back saying they are waiting for info...so you send them the info again in reply and again, they disappear. Or they'll ask you to call them, you call and leave a message or two and they don't call back. When is enough, enough? After that I just saw forget it and don't write to them or call them again and I've actually had the same model contact me again later (say in a month or so) and say she/he wants to work with me again. WTF is with people??? It's just really irritating when that happens. Like Lilpink was saying, accidents do happen and things do come up, but when people "magically" lose emails or act like they didn't get a phone message and such, that is just irritating as heck! Okay, I have to go get another $0.02 now. LOL ;-) Regards, Mat G. Jul 24 05 12:12 pm Link I know money is the root of all evil Do funny things to some people Give me a nickel, brother can you spare a dime Money can drive some people out of their minds Jul 24 05 12:15 pm Link it's when there is no true product to give way to the meaning of Money. One thing I want to know of what percent of the images..do make money or land models or photographers.....bread & butter work...something beyond you got some real nice pictures to view. Jul 24 05 12:17 pm Link My motto has always been "book three to get one." Unless it's someone I know well and have worked with before, I always book at least three models of similar type for a given shoot. Jul 24 05 12:27 pm Link But what do you gain from booking three to get one, if the one is not the one you want in the first place Jul 24 05 12:29 pm Link Posted by Alex Alexander: One model is better than no models - I can totally identify with Melvin. I've been trying for over a month to get even one model to show up! And this is after long, in-depth emails, phone calls, meetings, etc. Oy...guess I'll have to start doing the same thing. Jul 24 05 12:35 pm Link I fully support the idea of a blacklist for models who do not show up to a scheduled shoot. Jul 24 05 12:36 pm Link Posted by Michael Thayer: It looks like you blacklisted anyone who isn't blond! Jul 24 05 12:38 pm Link Posted by Mat Gdowski: Why? You're setting up a photo shoot, not trying to get a date (I hope) Jul 24 05 01:47 pm Link Posted by XtremeArtists: Posted by Michael Thayer: It looks like you blacklisted anyone who isn't blond! Guess that is what he likes.... Jul 24 05 01:55 pm Link Posted by Michael Thayer: I was against this idea, but after getting burned 3 times in one week... Jul 24 05 02:01 pm Link Posted by Alex Alexander: I pride myself on being versatile and open-minded enough to create with anyone who comes into the room. I actually like the unexpected. And I never make any hard fast decisions until the subject is in front of me and a camera is in my hand. Jul 24 05 02:37 pm Link Of course, it happens on both cash and "compensation other than cash" shoots. I had booked a model who was with a top agency in Chicago to spend 3 hours at a banquet selling raffle tickets. Not a glam-glam job, but it was $200, all she had to do was smile, and she got to keep her clothes on. About an hour before the event, she called to say she wasn't showing up because she didn't agree with the politics of the sponsoring organization. Unfortunately, I didn't book her thru her agency, otherwise I would have bitched to them about it. I ended up getting the daughter of one of the organizers to take over...she enjoyed the $200. Another time, I had a shoot for a catalog client. The budget for a model, stylist, and MUA was $600 for a 3 hour shoot. The model arranged for the stylist and MUA. When they were about 20 mins late for the shoot, I called the model on her cell phone. When she answered the phone, I could hear music in the background and other women talking. She reported that she, stylist, and MUA had "stopped at McDonalds" and would be at the shoot in 15 minutes. I never heard from them again. I sent the model a couple of emails that went unanswered...until she shut down her email account. Ealy in my OMP/TFP days, I got an education when I had my first no-show. I called the model about 1/2 hour after the appointed time. She acted surprised that I called. I asked her why she hadn't shown up. She responded something to the effect that "...a lady should always keep her options open" and that she decided to hang out with friends that day. I told her that I thought it was unfortunate that she chose not to let me know. She responded by asking me, "Do you pay my rent?" "Do you pay my car note?" "Are you my daddy?" "Are you my man?" And then went on to tell me that she was "grown" and that "nobody" tells her what to do. LOL...no, I didn't reschedule. Jul 24 05 03:14 pm Link Once upon a time I was the schnuck who models would not show up for, and perhaps my thoughts will help you transcend the no-shows. Yes, the car breakdown and other excuses