Glenn Liam Kelly wrote:
http://strobist.blogspot.com.au/2012/09 … -jump.html

David Hobby at strobist.com considers the 200/s sync speed a deal breaker.

Yeah I read that article, but since I am not a studio shooter I am wondering the impact to event shoots and location work...

Thanks for the link - it is a good read.

Scott

Images by MR wrote:
nm

nm?  I am low on sleep and can't figure that out (it is probably obvious).

ImageX wrote:
Set it to iso 50 or use an ND. 1/4000 wasn't a deal breaker for me and I'm glad I bought a D600.

I have been checking your work on other threads and the D600 is really performing well for you.  I was already researching neutral density filters for the 50mm f/1.4G and I am wondering if I need a .9 or .6 ND filter?

I think the rest of the glass (f/2.8 and slower) won't be as big of an issue.

Scott

Glenn Liam Kelly wrote:
http://strobist.blogspot.com.au/2012/09 … -jump.html

David Hobby at strobist.com considers the 200/s sync speed a deal breaker.

Yea really????

1/5th of a stop is really going to change his world???

1/200th s vs 1/250th.

Yes you can go to 1/320th (option) but only with Nikon speedlights on camera.

ImageX wrote:
Set it to iso 50 or use an ND. 1/4000 wasn't a deal breaker for me and I'm glad I bought a D600.

Same here... glad I also bought the D600... I don't plan on freezing hummingbird wings at more that 1/4000 of a second... and with the amazing low light capabilities of this cam (better low ISO score than the D800 at DXOMark)... I don't visualize myself using strobes much at all...


No strobe at 3200 ISO... yeah... this camera ROCKS!

JSB Fine Art Photo wrote:
......
I always shoot in RAW.  Post is done with Nikon NX2.

Glass will be:

Nikon 50mm f/1.4G

Nikon 105 f/2.8 VR

Nikon 70-300 VR

Tamron 24-70 f/2.8 VC

Scott

All your lenses will look good on both the D800 and D600, however you would get more image quality from the 85mm 1.4 that the 105 2.8 VR.

The 70-300 and the Tamron are not quite upto what both the d600 and D800 are capable of, but you will see gains over your previous Nikon with these lenses.

Comparison of the 105 and 85mm 1.4G



The 105 is a fine lens, but you can get better...

Fotografica Gregor wrote:
The one absolutely critical downfall of the D600 for studio work is the lack of ability to lock the aperture and shutter speed setting, which is standard on Nikon semi-pro level cameras like the D700 and D800 as well as their professional bodies.

Can you explain to me what you are saying here?  I haven't heard this one and I am not understanding what you mean by "lock the aperture and shutter speed setting."

JSB Fine Art Photo wrote:
I am moving from a Nikon D60 to a combination of either a D800 or D600 with a D7000 as a backup body.  I mostly shoot fashion and portraits.  I don't shoot studio, mostly location and shows (runway). I plan on growing my business and I need to invest in tools that will meet my needs over a period of years.  I have a SB-600 for the D7000 and I will invest in a SB-910 for the D800 or a SB-700 for the D600.  I will use a battery grip on all bodies.

I always shoot in RAW.  Post is done with Nikon NX2.

Glass will be:

Nikon 50mm f/1.4G

Nikon 105 f/2.8 VR

Nikon 70-300 VR

Tamron 24-70 f/2.8 VC

Will the D600's limitation of 1/4000 second shutter speed impact well lit outdoor shots when using lenses wide open?  How much of a real issue is over exposure with this camera?

Will the 1/200 flash sync cause issues with normal runway shots?

Does the D800's resolution give it a noticable image quality jump over the D600 when printing relatively large or will 24MP be more than needed for high quality print work for magazines and poster sized prints?

I appreciate your time and assistance.

Scott

D600:
  1/4000 is not a limitation.  You can always add ND or polarizer in front of the lense.

1/200th flash sync isn't limitation either.  You can also set hyper sync and that can go to 1/4000th of a second .

For Magazine, 24MP is plenty.   36MP does resolve more but for magazine, editorial etc, it is plenty.

Things you should keep in mind is that the D600 does not come with PC connection (but those aren't needed if you use transmitter/receiver).