are as much of a cliche as 'i had a portfolio but it was stolen.' A lot of girls put up their pictures on these modeling sites as if it's a hotornot.com venue. They like having an inbox full of emails and offers, playing e-tag, hearing that they are hot, and pussyfooting around about something they will never step up to the plate for. Putting up some pics costs them nothing, and they feel, who knows, maybe they will be "discovered" by some producer for the next HBO hit. I've offered to do free shoots in the past with amateur models who had great potential, only to have those shoots blown off - today, a few years later I see those same girls on MM who are showing the same webcam pictures or cheap candids they presented years ago. Many of these "models" are either afraid of success or afraid of failure, and so do nothing but play e-tag or talk about some other fictional shoot they are booked for on the day you request them. Then they sit home and dream about being Paris Hilton or Jessica Simpson, or dream about "getting signed" to a top agency although they will never actually call an agency or show up for an agency's open call. Fellow photographers, if you have a serious shoot I beseech you to meet the model well before the shoot to ensure she is reliable and looks somewhat like her 72 dpi postage stamp sized pictures. It's standard procedure for agencies to send professional models on go-sees and castings for prospective jobs, without there every being a guarantee that the meeting will lead to a job. i would expect newbie "internet" models with no book or agency referral to make that same effort, whether the shoot is paid or not. If you can't do this, ask yourself if it looks like she's shooting with others regularly, or if she's only posted prom picture and 3 webcam pictures from last year. If you find yourself emailing trite one-liners back and forth and she doesnt give her number or call, give yourself the satisfaction of blowing her off first because in 4 out of 5 cases that's just what's gonna happen to you. Jul 24 05 03:24 pm Link Posted by Belair: Somehow, I think you're going to win this thread, sir...That last story is about the worst I've ever heard. Jul 24 05 03:26 pm Link I've have a perfect record for shows in the last 6 months. Thank goodness.  Jul 24 05 03:32 pm Link Posted by Melvin Moten Jr: Posted by Belair: Somehow, I think you're going to win this thread, sir...That last story is about the worst I've ever heard. Chicago has more than its share of "divas" and she was pretty much par for the course based on some other similar stories I have heard from other area photogs regarding other models suffering from diva-itis. Jul 24 05 03:38 pm Link this is why the industry (partically in new york city) doesnt bother to invest their money into the modeling product in general - i'll never forget a DC area babe was supposed to shoot with me for a calendar and she gave me the "my car overheated" excuse..... it was wintertime, and apparently it didnt overheat that bad cause i later saw her in Club Dream that same night, lol. the bottom line is anything that applies the phrase "$" shouldnt be justified because it seperates the models who understand the ins and outs of behind the scenes from the models "who are interested" and for every model who "is interested" on MM, maybe 1/10 of them will remember that they even typed it. in the new york city area, this is the norm, and this is why photographers here are now venturing out of town to work with more serious minded models. but thats just my 2 cents Jul 24 05 04:20 pm Link Posted by Belair: Posted by Melvin Moten Jr: Posted by Belair: Somehow, I think you're going to win this thread, sir...That last story is about the worst I've ever heard. Chicago has more than its share of "divas" and she was pretty much par for the course based on some other similar stories I have heard from other area photogs regarding other models suffering from diva-itis. It's kind of funny...in my area of work [erotic/fetish], we really don't get nearly as much diva behavior...naturally we have some, but not nearly as much as you might expect. Near as I can figure, people once decide to do erotic/fetish/porn/whatever work, they really want to do it...for whatever reason. I think I've had one no-show and one lame excuse in the last year or so. Jul 24 05 07:08 pm Link It is a sad thing that everyone is afraid to call these people out and "clean up" the industry. People think it is incredible hard to make it in this industry, but the truth of the matter is that there is soooo many flakes out there it is difficult for professional models to be taken seriously. If we black list the scrubs we will finally be able to work with REAL models. A good rule to follow that I have found is if a model has potential to actually make it and she doesn't have a single professional shot... don't bother contacting her, because there is probably a reason she doesn't have a lot of work. I would really like to have a reporting system similar to the credit bureaus in order to monitor and not waste peoples time on unprofessional models. Most of these people don't understand that whether or not a photo shoot is TFP the photographer and his staff has to set aside time to prepare for the shoot. Giving a model a TFP or test shoot and actually letting her use the pictures in her portfolio is a privilege not a right. I understand that some model do not except TFP work, and some models don't even show up for paid assignments, but as a professional you should not schedule a shoot that you do not plan on making. It has gotten ridiculous. But before I continue to ramble on I will finish with I totally agree with everything the original poster of this subject. It sucks and we really should do something about it... other industries have a checks and balance system why is everyone afraid to do it with this industry? Jul 24 05 07:26 pm Link I do not know what to add except for this story. In my junior year of High School last year, A hot female liked me. But I was with someone. She was quite the babe. Well she pursued but no go. Then months later when I was free from the hell that I knew. I called her up but she was with a sleeze ball with a Trans am. It became obvious that she was making up excuses not to talk to me. Like in three days, I am no psycho. Anyway, like you care. The punchline, we would take bets at parties of what her excuse was for not talking. Harmless fun, she never knew or maybe she did and got a kickback. Bad yes, but harmless fun. That is all I have to add to the conversation, By the way I did later date her older sister who was much nicer and Hotter. Jul 24 05 07:31 pm Link Worse! Some of the models message me wanting work with me then I email them back saying yes and I never hear from them again. Whats up with that? Jul 24 05 07:32 pm Link "Industry disease" ? Well yes, I think it comes with the online "modeling" "industry". (if you can really call it an industry). In the real world of the fashion industry it's basically not a problem. John Jul 24 05 07:33 pm Link When I book models I already expect "no show", lateness, confusion, blatant lies .. etc .. which happen most of the time. When a photoshoot happens as planned I take it as a lucky bonus .. Jul 24 05 07:40 pm Link I'll tell you one damn thing. My daughter shows up as long as I'm helping her. The day she don't is the day I stop helping! Jul 24 05 07:42 pm Link I try to make it a point to be on time for a shoot if not early. In fact, I just got off the phone with a photographer scheduling a shoot for next week (yes, I called him...shocked?). Anyhow, he wanted to start shooting at 9am. He sounded a little shocked when I asked if that wasn't too late, and if he wanted me to be there earlier. In fact, he sounded a bit relieved when I told him I may be there around 8:45 just to be on the safe side. That way, we can go over things more, and I can make sure my makeup/wardrobe, etc is just right (I'm doing makeup myself). Am I the only model who seems to care to be early for a shoot? Please tell me there are others out there.... Jul 24 05 07:45 pm Link This is typical Jul 24 05 07:49 pm Link I just have to insert my bitch here. I've had several girls express a major interest in working with me, we've spoken, set a date, a day or two before the shoot we've confirmed, and then nothing. Just a waste of my time to have an entire day scheduled around someone who just doesn't even have the decency to say 'I changed my mind'. Even that sucks but atleast it would be better than a no call/no show. Jul 24 05 07:52 pm Link I just want to pull all the hair I have left. I'm the type I allways show up on time. And it really gives me the red ass when I have to wait or someone just does'nt show up. I had a guy model the other day supose to meet me at my office just to discuss what we were going to shoot. No show end of the day, went home very pissed off, never called, I stayed 1 hour over waiting on this guy! Jul 24 05 07:54 pm Link I have one episode that I still haven't figured out. I was on the phone talking with this model to set up a shoot... MODEL: "Are you one of those guys who shoots in hotel rooms? Because I won't shoot in any hotel room." ME: "No, I don't shoot in hotel rooms." MODEL: "Well f**k off then!" CLICK Jul 24 05 07:56 pm Link Posted by Belair: HAHAHA!!! She wanted to bang or rob you. Jul 24 05 08:09 pm Link Posted by Belair: Another classic. Jul 24 05 08:17 pm Link Posted by oscarNOW.com: You talk too much, post too much, and complain too much, now shut up. Jul 24 05 08:17 pm Link Posted by John Allan: Your right on the mark. Jul 24 05 09:21 pm Link "Industry disease" ? I would say Industry Standards. T Jul 24 05 09:24 pm Link |