Lenses:

  Instead of the 50mm 1.4G:

get the 85mm 1.8g and the 50mm f1.8G.

if you really want sharp images, get the 85mm f1.4G but it is three times the price of 85mm f1.8G.  85mm f1.8G does 95% of 85mm f1.4G for 1/3 the price.  It is your choice.

instead of 70-300mm, save the money and get the 70-200mm f2.8G VR II.

JSB Fine Art Photo wrote:
Yeah I read that article, but since I am not a studio shooter I am wondering the impact to event shoots and location work...

Thanks for the link - it is a good read.

Scott

Anyone who thinks that 1/200th is a deal breaker obviously have never heard of hyper sync.  And besides, from 1/200th to 1/250th isn't much difference.  The Canon 5D series (I, II and III) has always has 1/200th and that has not been an issue.

ei Total Productions wrote:

Can you explain to me what you are saying here?  I haven't heard this one and I am not understanding what you mean by "lock the aperture and shutter speed setting."

With the D700 D800 and professional bodies you can set the shutter and aperture in manual mode and lock it so that you cannot change it without disengaging the lock first - so accidentally moving the control wheels with handling will not change your settings. 

With the D800 and D700 this is accomplished by first setting aperture and shutter and then holding down the Fn button while rotating the appropriate control wheel to turn the aperture and shutter lock on and off.    The D600 lacks this professional standard feature - for NO REASON that I can see, as all of the other Fn assignments are still there.

I think Nikon knew how important this feature was to professionals and left it off on purpose to further distinguish this camera from their semi-pro line.

JSB Fine Art Photo wrote:

Yeah I read that article, but since I am not a studio shooter I am wondering the impact to event shoots and location work...

Thanks for the link - it is a good read.

Scott

The sync speed is more of a problem in situations where you cannot control the ambiant, sich as out side when you want a open aperature in bright sun.

ChanStudio - OtherSide wrote:
Things you should keep in mind is that the D600 does not come with PC connection (but those aren't needed if you use transmitter/receiver).

Lenses:

  Instead of the 50mm 1.4G:

get the 85mm 1.8g and the 50mm f1.8G.

if you really want sharp images, get the 85mm f1.4G but it is three times the price of 85mm f1.8G.  85mm f1.8G does 95% of 85mm f1.4G for 1/3 the price.  It is your choice.

instead of 70-300mm, save the money and get the 70-200mm f2.8G VR II.

The Nikon AS-15 hot shoe to PC adapter solves the lack of PC terminal on the body.

I consider the advice to buy the 1.8 versions of the 50 and 85 to be not the best really -  you do get what you pay for here, in terms of tighter tolerances and more professional build quality. 

My experience has always been that the f1.4 versions out-perform the f1.8 / f2 versions of Nikon lenses going back to pre-AI when considering a wide array of conditions.  The bokeh contrast and colour are noticeably better on the f1.4s at higher resolutions. 

And do not neglect the 35mm f1.4 -  this has always been a very desirable professional standard providing an exceptionally pleasing angle of view and perspective and is an excellent performer.  My latest fashion story for publication was shot entirely with this lens. 


The Nikon 70-300 is not nearly a professional quality lens.  Very mediocre really.

Fred Greissing wrote:

All your lenses will look good on both the D800 and D600, however you would get more image quality from the 85mm 1.4 that the 105 2.8 VR.

The 70-300 and the Tamron are not quite upto what both the d600 and D800 are capable of, but you will see gains over your previous Nikon with these lenses.

Comparison of the 105 and 85mm 1.4G



The 105 is a fine lens, but you can get better...

Thanks Fred.  I checked out the 85 but I was more impressed with the VR on the 105.  With either the D600 or D800 I was thinking the high resolution might benefit from the VR system.  I know the 85 f/1.4 would give me more options on DOF though.  Thanks Sir.

Scott

ChanStudio - OtherSide wrote:

D600:
  1/4000 is not a limitation.  You can always add ND or polarizer in front of the lense.

1/200th flash sync isn't limitation either.  You can also set hyper sync and that can go to 1/4000th of a second .

For Magazine, 24MP is plenty.   36MP does resolve more but for magazine, editorial etc, it is plenty.

Things you should keep in mind is that the D600 does not come with PC connection (but those aren't needed if you use transmitter/receiver).

Lenses:

  Instead of the 50mm 1.4G:

get the 85mm 1.8g and the 50mm f1.8G.

if you really want sharp images, get the 85mm f1.4G but it is three times the price of 85mm f1.8G.  85mm f1.8G does 95% of 85mm f1.4G for 1/3 the price.  It is your choice.

instead of 70-300mm, save the money and get the 70-200mm f2.8G VR II.

LOL  You listed the two lenses out of the four that I already own.  I have looked at the 85 f/1.8 but I like the VR feature of the 105.  Thanks for the help and the insight on the D600.

Scott

Joseph William  wrote:

The sync speed is more of a problem in situations where you cannot control the ambiant, sich as out side when you want a open aperature in bright sun.

Looking at ND filters if this starts being a limitation with either camera.  Thanks for the info.

Scott

Fotografica Gregor wrote:

The Nikon AS-15 hot shoe to PC adapter solves the lack of PC terminal on the body.

I consider the advice to buy the 1.8 versions of the 50 and 85 to be not the best really -  you do get what you pay for here, in terms of tighter tolerances and more professional build quality. 

My experience has always been that the f1.4 versions out-perform the f1.8 / f2 versions of Nikon lenses going back to pre-AI when considering a wide array of conditions.  The bokeh contrast and colour are noticeably better on the f1.4s at higher resolutions. 

And do not neglect the 35mm f1.4 -  this has always been a very desirable professional standard providing an exceptionally pleasing angle of view and perspective and is an excellent performer.  My latest fashion story for publication was shot entirely with this lens. 


The Nikon 70-300 is not nearly a professional quality lens.  Very mediocre really.

I am in love with my 50mm f/1.4G  The 70-300 VR would be the my main glass concern moving from my current 10.2MP camera to the 24MP or 36MP options I am considering.  I will try it with whatever I choose and adjust fire as needed if it proves to be deficient.  Thanks for the help.

Scott

Blue Rose Photos wrote:
Go with the D600 and D7000. Its the combo i have and its always good to have a backup

I have researched the D600 heavily and I see that the interface is very similar to the D7000.  How easy is it to transfer between cameras?  Does it feel natural or do you have to think about the differences? 

Scott

Fotografica Gregor wrote:
I think Nikon knew how important this feature was to professionals and left it off on purpose to further distinguish this camera from their semi-pro line.

It isn't at all important to me. Never used this. Anyone else?

Kousoulas Photography wrote:
I think the 600 is a fantastic choice and from an image quality and image size perspective will leave  you very happy. The semi pro functionality vs the 800 is a marginal detriment in my view.

A curious part of your post that hasn't been commented on is the use of the 7000 as a backup. it is an fine camera and exposed more upmarket brethren in the line for what they lacked, but it is a cropped factor. Your lenses will behave differently between the full frame bodies you are asking about and the 7000.

This may not be an issue to your workflow, but it is something more and more will confront as we take the migration from DX to FX.

That is a valid point.  I just picked up the D7000 based on image quality and its other characteristics (size, build, and price).  I know I need a second body, but I am not able to purchase a pair of FX bodies due to $$$.  I have always shot crop, so I know how the lenses will behave.  The adjustment to FX coming from DX will be interesting.  I have read it makes lenses perform at a whole new level.

The change in function is just something I will have to live with at this point due to finances.

Scott

Fred Greissing wrote:
Yea really????

1/5th of a stop is really going to change his world???

1/200th s vs 1/250th.

Yes you can go to 1/320th (option) but only with Nikon speedlights on camera.

It really depends on their setup, some cheaper wireless triggers add enough of a delay that they will be at 1/125 max sync.  So yes it's an issue for some.

Back to the OP

I think the D600 will still be a useful tool for many.  As for the D800 extra resolution, that isn't going to be a big gain for most wanting to shoot fashion.  Given most commercial work is not printed very large.  Even a billboard doesn't need that resolution.  No maybe if I needed to shoot a 9'x12 foot wall image that people would be fairly close it would be helpful.

As for this whole crop vs full frame, can you look at a cover of W and tell me if it was shot with a 26mm or 35mm sensor?

Fred Greissing wrote:
1/5th of a stop is really going to change his world???

1/200th s vs 1/250th.

1/3rd, but yeah, not a massive amount.  Still, it's annoying.

Fred Greissing wrote:

Yea really????

1/5th of a stop is really going to change his world???

1/200th s vs 1/250th.

Yes you can go to 1/320th (option) but only with Nikon speedlights on camera.

Fred,

Can you go to 1/320th on the D600 or just the D800?  I shoot with Nikon Speedlights on camera.

Scott

JSB Fine Art Photo wrote:
I am moving from a Nikon D60 to a combination of either a D800 or D600 with a D7000 as a backup body.  I mostly shoot fashion and portraits.  I don't shoot studio, mostly location and shows (runway). I plan on growing my business and I need to invest in tools that will meet my needs over a period of years.  I have a SB-600 for the D7000 and I will invest in a SB-910 for the D800 or a SB-700 for the D600.  I will use a battery grip on all bodies.

I always shoot in RAW.  Post is done with Nikon NX2.

Glass will be:

Nikon 50mm f/1.4G

Nikon 105 f/2.8 VR

Nikon 70-300 VR

Tamron 24-70 f/2.8 VC

Will the D600's limitation of 1/4000 second shutter speed impact well lit outdoor shots when using lenses wide open?  How much of a real issue is over exposure with this camera?

Will the 1/200 flash sync cause issues with normal runway shots?

Does the D800's resolution give it a noticable image quality jump over the D600 when printing relatively large or will 24MP be more than needed for high quality print work for magazines and poster sized prints?

I appreciate your time and assistance.

Scott

I found the Nikkor 70-300 VR to be to soft on my D800. A lot of other lenses too. It's VERY picky on the glass. I'd suspect the Tokina you have as well. The only medium  zoom that tested well were the 24-70 Nikkor and the 70-200 VR Nikkor. That ads a couple grand to your costs on the D800. I have no experience with the D600 but I've read several posts by Gary (select models) praising his D600 at high ISO (The d800 is acceptable at best at high ISO in MY opinion) and his results with the Nikkor 70-300.

JSB Fine Art Photo wrote:
Can you go to 1/320th on the D600 or just the D800?  I shoot with Nikon Speedlights on camera.

You can do it on either as long as you're using a Nikon flash capable of AutoFP HSS (SB-600/700/800/900/910) or CLS/AWL commander on the hotshoe (SB-700/800/900/910 or SU-800) controlling Nikon flashes remotely.  Some bodies will even let you use the popup as a CLS/AWL commander in high speed sync mode, as long as the popup is ONLY acting as a commander, and not also contributing to the lighting in the scene.

Fotografica Gregor wrote:
I think Nikon knew how important this feature was to professionals and left it off on purpose to further distinguish this camera from their semi-pro line.

Robert Feliciano wrote:
It isn't at all important to me. Never used this. Anyone else?

Same. It would be a non-factor for me, as well. I never accidentally change my settings, so I have never needed to use it.

R Michael Walker wrote:

I found the Nikkor 70-300 VR to be to soft on my D800. A lot of other lenses too. It's VERY picky on the glass. I'd suspect the Tokina you have as well. The only medium  zoom that tested well were the 24-70 Nikkor and the 70-200 VR Nikkor. That ads a couple grand to your costs on the D800. I have no experience with the D600 but I've read several posts by Gary (select models) praising his D600 at high ISO (The d800 is acceptable at best at high ISO in MY opinion) and his results with the Nikkor 70-300.

Thanks Michael.

Scott

Kaouthia wrote:

You can do it on either as long as you're using a Nikon flash capable of AutoFP HSS (SB-600/700/800/900/910) or CLS/AWL commander on the hotshoe (SB-700/800/900/910 or SU-800) controlling Nikon flashes remotely.  Some bodies will even let you use the popup as a CLS/AWL commander in high speed sync mode, as long as the popup is ONLY acting as a commander, and not also contributing to the lighting in the scene.

Thanks for the info.  So the Nikon CLS overides the normal flash sync limitations of the camera?

Scott

Andrea Acailawen wrote:

Fotografica Gregor wrote:
I think Nikon knew how important this feature was to professionals and left it off on purpose to further distinguish this camera from their semi-pro line.

Same. It would be a non-factor for me, as well. I never accidentally change my settings, so I have never needed to use it.

Since I have never shot with a pro body I don't think it will be much of an impact on my situation either.  If I had regularly used this feature on a camera I might see things differently.

Scott

JSB Fine Art Photo wrote:
Thanks for the info.  So the Nikon CLS overides the normal flash sync limitations of the camera?

Yup, you can shoot all the way up to 1/8000th with Nikon flashes... although, not on the D600, obviously.

You do lose some power from the flashes (up to about 2 stops at 1/8000th).